Home » The PARIS Forums » PARIS: Main » OT...Mac...ideas on why...
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| Re: OT...Mac...ideas on why... [message #63852 is a reply to message #63851] |
Fri, 27 January 2006 05:45   |
Dedric Terry
Messages: 788
Registered: June 2007
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Senior Member |
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Rick,
Was this a one time occurrence or do kernel panics (grey screen) happen with
any specific application open, or at random? Do you still have the original
RAM or have you added any?
We've been having random kernel panics and lockups on our dual G4 for over a
year (sitting idle, typing email, doesn't matter). Reinstalled the OS twice
(the second time crashes had tanked the system drive, so that's been
replaced); tried different RAM; removed peripheral devices, etc. We don't
have energy saver running here either.
The only new advice I've gotten from Apple's forum is to replace the PRAM
battery. Seems like a long shot as I'm guessing we have a bad logic board,
but at $700 I'm not wanting to replace that just to find out.
10.2.8 here, btw. 10.4.x is supposed to be more stable so you should be
okay there.
Regards,
Dedric
On 1/27/06 3:11 AM, in article jasjt1tj0f1no1kpl76jedajcpfeb2ug58@4ax.com,
"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
> all the power saver settings were already set to never and locked.
>
> thanks
>
> On 27 Jan 2006 07:53:59 +1000, "James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>>
>> Turn off all energy saver stuff. Go to system preferences, energy saver,
>> unlock it if necessary, set sleep options to Never. Then lock it be fore
>> closing the window.
>>
>> I hope this helps!
>>
>> James
>>
>> rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>> installed 10.4.3 (new install with zeroing out the drive as usual).
>>> twice after leaving the puter idling with logic 7.1.1 up for less than
>>> 1 hour the gray screen (with the in 7 languages appeared with the
>>> message of you must do a hard restart) has appeared. then a complete
>>> power down (computer just shut off in the midst of running on a loop);
>>> calendar (set itself to 4/15/1968) needed to be reset on reboot.
>>> nothing else shut down so it wasn't a power issue from outside the
>>> mac. ideas?
>
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| Re: OT...Mac...ideas on why... [message #63892 is a reply to message #63852] |
Sat, 28 January 2006 13:53 |
rick
Messages: 1976
Registered: February 2006
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Senior Member |
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Dedric,
no, this has happened before but it has been a while. it actually
happened 3 times on the first new install and once3 since...the gray
screen and 8 language restart command. the whole power shutdown was
new for this work of art. some things i think are logic related cuz
it doesn't happen in DP and some things that happen in DP don't happen
in logic.
i went through the ram replacement thing when i first got this thing.
i originally had mushkin in it (highly recommended and it was my ram
of choice in my pc's) but the fw800 g4 didn't know what it was so i
replaced it.
i totally agree with you on the $700.00 for a battery...ain't gonna
happen here either.
thanks
On Fri, 27 Jan 2006 06:45:58 -0700, Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net>
wrote:
>Rick,
>
>Was this a one time occurrence or do kernel panics (grey screen) happen with
>any specific application open, or at random? Do you still have the original
>RAM or have you added any?
>
>We've been having random kernel panics and lockups on our dual G4 for over a
>year (sitting idle, typing email, doesn't matter). Reinstalled the OS twice
>(the second time crashes had tanked the system drive, so that's been
>replaced); tried different RAM; removed peripheral devices, etc. We don't
>have energy saver running here either.
>
>The only new advice I've gotten from Apple's forum is to replace the PRAM
>battery. Seems like a long shot as I'm guessing we have a bad logic board,
>but at $700 I'm not wanting to replace that just to find out.
>
>10.2.8 here, btw. 10.4.x is supposed to be more stable so you should be
>okay there.
>
>Regards,
>Dedric
>
>On 1/27/06 3:11 AM, in article jasjt1tj0f1no1kpl76jedajcpfeb2ug58@4ax.com,
>"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> all the power saver settings were already set to never and locked.
>>
>> thanks
>>
>> On 27 Jan 2006 07:53:59 +1000, "James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Turn off all energy saver stuff. Go to system preferences, energy saver,
>>> unlock it if necessary, set sleep options to Never. Then lock it be fore
>>> closing the window.
>>>
>>> I hope this helps!
>>>
>>> James
>>>
>>> rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>> installed 10.4.3 (new install with zeroing out the drive as usual).
>>>> twice after leaving the puter idling with logic 7.1.1 up for less than
>>>> 1 hour the gray screen (with the in 7 languages appeared with the
>>>> message of you must do a hard restart) has appeared. then a complete
>>>> power down (computer just shut off in the midst of running on a loop);
>>>> calendar (set itself to 4/15/1968) needed to be reset on reboot.
>>>> nothing else shut down so it wasn't a power issue from outside the
>>>> mac. ideas?
>>
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| Re: OT...Mac...ideas on why... [message #63897 is a reply to message #63892] |
Sat, 28 January 2006 14:52 |
Dedric Terry
Messages: 788
Registered: June 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Rick,
Sounds like what we are seeing. I've posted on the Apple forum, but not
much help there yet - mostly people suggesting what I said in my posts I had
already done.
The picky Ram issue with Macs really irritates me - Mushkin is probably
better than what they spec (although one user suggested crucial). Also our
combo drive won't burn DVDs - just CDs. Apple says a replacement would have
to be a Panasonic. Why Panasonic? What about Plextor, etc? I also found
that our Mac couldn't support IDE cables longer than the 6" or so ones that
come with it (even high quality 10-12" cables). The only reason for a Mac
being so picky about part manufacturers (down to there being only one in
some cases) is poor design tolerances, period. They just tried to cut
corners and extend the profit margin by not designing a more robust system
with more power to the IDE busses, etc. Easier to pack it all in a spiffy
looking case if you get it working in one config and don't have to worry
about better ground planes, isolation, etc. Then it is all sold as "this is
what is guaranteed to work" making customers think they are getting a highly
spec'd system. BS. It's nothing but lazy design and lazy support - easier
to say "buy one of these" than actually find a problem.
Yeah, $700 for a 2+ yr old motherboard that in the PC world would run about
$125. I'm considering building my wife (it's her G4) a dual core AMD or
Intel and just crossgrading our design software to PC. Probably less
expensive than buying a new MacIntel.
Regards,
Dedric
On 1/28/06 2:53 PM, in article hgpnt1d6mc6flt4492eqjg8n6dhi7qpvf8@4ax.com,
"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Dedric,
>
> no, this has happened before but it has been a while. it actually
> happened 3 times on the first new install and once3 since...the gray
> screen and 8 language restart command. the whole power shutdown was
> new for this work of art. some things i think are logic related cuz
> it doesn't happen in DP and some things that happen in DP don't happen
> in logic.
>
> i went through the ram replacement thing when i first got this thing.
> i originally had mushkin in it (highly recommended and it was my ram
> of choice in my pc's) but the fw800 g4 didn't know what it was so i
> replaced it.
>
> i totally agree with you on the $700.00 for a battery...ain't gonna
> happen here either.
>
> thanks
>
> On Fri, 27 Jan 2006 06:45:58 -0700, Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net>
> wrote:
>
>> Rick,
>>
>> Was this a one time occurrence or do kernel panics (grey screen) happen with
>> any specific application open, or at random? Do you still have the original
>> RAM or have you added any?
>>
>> We've been having random kernel panics and lockups on our dual G4 for over a
>> year (sitting idle, typing email, doesn't matter). Reinstalled the OS twice
>> (the second time crashes had tanked the system drive, so that's been
>> replaced); tried different RAM; removed peripheral devices, etc. We don't
>> have energy saver running here either.
>>
>> The only new advice I've gotten from Apple's forum is to replace the PRAM
>> battery. Seems like a long shot as I'm guessing we have a bad logic board,
>> but at $700 I'm not wanting to replace that just to find out.
>>
>> 10.2.8 here, btw. 10.4.x is supposed to be more stable so you should be
>> okay there.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Dedric
>>
>> On 1/27/06 3:11 AM, in article jasjt1tj0f1no1kpl76jedajcpfeb2ug58@4ax.com,
>> "rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> all the power saver settings were already set to never and locked.
>>>
>>> thanks
>>>
>>> On 27 Jan 2006 07:53:59 +1000, "James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Turn off all energy saver stuff. Go to system preferences, energy saver,
>>>> unlock it if necessary, set sleep options to Never. Then lock it be fore
>>>> closing the window.
>>>>
>>>> I hope this helps!
>>>>
>>>> James
>>>>
>>>> rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> installed 10.4.3 (new install with zeroing out the drive as usual).
>>>>> twice after leaving the puter idling with logic 7.1.1 up for less than
>>>>> 1 hour the gray screen (with the in 7 languages appeared with the
>>>>> message of you must do a hard restart) has appeared. then a complete
>>>>> power down (computer just shut off in the midst of running on a loop);
>>>>> calendar (set itself to 4/15/1968) needed to be reset on reboot.
>>>>> nothing else shut down so it wasn't a power issue from outside the
>>>>> mac. ideas?
>>>
>
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| Re: OT...Mac...ideas on why... [message #63904 is a reply to message #63892] |
Sat, 28 January 2006 19:37 |
excelav
Messages: 2130
Registered: July 2005
Location: Metro Detroit
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Hey Rick! The battery for that machine should be about $6.00.
James
rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>Dedric,
>
>no, this has happened before but it has been a while. it actually
>happened 3 times on the first new install and once3 since...the gray
>screen and 8 language restart command. the whole power shutdown was
>new for this work of art. some things i think are logic related cuz
>it doesn't happen in DP and some things that happen in DP don't happen
>in logic.
>
>i went through the ram replacement thing when i first got this thing.
>i originally had mushkin in it (highly recommended and it was my ram
>of choice in my pc's) but the fw800 g4 didn't know what it was so i
>replaced it.
>
>i totally agree with you on the $700.00 for a battery...ain't gonna
>happen here either.
>
>thanks
>
>On Fri, 27 Jan 2006 06:45:58 -0700, Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net>
>wrote:
>
>>Rick,
>>
>>Was this a one time occurrence or do kernel panics (grey screen) happen
with
>>any specific application open, or at random? Do you still have the original
>>RAM or have you added any?
>>
>>We've been having random kernel panics and lockups on our dual G4 for over
a
>>year (sitting idle, typing email, doesn't matter). Reinstalled the OS
twice
>>(the second time crashes had tanked the system drive, so that's been
>>replaced); tried different RAM; removed peripheral devices, etc. We don't
>>have energy saver running here either.
>>
>>The only new advice I've gotten from Apple's forum is to replace the PRAM
>>battery. Seems like a long shot as I'm guessing we have a bad logic board,
>>but at $700 I'm not wanting to replace that just to find out.
>>
>>10.2.8 here, btw. 10.4.x is supposed to be more stable so you should be
>>okay there.
>>
>>Regards,
>>Dedric
>>
>>On 1/27/06 3:11 AM, in article jasjt1tj0f1no1kpl76jedajcpfeb2ug58@4ax.com,
>>"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> all the power saver settings were already set to never and locked.
>>>
>>> thanks
>>>
>>> On 27 Jan 2006 07:53:59 +1000, "James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Turn off all energy saver stuff. Go to system preferences, energy saver,
>>>> unlock it if necessary, set sleep options to Never. Then lock it be
fore
>>>> closing the window.
>>>>
>>>> I hope this helps!
>>>>
>>>> James
>>>>
>>>> rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> installed 10.4.3 (new install with zeroing out the drive as usual).
>>>>> twice after leaving the puter idling with logic 7.1.1 up for less than
>>>>> 1 hour the gray screen (with the in 7 languages appeared with the
>>>>> message of you must do a hard restart) has appeared. then a complete
>>>>> power down (computer just shut off in the midst of running on a loop);
>>>>> calendar (set itself to 4/15/1968) needed to be reset on reboot.
>>>>> nothing else shut down so it wasn't a power issue from outside the
>>>>> mac. ideas?
>>>
>
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| Re: OT...Mac...ideas on why... [message #63905 is a reply to message #63897] |
Sat, 28 January 2006 19:47 |
excelav
Messages: 2130
Registered: July 2005
Location: Metro Detroit
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Hey Dedric! I believe on the DVD drive, you need to go with Pioneer. They
also used Sony in some of the G5s, but you would have to find out which one
they used and go with the exact model. I do not believe they used Panasonic
DVDs in the G4 or G5, but anything is possible. I put a Pioneer in my dual
mirror G4, it works great!
James
Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>Rick,
>
>Sounds like what we are seeing. I've posted on the Apple forum, but not
>much help there yet - mostly people suggesting what I said in my posts I
had
>already done.
>
>The picky Ram issue with Macs really irritates me - Mushkin is probably
>better than what they spec (although one user suggested crucial). Also
our
>combo drive won't burn DVDs - just CDs. Apple says a replacement would
have
>to be a Panasonic. Why Panasonic? What about Plextor, etc? I also found
>that our Mac couldn't support IDE cables longer than the 6" or so ones that
>come with it (even high quality 10-12" cables). The only reason for a Mac
>being so picky about part manufacturers (down to there being only one in
>some cases) is poor design tolerances, period. They just tried to cut
>corners and extend the profit margin by not designing a more robust system
>with more power to the IDE busses, etc. Easier to pack it all in a spiffy
>looking case if you get it working in one config and don't have to worry
>about better ground planes, isolation, etc. Then it is all sold as "this
is
>what is guaranteed to work" making customers think they are getting a highly
>spec'd system. BS. It's nothing but lazy design and lazy support - easier
>to say "buy one of these" than actually find a problem.
>
>Yeah, $700 for a 2+ yr old motherboard that in the PC world would run about
>$125. I'm considering building my wife (it's her G4) a dual core AMD or
>Intel and just crossgrading our design software to PC. Probably less
>expensive than buying a new MacIntel.
>
>Regards,
>Dedric
>
>On 1/28/06 2:53 PM, in article hgpnt1d6mc6flt4492eqjg8n6dhi7qpvf8@4ax.com,
>"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Dedric,
>>
>> no, this has happened before but it has been a while. it actually
>> happened 3 times on the first new install and once3 since...the gray
>> screen and 8 language restart command. the whole power shutdown was
>> new for this work of art. some things i think are logic related cuz
>> it doesn't happen in DP and some things that happen in DP don't happen
>> in logic.
>>
>> i went through the ram replacement thing when i first got this thing.
>> i originally had mushkin in it (highly recommended and it was my ram
>> of choice in my pc's) but the fw800 g4 didn't know what it was so i
>> replaced it.
>>
>> i totally agree with you on the $700.00 for a battery...ain't gonna
>> happen here either.
>>
>> thanks
>>
>> On Fri, 27 Jan 2006 06:45:58 -0700, Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Rick,
>>>
>>> Was this a one time occurrence or do kernel panics (grey screen) happen
with
>>> any specific application open, or at random? Do you still have the original
>>> RAM or have you added any?
>>>
>>> We've been having random kernel panics and lockups on our dual G4 for
over a
>>> year (sitting idle, typing email, doesn't matter). Reinstalled the OS
twice
>>> (the second time crashes had tanked the system drive, so that's been
>>> replaced); tried different RAM; removed peripheral devices, etc. We
don't
>>> have energy saver running here either.
>>>
>>> The only new advice I've gotten from Apple's forum is to replace the
PRAM
>>> battery. Seems like a long shot as I'm guessing we have a bad logic
board,
>>> but at $700 I'm not wanting to replace that just to find out.
>>>
>>> 10.2.8 here, btw. 10.4.x is supposed to be more stable so you should
be
>>> okay there.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Dedric
>>>
>>> On 1/27/06 3:11 AM, in article jasjt1tj0f1no1kpl76jedajcpfeb2ug58@4ax.com,
>>> "rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> all the power saver settings were already set to never and locked.
>>>>
>>>> thanks
>>>>
>>>> On 27 Jan 2006 07:53:59 +1000, "James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Turn off all energy saver stuff. Go to system preferences, energy
saver,
>>>>> unlock it if necessary, set sleep options to Never. Then lock it be
fore
>>>>> closing the window.
>>>>>
>>>>> I hope this helps!
>>>>>
>>>>> James
>>>>>
>>>>> rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> installed 10.4.3 (new install with zeroing out the drive as usual).
>>>>>> twice after leaving the puter idling with logic 7.1.1 up for less
than
>>>>>> 1 hour the gray screen (with the in 7 languages appeared with the
>>>>>> message of you must do a hard restart) has appeared. then a complete
>>>>>> power down (computer just shut off in the midst of running on a loop);
>>>>>> calendar (set itself to 4/15/1968) needed to be reset on reboot.
>>>>>> nothing else shut down so it wasn't a power issue from outside the
>>>>>> mac. ideas?
>>>>
>>
>
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| Re: OT...Mac...ideas on why... [message #63906 is a reply to message #63905] |
Sat, 28 January 2006 19:18 |
Dedric Terry
Messages: 788
Registered: June 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Hey James - it may have been Pioneer. Certainly nothing wrong with them, or
Plextor, Sony, Yamaha, HP, LaCie... But oddly enough Macs can sense what
brand memory, DVD drive and probably IDE, power and USB cables, even if it
isn't the best on the market, and lo and behold that's all they will work
with. IMHO, that's really lame. Worse than $399 desktop
Dell-don't-try-to-add-a-PCI card lame.... ;-)
I'm surprised our Belkin mouse pad works with it. Shocked actually. I feel
lucky. Who would have thunk it. Maybe I'll play the lottery this week.
Dedric
On 1/28/06 8:47 PM, in article 43dc2cd4$1@linux, "James McCloskey"
<excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hey Dedric! I believe on the DVD drive, you need to go with Pioneer. They
> also used Sony in some of the G5s, but you would have to find out which one
> they used and go with the exact model. I do not believe they used Panasonic
> DVDs in the G4 or G5, but anything is possible. I put a Pioneer in my dual
> mirror G4, it works great!
>
> James
>
> Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>> Rick,
>>
>> Sounds like what we are seeing. I've posted on the Apple forum, but not
>> much help there yet - mostly people suggesting what I said in my posts I
> had
>> already done.
>>
>> The picky Ram issue with Macs really irritates me - Mushkin is probably
>> better than what they spec (although one user suggested crucial). Also
> our
>> combo drive won't burn DVDs - just CDs. Apple says a replacement would
> have
>> to be a Panasonic. Why Panasonic? What about Plextor, etc? I also found
>> that our Mac couldn't support IDE cables longer than the 6" or so ones that
>> come with it (even high quality 10-12" cables). The only reason for a Mac
>> being so picky about part manufacturers (down to there being only one in
>> some cases) is poor design tolerances, period. They just tried to cut
>> corners and extend the profit margin by not designing a more robust system
>> with more power to the IDE busses, etc. Easier to pack it all in a spiffy
>> looking case if you get it working in one config and don't have to worry
>> about better ground planes, isolation, etc. Then it is all sold as "this
> is
>> what is guaranteed to work" making customers think they are getting a highly
>> spec'd system. BS. It's nothing but lazy design and lazy support - easier
>> to say "buy one of these" than actually find a problem.
>>
>> Yeah, $700 for a 2+ yr old motherboard that in the PC world would run about
>> $125. I'm considering building my wife (it's her G4) a dual core AMD or
>> Intel and just crossgrading our design software to PC. Probably less
>> expensive than buying a new MacIntel.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Dedric
>>
>> On 1/28/06 2:53 PM, in article hgpnt1d6mc6flt4492eqjg8n6dhi7qpvf8@4ax.com,
>> "rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Dedric,
>>>
>>> no, this has happened before but it has been a while. it actually
>>> happened 3 times on the first new install and once3 since...the gray
>>> screen and 8 language restart command. the whole power shutdown was
>>> new for this work of art. some things i think are logic related cuz
>>> it doesn't happen in DP and some things that happen in DP don't happen
>>> in logic.
>>>
>>> i went through the ram replacement thing when i first got this thing.
>>> i originally had mushkin in it (highly recommended and it was my ram
>>> of choice in my pc's) but the fw800 g4 didn't know what it was so i
>>> replaced it.
>>>
>>> i totally agree with you on the $700.00 for a battery...ain't gonna
>>> happen here either.
>>>
>>> thanks
>>>
>>> On Fri, 27 Jan 2006 06:45:58 -0700, Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Rick,
>>>>
>>>> Was this a one time occurrence or do kernel panics (grey screen) happen
> with
>>>> any specific application open, or at random? Do you still have the
>>>> original
>>>> RAM or have you added any?
>>>>
>>>> We've been having random kernel panics and lockups on our dual G4 for
> over a
>>>> year (sitting idle, typing email, doesn't matter). Reinstalled the OS
> twice
>>>> (the second time crashes had tanked the system drive, so that's been
>>>> replaced); tried different RAM; removed peripheral devices, etc. We
> don't
>>>> have energy saver running here either.
>>>>
>>>> The only new advice I've gotten from Apple's forum is to replace the
> PRAM
>>>> battery. Seems like a long shot as I'm guessing we have a bad logic
> board,
>>>> but at $700 I'm not wanting to replace that just to find out.
>>>>
>>>> 10.2.8 here, btw. 10.4.x is supposed to be more stable so you should
> be
>>>> okay there.
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Dedric
>>>>
>>>> On 1/27/06 3:11 AM, in article jasjt1tj0f1no1kpl76jedajcpfeb2ug58@4ax.com,
>>>> "rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> all the power saver settings were already set to never and locked.
>>>>>
>>>>> thanks
>>>>>
>>>>> On 27 Jan 2006 07:53:59 +1000, "James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Turn off all energy saver stuff. Go to system preferences, energy
> saver,
>>>>>> unlock it if necessary, set sleep options to Never. Then lock it be
> fore
>>>>>> closing the window.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I hope this helps!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> James
>>>>>>
>>>>>> rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> installed 10.4.3 (new install with zeroing out the drive as usual).
>>>>>>> twice after leaving the puter idling with logic 7.1.1 up for less
> than
>>>>>>> 1 hour the gray screen (with the in 7 languages appeared with the
>>>>>>> message of you must do a hard restart) has appeared. then a complete
>>>>>>> power down (computer just shut off in the midst of running on a loop);
>>>>>>> calendar (set itself to 4/15/1968) needed to be reset on reboot.
>>>>>>> nothing else shut down so it wasn't a power issue from outside the
>>>>>>> mac. ideas?
>>>>>
>>>
>>
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| Re: OT...Mac...ideas on why... [message #63946 is a reply to message #63906] |
Mon, 30 January 2006 02:02 |
excelav
Messages: 2130
Registered: July 2005
Location: Metro Detroit
|
Senior Member |
|
|
You Apple computer will work with those other DVD drives, you just need to
install the right drivers and DVD burning software just like on a PC. On
a Mac, some third party manufactures ship there drives with OEM software
for the Mac. You could also get a software like Toast for burning, and there
are others. Apple doesn't support all the third part manufactures for obvious
reasons, cost and the support night mirror. It's the same for the most part
on a PC, you can't just install Windows and a third party DVD drive and
expect it to work out of the box. You have to install third party authoring
software to burn DVDs with it. I would say it's more like, not every drive
manufacture supports Apple. Thanks to third party software manufacture,
most drives are supported for the Mac.
Remember Apple was the first computer company to offer DVD burners on computers.
Prior to that a dvd burner cost $6,000.00, I know I was a computer dealer.
The first Apple machine was less that $2,500.00, that was a hell of a deal
back then. They started off with the Pioneer super drive, it was the only
one available at that time. Pioneer had years of experience starting back
to the pioneer laser disc. A raw Pioneer drive was about a grand back then.
With in 6 mo. they were about $700.00 and PC manufactures were getting in
to the game. So my hats off to Apple for blazing that trail.
What does suck is how Apple has locked us out with hardware profile. This
is basically what you are saying. There are other options available on the
DVD front. There are many things that suck about Apple and the MS way they
have chosen to conduct business in the last four years. They have dropped
VST support in some of their audio products, they have no direct support
for Mpeg2 video in some of their video products. Mpeg2 is the industry standard
in video (DVD). Yet they want to say they support open industry standards,
which is bullshit!
With third party software you can do all the things you want to on a Mac,
but that cost more money. Apple's video software, you have to convert/encode
every thing to QuickTime, then edit your video, then encode back to to MPEG2
to burn to DVD!!! Who in the hell has time for all that!!! Apples answer,
oh buy our new faster machine, it encodes faster. I say F*** encoding,
and F*** Apple!!! I went out and bough two cards for my PC and now I can
encode in real time, and it cost me a total of $50.00 on sale!!! I no longer
have to wait hours. So Apple has Mpeg4 in quickTime now, so what! DVD
and Mpeg2 are the standards not Mpeg 4, I can't rent an Mpeg4 disc and play
it in any of my DVD players. I don't think they have gotten lazy, Apple
has just gotten greedy! They didn't want to pay Mpeg for Mpeg 2. It cost
$20.00 just to get Mpeg2 player in QuickTime.
It used to be that you could be running 8 year old software on your Mac.
It was an advantage over PCs in many cases. Now with OSX, Apple dumps older
hardware support. They just dumped support for my iBook G3 which is about
3.5 years old. So no more G3 support! They were still selling G3 models
2.5 years ago. iLife 06, GarageBand 3 is no longer supported on G3 models,
they have locked us out with hardware profile. That sucks! The more Apple
uses tactics like this the slower I and many other people will be to upgrade.
I'm not totally happy with all of Apples decisions, so I can understand your
frustration. Some of their decisions are just business decisions, and I
under stand that too. Putting the above mentioned aside, I think Apple is
a great company with great vision and great innovation. There audio support
in OSX is great, and AU rocks. The concept of one company designing the hardware
and writing the OS and software to run on that hardware is good. It means
tighter integration and less problems for the end user. The trade off is
less upgrade hardware options. Hopefully Apple will make good decisions
when it comes to OEM products.
On the DVD burner, there may be some better choices, but I can tell you that
Pioneer is a good solid choice.
As for your mouse pad, well I can't comment, I use a Kensington track ball;
)
James
Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>Hey James - it may have been Pioneer. Certainly nothing wrong with them,
or
>Plextor, Sony, Yamaha, HP, LaCie... But oddly enough Macs can sense what
>brand memory, DVD drive and probably IDE, power and USB cables, even if
it
>isn't the best on the market, and lo and behold that's all they will work
>with. IMHO, that's really lame. Worse than $399 desktop
>Dell-don't-try-to-add-a-PCI card lame.... ;-)
>
>I'm surprised our Belkin mouse pad works with it. Shocked actually. I
feel
>lucky. Who would have thunk it. Maybe I'll play the lottery this week.
>
>Dedric
>
>On 1/28/06 8:47 PM, in article 43dc2cd4$1@linux, "James McCloskey"
><excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> Hey Dedric! I believe on the DVD drive, you need to go with Pioneer.
They
>> also used Sony in some of the G5s, but you would have to find out which
one
>> they used and go with the exact model. I do not believe they used Panasonic
>> DVDs in the G4 or G5, but anything is possible. I put a Pioneer in my
dual
>> mirror G4, it works great!
>>
>> James
>>
>> Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>>> Rick,
>>>
>>> Sounds like what we are seeing. I've posted on the Apple forum, but
not
>>> much help there yet - mostly people suggesting what I said in my posts
I
>> had
>>> already done.
>>>
>>> The picky Ram issue with Macs really irritates me - Mushkin is probably
>>> better than what they spec (although one user suggested crucial). Also
>> our
>>> combo drive won't burn DVDs - just CDs. Apple says a replacement would
>> have
>>> to be a Panasonic. Why Panasonic? What about Plextor, etc? I also
found
>>> that our Mac couldn't support IDE cables longer than the 6" or so ones
that
>>> come with it (even high quality 10-12" cables). The only reason for
a Mac
>>> being so picky about part manufacturers (down to there being only one
in
>>> some cases) is poor design tolerances, period. They just tried to cut
>>> corners and extend the profit margin by not designing a more robust system
>>> with more power to the IDE busses, etc. Easier to pack it all in a spiffy
>>> looking case if you get it working in one config and don't have to worry
>>> about better ground planes, isolation, etc. Then it is all sold as "this
>> is
>>> what is guaranteed to work" making customers think they are getting a
highly
>>> spec'd system. BS. It's nothing but lazy design and lazy support -
easier
>>> to say "buy one of these" than actually find a problem.
>>>
>>> Yeah, $700 for a 2+ yr old motherboard that in the PC world would run
about
>>> $125. I'm considering building my wife (it's her G4) a dual core AMD
or
>>> Intel and just crossgrading our design software to PC. Probably less
>>> expensive than buying a new MacIntel.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Dedric
>>>
>>> On 1/28/06 2:53 PM, in article hgpnt1d6mc6flt4492eqjg8n6dhi7qpvf8@4ax.com,
>>> "rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Dedric,
>>>>
>>>> no, this has happened before but it has been a while. it actually
>>>> happened 3 times on the first new install and once3 since...the gray
>>>> screen and 8 language restart command. the whole power shutdown was
>>>> new for this work of art. some things i think are logic related cuz
>>>> it doesn't happen in DP and some things that happen in DP don't happen
>>>> in logic.
>>>>
>>>> i went through the ram replacement thing when i first got this thing.
>>>> i originally had mushkin in it (highly recommended and it was my ram
>>>> of choice in my pc's) but the fw800 g4 didn't know what it was so i
>>>> replaced it.
>>>>
>>>> i totally agree with you on the $700.00 for a battery...ain't gonna
>>>> happen here either.
>>>>
>>>> thanks
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, 27 Jan 2006 06:45:58 -0700, Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Rick,
>>>>>
>>>>> Was this a one time occurrence or do kernel panics (grey screen) happen
>> with
>>>>> any specific application open, or at random? Do you still have the
>>>>> original
>>>>> RAM or have you added any?
>>>>>
>>>>> We've been having random kernel panics and lockups on our dual G4 for
>> over a
>>>>> year (sitting idle, typing email, doesn't matter). Reinstalled the
OS
>> twice
>>>>> (the second time crashes had tanked the system drive, so that's been
>>>>> replaced); tried different RAM; removed peripheral devices, etc. We
>> don't
>>>>> have energy saver running here either.
>>>>>
>>>>> The only new advice I've gotten from Apple's forum is to replace the
>> PRAM
>>>>> battery. Seems like a long shot as I'm guessing we have a bad logic
>> board,
>>>>> but at $700 I'm not wanting to replace that just to find out.
>>>>>
>>>>> 10.2.8 here, btw. 10.4.x is supposed to be more stable so you should
>> be
>>>>> okay there.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> Dedric
>>>>>
>>>>> On 1/27/06 3:11 AM, in article jasjt1tj0f1no1kpl76jedajcpfeb2ug58@4ax.com,
>>>>> "rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> all the power saver settings were already set to never and locked.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> thanks
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 27 Jan 2006 07:53:59 +1000, "James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Turn off all energy saver stuff. Go to system preferences, energy
>> saver,
>>>>>>> unlock it if necessary, set sleep options to Never. Then lock it
be
>> fore
>>>>>>> closing the window.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I hope this helps!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> James
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> installed 10.4.3 (new install with zeroing out the drive as usual).
>>>>>>>> twice after leaving the puter idling with logic 7.1.1 up for less
>> than
>>>>>>>> 1 hour the gray screen (with the in 7 languages appeared with the
>>>>>>>> message of you must do a hard restart) has appeared. then a complete
>>>>>>>> power down (computer just shut off in the midst of running on a
loop);
>>>>>>>> calendar (set itself to 4/15/1968) needed to be reset on reboot.
>>>>>>>> nothing else shut down so it wasn't a power issue from outside the
>>>>>>>> mac. ideas?
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: OT...Mac...ideas on why... [message #63947 is a reply to message #63897] |
Mon, 30 January 2006 02:19 |
rick
Messages: 1976
Registered: February 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
crucial is what replaced the muskin (which is working fine in the
pc's) in it now
On Sat, 28 Jan 2006 15:52:23 -0700, Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net>
wrote:
>Rick,
>
>Sounds like what we are seeing. I've posted on the Apple forum, but not
>much help there yet - mostly people suggesting what I said in my posts I had
>already done.
>
>The picky Ram issue with Macs really irritates me - Mushkin is probably
>better than what they spec (although one user suggested crucial). Also our
>combo drive won't burn DVDs - just CDs. Apple says a replacement would have
>to be a Panasonic. Why Panasonic? What about Plextor, etc? I also found
>that our Mac couldn't support IDE cables longer than the 6" or so ones that
>come with it (even high quality 10-12" cables). The only reason for a Mac
>being so picky about part manufacturers (down to there being only one in
>some cases) is poor design tolerances, period. They just tried to cut
>corners and extend the profit margin by not designing a more robust system
>with more power to the IDE busses, etc. Easier to pack it all in a spiffy
>looking case if you get it working in one config and don't have to worry
>about better ground planes, isolation, etc. Then it is all sold as "this is
>what is guaranteed to work" making customers think they are getting a highly
>spec'd system. BS. It's nothing but lazy design and lazy support - easier
>to say "buy one of these" than actually find a problem.
>
>Yeah, $700 for a 2+ yr old motherboard that in the PC world would run about
>$125. I'm considering building my wife (it's her G4) a dual core AMD or
>Intel and just crossgrading our design software to PC. Probably less
>expensive than buying a new MacIntel.
>
>Regards,
>Dedric
>
>On 1/28/06 2:53 PM, in article hgpnt1d6mc6flt4492eqjg8n6dhi7qpvf8@4ax.com,
>"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Dedric,
>>
>> no, this has happened before but it has been a while. it actually
>> happened 3 times on the first new install and once3 since...the gray
>> screen and 8 language restart command. the whole power shutdown was
>> new for this work of art. some things i think are logic related cuz
>> it doesn't happen in DP and some things that happen in DP don't happen
>> in logic.
>>
>> i went through the ram replacement thing when i first got this thing.
>> i originally had mushkin in it (highly recommended and it was my ram
>> of choice in my pc's) but the fw800 g4 didn't know what it was so i
>> replaced it.
>>
>> i totally agree with you on the $700.00 for a battery...ain't gonna
>> happen here either.
>>
>> thanks
>>
>> On Fri, 27 Jan 2006 06:45:58 -0700, Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Rick,
>>>
>>> Was this a one time occurrence or do kernel panics (grey screen) happen with
>>> any specific application open, or at random? Do you still have the original
>>> RAM or have you added any?
>>>
>>> We've been having random kernel panics and lockups on our dual G4 for over a
>>> year (sitting idle, typing email, doesn't matter). Reinstalled the OS twice
>>> (the second time crashes had tanked the system drive, so that's been
>>> replaced); tried different RAM; removed peripheral devices, etc. We don't
>>> have energy saver running here either.
>>>
>>> The only new advice I've gotten from Apple's forum is to replace the PRAM
>>> battery. Seems like a long shot as I'm guessing we have a bad logic board,
>>> but at $700 I'm not wanting to replace that just to find out.
>>>
>>> 10.2.8 here, btw. 10.4.x is supposed to be more stable so you should be
>>> okay there.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Dedric
>>>
>>> On 1/27/06 3:11 AM, in article jasjt1tj0f1no1kpl76jedajcpfeb2ug58@4ax.com,
>>> "rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> all the power saver settings were already set to never and locked.
>>>>
>>>> thanks
>>>>
>>>> On 27 Jan 2006 07:53:59 +1000, "James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Turn off all energy saver stuff. Go to system preferences, energy saver,
>>>>> unlock it if necessary, set sleep options to Never. Then lock it be fore
>>>>> closing the window.
>>>>>
>>>>> I hope this helps!
>>>>>
>>>>> James
>>>>>
>>>>> rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> installed 10.4.3 (new install with zeroing out the drive as usual).
>>>>>> twice after leaving the puter idling with logic 7.1.1 up for less than
>>>>>> 1 hour the gray screen (with the in 7 languages appeared with the
>>>>>> message of you must do a hard restart) has appeared. then a complete
>>>>>> power down (computer just shut off in the midst of running on a loop);
>>>>>> calendar (set itself to 4/15/1968) needed to be reset on reboot.
>>>>>> nothing else shut down so it wasn't a power issue from outside the
>>>>>> mac. ideas?
>>>>
>>
|
|
|
|
| Re: OT...Mac...ideas on why... [message #63948 is a reply to message #63904] |
Mon, 30 January 2006 02:20 |
rick
Messages: 1976
Registered: February 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
that's a bit more reasonable, i'll check it out.
thanks
On 29 Jan 2006 13:37:16 +1000, "James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com>
wrote:
>
>Hey Rick! The battery for that machine should be about $6.00.
>
>James
>
>rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>Dedric,
>>
>>no, this has happened before but it has been a while. it actually
>>happened 3 times on the first new install and once3 since...the gray
>>screen and 8 language restart command. the whole power shutdown was
>>new for this work of art. some things i think are logic related cuz
>>it doesn't happen in DP and some things that happen in DP don't happen
>>in logic.
>>
>>i went through the ram replacement thing when i first got this thing.
>>i originally had mushkin in it (highly recommended and it was my ram
>>of choice in my pc's) but the fw800 g4 didn't know what it was so i
>>replaced it.
>>
>>i totally agree with you on the $700.00 for a battery...ain't gonna
>>happen here either.
>>
>>thanks
>>
>>On Fri, 27 Jan 2006 06:45:58 -0700, Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>Rick,
>>>
>>>Was this a one time occurrence or do kernel panics (grey screen) happen
>with
>>>any specific application open, or at random? Do you still have the original
>>>RAM or have you added any?
>>>
>>>We've been having random kernel panics and lockups on our dual G4 for over
>a
>>>year (sitting idle, typing email, doesn't matter). Reinstalled the OS
>twice
>>>(the second time crashes had tanked the system drive, so that's been
>>>replaced); tried different RAM; removed peripheral devices, etc. We don't
>>>have energy saver running here either.
>>>
>>>The only new advice I've gotten from Apple's forum is to replace the PRAM
>>>battery. Seems like a long shot as I'm guessing we have a bad logic board,
>>>but at $700 I'm not wanting to replace that just to find out.
>>>
>>>10.2.8 here, btw. 10.4.x is supposed to be more stable so you should be
>>>okay there.
>>>
>>>Regards,
>>>Dedric
>>>
>>>On 1/27/06 3:11 AM, in article jasjt1tj0f1no1kpl76jedajcpfeb2ug58@4ax.com,
>>>"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> all the power saver settings were already set to never and locked.
>>>>
>>>> thanks
>>>>
>>>> On 27 Jan 2006 07:53:59 +1000, "James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Turn off all energy saver stuff. Go to system preferences, energy saver,
>>>>> unlock it if necessary, set sleep options to Never. Then lock it be
>fore
>>>>> closing the window.
>>>>>
>>>>> I hope this helps!
>>>>>
>>>>> James
>>>>>
>>>>> rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> installed 10.4.3 (new install with zeroing out the drive as usual).
>>>>>> twice after leaving the puter idling with logic 7.1.1 up for less than
>>>>>> 1 hour the gray screen (with the in 7 languages appeared with the
>>>>>> message of you must do a hard restart) has appeared. then a complete
>>>>>> power down (computer just shut off in the midst of running on a loop);
>>>>>> calendar (set itself to 4/15/1968) needed to be reset on reboot.
>>>>>> nothing else shut down so it wasn't a power issue from outside the
>>>>>> mac. ideas?
>>>>
>>
|
|
|
|
| Re: OT...Mac...ideas on why... [message #63992 is a reply to message #63946] |
Mon, 30 January 2006 19:06 |
Dedric Terry
Messages: 788
Registered: June 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
I'm sure other DVD drives will work. Apple just won't support the Mac
anymore if we put anything else in (but we don't have Applecare, so no big
deal there).
As far as mpeg2 video, I don't know that you would want to edit mp2. DVD
mpeg2 is highly compressed and won't re-render or recompress well. If
capturing from a DV/HDV camera, it may be an m2t stream, which also won't
edit well (interleaved frames).
Regards,
Dedric
Not sure why Apple doesn't support mpeg2 for Quicktime or FCP.
On 1/30/06 3:02 AM, in article 43ddd640$1@linux, "James McCloskey"
<excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> You Apple computer will work with those other DVD drives, you just need to
> install the right drivers and DVD burning software just like on a PC. On
> a Mac, some third party manufactures ship there drives with OEM software
> for the Mac. You could also get a software like Toast for burning, and there
> are others. Apple doesn't support all the third part manufactures for obvious
> reasons, cost and the support night mirror. It's the same for the most part
> on a PC, you can't just install Windows and a third party DVD drive and
> expect it to work out of the box. You have to install third party authoring
> software to burn DVDs with it. I would say it's more like, not every drive
> manufacture supports Apple. Thanks to third party software manufacture,
> most drives are supported for the Mac.
>
> Remember Apple was the first computer company to offer DVD burners on
> computers.
> Prior to that a dvd burner cost $6,000.00, I know I was a computer dealer.
> The first Apple machine was less that $2,500.00, that was a hell of a deal
> back then. They started off with the Pioneer super drive, it was the only
> one available at that time. Pioneer had years of experience starting back
> to the pioneer laser disc. A raw Pioneer drive was about a grand back then.
> With in 6 mo. they were about $700.00 and PC manufactures were getting in
> to the game. So my hats off to Apple for blazing that trail.
>
> What does suck is how Apple has locked us out with hardware profile. This
> is basically what you are saying. There are other options available on the
> DVD front. There are many things that suck about Apple and the MS way they
> have chosen to conduct business in the last four years. They have dropped
> VST support in some of their audio products, they have no direct support
> for Mpeg2 video in some of their video products. Mpeg2 is the industry
> standard
> in video (DVD). Yet they want to say they support open industry standards,
> which is bullshit!
>
> With third party software you can do all the things you want to on a Mac,
> but that cost more money. Apple's video software, you have to convert/encode
> every thing to QuickTime, then edit your video, then encode back to to MPEG2
> to burn to DVD!!! Who in the hell has time for all that!!! Apples answer,
> oh buy our new faster machine, it encodes faster. I say F*** encoding,
> and F*** Apple!!! I went out and bough two cards for my PC and now I can
> encode in real time, and it cost me a total of $50.00 on sale!!! I no longer
> have to wait hours. So Apple has Mpeg4 in quickTime now, so what! DVD
> and Mpeg2 are the standards not Mpeg 4, I can't rent an Mpeg4 disc and play
> it in any of my DVD players. I don't think they have gotten lazy, Apple
> has just gotten greedy! They didn't want to pay Mpeg for Mpeg 2. It cost
> $20.00 just to get Mpeg2 player in QuickTime.
>
> It used to be that you could be running 8 year old software on your Mac.
> It was an advantage over PCs in many cases. Now with OSX, Apple dumps older
> hardware support. They just dumped support for my iBook G3 which is about
> 3.5 years old. So no more G3 support! They were still selling G3 models
> 2.5 years ago. iLife 06, GarageBand 3 is no longer supported on G3 models,
> they have locked us out with hardware profile. That sucks! The more Apple
> uses tactics like this the slower I and many other people will be to upgrade.
>
> I'm not totally happy with all of Apples decisions, so I can understand your
> frustration. Some of their decisions are just business decisions, and I
> under stand that too. Putting the above mentioned aside, I think Apple is
> a great company with great vision and great innovation. There audio support
> in OSX is great, and AU rocks. The concept of one company designing the
> hardware
> and writing the OS and software to run on that hardware is good. It means
> tighter integration and less problems for the end user. The trade off is
> less upgrade hardware options. Hopefully Apple will make good decisions
> when it comes to OEM products.
>
> On the DVD burner, there may be some better choices, but I can tell you that
> Pioneer is a good solid choice.
>
> As for your mouse pad, well I can't comment, I use a Kensington track ball;
> )
>
> James
>
>
> Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>> Hey James - it may have been Pioneer. Certainly nothing wrong with them,
> or
>> Plextor, Sony, Yamaha, HP, LaCie... But oddly enough Macs can sense what
>> brand memory, DVD drive and probably IDE, power and USB cables, even if
> it
>> isn't the best on the market, and lo and behold that's all they will work
>> with. IMHO, that's really lame. Worse than $399 desktop
>> Dell-don't-try-to-add-a-PCI card lame.... ;-)
>>
>> I'm surprised our Belkin mouse pad works with it. Shocked actually. I
> feel
>> lucky. Who would have thunk it. Maybe I'll play the lottery this week.
>>
>> Dedric
>>
>> On 1/28/06 8:47 PM, in article 43dc2cd4$1@linux, "James McCloskey"
>> <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Hey Dedric! I believe on the DVD drive, you need to go with Pioneer.
> They
>>> also used Sony in some of the G5s, but you would have to find out which
> one
>>> they used and go with the exact model. I do not believe they used Panasonic
>>> DVDs in the G4 or G5, but anything is possible. I put a Pioneer in my
> dual
>>> mirror G4, it works great!
>>>
>>> James
>>>
>>> Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>>>> Rick,
>>>>
>>>> Sounds like what we are seeing. I've posted on the Apple forum, but
> not
>>>> much help there yet - mostly people suggesting what I said in my posts
> I
>>> had
>>>> already done.
>>>>
>>>> The picky Ram issue with Macs really irritates me - Mushkin is probably
>>>> better than what they spec (although one user suggested crucial). Also
>>> our
>>>> combo drive won't burn DVDs - just CDs. Apple says a replacement would
>>> have
>>>> to be a Panasonic. Why Panasonic? What about Plextor, etc? I also
> found
>>>> that our Mac couldn't support IDE cables longer than the 6" or so ones
> that
>>>> come with it (even high quality 10-12" cables). The only reason for
> a Mac
>>>> being so picky about part manufacturers (down to there being only one
> in
>>>> some cases) is poor design tolerances, period. They just tried to cut
>>>> corners and extend the profit margin by not designing a more robust system
>>>> with more power to the IDE busses, etc. Easier to pack it all in a spiffy
>>>> looking case if you get it working in one config and don't have to worry
>>>> about better ground planes, isolation, etc. Then it is all sold as "this
>>> is
>>>> what is guaranteed to work" making customers think they are getting a
> highly
>>>> spec'd system. BS. It's nothing but lazy design and lazy support -
> easier
>>>> to say "buy one of these" than actually find a problem.
>>>>
>>>> Yeah, $700 for a 2+ yr old motherboard that in the PC world would run
> about
>>>> $125. I'm considering building my wife (it's her G4) a dual core AMD
> or
>>>> Intel and just crossgrading our design software to PC. Probably less
>>>> expensive than buying a new MacIntel.
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Dedric
>>>>
>>>> On 1/28/06 2:53 PM, in article hgpnt1d6mc6flt4492eqjg8n6dhi7qpvf8@4ax.com,
>>>> "rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Dedric,
>>>>>
>>>>> no, this has happened before but it has been a while. it actually
>>>>> happened 3 times on the first new install and once3 since...the gray
>>>>> screen and 8 language restart command. the whole power shutdown was
>>>>> new for this work of art. some things i think are logic related cuz
>>>>> it doesn't happen in DP and some things that happen in DP don't happen
>>>>> in logic.
>>>>>
>>>>> i went through the ram replacement thing when i first got this thing.
>>>>> i originally had mushkin in it (highly recommended and it was my ram
>>>>> of choice in my pc's) but the fw800 g4 didn't know what it was so i
>>>>> replaced it.
>>>>>
>>>>> i totally agree with you on the $700.00 for a battery...ain't gonna
>>>>> happen here either.
>>>>>
>>>>> thanks
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, 27 Jan 2006 06:45:58 -0700, Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Rick,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Was this a one time occurrence or do kernel panics (grey screen) happen
>>> with
>>>>>> any specific application open, or at random? Do you still have the
>>>>>> original
>>>>>> RAM or have you added any?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We've been having random kernel panics and lockups on our dual G4 for
>>> over a
>>>>>> year (sitting idle, typing email, doesn't matter). Reinstalled the
> OS
>>> twice
>>>>>> (the second time crashes had tanked the system drive, so that's been
>>>>>> replaced); tried different RAM; removed peripheral devices, etc. We
>>> don't
>>>>>> have energy saver running here either.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The only new advice I've gotten from Apple's forum is to replace the
>>> PRAM
>>>>>> battery. Seems like a long shot as I'm guessing we have a bad logic
>>> board,
>>>>>> but at $700 I'm not wanting to replace that just to find out.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 10.2.8 here, btw. 10.4.x is supposed to be more stable so you should
>>> be
>>>>>> okay there.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>> Dedric
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 1/27/06 3:11 AM, in article
>>>>>> jasjt1tj0f1no1kpl76jedajcpfeb2ug58@4ax.com,
>>>>>> "rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> all the power saver settings were already set to never and locked.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> thanks
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 27 Jan 2006 07:53:59 +1000, "James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Turn off all energy saver stuff. Go to system preferences, energy
>>> saver,
>>>>>>>> unlock it if necessary, set sleep options to Never. Then lock it
> be
>>> fore
>>>>>>>> closing the window.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I hope this helps!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> James
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> installed 10.4.3 (new install with zeroing out the drive as usual).
>>>>>>>>> twice after leaving the puter idling with logic 7.1.1 up for less
>>> than
>>>>>>>>> 1 hour the gray screen (with the in 7 languages appeared with the
>>>>>>>>> message of you must do a hard restart) has appeared. then a complete
>>>>>>>>> power down (computer just shut off in the midst of running on a
> loop);
>>>>>>>>> calendar (set itself to 4/15/1968) needed to be reset on reboot.
>>>>>>>>> nothing else shut down so it wasn't a power issue from outside the
>>>>>>>>> mac. ideas?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: OT...Mac...ideas on why... [message #63997 is a reply to message #63992] |
Mon, 30 January 2006 23:55 |
excelav
Messages: 2130
Registered: July 2005
Location: Metro Detroit
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>I'm sure other DVD drives will work. Apple just won't support the Mac
>anymore if we put anything else in (but we don't have Applecare, so no big
>deal there).
>
>As far as mpeg2 video, I don't know that you would want to edit mp2. DVD
>mpeg2 is highly compressed and won't re-render or recompress well. If
>capturing from a DV/HDV camera, it may be an m2t stream, which also won't
>edit well (interleaved frames).
>
>Regards,
>Dedric
>
>Not sure why Apple doesn't support mpeg2 for Quicktime or FCP.
Not all my videos need to be masterpieces. Sometimes I just need a quick
and dirty clean up, some basic editing, and then burn to a DVD. I can do
this faster on my PC in Mpeg2, it's a lot more time on my Mac. The Mac is
great for more professional productions, when I've got the time.
James
>
>On 1/30/06 3:02 AM, in article 43ddd640$1@linux, "James McCloskey"
><excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> You Apple computer will work with those other DVD drives, you just need
to
>> install the right drivers and DVD burning software just like on a PC.
On
>> a Mac, some third party manufactures ship there drives with OEM software
>> for the Mac. You could also get a software like Toast for burning, and
there
>> are others. Apple doesn't support all the third part manufactures for
obvious
>> reasons, cost and the support night mirror. It's the same for the most
part
>> on a PC, you can't just install Windows and a third party DVD drive and
>> expect it to work out of the box. You have to install third party authoring
>> software to burn DVDs with it. I would say it's more like, not every
drive
>> manufacture supports Apple. Thanks to third party software manufacture,
>> most drives are supported for the Mac.
>>
>> Remember Apple was the first computer company to offer DVD burners on
>> computers.
>> Prior to that a dvd burner cost $6,000.00, I know I was a computer dealer.
>> The first Apple machine was less that $2,500.00, that was a hell of a
deal
>> back then. They started off with the Pioneer super drive, it was the
only
>> one available at that time. Pioneer had years of experience starting
back
>> to the pioneer laser disc. A raw Pioneer drive was about a grand back
then.
>> With in 6 mo. they were about $700.00 and PC manufactures were getting
in
>> to the game. So my hats off to Apple for blazing that trail.
>>
>> What does suck is how Apple has locked us out with hardware profile.
This
>> is basically what you are saying. There are other options available on
the
>> DVD front. There are many things that suck about Apple and the MS way
they
>> have chosen to conduct business in the last four years. They have dropped
>> VST support in some of their audio products, they have no direct support
>> for Mpeg2 video in some of their video products. Mpeg2 is the industry
>> standard
>> in video (DVD). Yet they want to say they support open industry standards,
>> which is bullshit!
>>
>> With third party software you can do all the things you want to on a Mac,
>> but that cost more money. Apple's video software, you have to convert/encode
>> every thing to QuickTime, then edit your video, then encode back to to
MPEG2
>> to burn to DVD!!! Who in the hell has time for all that!!! Apples answer,
>> oh buy our new faster machine, it encodes faster. I say F*** encoding,
>> and F*** Apple!!! I went out and bough two cards for my PC and now I
can
>> encode in real time, and it cost me a total of $50.00 on sale!!! I no
longer
>> have to wait hours. So Apple has Mpeg4 in quickTime now, so what! DVD
>> and Mpeg2 are the standards not Mpeg 4, I can't rent an Mpeg4 disc and
play
>> it in any of my DVD players. I don't think they have gotten lazy, Apple
>> has just gotten greedy! They didn't want to pay Mpeg for Mpeg 2. It
cost
>> $20.00 just to get Mpeg2 player in QuickTime.
>>
>> It used to be that you could be running 8 year old software on your Mac.
>> It was an advantage over PCs in many cases. Now with OSX, Apple dumps
older
>> hardware support. They just dumped support for my iBook G3 which is about
>> 3.5 years old. So no more G3 support! They were still selling G3 models
>> 2.5 years ago. iLife 06, GarageBand 3 is no longer supported on G3 models,
>> they have locked us out with hardware profile. That sucks! The more
Apple
>> uses tactics like this the slower I and many other people will be to upgrade.
>>
>> I'm not totally happy with all of Apples decisions, so I can understand
your
>> frustration. Some of their decisions are just business decisions, and
I
>> under stand that too. Putting the above mentioned aside, I think Apple
is
>> a great company with great vision and great innovation. There audio support
>> in OSX is great, and AU rocks. The concept of one company designing the
>> hardware
>> and writing the OS and software to run on that hardware is good. It means
>> tighter integration and less problems for the end user. The trade off
is
>> less upgrade hardware options. Hopefully Apple will make good decisions
>> when it comes to OEM products.
>>
>> On the DVD burner, there may be some better choices, but I can tell you
that
>> Pioneer is a good solid choice.
>>
>> As for your mouse pad, well I can't comment, I use a Kensington track
ball;
>> )
>>
>> James
>>
>>
>> Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>>> Hey James - it may have been Pioneer. Certainly nothing wrong with them,
>> or
>>> Plextor, Sony, Yamaha, HP, LaCie... But oddly enough Macs can sense what
>>> brand memory, DVD drive and probably IDE, power and USB cables, even
if
>> it
>>> isn't the best on the market, and lo and behold that's all they will
work
>>> with. IMHO, that's really lame. Worse than $399 desktop
>>> Dell-don't-try-to-add-a-PCI card lame.... ;-)
>>>
>>> I'm surprised our Belkin mouse pad works with it. Shocked actually.
I
>> feel
>>> lucky. Who would have thunk it. Maybe I'll play the lottery this week.
>>>
>>> Dedric
>>>
>>> On 1/28/06 8:47 PM, in article 43dc2cd4$1@linux, "James McCloskey"
>>> <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hey Dedric! I believe on the DVD drive, you need to go with Pioneer.
>> They
>>>> also used Sony in some of the G5s, but you would have to find out which
>> one
>>>> they used and go with the exact model. I do not believe they used Panasonic
>>>> DVDs in the G4 or G5, but anything is possible. I put a Pioneer in
my
>> dual
>>>> mirror G4, it works great!
>>>>
>>>> James
>>>>
>>>> Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>>>>> Rick,
>>>>>
>>>>> Sounds like what we are seeing. I've posted on the Apple forum, but
>> not
>>>>> much help there yet - mostly people suggesting what I said in my posts
>> I
>>>> had
>>>>> already done.
>>>>>
>>>>> The picky Ram issue with Macs really irritates me - Mushkin is probably
>>>>> better than what they spec (although one user suggested crucial).
Also
>>>> our
>>>>> combo drive won't burn DVDs - just CDs. Apple says a replacement would
>>>> have
>>>>> to be a Panasonic. Why Panasonic? What about Plextor, etc? I also
>> found
>>>>> that our Mac couldn't support IDE cables longer than the 6" or so ones
>> that
>>>>> come with it (even high quality 10-12" cables). The only reason for
>> a Mac
>>>>> being so picky about part manufacturers (down to there being only one
>> in
>>>>> some cases) is poor design tolerances, period. They just tried to
cut
>>>>> corners and extend the profit margin by not designing a more robust
system
>>>>> with more power to the IDE busses, etc. Easier to pack it all in a
spiffy
>>>>> looking case if you get it working in one config and don't have to
worry
>>>>> about better ground planes, isolation, etc. Then it is all sold as
"this
>>>> is
>>>>> what is guaranteed to work" making customers think they are getting
a
>> highly
>>>>> spec'd system. BS. It's nothing but lazy design and lazy support
-
>> easier
>>>>> to say "buy one of these" than actually find a problem.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yeah, $700 for a 2+ yr old motherboard that in the PC world would run
>> about
>>>>> $125. I'm considering building my wife (it's her G4) a dual core AMD
>> or
>>>>> Intel and just crossgrading our design software to PC. Probably less
>>>>> expensive than buying a new MacIntel.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> Dedric
>>>>>
>>>>> On 1/28/06 2:53 PM, in article hgpnt1d6mc6flt4492eqjg8n6dhi7qpvf8@4ax.com,
>>>>> "rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Dedric,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> no, this has happened before but it has been a while. it actually
>>>>>> happened 3 times on the first new install and once3 since...the gray
>>>>>> screen and 8 language restart command. the whole power shutdown was
>>>>>> new for this work of art. some things i think are logic related cuz
>>>>>> it doesn't happen in DP and some things that happen in DP don't happen
>>>>>> in logic.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> i went through the ram replacement thing when i first got this thing.
>>>>>> i originally had mushkin in it (highly recommended and it was my ram
>>>>>> of choice in my pc's) but the fw800 g4 didn't know what it was so
i
>>>>>> replaced it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> i totally agree with you on the $700.00 for a battery...ain't gonna
>>>>>> happen here either.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> thanks
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, 27 Jan 2006 06:45:58 -0700, Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Rick,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Was this a one time occurrence or do kernel panics (grey screen)
happen
>>>> with
>>>>>>> any specific application open, or at random? Do you still have the
>>>>>>> original
>>>>>>> RAM or have you added any?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> We've been having random kernel panics and lockups on our dual G4
for
>>>> over a
>>>>>>> year (sitting idle, typing email, doesn't matter). Reinstalled the
>> OS
>>>> twice
>>>>>>> (the second time crashes had tanked the system drive, so that's been
>>>>>>> replaced); tried different RAM; removed peripheral devices, etc.
We
>>>> don't
>>>>>>> have energy saver running here either.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The only new advice I've gotten from Apple's forum is to replace
the
>>>> PRAM
>>>>>>> battery. Seems like a long shot as I'm guessing we have a bad logic
>>>> board,
>>>>>>> but at $700 I'm not wanting to replace that just to find out.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 10.2.8 here, btw. 10.4.x is supposed to be more stable so you should
>>>> be
>>>>>>> okay there.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>> Dedric
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 1/27/06 3:11 AM, in article
>>>>>>> jasjt1tj0f1no1kpl76jedajcpfeb2ug58@4ax.com,
>>>>>>> "rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> all the power saver settings were already set to never and locked.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> thanks
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 27 Jan 2006 07:53:59 +1000, "James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Turn off all energy saver stuff. Go to system preferences, energy
>>>> saver,
>>>>>>>>> unlock it if necessary, set sleep options to Never. Then lock
it
>> be
>>>> fore
>>>>>>>>> closing the window.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I hope this helps!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> James
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> installed 10.4.3 (new install with zeroing out the drive as usual).
>>>>>>>>>> twice after leaving the puter idling with logic 7.1.1 up for less
>>>> than
>>>>>>>>>> 1 hour the gray screen (with the in 7 languages appeared with
the
>>>>>>>>>> message of you must do a hard restart) has appeared. then a complete
>>>>>>>>>> power down (computer just shut off in the midst of running on
a
>> loop);
>>>>>>>>>> calendar (set itself to 4/15/1968) needed to be reset on reboot.
>>>>>>>>>> nothing else shut down so it wasn't a power issue from outside
the
>>>>>>>>>> mac. ideas?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>>
>
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