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| Re: My new guitar amp [message #64508 is a reply to message #64504] |
Mon, 13 February 2006 12:35   |
DC
Messages: 722
Registered: July 2005
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Senior Member |
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When I was about 20 I had a band in San Diego. Now, my Dad was
an old jazz guy who *hated* rock music and was always criticizing
it whenever he had the chance. One night he was grousing about
how lousy the guitar players in rock were, and I asked him,
Ok, so who is a great player in your mind?
Oh "Charlie Christian, you rock guys aren't even in the league with
him" he says.
Charlie's great, I agreed, but you don't have to hate rock to love
jazz do you?
Ahhhh, them rock guys are terrible, you should play like CC!
Sooo off to band practice I go. Afterwards, I showed the guys a
thing I had made up, kind of an old shuffle played through a
Hammond orgam amp. The piano guy picked it right up and
everyone else joined in, and an evil plan started forming in my
mind...
We put up a cassette recorder and ran through it again, and I said
thanks, and went home.
When I got home I found Dad and said "HEY! I was at the Library
and they had a copy of an unreleased Charlie Christian number"
"I got a copy and brought it home, want to hear it??"
Sure! says Dad.
So I put on this cassette we had just recorded at practice.
And...
"Hmmm, I don't know this one"
"I like it"
Then a little lead break comes in and he says:
"OH YEAH THAT'S CHARLIE THERE! You kids oughta learn
something from that, you guys can't do great music like this!!"
And I fell about the living room laughing... just lost it...
HEY DAD, THAT'S US! HAH HAH HAA That's ME on guitar!!!
Oh hey, it was funny...
He didn't say a word. disappeared into his bedroom for the night
and never hassled me about music again. Years later when we
got in the paper for a show, he took it to work and bragged about
his kid the guitar player...
I was a mean kid...
heh hehh
DC
"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>
>At one point in my life I learned about half a dozen Charlie Christian solos
>note for note. I could translate practically zero of it into anything useful,
>other that that CC was a supremely melodic thinker and player. I couldn't
>figure out much of anything about the way he was thinking about putting
things
>together. I'm sure a better player could, but I sure couldn't.
>
>TC
>
>"Bill Lorentzen" <bill@lorentzen.ws> wrote:
>>DC, you haf=ve Charlie Chrisitan listed in your Lines. Do you play his
>>lines?
>>
>>Bill
>>
>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.org> wrote in message news:43ece0ac$1@linux...
>>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> Here's a review of my new amp. Boy is it nice.
>>>
>>> http://dcguitarjournal.blogspot.com/
>>>
>>> DC
>>>
>>
>>
>
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| Re: My new guitar amp [message #64519 is a reply to message #64508] |
Mon, 13 February 2006 17:43 |
Bill Lorentzen
Messages: 140
Registered: June 2005
|
Senior Member |
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You were mean, but he deserved it.
"DC" <dc@spamyermama.com> wrote in message news:43f0df73$1@linux...
>
> When I was about 20 I had a band in San Diego. Now, my Dad was
> an old jazz guy who *hated* rock music and was always criticizing
> it whenever he had the chance. One night he was grousing about
> how lousy the guitar players in rock were, and I asked him,
>
> Ok, so who is a great player in your mind?
>
> Oh "Charlie Christian, you rock guys aren't even in the league with
> him" he says.
>
> Charlie's great, I agreed, but you don't have to hate rock to love
> jazz do you?
>
> Ahhhh, them rock guys are terrible, you should play like CC!
>
> Sooo off to band practice I go. Afterwards, I showed the guys a
> thing I had made up, kind of an old shuffle played through a
> Hammond orgam amp. The piano guy picked it right up and
> everyone else joined in, and an evil plan started forming in my
> mind...
>
> We put up a cassette recorder and ran through it again, and I said
> thanks, and went home.
>
> When I got home I found Dad and said "HEY! I was at the Library
> and they had a copy of an unreleased Charlie Christian number"
> "I got a copy and brought it home, want to hear it??"
>
> Sure! says Dad.
>
> So I put on this cassette we had just recorded at practice.
>
> And...
>
> "Hmmm, I don't know this one"
>
> "I like it"
>
> Then a little lead break comes in and he says:
>
> "OH YEAH THAT'S CHARLIE THERE! You kids oughta learn
> something from that, you guys can't do great music like this!!"
>
> And I fell about the living room laughing... just lost it...
>
> HEY DAD, THAT'S US! HAH HAH HAA That's ME on guitar!!!
>
> Oh hey, it was funny...
>
> He didn't say a word. disappeared into his bedroom for the night
> and never hassled me about music again. Years later when we
> got in the paper for a show, he took it to work and bragged about
> his kid the guitar player...
>
> I was a mean kid...
>
> heh hehh
>
> DC
>
>
> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>
>>At one point in my life I learned about half a dozen Charlie Christian
>>solos
>>note for note. I could translate practically zero of it into anything
>>useful,
>>other that that CC was a supremely melodic thinker and player. I couldn't
>>figure out much of anything about the way he was thinking about putting
> things
>>together. I'm sure a better player could, but I sure couldn't.
>>
>>TC
>>
>>"Bill Lorentzen" <bill@lorentzen.ws> wrote:
>>>DC, you haf=ve Charlie Chrisitan listed in your Lines. Do you play his
>
>>>lines?
>>>
>>>Bill
>>>
>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.org> wrote in message news:43ece0ac$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> Hi all,
>>>>
>>>> Here's a review of my new amp. Boy is it nice.
>>>>
>>>> http://dcguitarjournal.blogspot.com/
>>>>
>>>> DC
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
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| Re: My new guitar amp [message #64521 is a reply to message #64519] |
Mon, 13 February 2006 20:11 |
DC
Messages: 722
Registered: July 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Yeah, and then I got mine when I actually listened to lots of CC...
That's why I am a rock and blues guy and a big fan of jazz...
If you know what I mean.
DC
"Bill Lorentzen" <bill@lorentzen.ws> wrote:
>You were mean, but he deserved it.
>
>
>"DC" <dc@spamyermama.com> wrote in message news:43f0df73$1@linux...
>>
>> When I was about 20 I had a band in San Diego. Now, my Dad was
>> an old jazz guy who *hated* rock music and was always criticizing
>> it whenever he had the chance. One night he was grousing about
>> how lousy the guitar players in rock were, and I asked him,
>>
>> Ok, so who is a great player in your mind?
>>
>> Oh "Charlie Christian, you rock guys aren't even in the league with
>> him" he says.
>>
>> Charlie's great, I agreed, but you don't have to hate rock to love
>> jazz do you?
>>
>> Ahhhh, them rock guys are terrible, you should play like CC!
>>
>> Sooo off to band practice I go. Afterwards, I showed the guys a
>> thing I had made up, kind of an old shuffle played through a
>> Hammond orgam amp. The piano guy picked it right up and
>> everyone else joined in, and an evil plan started forming in my
>> mind...
>>
>> We put up a cassette recorder and ran through it again, and I said
>> thanks, and went home.
>>
>> When I got home I found Dad and said "HEY! I was at the Library
>> and they had a copy of an unreleased Charlie Christian number"
>> "I got a copy and brought it home, want to hear it??"
>>
>> Sure! says Dad.
>>
>> So I put on this cassette we had just recorded at practice.
>>
>> And...
>>
>> "Hmmm, I don't know this one"
>>
>> "I like it"
>>
>> Then a little lead break comes in and he says:
>>
>> "OH YEAH THAT'S CHARLIE THERE! You kids oughta learn
>> something from that, you guys can't do great music like this!!"
>>
>> And I fell about the living room laughing... just lost it...
>>
>> HEY DAD, THAT'S US! HAH HAH HAA That's ME on guitar!!!
>>
>> Oh hey, it was funny...
>>
>> He didn't say a word. disappeared into his bedroom for the night
>> and never hassled me about music again. Years later when we
>> got in the paper for a show, he took it to work and bragged about
>> his kid the guitar player...
>>
>> I was a mean kid...
>>
>> heh hehh
>>
>> DC
>>
>>
>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>At one point in my life I learned about half a dozen Charlie Christian
>>>solos
>>>note for note. I could translate practically zero of it into anything
>>>useful,
>>>other that that CC was a supremely melodic thinker and player. I couldn't
>>>figure out much of anything about the way he was thinking about putting
>> things
>>>together. I'm sure a better player could, but I sure couldn't.
>>>
>>>TC
>>>
>>>"Bill Lorentzen" <bill@lorentzen.ws> wrote:
>>>>DC, you haf=ve Charlie Chrisitan listed in your Lines. Do you play his
>>
>>>>lines?
>>>>
>>>>Bill
>>>>
>>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.org> wrote in message news:43ece0ac$1@linux...
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>
>>>>> Here's a review of my new amp. Boy is it nice.
>>>>>
>>>>> http://dcguitarjournal.blogspot.com/
>>>>>
>>>>> DC
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
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| Re: My new guitar amp [message #64534 is a reply to message #64520] |
Tue, 14 February 2006 11:30 |
TCB
Messages: 1261
Registered: July 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Agreed, but my harmony knowledge is pretty decent. I'm not great, but I can
hear what, say, Wes Montgomery is doing or what Miles is doing reasonably
well. I can't do it myself but I can say, "Hmmm, that's a Lydian blues lick
of all things."
Personally I think CC is so hard to understand because he was _not_ thinking
about harmony, and especially not about modal harmony as jazz is taught these
days. There's more of that on some of the lo-fi "jam" tapes that exist but
even then he doesn't sound like he's thinking as theoretically as the other
proto-beboppers. But then again, I'm not a jazz player so what do I know.
TCB
"Bill Lorentzen" <bill@lorentzen.ws> wrote:
>I know what you went through Thad. When I was really young I was in a band
>that had me learn a lot of solos note for note. There were some solos i
>could not figure out what the guy was thinking, and the missing
>understanding was the harmonization. I did not understand the chord
>progressions. Most rock players start out with the blues 1/4/5 progression
>and never learn about the 2/5/1 progression that jazz uses. The real fun
is
>when you play the 2/5/1 inside a 4/5/1 - bebop blues.
>
>Bill
>
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:43f0d61c$1@linux...
>>
>> At one point in my life I learned about half a dozen Charlie Christian
>> solos
>> note for note. I could translate practically zero of it into anything
>> useful,
>> other that that CC was a supremely melodic thinker and player. I couldn't
>> figure out much of anything about the way he was thinking about putting
>> things
>> together. I'm sure a better player could, but I sure couldn't.
>>
>> TC
>>
>> "Bill Lorentzen" <bill@lorentzen.ws> wrote:
>>>DC, you haf=ve Charlie Chrisitan listed in your Lines. Do you play his
>>>lines?
>>>
>>>Bill
>>>
>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.org> wrote in message news:43ece0ac$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> Hi all,
>>>>
>>>> Here's a review of my new amp. Boy is it nice.
>>>>
>>>> http://dcguitarjournal.blogspot.com/
>>>>
>>>> DC
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
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| Re: My new guitar amp [message #64563 is a reply to message #64534] |
Wed, 15 February 2006 10:59 |
steve the artguy
Messages: 308
Registered: June 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
my own personal opinion is that the brain works on two levels, the intellectual
and emotional. You can intellectually figure out things musically from now
until forever, and come up with what should be a good jazz solo line, or,
with sufficient background in the music and physical facility, you can just
forget all about that lydian/modal stuff and just let the music come out.
Well, sometimes you can. Perhaps it's rationalization after the fact.
Dizzy or Louis could play whole solos, if they chose, with only one or two
well placed notes. Miles, too. Scales not necessary. It's the placement that's
important.
But my opinion is that CC couldn't have cared less about scales and modes
and what does and doesn't work. He just did it. I'm just guessing here, but
he was a young kid from the sticks.. I don't think he had years of music
theory. He just listened and played. That's why he so confounded schooled
players.
Reminds me of a supposed meeting between Fats Waller and Artur Rubinstein.
I may have the names mixed up -- you can substitute "great jazz pianist"
and "great classical pianist" -- but the story went that AR said, here's
a chorus of, oh, some standard jazz tune, like "I've Got Rhythm", and he
played it, and AT said, that's great! and AR said, well, I've been working
it out for the last two months. So AT sat down and ripped one off, equally
great. AR said, wow, when did you write that? and AT said, just now, when
I sat down...
-steve
"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>
>Agreed, but my harmony knowledge is pretty decent. I'm not great, but I
can
>hear what, say, Wes Montgomery is doing or what Miles is doing reasonably
>well. I can't do it myself but I can say, "Hmmm, that's a Lydian blues lick
>of all things."
>
>Personally I think CC is so hard to understand because he was _not_ thinking
>about harmony, and especially not about modal harmony as jazz is taught
these
>days. There's more of that on some of the lo-fi "jam" tapes that exist but
>even then he doesn't sound like he's thinking as theoretically as the other
>proto-beboppers. But then again, I'm not a jazz player so what do I know.
>
>
>TCB
>
>"Bill Lorentzen" <bill@lorentzen.ws> wrote:
>>I know what you went through Thad. When I was really young I was in a band
>
>>that had me learn a lot of solos note for note. There were some solos i
>
>>could not figure out what the guy was thinking, and the missing
>>understanding was the harmonization. I did not understand the chord
>>progressions. Most rock players start out with the blues 1/4/5 progression
>
>>and never learn about the 2/5/1 progression that jazz uses. The real fun
>is
>>when you play the 2/5/1 inside a 4/5/1 - bebop blues.
>>
>>Bill
>>
>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:43f0d61c$1@linux...
>>>
>>> At one point in my life I learned about half a dozen Charlie Christian
>
>>> solos
>>> note for note. I could translate practically zero of it into anything
>
>>> useful,
>>> other that that CC was a supremely melodic thinker and player. I couldn't
>>> figure out much of anything about the way he was thinking about putting
>
>>> things
>>> together. I'm sure a better player could, but I sure couldn't.
>>>
>>> TC
>>>
>>> "Bill Lorentzen" <bill@lorentzen.ws> wrote:
>>>>DC, you haf=ve Charlie Chrisitan listed in your Lines. Do you play his
>>>>lines?
>>>>
>>>>Bill
>>>>
>>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.org> wrote in message news:43ece0ac$1@linux...
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>
>>>>> Here's a review of my new amp. Boy is it nice.
>>>>>
>>>>> http://dcguitarjournal.blogspot.com/
>>>>>
>>>>> DC
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
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