| Methods for drum bussing in Paris [message #105907] |
Tue, 04 January 2011 13:33  |
Ted Gerber
Messages: 705
Registered: January 2009
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Senior Member |
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So - amidst all the well known limitations of the Paris architecture - 16 tracks per submix; no automatic delay compensation; 48K max sample rate; no native plugins on Master buss etc etc, the thing that I struggle with the most is related to the last item, namely how to handle busses in Paris, specifically drum busses. Most other tracks I want to group and process together can be handled as stereo tracks or by dropping the same eq/compressor plugin as a Native insert across the tracks in question, while simultaneously linking them in the "groups" window with relative fader, or inverse pan etc.
Drums are different though, with some of the tracks needing to be eq'd/comp'd separately and others needing to be grouped and processed together. With any other modern DAW now, this is easy. With Paris it isn't. DFrakencopter's work with Senderella looked promising last Spring (sending tracks to a Native submix for processing in "real time"), but in the end, it didn't work out.
Wondering how folks are doing it in Paris...
Right now, I'm generally approximating everything I want to do to the individual tracks, (drum replacement, eq/comp etc) then bouncing those tracks down to L/R and reinserting that unto the playing field to be processed as a group (verbs eq compression).
The problem of course, is that if something needs further tweaking then I have to step backwards and work on the individual tracks in question and re-bounce. Big PITA.
What do you folks do? Is there another way that's simpler?
Ted
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| Re: Methods for drum bussing in Paris [message #105909 is a reply to message #105907] |
Tue, 04 January 2011 15:47  |
dnafe
Messages: 390
Registered: February 2009
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Senior Member |
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Off the top of my head
I've sent the drums through the FX sends in stereo or dual mono
I've used Chucks in / out plugs to send all the desired drum tracks to 2 new tracks
I've used Senderella within an active sub mix like Chucks plugs - even tried a quicky across submixes and into native submixes with some success but didn't pursue it as life got in the way
I've flown them out of Paris into Reaper on another rig, processed them then flew them back to where ever I pleased inside Paris
And I've rendered a stereo drum stem
hope that's what you were looking for
[Updated on: Tue, 04 January 2011 15:49] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Methods for drum bussing in Paris [message #105912 is a reply to message #105911] |
Wed, 05 January 2011 03:39 |
dnafe
Messages: 390
Registered: February 2009
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Senior Member |
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Chucks EDS line in / out inserts were something like senderella...insert a line out into a track, select a channel to send on then on an empty track insert a line in and select the same channel to receive on and you're done - bussing a track across to another track inside a submix.
Make sense?
edit - I forgot to say that although my FX routing is done internally I believe DJ used to route stuff via the FX sends to external dynamic processors and FX all the time - I think I still have his patch bay layout for that, let me see if I can find it and post it here and on the Wiki site
[Updated on: Wed, 05 January 2011 04:20] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Methods for drum bussing in Paris [message #105925 is a reply to message #105924] |
Thu, 06 January 2011 06:04 |
drfrankencopter
Messages: 137
Registered: July 2009
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Senior Member |
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Oh, and here's a copy of the bit of the manual explaining the limitations of Paris-Senderella:
Gottcha's (Tricks & Traps)
Over the course of the development of this plugin I've learned a fair bit about how to get it to work within PARIS, and here are my tips:
1) Only use Paris-Senderella on tracks that have been rendered or bounced, and that have no edit handles other than at the start and end. If Paris-Senderella encounters a start/end handle the latency will become unpredictable and could go as high as 90 ms. Sorry, but no crossfades either...
2) Channel 1 on submix 1 has an issue for wavs that start right at the leftmost extent of the timeline. I'm not sure why...just another strange PARIS thing. If you want to put Paris-Senderella on channel 1, move the zero time (via the locator window) to slightly inside the object (again, you need to prevent the plugin from encountering the object start handles). I didn't experience this problem on other channels, but if it pops up I'd say the fix is the same, start the transport inside the objects, not before them.
3) When using 16 bit send tracks the dummy track audio for the returns can be 16 bit or 24 bit on either EDS or Native submixes.
4) When using 24 bit send tracks, you can use only 24 bit dummy tracks on the returns on EDS submixes. 16 or 24 bit dummy tracks for the returns work for the Native submixes. This is why I suggest just using a single 24 bit silence track.
Issue (2) could result in lots of folks trying it out and being disappointed with the results...I mean who doesn't try things out on track 1 submix 1 of a new project? The trick is to move the zero time to just inside the object start. Paris is bizarre in how it handles plugins.
Cheers
Kris
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