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| Mastering in Paris [message #68651] |
Fri, 26 May 2006 21:57  |
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dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
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Senior Member |
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Hey all,
I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for the
help with this.
More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar material
that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the details.
Paris lives!
DC
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| Re: Mastering in Paris [message #68707 is a reply to message #68679] |
Sat, 27 May 2006 23:11  |
dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
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Senior Member |
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Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most of the
day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4 stereo
bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
(yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
friggin' fabulous.
Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it seems
like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
DC
DC
>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>
>>
>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>
>>> Hey all,
>>>
>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for the
>>> help with this.
>>>
>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar material
>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>
>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the details.
>>>
>>> Paris lives!
>>>
>>> DC
>>>
>>
>>
>
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| Re: Mastering in Paris [message #68709 is a reply to message #68707] |
Sat, 27 May 2006 23:57 |
Aaron Allen
Messages: 1988
Registered: May 2008
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Senior Member |
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> I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
> is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
> set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
> (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris VST EQ,
and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the VST
Paris EQ for this application yet?
It doth rock much.
AA
"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:44793f10$1@linux...
>
> Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most of the
> day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>
> It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4 stereo
> bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>
> I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
> is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
> set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
> (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>
> It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>
> HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
> friggin' fabulous.
>
> Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>
> There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
> headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
> mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
> works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it seems
> like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>
> Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>
> DC
>
> DC
>
>
>>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>
>>>
>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> Hey all,
>>>>
>>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for the
>>>> help with this.
>>>>
>>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar material
>>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>>
>>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the details.
>>>>
>>>> Paris lives!
>>>>
>>>> DC
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
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| Re: Mastering in Paris [message #68725 is a reply to message #68709] |
Sun, 28 May 2006 09:57 |
Edna Sloan
Messages: 304
Registered: October 2005
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Senior Member |
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Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
Thanks, Edna
"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
news:447948de$1@linux...
>
> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>
> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris VST EQ,
> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the VST
> Paris EQ for this application yet?
> It doth rock much.
>
> AA
>
>
>
> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:44793f10$1@linux...
> >
> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most of the
> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
> >
> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4 stereo
> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
> >
> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
> >
> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
> >
> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
> > friggin' fabulous.
> >
> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
> >
> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it seems
> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
> >
> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
> >
> > DC
> >
> > DC
> >
> >
> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:4477dc50$1@linux...
> >>>>
> >>>> Hey all,
> >>>>
> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for the
> >>>> help with this.
> >>>>
> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar material
> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
> >>>>
> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the details.
> >>>>
> >>>> Paris lives!
> >>>>
> >>>> DC
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >
>
>
> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>
>
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| Re: Mastering in Paris [message #68734 is a reply to message #68725] |
Sun, 28 May 2006 13:43 |
DC
Messages: 722
Registered: July 2005
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Senior Member |
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As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
Sounds great though.
DC
"RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>Thanks, Edna
>
>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>
>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>
>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris VST
EQ,
>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the VST
>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>> It doth rock much.
>>
>> AA
>>
>>
>>
>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:44793f10$1@linux...
>> >
>> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most of the
>> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>> >
>> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4 stereo
>> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>> >
>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>> >
>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>> >
>> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>> > friggin' fabulous.
>> >
>> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>> >
>> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it seems
>> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>> >
>> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>> >
>> > DC
>> >
>> > DC
>> >
>> >
>> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Hey all,
>> >>>>
>> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for the
>> >>>> help with this.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar material
>> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>> >>>>
>> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the details.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Paris lives!
>> >>>>
>> >>>> DC
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >
>>
>>
>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>
>>
>
>
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| Re: Mastering in Paris [message #68743 is a reply to message #68734] |
Mon, 29 May 2006 03:48 |
John [1]
Messages: 2229
Registered: September 2005
|
Senior Member |
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Why not use a linear phase EQ?
DC wrote:
> As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
> What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
> does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>
> Sounds great though.
>
> DC
>
>
> "RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>
>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>Thanks, Edna
>>
>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>
>>>>I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>>>is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>>>set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>>>editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>>>(yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>>
>>>DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris VST
>
> EQ,
>
>>>and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the VST
>>>Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>>It doth rock much.
>>>
>>>AA
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>>
>>>>Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most of the
>>>>day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>>>
>>>>It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4 stereo
>>>>bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>>>
>>>>I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>>>is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>>>set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>>>editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>>>(yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>>>
>>>>It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>>>
>>>>HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>>>>friggin' fabulous.
>>>>
>>>>Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>>>
>>>>There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>>>headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>>>mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>>>works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it seems
>>>>like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>>>
>>>>Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>>>
>>>>DC
>>>>
>>>>DC
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Hey all,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>>>>>split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for the
>>>>>>>help with this.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar material
>>>>>>>that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the details.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Paris lives!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>DC
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>
>>>I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
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| Re: Mastering in Paris [message #68744 is a reply to message #68734] |
Mon, 29 May 2006 03:49 |
John [1]
Messages: 2229
Registered: September 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
What is the exact goal of this process? I have reread the thread and am
not clear on what you are doing? Where is rick when I need him!
John
DC wrote:
> As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
> What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
> does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>
> Sounds great though.
>
> DC
>
>
> "RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>
>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>Thanks, Edna
>>
>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>
>>>>I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>>>is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>>>set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>>>editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>>>(yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>>
>>>DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris VST
>
> EQ,
>
>>>and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the VST
>>>Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>>It doth rock much.
>>>
>>>AA
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>>
>>>>Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most of the
>>>>day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>>>
>>>>It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4 stereo
>>>>bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>>>
>>>>I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>>>is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>>>set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>>>editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>>>(yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>>>
>>>>It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>>>
>>>>HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>>>>friggin' fabulous.
>>>>
>>>>Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>>>
>>>>There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>>>headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>>>mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>>>works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it seems
>>>>like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>>>
>>>>Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>>>
>>>>DC
>>>>
>>>>DC
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Hey all,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>>>>>split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for the
>>>>>>>help with this.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar material
>>>>>>>that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the details.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Paris lives!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>DC
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>
>>>I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
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| Re: Mastering in Paris [message #68748 is a reply to message #68734] |
Mon, 29 May 2006 11:59 |
Aaron Allen
Messages: 1988
Registered: May 2008
|
Senior Member |
|
|
The plug for VST 'is' the EQ in paris. Same code, reported I believe. If
there's a difference I didn't hear it.
Bummer you're not on PC man, sorry to get you all excited about the VST
version. However, there has to be other decent EQ's out there you can use in
this day and age of plugs.
Gene, any thoughts?
AA
"DC" <dc@spammersinheck.com> wrote in message news:447a0b7b$1@linux...
>
> As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
> What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
> does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>
> Sounds great though.
>
> DC
>
>
> "RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>Thanks, Edna
>>
>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>>
>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>>
>>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris VST
> EQ,
>>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the VST
>>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>> It doth rock much.
>>>
>>> AA
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>> >
>>> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most of the
>>> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>> >
>>> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4 stereo
>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>> >
>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>> >
>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>> >
>>> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>>> > friggin' fabulous.
>>> >
>>> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>> >
>>> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it seems
>>> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>> >
>>> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>> >
>>> > DC
>>> >
>>> > DC
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message
>>> >>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> Hey all,
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for the
>>> >>>> help with this.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar material
>>> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the
>>> >>>> details.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> Paris lives!
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> DC
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
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| Re: Mastering in Paris [message #68749 is a reply to message #68748] |
Mon, 29 May 2006 12:53 |
John [1]
Messages: 2229
Registered: September 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Sonalksis EQ is very nice.
"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>The plug for VST 'is' the EQ in paris. Same code, reported I believe. If
>there's a difference I didn't hear it.
>Bummer you're not on PC man, sorry to get you all excited about the VST
>version. However, there has to be other decent EQ's out there you can use
in
>this day and age of plugs.
>Gene, any thoughts?
>
>AA
>
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersinheck.com> wrote in message news:447a0b7b$1@linux...
>>
>> As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
>> What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
>> does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>>
>> Sounds great though.
>>
>> DC
>>
>>
>> "RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>>Thanks, Edna
>>>
>>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>>>
>>>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris VST
>> EQ,
>>>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the
VST
>>>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>>> It doth rock much.
>>>>
>>>> AA
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>>> >
>>>> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most of the
>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>>> >
>>>> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4 stereo
>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>>> >
>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>>> >
>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>>> >
>>>> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>>>> > friggin' fabulous.
>>>> >
>>>> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>>> >
>>>> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>>> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>>> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>>> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it seems
>>>> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>>> >
>>>> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>>> >
>>>> > DC
>>>> >
>>>> > DC
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message
>>>> >>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> Hey all,
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for the
>>>> >>>> help with this.
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar material
>>>> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the
>>>> >>>> details.
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> Paris lives!
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> DC
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: Mastering in Paris [message #68750 is a reply to message #68734] |
Mon, 29 May 2006 16:39 |
chuck duffy
Messages: 453
Registered: July 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Hi Don,
The vst eq bit cancels with the paris eq when phase inverted.
I forced Brian T to try it when he was unconvinced.
I know that everyone is dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for months
to ensure that he could perfectly emulate the paris eq.
I am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about this
plug, as I read and responded to it way back when on whatever vst forum it
was posted in.
I know this won't help anyones perception, but when I hear people wondering
how to capture the paris special sauce - this plug is it.
CHuck
"DC" <dc@spammersinheck.com> wrote:
>
>As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
>What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
>does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>
>Sounds great though.
>
>DC
>
>
>"RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>Thanks, Edna
>>
>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>>
>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>>
>>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris VST
>EQ,
>>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the
VST
>>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>> It doth rock much.
>>>
>>> AA
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>> >
>>> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most of the
>>> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>> >
>>> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4 stereo
>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>> >
>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>> >
>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>> >
>>> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>>> > friggin' fabulous.
>>> >
>>> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>> >
>>> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it seems
>>> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>> >
>>> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>> >
>>> > DC
>>> >
>>> > DC
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> Hey all,
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for the
>>> >>>> help with this.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar material
>>> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the details.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> Paris lives!
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> DC
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: Mastering in Paris [message #68751 is a reply to message #68750] |
Mon, 29 May 2006 17:53 |
Rod Lincoln
Messages: 883
Registered: September 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
There you have it. Like Aaron said. It doeth Rocketh Hard(eth)
Rod
"chuck duffy" <cxsd@c.com> wrote:
>
>Hi Don,
>
>The vst eq bit cancels with the paris eq when phase inverted.
>
>I forced Brian T to try it when he was unconvinced.
>
>I know that everyone is dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for months
>to ensure that he could perfectly emulate the paris eq.
>
>I am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about this
>plug, as I read and responded to it way back when on whatever vst forum
it
>was posted in.
>
>
>I know this won't help anyones perception, but when I hear people wondering
>how to capture the paris special sauce - this plug is it.
>
>CHuck
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersinheck.com> wrote:
>>
>>As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
>>What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
>>does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>>
>>Sounds great though.
>>
>>DC
>>
>>
>>"RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>>Thanks, Edna
>>>
>>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>>>
>>>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris VST
>>EQ,
>>>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the
>VST
>>>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>>> It doth rock much.
>>>>
>>>> AA
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>>> >
>>>> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most of the
>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>>> >
>>>> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4 stereo
>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>>> >
>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>>> >
>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>>> >
>>>> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>>>> > friggin' fabulous.
>>>> >
>>>> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>>> >
>>>> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>>> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>>> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>>> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it seems
>>>> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>>> >
>>>> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>>> >
>>>> > DC
>>>> >
>>>> > DC
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> Hey all,
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for the
>>>> >>>> help with this.
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar material
>>>> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the details.
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> Paris lives!
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> DC
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: Mastering in Paris [message #68752 is a reply to message #68750] |
Mon, 29 May 2006 21:03 |
dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Dang... Sounds like what I need.
No mac version....
rats
DC
"chuck duffy" <cxsd@c.com> wrote:
>
>Hi Don,
>
>The vst eq bit cancels with the paris eq when phase inverted.
>
>I forced Brian T to try it when he was unconvinced.
>
>I know that everyone is dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for months
>to ensure that he could perfectly emulate the paris eq.
>
>I am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about this
>plug, as I read and responded to it way back when on whatever vst forum
it
>was posted in.
>
>
>I know this won't help anyones perception, but when I hear people wondering
>how to capture the paris special sauce - this plug is it.
>
>CHuck
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersinheck.com> wrote:
>>
>>As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
>>What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
>>does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>>
>>Sounds great though.
>>
>>DC
>>
>>
>>"RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>>Thanks, Edna
>>>
>>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>>>
>>>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris VST
>>EQ,
>>>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the
>VST
>>>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>>> It doth rock much.
>>>>
>>>> AA
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>>> >
>>>> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most of the
>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>>> >
>>>> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4 stereo
>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>>> >
>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>>> >
>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>>> >
>>>> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>>>> > friggin' fabulous.
>>>> >
>>>> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>>> >
>>>> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>>> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>>> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>>> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it seems
>>>> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>>> >
>>>> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>>> >
>>>> > DC
>>>> >
>>>> > DC
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> Hey all,
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for the
>>>> >>>> help with this.
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar material
>>>> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the details.
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> Paris lives!
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> DC
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: Mastering in Paris [message #68753 is a reply to message #68750] |
Mon, 29 May 2006 23:00 |
Aaron Allen
Messages: 1988
Registered: May 2008
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is somewhere in Tank's Steiny
arsenal in regular use. Matt did an amazing job of recreating the Paris
channel Eq/Gain mojo.
AA
"chuck duffy" <cxsd@c.com> wrote in message news:447b8639$1@linux...
>
> Hi Don,
>
> The vst eq bit cancels with the paris eq when phase inverted.
>
> I forced Brian T to try it when he was unconvinced.
>
> I know that everyone is dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for months
> to ensure that he could perfectly emulate the paris eq.
>
> I am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about this
> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when on whatever vst forum it
> was posted in.
>
>
> I know this won't help anyones perception, but when I hear people
> wondering
> how to capture the paris special sauce - this plug is it.
>
> CHuck
>
> "DC" <dc@spammersinheck.com> wrote:
>>
>>As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
>>What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
>>does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>>
>>Sounds great though.
>>
>>DC
>>
>>
>>"RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>>Thanks, Edna
>>>
>>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>>>
>>>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris VST
>>EQ,
>>>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the
> VST
>>>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>>> It doth rock much.
>>>>
>>>> AA
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>>> >
>>>> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most of the
>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>>> >
>>>> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4 stereo
>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>>> >
>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>>> >
>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>>> >
>>>> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>>>> > friggin' fabulous.
>>>> >
>>>> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>>> >
>>>> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>>> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>>> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>>> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it seems
>>>> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>>> >
>>>> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>>> >
>>>> > DC
>>>> >
>>>> > DC
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message
>>>> >>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> Hey all,
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for the
>>>> >>>> help with this.
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar
>>>> >>>> material
>>>> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the
>>>> >>>> details.
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> Paris lives!
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> DC
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: Mastering in Paris [message #68766 is a reply to message #68753] |
Tue, 30 May 2006 14:12 |
John [1]
Messages: 2229
Registered: September 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
So what's this trick mastering technique?
"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is somewhere in Tank's Steiny
>arsenal in regular use. Matt did an amazing job of recreating the Paris
>channel Eq/Gain mojo.
>AA
>
>"chuck duffy" <cxsd@c.com> wrote in message news:447b8639$1@linux...
>>
>> Hi Don,
>>
>> The vst eq bit cancels with the paris eq when phase inverted.
>>
>> I forced Brian T to try it when he was unconvinced.
>>
>> I know that everyone is dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for months
>> to ensure that he could perfectly emulate the paris eq.
>>
>> I am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about this
>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when on whatever vst forum
it
>> was posted in.
>>
>>
>> I know this won't help anyones perception, but when I hear people
>> wondering
>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this plug is it.
>>
>> CHuck
>>
>> "DC" <dc@spammersinheck.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
>>>What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
>>>does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>>>
>>>Sounds great though.
>>>
>>>DC
>>>
>>>
>>>"RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>>>Thanks, Edna
>>>>
>>>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>>>>
>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>>>>
>>>>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris
VST
>>>EQ,
>>>>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the
>> VST
>>>>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>>>> It doth rock much.
>>>>>
>>>>> AA
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most of
the
>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4 stereo
>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>>>> >
>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>>>>> > friggin' fabulous.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>>>> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>>>> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it seems
>>>>> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > DC
>>>>> >
>>>>> > DC
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>>> >>>
>>>>> >>>
>>>>> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message
>>>>> >>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> Hey all,
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>>> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for the
>>>>> >>>> help with this.
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar
>>>>> >>>> material
>>>>> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the
>>>>> >>>> details.
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> Paris lives!
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>> DC
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>
>>>>> >>>
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: Mastering in Paris [message #68770 is a reply to message #68752] |
Tue, 30 May 2006 17:52 |
DC
Messages: 722
Registered: July 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Ok, here's what I have been doing.
-first- let me say that I owe Sakis everything for this, since what I
am doing differs little from how he does it. Also, DJ got me thinking
along these lines and I want to thank him as well for the great input.
Simply, it's 4-band multiband compression in Paris. DJ made the
point that signal flow in Paris goes through the EDS compressor
before the EQ. What this means is that if you split the bands with
the PARIS EQ the EDS compressor is still responding to the full
bandwidth signal because the compressors see the signal before the
EQ.
If you do this, and open up the compressor windows, you
will see the compressors working in perfect unison. It works fairly
well nonetheless, but I wondered what would happen if you bounced
the track with the comp off and the filter in (yes you have to do this
4 times for LO, LM HM, and HI bands) You then end up with
bounced tracks that only have the desired bands on them.
Now, you turn off the EQ, and bring the 8 tracks back to the editor
(use the time-locked tool please!) and put them in their correct
channels. As Sakis said, use low comp. ratios and do not make
big changes in threshold from one band to another. I ended up using
various thresholds and about 1.55:1 ratios with little or no makeup
gain. You want to see about 3-6db gain reduction depending on
the material.
Group all the faders together. Run the sub master and global
masters cranked and now you can use the PARIS mix buss as a fat
control as you desire when bouncing back to 2 tracks.
This is *very* tedious and you have to be relentless about changing
your comp settings until it is just right. But boy-howdy does it pay
off if you do it well! I'm here to tell you that we made a real
difference in an already-great sounding CD doing this.
If there is a native plug that would help here I would LOVE to use it
and save all this work making the band-split tracks. Let me know.
I will tell you this, that done well, this process is spectacular
sounding.
Mix cleaner. Do not push PARIS so hard and leave yourself
something to work with at the mastering stage. Pushing PARIS hard
with the 8 band-split tracks and the comps on sounds terrific and is
very controllable.
I used Sakis recommended bands as a great starting point. ( Use
the steep rolloff-hipass or lopass filters rather than the shelf)
They are:
Lo 30-90hz.
Lo-Mid 90-540
Hi-Mid 540-6Khz
Hi 6-20Khz.
Do not push things when bouncing. Leave the channel level at 0.
Listen listen listen. This process should make things both more
clear and bigger. If it gets muddy, you are probably hitting the
compressors too hard. Take a stereo track you know well and
spend an afternoon trying this out. (did I mention it was tedious?)
Those of you with native EQ plugs can probably do this in one pass,
but I would still try it my way, just once and see if it is any better.
best,
DC
The live CD is DONE yes! Now I can go outside again...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Multi Band Mastering in Paris [message #68778 is a reply to message #68766] |
Tue, 30 May 2006 21:18 |
Aaron Allen
Messages: 1988
Registered: May 2008
|
Senior Member |
|
|
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
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charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Ok, you asked for it......... PC mastering technique in Paris:
Take your 2 track L/R master final mix file. Put the Left mix file on =
Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left. Put the Right mix file on Channels =
2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris VST EQ, split the files =
into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will be low mid band, 5/6 =
will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary depending on =
taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears, =
nobody can hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with =
the Sakis Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid 540-6Khz Hi =
6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with =
either the Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris =
VST EQ. The placement is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together =
using Grouping on the mixer. Do not for ANY reason split these waves =
into another editor unless you're ready to fight phase and time delay =
demons between submixes. Also, be sure you have everything selected with =
the time lock tool when you do this - same reason about phase/time.=20
Now, the thing is, you can adjust the Gain/EQ mojo separately for each =
band, you can compress with different ratios, thresholds.. whatever =
suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the Paris compressor, be =
sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, 3=3D4, 5=3D6, =
7=3D8). Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period.=20
Now then, for more secret sauce beyond the Eq/Gain trick.. put one more =
compressor on the global but do NOT compress with it. Threshold all the =
way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the gain output to beat the =
snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but ... and this is also =
super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5 dB or you'll =
blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital converters that =
your stuff will eventually have to suffer.=20
Be careful in all this, you have SO much gain shaping you can turn the =
wav into a baby ruth in the repro guy's editor... and no one wants to =
find a baby ruth floating in their pool of music. Don't smash it so much =
that it only takes 5 bits to play it back faithfully. Again, use your =
ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will take more abuse than say, a =
ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program material dependant' =
thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like a Pantera =
tune, for example.=20
Essentially you are creating a Waves multiband compressor, only you're =
using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, .. better IMO. YMMV. If you =
plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and create your own =
template PPJ you can just time lock drag the 'files' to and be on your =
way.=20
For you Mac mastering gurus, just replace the Paris VST EQ with a good =
sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band pass and hi pass. =
Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain trick in the =
Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris EQ =
Gain in it's place post eq/compression for each group of channels.
If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I suspect Doug Wellington has it =
posted on his page.
Doug, you still out there man?
AA,=20
semi kinda not really a mastering dude guy
------------------------------------------------------------ -------------=
----------------------
"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:447cb558$1@linux...
>=20
> So what's this trick mastering technique?
>=20
> "Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is somewhere in Tank's =
Steiny
>=20
>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did an amazing job of recreating the =
Paris
>=20
>>channel Eq/Gain mojo.
>>AA
>>
>>"chuck duffy" <cxsd@c.com> wrote in message news:447b8639$1@linux...
>>>
>>> Hi Don,
>>>
>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the paris eq when phase inverted.
>>>
>>> I forced Brian T to try it when he was unconvinced.
>>>
>>> I know that everyone is dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for =
months
>>> to ensure that he could perfectly emulate the paris eq.
>>>
>>> I am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about =
this
>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when on whatever vst =
forum
> it
>>> was posted in.
>>>
>>>
>>> I know this won't help anyones perception, but when I hear people=20
>>> wondering
>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this plug is it.
>>>
>>> CHuck
>>>
>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinheck.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
>>>>What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
>>>>does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>>>>
>>>>Sounds great though.
>>>>
>>>>DC
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>"RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>>>>Thanks, Edna
>>>>>
>>>>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the =
secret
>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the =
next
>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to =
the
>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
settings.
>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do =
this!)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig =
Paris
> VST
>>>>EQ,
>>>>>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried =
the
>>> VST
>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>>>>> It doth rock much.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> AA
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message =
news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most =
of
> the
>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4 =
stereo
>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the =
secret
>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the =
next
>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to =
the
>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
settings.
>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do =
this!)
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>>>>>> > friggin' fabulous.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>>>>> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>>>>> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it =
seems
>>>>>> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message=20
>>>>>> >>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> Hey all,
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for =
the
>>>>>> >>>> help with this.
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar=20
>>>>>> >>>> material
>>>>>> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the =
>>>>>> >>>> details.
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> Paris lives!
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>> DC
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>=20
>>
>>
>
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<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.5296.0" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><EM>Ok, you asked for it......... PC =
mastering=20
technique in Paris:</EM></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Take your 2 track L/R master =
final mix=20
file. Put the Left mix file on Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left. =
Put the=20
Right mix file on Channels 2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris =
VST EQ,=20
split the files into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will be =
low mid=20
band, 5/6 will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary =
depending on=20
taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears, =
nobody can=20
hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with the Sakis=20
Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid =
540-6Khz Hi=20
6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with =
either the=20
Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris VST EQ. The =
placement=20
is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together using Grouping on the =
mixer. Do=20
not for ANY reason split these waves into another editor unless you're =
ready to=20
fight phase and time delay demons between submixes. Also, be sure you =
have=20
everything selected with the time lock tool when you do this - same =
reason about=20
phase/time. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now, the thing is, you can =
adjust the=20
Gain/EQ mojo separately for each band, you can compress with different =
ratios,=20
thresholds.. whatever suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the =
Paris=20
compressor, be sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, =
3=3D4, 5=3D6, 7=3D8).=20
Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now then, for more secret sauce =
beyond the=20
Eq/Gain trick.. put one more compressor on the global but do NOT =
compress with=20
it. Threshold all the way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the =
gain=20
output to beat the snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but =
.... and=20
this is also super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5 dB =
or=20
you'll blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital =
converters=20
that your stuff will eventually have to suffer. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Be careful in all this, you =
have SO much=20
gain shaping you can turn the wav into a baby ruth in the repro=20
guy's editor... and no one wants to find a baby ruth floating in =
their pool=20
of music. Don't smash it so much that it only takes 5 bits to play =
it back=20
faithfully. Again, use your ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will =
take more=20
abuse than say, a ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program =
material=20
dependant' thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like a =
Pantera=20
tune, for example</STRONG>. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Essentially you are creating a Waves =
multiband=20
compressor, only you're using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, .. =
better=20
IMO. YMMV. If you plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and=20
create your own template PPJ you can just time lock drag the =
'files'=20
to and be on your way. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>For you Mac mastering gurus, just =
replace the Paris=20
VST EQ with a good sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band =
pass and=20
hi pass. Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain =
trick in=20
the Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris =
EQ Gain=20
in it's place post eq/compression for each group of =
channels.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I =
suspect Doug=20
Wellington has it posted on his page.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Doug, you still out there =
man?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"=20
size=3D3><EM><STRONG>AA,</STRONG></EM></FONT> </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>semi kinda not really a mastering dude=20
guy</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2> ------------------------------------------------------------ ----=
-------------------------------</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>"John" <</FONT><A =
href=3D"mailto:no@no.com"><FONT=20
face=3DArial size=3D2>no@no.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>> wrote in=20
message </FONT><A href=3D"news:447cb558$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>news:447cb558$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>...</FONT></DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> <BR>> So =
what's this=20
trick mastering technique?<BR>> <BR>> "Aaron Allen" <</FONT><A=20
href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> =
wrote:<BR>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is =
somewhere in=20
Tank's Steiny<BR>> <BR>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did =
an=20
amazing job of recreating the Paris<BR>> <BR>>>channel Eq/Gain=20
mojo.<BR>>>AA<BR>>><BR>>> "chuck duffy" <</FONT><A=20
href=3D"mailto:cxsd@c.com"><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>cxsd@c.com</FONT></A><FONT=20
face=3DArial size=3D2>> wrote in message </FONT><A=20
href=3D"news:447b8639$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>news:447b8639$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>...<BR>>>><BR>>>> Hi=20
Don,<BR>>>><BR>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the =
paris eq=20
when phase inverted.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I forced Brian T to =
try it=20
when he was unconvinced.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I know that =
everyone is=20
dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for months<BR>>>> to =
ensure=20
that he could perfectly emulate the paris =
eq.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I=20
am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about=20
this<BR>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when =
on=20
whatever vst forum<BR>> it<BR>>>> was posted=20
in.<BR>>>><BR>>>> <BR>>>> I know this won't =
help=20
anyones perception, but when I hear people <BR>>>>=20
wondering<BR>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this =
plug is=20
it.<BR>>>><BR>>>> =
CHuck<BR>>>><BR>>>> "DC"=20
<</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinheck.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>dc@spammersinheck.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>>=20
wrote:<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>As I understand it, that =
EQ was=20
pretty colored and non-linear.<BR>>>>>What I need is simple, =
clean,=20
accurate band splits. The Paris EQ<BR>>>>>does this =
nicely,=20
but the whole process is tedious to say the=20
least.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>Sounds great=20
though.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>DC <BR>>>>><BR>=
>>>><BR>>>>> "RiverLake=20
Farms" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:edna@texomaonline.com"><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>edna@texomaonline.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>>=20
wrote:<BR>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still=20
available?<BR>>>>>>Thanks,=20
Edna<BR>>>>>><BR>>>>>> "Aaron Allen" =
<</FONT><A=20
href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> =
wrote in=20
message<BR>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...<BR>>>>&g=
t;>><BR>>>>>>>=20
> I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
band with=20
EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
all are=20
done. Then you bring the bands back to =
the<BR>>>>>>>=20
> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
to just=20
create the files to do=20
this!)<BR>>>>>>> <BR>>>>>>> DC, this =
can be=20
achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris<BR>>=20
VST<BR>>>>>EQ,<BR>>>>>>> and in real =
timeif you=20
want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the<BR>>>>=20
VST<BR>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application=20
yet?<BR>>>>>>> It doth rock=20
much.<BR>>>>>>><BR >>>>>>>=20
AA<BR>>>>>>><BR >>>>>>><BR>>>>=
;>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
"DC" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>> wrote in=20
message </FONT><A href=3D"news:44793f10$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>news:44793f10$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>...<BR>>>>>>> =
><BR>>>>>>> > Ok,=20
here's the short version. I've been working on this most =
of<BR>>=20
the<BR>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so =
this is=20
very incomplete.<BR>>>>>>> =
><BR>>>>>>>=20
> It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4=20
stereo<BR>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8=20
compressors.<BR>>>>>>> =
><BR>>>>>>> >=20
I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
band with=20
EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
all are=20
done. Then you bring the bands back to =
the<BR>>>>>>>=20
> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
to just=20
create the files to do this!)<BR>>>>>>>=20
><BR>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, =
and a=20
general PITA.<BR>>>>>>> =
><BR>>>>>>> >=20
HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results=20
are<BR>>>>>>> > friggin'=20
fabulous.<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>=20
Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing =
really.<BR>>>>>>>=20
><BR>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. =20
Later. BTW, you must leave some<BR>>>>>>> =
>=20
headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but=20
the<BR>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying =
that for=20
years). This technique<BR>>>>>>> > works so =
beautifully=20
with slamming the Paris mix buss that it =
seems<BR>>>>>>> >=20
like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is=20
grinning...<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>=20
Paris for mastering. wadda concept.<BR>>>>>>>=20
><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
><BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>Rob=20
Arsenault" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:mani2@nbnet.nb.ca"><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>mani2@nbnet.nb.ca</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>>=20
wrote:<BR>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do=20
share...!!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <</FONT><A=20
href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>> wrote in=20
message <BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Hey=20
all,<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a=20
multiband<BR>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor =
in=20
Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for=20
the<BR>>>>>>> >>>> help with=20
this.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very =
familiar=20
<BR>>>>>>> >>>>=20
material<BR>>>>>>> >>>> that are just =
making me=20
grin from ear to ear...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as =
I get=20
this live disc out the door I will post the <BR>>>>>>> =
>>>> details.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Paris=20
lives!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>> DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>><BR>>>>>>> =
>><BR>>>>>>>=20
><BR>>>>>>> <BR>>>>>>><BR>>>&=
gt;>>>=20
I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and =
you?<BR>>>>>>>=20
</FONT><A href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html"><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html</FONT></A><BR><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>>>>>>><BR >>>>>>><BR>>>=
>>><BR>>>>>> <BR>>>>><BR>>>> =
<BR>>><BR>>><BR>></FONT > </BODY></HTML>
------=_NextPart_000_009C_01C6843F.575BFC10--
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| Re: Multi Band Mastering in Paris [message #68780 is a reply to message #68778] |
Wed, 31 May 2006 02:16 |
Kim
Messages: 1246
Registered: October 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
While I have heard a lot of people more knowledgable than myself talk up
this method of mastering, one thing has always bothered me...
The Paris compressors are mono. Therefore your left and right channels are
being processed seperately. Surely your stereo imaging will go all over the
place?!? I mean, for starters, anything that's loud in a given frequency
band, and not centred, will tend to get centred, because the louder channel
will cop more compression. If, in a given band, the left channel is louder
than the right channel, everything in that band will get panned further right,
because the left channel will get compressed / reduced in level more than
the right channel. What's more, some sounds will no doubt cover more than
one frequency band, and as this "repanning" effect is unlikely to be identical
in all frequency bands, one part of a sound may get panned further right,
while another band of it stays where it is, or even moves further left depending
what is in that band.
I would have thought that on material with considerable stereo content, things
will end up all over the shop in terms of stereo imaging.
On the other hand, there's a very practicle school of thought which says
"If it sounds good, just do it"...
Cheers,
Kim.
"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>
>
>Ok, you asked for it......... PC mastering technique in Paris:
>
>Take your 2 track L/R master final mix file. Put the Left mix file on =
>Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left. Put the Right mix file on Channels
=
>2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris VST EQ, split the files =
>into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will be low mid band, 5/6
=
>will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary depending on =
>taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears, =
>nobody can hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with
=
>the Sakis Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid 540-6Khz Hi
=
>6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with =
>either the Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris =
>VST EQ. The placement is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together =
>using Grouping on the mixer. Do not for ANY reason split these waves =
>into another editor unless you're ready to fight phase and time delay =
>demons between submixes. Also, be sure you have everything selected with
=
>the time lock tool when you do this - same reason about phase/time.=20
>
>Now, the thing is, you can adjust the Gain/EQ mojo separately for each =
>band, you can compress with different ratios, thresholds.. whatever =
>suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the Paris compressor, be =
>sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, 3=3D4, 5=3D6, =
>7=3D8). Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period.=20
>
>Now then, for more secret sauce beyond the Eq/Gain trick.. put one more
=
>compressor on the global but do NOT compress with it. Threshold all the
=
>way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the gain output to beat the
=
>snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but ... and this is also
=
>super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5 dB or you'll =
>blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital converters that =
>your stuff will eventually have to suffer.=20
>Be careful in all this, you have SO much gain shaping you can turn the =
>wav into a baby ruth in the repro guy's editor... and no one wants to =
>find a baby ruth floating in their pool of music. Don't smash it so much
=
>that it only takes 5 bits to play it back faithfully. Again, use your =
>ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will take more abuse than say, a =
>ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program material dependant' =
>thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like a Pantera =
>tune, for example.=20
>
>Essentially you are creating a Waves multiband compressor, only you're =
>using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, .. better IMO. YMMV. If you =
>plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and create your own =
>template PPJ you can just time lock drag the 'files' to and be on your =
>way.=20
>
>For you Mac mastering gurus, just replace the Paris VST EQ with a good =
>sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band pass and hi pass. =
>Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain trick in the =
>Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris EQ =
>Gain in it's place post eq/compression for each group of channels.
>
>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I suspect Doug Wellington has it =
>posted on his page.
>Doug, you still out there man?
>
>AA,=20
>semi kinda not really a mastering dude guy
> ------------------------------------------------------------ -------------=
>----------------------
>
>"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:447cb558$1@linux...
>>=20
>> So what's this trick mastering technique?
>>=20
>> "Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is somewhere in Tank's
=
>Steiny
>>=20
>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did an amazing job of recreating the =
>Paris
>>=20
>>>channel Eq/Gain mojo.
>>>AA
>>>
>>>"chuck duffy" <cxsd@c.com> wrote in message news:447b8639$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> Hi Don,
>>>>
>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the paris eq when phase inverted.
>>>>
>>>> I forced Brian T to try it when he was unconvinced.
>>>>
>>>> I know that everyone is dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for
=
>months
>>>> to ensure that he could perfectly emulate the paris eq.
>>>>
>>>> I am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about
=
>this
>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when on whatever vst =
>forum
>> it
>>>> was posted in.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I know this won't help anyones perception, but when I hear people=20
>>>> wondering
>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this plug is it.
>>>>
>>>> CHuck
>>>>
>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinheck.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
>>>>>What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
>>>>>does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>>>>>
>>>>>Sounds great though.
>>>>>
>>>>>DC
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>"RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>>>>>Thanks, Edna
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the
=
>secret
>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the =
>next
>>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>the
>>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
>settings.
>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do =
>this!)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig =
>Paris
>> VST
>>>>>EQ,
>>>>>>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried
=
>the
>>>> VST
>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>>>>>> It doth rock much.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> AA
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message =
>news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most =
>of
>> the
>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4
=
>stereo
>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the
=
>secret
>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the =
>next
>>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>the
>>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
>settings.
>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do =
>this!)
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>>>>>>> > friggin' fabulous.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>>>>>> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>>>>>> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it =
>seems
>>>>>>> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message=20
>>>>>>> >>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>> >>>> Hey all,
>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for
=
>the
>>>>>>> >>>> help with this.
>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar=20
>>>>>>> >>>> material
>>>>>>> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the
=
>
>>>>>>> >>>> details.
>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>> >>>> Paris lives!
>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>> >>>> DC
>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>=20
>>>
>>>
>>
>
><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
><HTML><HEAD>
><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.5296.0" name=3DGENERATOR>
><STYLE></STYLE>
></HEAD>
><BODY>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><EM>Ok, you asked for it......... PC =
>mastering=20
>technique in Paris:</EM></FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Take your 2 track L/R master =
>final mix=20
>file. Put the Left mix file on Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left. =
>Put the=20
>Right mix file on Channels 2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris
=
>VST EQ,=20
>split the files into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will be =
>low mid=20
>band, 5/6 will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary =
>depending on=20
>taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears, =
>nobody can=20
>hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with the Sakis=20
>Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid =
>540-6Khz Hi=20
>6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with =
>either the=20
>Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris VST EQ. The =
>placement=20
>is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together using Grouping on the =
>mixer. Do=20
>not for ANY reason split these waves into another editor unless you're =
>ready to=20
>fight phase and time delay demons between submixes. Also, be sure you =
>have=20
>everything selected with the time lock tool when you do this - same =
>reason about=20
>phase/time. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now, the thing is, you can =
>adjust the=20
>Gain/EQ mojo separately for each band, you can compress with different =
>ratios,=20
>thresholds.. whatever suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the =
>Paris=20
>compressor, be sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, =
>3=3D4, 5=3D6, 7=3D8).=20
>Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now then, for more secret sauce
=
>beyond the=20
>Eq/Gain trick.. put one more compressor on the global but do NOT =
>compress with=20
>it. Threshold all the way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the =
>gain=20
>output to beat the snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but =
>... and=20
>this is also super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5 dB
=
>or=20
>you'll blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital =
>converters=20
>that your stuff will eventually have to suffer. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Be careful in all this, you =
>have SO much=20
>gain shaping you can turn the wav into a baby ruth in the repro=20
>guy's editor... and no one wants to find a baby ruth floating in =
>their pool=20
>of music. Don't smash it so much that it only takes 5 bits to play =
>it back=20
>faithfully. Again, use your ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will =
>take more=20
>abuse than say, a ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program =
>material=20
>dependant' thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like a
=
>Pantera=20
>tune, for example</STRONG>. </FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Essentially you are creating a Waves =
>multiband=20
>compressor, only you're using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, .. =
>better=20
>IMO. YMMV. If you plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and=20
>create your own template PPJ you can just time lock drag the =
>'files'=20
>to and be on your way. </FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>For you Mac mastering gurus, just =
>replace the Paris=20
>VST EQ with a good sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band =
>pass and=20
>hi pass. Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain =
>trick in=20
>the Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris =
>EQ Gain=20
>in it's place post eq/compression for each group of =
>channels.</FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I =
>suspect Doug=20
>Wellington has it posted on his page.</FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Doug, you still out there =
>man?</FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"=20
>size=3D3><EM><STRONG>AA,</STRONG></EM></FONT> </FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>semi kinda not really a mastering dude=20
>guy</FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2> ------------------------------------------------------------ ----=
>-------------------------------</FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>"John" <</FONT><A =
>href=3D"mailto:no@no.com"><FONT=20
>face=3DArial size=3D2>no@no.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>message </FONT><A href=3D"news:447cb558$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>news:447cb558$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>...</FONT></DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> <BR>> So =
>what's this=20
>trick mastering technique?<BR>> <BR>> "Aaron Allen" <</FONT><A=20
>href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> =
>
>wrote:<BR>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is =
>somewhere in=20
>Tank's Steiny<BR>> <BR>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did =
>an=20
>amazing job of recreating the Paris<BR>> <BR>>>channel Eq/Gain=20
>mojo.<BR>>>AA<BR>>><BR>>>"chuck duffy" <</FONT><A=20
>href=3D"mailto:cxsd@c.com"><FONT face=3DArial =
>size=3D2>cxsd@c.com</FONT></A><FONT=20
>face=3DArial size=3D2>> wrote in message </FONT><A=20
>href=3D"news:447b8639$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>news:447b8639$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>...<BR>>>><BR>>>> Hi=20
>Don,<BR>>>><BR>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the =
>paris eq=20
>when phase inverted.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I forced Brian T to =
>try it=20
>when he was unconvinced.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I know that =
>everyone is=20
>dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for months<BR>>>> to =
>ensure=20
>that he could perfectly emulate the paris =
>eq.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I=20
>am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about=20
>this<BR>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when =
>on=20
>whatever vst forum<BR>> it<BR>>>> was posted=20
>in.<BR>>>><BR>>>><BR>>>> I know this won't =
>help=20
>anyones perception, but when I hear people <BR>>>>=20
>wondering<BR>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this =
>plug is=20
>it.<BR>>>><BR>>>> =
>CHuck<BR>>>><BR>>>> "DC"=20
><</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinheck.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>dc@spammersinheck.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>size=3D2>>=20
>wrote:<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>As I understand it, that =
>EQ was=20
>pretty colored and non-linear.<BR>>>>>What I need is simple, =
>clean,=20
>accurate band splits. The Paris EQ<BR>>>>>does this =
>nicely,=20
>but the whole process is tedious to say the=20
>least.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>Sounds great=20
>though.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>DC<BR>>>>><BR>=
>>>>><BR>>>>>"RiverLake=20
>Farms" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:edna@texomaonline.com"><FONT =
>face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>edna@texomaonline.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>size=3D2>>=20
>wrote:<BR>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still=20
>available?<BR>>>>>>Thanks,=20
>Edna<BR>>>>>><BR>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" =
><</FONT><A=20
>href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> =
>wrote in=20
>message<BR>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...<BR>>>>&g=
>t;>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>> I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
>secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
>band with=20
>EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
>all are=20
>done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>the<BR>>>>>>>=20
>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
>settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
>to just=20
>create the files to do=20
>this!)<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> DC, this =
>can be=20
>achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris<BR>>=20
>VST<BR>>>>>EQ,<BR>>>>>>> and in real =
>timeif you=20
>want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the<BR>>>>=20
>VST<BR>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application=20
>yet?<BR>>>>>>> It doth rock=20
>much.<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>AA<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>=
>;>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>"DC" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT =
>face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>message </FONT><A href=3D"news:44793f10$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>news:44793f10$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>...<BR>>>>>>> =
>><BR>>>>>>> > Ok,=20
>here's the short version. I've been working on this most =
>of<BR>>=20
>the<BR>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so =
>this is=20
>very incomplete.<BR>>>>>>> =
>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>> It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4=20
>stereo<BR>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8=20
>compressors.<BR>>>>>>> =
>><BR>>>>>>> >=20
>I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
>secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
>band with=20
>EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
>all are=20
>done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>the<BR>>>>>>>=20
>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
>settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
>to just=20
>create the files to do this!)<BR>>>>>>>=20
>><BR>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, =
>and a=20
>general PITA.<BR>>>>>>> =
>><BR>>>>>>> >=20
>HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results=20
>are<BR>>>>>>> > friggin'=20
>fabulous.<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>=20
>Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing =
>really.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>><BR>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. =20
>Later. BTW, you must leave some<BR>>>>>>> =
>>=20
>headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but=20
>the<BR>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying =
>that for=20
>years). This technique<BR>>>>>>> > works so =
>beautifully=20
>with slamming the Paris mix buss that it =
>seems<BR>>>>>>> >=20
>like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is=20
>grinning...<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>=20
>Paris for mastering. wadda concept.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>><BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>Rob=20
>Arsenault" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:mani2@nbnet.nb.ca"><FONT =
>face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>mani2@nbnet.nb.ca</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>>=20
>wrote:<BR>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do=20
>share...!!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <</FONT><A=20
>href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>message <BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Hey=20
>all,<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a=20
>multiband<BR>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor =
>in=20
>Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for=20
>the<BR>>>>>>> >>>> help with=20
>this.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very =
>familiar=20
><BR>>>>>>> >>>>=20
>material<BR>>>>>>> >>>> that are just =
>making me=20
>grin from ear to ear...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as =
>I get=20
>this live disc out the door I will post the <BR>>>>>>> =
>
>>>>> details.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Paris=20
>lives!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>> DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>> =
>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>&=
>gt;>>>=20
>I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and =
>you?<BR>>>>>>>=20
></FONT><A href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html"><FONT face=3DArial
=
>
>size=3D2>http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html</FONT></A><BR><FONT =
>face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>=
>>>><BR>>>>>><BR>>>>><BR>>>> =
>
><BR>>><BR>>><BR>></FONT> </BODY></HTML>
>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: Mastering in Paris [message #68781 is a reply to message #68753] |
Tue, 30 May 2006 16:16 |
Amuse
Messages: 90
Registered: February 2006
|
Member |
|
|
Aaron/DC, any change of the complete step by step guide to doing this
multiband split mastering technique, including the little details, and
the Vst plug?
Thanks,
Pete
Aaron Allen wrote:
> Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is somewhere in Tank's Steiny
> arsenal in regular use. Matt did an amazing job of recreating the Paris
> channel Eq/Gain mojo.
> AA
>
> "chuck duffy" <cxsd@c.com> wrote in message news:447b8639$1@linux...
>> Hi Don,
>>
>> The vst eq bit cancels with the paris eq when phase inverted.
>>
>> I forced Brian T to try it when he was unconvinced.
>>
>> I know that everyone is dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for months
>> to ensure that he could perfectly emulate the paris eq.
>>
>> I am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about this
>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when on whatever vst forum it
>> was posted in.
>>
>>
>> I know this won't help anyones perception, but when I hear people
>> wondering
>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this plug is it.
>>
>> CHuck
>>
>> "DC" <dc@spammersinheck.com> wrote:
>>> As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
>>> What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
>>> does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>>>
>>> Sounds great though.
>>>
>>> DC
>>>
>>>
>>> "RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>>>> Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>>> Thanks, Edna
>>>>
>>>> "Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>>> news:447948de$1@linux...
>>>>>> I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>>>>> is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>>>>> set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>>>>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>>>>> (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>>>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris VST
>>> EQ,
>>>>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the
>> VST
>>>>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>>>> It doth rock much.
>>>>>
>>>>> AA
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>>>>> Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most of the
>>>>>> day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4 stereo
>>>>>> bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the secret
>>>>>> is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the next
>>>>>> set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to the
>>>>>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp settings.
>>>>>> (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do this!)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>>>>>> friggin' fabulous.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>>>>> headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>>>>> mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>>>>> works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it seems
>>>>>> like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> DC
>>>>>>
>>>>>> DC
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>> news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>> Hey all,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>>>>>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for the
>>>>>>>>> help with this.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar
>>>>>>>>> material
>>>>>>>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the
>>>>>>>>> details.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Paris lives!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> DC
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: Multi Band Mastering in Paris [message #68782 is a reply to message #68780] |
Wed, 31 May 2006 05:42 |
Rod Lincoln
Messages: 883
Registered: September 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Kim, I have experimented with mastering this way a lot. And yes, sometimes
that does happen. What I notice is, stereo imaging will jump around. I know
Sakis uses this method, with success so it's probably a matter of getting
every set right. I'm just not that good!
Now here's the good news for PC guys. Using Matt Craig's comp. you check
the stereo box and have a stereo Paris comp...pre eq.
Rod
"Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>While I have heard a lot of people more knowledgable than myself talk up
>this method of mastering, one thing has always bothered me...
>
>The Paris compressors are mono. Therefore your left and right channels are
>being processed seperately. Surely your stereo imaging will go all over
the
>place?!? I mean, for starters, anything that's loud in a given frequency
>band, and not centred, will tend to get centred, because the louder channel
>will cop more compression. If, in a given band, the left channel is louder
>than the right channel, everything in that band will get panned further
right,
>because the left channel will get compressed / reduced in level more than
>the right channel. What's more, some sounds will no doubt cover more than
>one frequency band, and as this "repanning" effect is unlikely to be identical
>in all frequency bands, one part of a sound may get panned further right,
>while another band of it stays where it is, or even moves further left depending
>what is in that band.
>
>I would have thought that on material with considerable stereo content,
things
>will end up all over the shop in terms of stereo imaging.
>
>On the other hand, there's a very practicle school of thought which says
>"If it sounds good, just do it"...
>
>Cheers,
>Kim.
>
>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>
>>
>>Ok, you asked for it......... PC mastering technique in Paris:
>>
>>Take your 2 track L/R master final mix file. Put the Left mix file on =
>>Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left. Put the Right mix file on Channels
>=
>>2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris VST EQ, split the files =
>>into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will be low mid band, 5/6
>=
>>will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary depending on =
>>taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears, =
>>nobody can hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with
>=
>>the Sakis Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid 540-6Khz Hi
>=
>>6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with =
>>either the Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris =
>>VST EQ. The placement is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together =
>>using Grouping on the mixer. Do not for ANY reason split these waves =
>>into another editor unless you're ready to fight phase and time delay =
>>demons between submixes. Also, be sure you have everything selected with
>=
>>the time lock tool when you do this - same reason about phase/time.=20
>>
>>Now, the thing is, you can adjust the Gain/EQ mojo separately for each
=
>>band, you can compress with different ratios, thresholds.. whatever =
>>suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the Paris compressor, be =
>>sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, 3=3D4, 5=3D6, =
>>7=3D8). Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period.=20
>>
>>Now then, for more secret sauce beyond the Eq/Gain trick.. put one more
>=
>>compressor on the global but do NOT compress with it. Threshold all the
>=
>>way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the gain output to beat the
>=
>>snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but ... and this is also
>=
>>super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5 dB or you'll =
>>blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital converters that =
>>your stuff will eventually have to suffer.=20
>>Be careful in all this, you have SO much gain shaping you can turn the
=
>>wav into a baby ruth in the repro guy's editor... and no one wants to =
>>find a baby ruth floating in their pool of music. Don't smash it so much
>=
>>that it only takes 5 bits to play it back faithfully. Again, use your =
>>ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will take more abuse than say, a =
>>ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program material dependant' =
>>thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like a Pantera =
>>tune, for example.=20
>>
>>Essentially you are creating a Waves multiband compressor, only you're
=
>>using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, .. better IMO. YMMV. If you
=
>>plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and create your own =
>>template PPJ you can just time lock drag the 'files' to and be on your
=
>>way.=20
>>
>>For you Mac mastering gurus, just replace the Paris VST EQ with a good
=
>>sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band pass and hi pass.
=
>>Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain trick in the =
>>Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris EQ =
>>Gain in it's place post eq/compression for each group of channels.
>>
>>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I suspect Doug Wellington has it =
>>posted on his page.
>>Doug, you still out there man?
>>
>>AA,=20
>>semi kinda not really a mastering dude guy
>> ------------------------------------------------------------ -------------=
>>----------------------
>>
>>"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:447cb558$1@linux...
>>>=20
>>> So what's this trick mastering technique?
>>>=20
>>> "Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is somewhere in Tank's
>=
>>Steiny
>>>=20
>>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did an amazing job of recreating the =
>>Paris
>>>=20
>>>>channel Eq/Gain mojo.
>>>>AA
>>>>
>>>>"chuck duffy" <cxsd@c.com> wrote in message news:447b8639$1@linux...
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi Don,
>>>>>
>>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the paris eq when phase inverted.
>>>>>
>>>>> I forced Brian T to try it when he was unconvinced.
>>>>>
>>>>> I know that everyone is dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for
>=
>>months
>>>>> to ensure that he could perfectly emulate the paris eq.
>>>>>
>>>>> I am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about
>=
>>this
>>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when on whatever vst =
>>forum
>>> it
>>>>> was posted in.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I know this won't help anyones perception, but when I hear people=20
>>>>> wondering
>>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this plug is it.
>>>>>
>>>>> CHuck
>>>>>
>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinheck.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
>>>>>>What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
>>>>>>does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Sounds great though.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>DC
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>>>>>>Thanks, Edna
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the
>=
>>secret
>>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the =
>>next
>>>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to
=
>>the
>>>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
>>settings.
>>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do =
>>this!)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig =
>>Paris
>>> VST
>>>>>>EQ,
>>>>>>>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried
>=
>>the
>>>>> VST
>>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>>>>>>> It doth rock much.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> AA
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message =
>>news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most
=
>>of
>>> the
>>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4
>=
>>stereo
>>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the
>=
>>secret
>>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the =
>>next
>>>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to
=
>>the
>>>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
>>settings.
>>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do =
>>this!)
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>>>>>>>> > friggin' fabulous.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>>>>>>> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>>>>>>> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it
=
>>seems
>>>>>>>> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message=20
>>>>>>>> >>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>> Hey all,
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for
>=
>>the
>>>>>>>> >>>> help with this.
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar=20
>>>>>>>> >>>> material
>>>>>>>> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the
>=
>>
>>>>>>>> >>>> details.
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>> Paris lives!
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>> DC
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>>>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>=20
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
>><HTML><HEAD>
>><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
>><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.5296.0" name=3DGENERATOR>
>><STYLE></STYLE>
>></HEAD>
>><BODY>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><EM>Ok, you asked for it......... PC =
>>mastering=20
>>technique in Paris:</EM></FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Take your 2 track L/R master =
>>final mix=20
>>file. Put the Left mix file on Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left. =
>>Put the=20
>>Right mix file on Channels 2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris
>=
>>VST EQ,=20
>>split the files into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will be
=
>>low mid=20
>>band, 5/6 will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary =
>>depending on=20
>>taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears, =
>>nobody can=20
>>hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with the Sakis=20
>>Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid =
>>540-6Khz Hi=20
>>6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with =
>>either the=20
>>Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris VST EQ. The
=
>>placement=20
>>is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together using Grouping on the =
>>mixer. Do=20
>>not for ANY reason split these waves into another editor unless you're
=
>>ready to=20
>>fight phase and time delay demons between submixes. Also, be sure you =
>>have=20
>>everything selected with the time lock tool when you do this - same =
>>reason about=20
>>phase/time. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now, the thing is, you can =
>>adjust the=20
>>Gain/EQ mojo separately for each band, you can compress with different
=
>>ratios,=20
>>thresholds.. whatever suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the
=
>>Paris=20
>>compressor, be sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, =
>>3=3D4, 5=3D6, 7=3D8).=20
>>Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now then, for more secret sauce
>=
>>beyond the=20
>>Eq/Gain trick.. put one more compressor on the global but do NOT =
>>compress with=20
>>it. Threshold all the way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the
=
>>gain=20
>>output to beat the snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but =
>>... and=20
>>this is also super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5 dB
>=
>>or=20
>>you'll blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital =
>>converters=20
>>that your stuff will eventually have to suffer. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Be careful in all this, you =
>>have SO much=20
>>gain shaping you can turn the wav into a baby ruth in the repro=20
>>guy's editor... and no one wants to find a baby ruth floating in =
>>their pool=20
>>of music. Don't smash it so much that it only takes 5 bits to play =
>>it back=20
>>faithfully. Again, use your ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will =
>>take more=20
>>abuse than say, a ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program =
>>material=20
>>dependant' thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like
a
>=
>>Pantera=20
>>tune, for example</STRONG>. </FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Essentially you are creating a Waves =
>>multiband=20
>>compressor, only you're using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, .. =
>>better=20
>>IMO. YMMV. If you plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and=20
>>create your own template PPJ you can just time lock drag the =
>>'files'=20
>>to and be on your way. </FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>For you Mac mastering gurus, just =
>>replace the Paris=20
>>VST EQ with a good sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band
=
>>pass and=20
>>hi pass. Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain =
>>trick in=20
>>the Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris
=
>>EQ Gain=20
>>in it's place post eq/compression for each group of =
>>channels.</FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I =
>>suspect Doug=20
>>Wellington has it posted on his page.</FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Doug, you still out there =
>>man?</FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"=20
>>size=3D3><EM><STRONG>AA,</STRONG></EM></FONT> </FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>semi kinda not really a mastering dude=20
>>guy</FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2> ------------------------------------------------------------ ----=
>>-------------------------------</FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>"John" <</FONT><A =
>>href=3D"mailto:no@no.com"><FONT=20
>>face=3DArial size=3D2>no@no.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>message </FONT><A href=3D"news:447cb558$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>news:447cb558$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>...</FONT></DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> <BR>> So =
>>what's this=20
>>trick mastering technique?<BR>> <BR>> "Aaron Allen" <</FONT><A=20
>>href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> =
>>
>>wrote:<BR>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is =
>>somewhere in=20
>>Tank's Steiny<BR>> <BR>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did =
>>an=20
>>amazing job of recreating the Paris<BR>> <BR>>>channel Eq/Gain=20
>>mojo.<BR>>>AA<BR>>><BR>>>"chuck duffy" <</FONT><A=20
>>href=3D"mailto:cxsd@c.com"><FONT face=3DArial =
>>size=3D2>cxsd@c.com</FONT></A><FONT=20
>>face=3DArial size=3D2>> wrote in message </FONT><A=20
>>href=3D"news:447b8639$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>news:447b8639$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>...<BR>>>><BR>>>> Hi=20
>>Don,<BR>>>><BR>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the =
>>paris eq=20
>>when phase inverted.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I forced Brian T to =
>>try it=20
>>when he was unconvinced.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I know that =
>>everyone is=20
>>dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for months<BR>>>> to =
>>ensure=20
>>that he could perfectly emulate the paris =
>>eq.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I=20
>>am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about=20
>>this<BR>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when =
>>on=20
>>whatever vst forum<BR>> it<BR>>>> was posted=20
>>in.<BR>>>><BR>>>><BR>>>> I know this won't =
>>help=20
>>anyones perception, but when I hear people <BR>>>>=20
>>wondering<BR>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this =
>>plug is=20
>>it.<BR>>>><BR>>>> =
>>CHuck<BR>>>><BR>>>> "DC"=20
>><</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinheck.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinheck.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>size=3D2>>=20
>>wrote:<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>As I understand it, that =
>>EQ was=20
>>pretty colored and non-linear.<BR>>>>>What I need is simple, =
>>clean,=20
>>accurate band splits. The Paris EQ<BR>>>>>does this =
>>nicely,=20
>>but the whole process is tedious to say the=20
>>least.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>Sounds great=20
>>though.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>DC<BR>>>>><BR>=
>>>>>><BR>>>>>"RiverLake=20
>>Farms" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:edna@texomaonline.com"><FONT =
>>face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>edna@texomaonline.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>size=3D2>>=20
>>wrote:<BR>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still=20
>>available?<BR>>>>>>Thanks,=20
>>Edna<BR>>>>>><BR>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" =
>><</FONT><A=20
>>href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> =
>>wrote in=20
>>message<BR>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...<BR>>>>&g=
>>t;>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>> I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
>>secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
>>band with=20
>>EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
>>all are=20
>>done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>>the<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
>>settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
>>to just=20
>>create the files to do=20
>>this!)<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> DC, this =
>>can be=20
>>achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris<BR>>=20
>>VST<BR>>>>>EQ,<BR>>>>>>> and in real =
>>timeif you=20
>>want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the<BR>>>>=20
>>VST<BR>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application=20
>>yet?<BR>>>>>>> It doth rock=20
>>much.<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>AA<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>=
>>;>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>"DC" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT =
>>face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>message </FONT><A href=3D"news:44793f10$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>news:44793f10$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>...<BR>>>>>>> =
>>><BR>>>>>>> > Ok,=20
>>here's the short version. I've been working on this most =
>>of<BR>>=20
>>the<BR>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so =
>>this is=20
>>very incomplete.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>> It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4=20
>>stereo<BR>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8=20
>>compressors.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>><BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
>>secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
>>band with=20
>>EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
>>all are=20
>>done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>>the<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
>>settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
>>to just=20
>>create the files to do this!)<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>><BR>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, =
>>and a=20
>>general PITA.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>><BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results=20
>>are<BR>>>>>>> > friggin'=20
>>fabulous.<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>=20
>>Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing =
>>really.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>><BR>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. =20
>>Later. BTW, you must leave some<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>=20
>>headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but=20
>>the<BR>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying =
>>that for=20
>>years). This technique<BR>>>>>>> > works so =
>>beautifully=20
>>with slamming the Paris mix buss that it =
>>seems<BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is=20
>>grinning...<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>=20
>>Paris for mastering. wadda concept.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>><BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>Rob=20
>>Arsenault" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:mani2@nbnet.nb.ca"><FONT =
>>face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>mani2@nbnet.nb.ca</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>>=20
>>wrote:<BR>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do=20
>>share...!!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <</FONT><A=20
>>href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>message <BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Hey=20
>>all,<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a=20
>>multiband<BR>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor =
>>in=20
>>Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for=20
>>the<BR>>>>>>> >>>> help with=20
>>this.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very =
>>familiar=20
>><BR>>>>>>> >>>>=20
>>material<BR>>>>>>> >>>> that are just =
>>making me=20
>>grin from ear to ear...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as =
>>I get=20
>>this live disc out the door I will post the <BR>>>>>>> =
>>
>>>>>> details.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Paris=20
>>lives!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>&=
>>gt;>>>=20
>>I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and =
>>you?<BR>>>>>>>=20
>></FONT><A href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html"><FONT face=3DArial
>=
>>
>>size=3D2>http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html</FONT></A><BR><FONT =
>>face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>=
>>>>><BR>>>>>><BR>>>>><BR>>>> =
>>
>><BR>>><BR>>><BR>></FONT> </BODY></HTML>
>>
>>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: Multi Band Mastering in Paris [message #68783 is a reply to message #68778] |
Wed, 31 May 2006 05:59 |
Neil
Messages: 1645
Registered: April 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I suspect Doug Wellington
>has it posted on his page. Doug, you still out there man?
I have that plugin, and would be happy to e-mail it to anyone
who needs it (which I assume Matt would be OK with, since he
made it available for free). If anyone needs it, shoot me an
e-mail so I can reply to it with the file attached. My e-mail
is: neil DOT henderson AT sbcglobal DOT net.
IMO, however, I disagree with those who say it sounds EXACTLY
like the embedded Paris EQ... the low end reacts a bit
differently, methinks. But then, that could be because I'm
using it at 88.2k, which Matt himself told me he wasn't sure if
it would work with that samplerate or not (it does).
Also, for you guys who are considering getting into mastering,
you absolutely need to check out Ozone as a much less labor-
intensive alternative to the method Don brought up herein; you
can get your multiband compression, limiting & expansion
(4 bands), a high-quality maximizer, exciter, mastering reverb,
several types of dithering, a stereo imager/enhancer (be
careful! use sparingly!), and a FANTASTIC linear-phase EQ (but
you can also "analog-model" it, too). For 250 bucks, once you
hear it - to quote DJ - you will have to have it or you will
die.
Read all about it & get the demo here:
http://www.izotope.com/products/audio/ozone/
Neil
|
|
|
|
| Re: Multi Band Mastering in Paris [message #68784 is a reply to message #68782] |
Wed, 31 May 2006 07:07 |
excelav
Messages: 2130
Registered: July 2005
Location: Metro Detroit
|
Senior Member |
|
|
I've got Matt Craig's Paris EQ some where, but I don't have his comp. Can
somebody email me Matt Craig's comp?
Thanks
James
excelsm@hotmail.com
"Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com> wrote:
>
>Kim, I have experimented with mastering this way a lot. And yes, sometimes
>that does happen. What I notice is, stereo imaging will jump around. I know
>Sakis uses this method, with success so it's probably a matter of getting
>every set right. I'm just not that good!
>Now here's the good news for PC guys. Using Matt Craig's comp. you check
>the stereo box and have a stereo Paris comp...pre eq.
>Rod
>
>"Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>While I have heard a lot of people more knowledgable than myself talk up
>>this method of mastering, one thing has always bothered me...
>>
>>The Paris compressors are mono. Therefore your left and right channels
are
>>being processed seperately. Surely your stereo imaging will go all over
>the
>>place?!? I mean, for starters, anything that's loud in a given frequency
>>band, and not centred, will tend to get centred, because the louder channel
>>will cop more compression. If, in a given band, the left channel is louder
>>than the right channel, everything in that band will get panned further
>right,
>>because the left channel will get compressed / reduced in level more than
>>the right channel. What's more, some sounds will no doubt cover more than
>>one frequency band, and as this "repanning" effect is unlikely to be identical
>>in all frequency bands, one part of a sound may get panned further right,
>>while another band of it stays where it is, or even moves further left
depending
>>what is in that band.
>>
>>I would have thought that on material with considerable stereo content,
>things
>>will end up all over the shop in terms of stereo imaging.
>>
>>On the other hand, there's a very practicle school of thought which says
>>"If it sounds good, just do it"...
>>
>>Cheers,
>>Kim.
>>
>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>Ok, you asked for it......... PC mastering technique in Paris:
>>>
>>>Take your 2 track L/R master final mix file. Put the Left mix file on
=
>>>Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left. Put the Right mix file on Channels
>>=
>>>2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris VST EQ, split the files =
>>>into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will be low mid band, 5/6
>>=
>>>will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary depending on
=
>>>taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears, =
>>>nobody can hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with
>>=
>>>the Sakis Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid 540-6Khz
Hi
>>=
>>>6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with =
>>>either the Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris
=
>>>VST EQ. The placement is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together
=
>>>using Grouping on the mixer. Do not for ANY reason split these waves =
>>>into another editor unless you're ready to fight phase and time delay
=
>>>demons between submixes. Also, be sure you have everything selected with
>>=
>>>the time lock tool when you do this - same reason about phase/time.=20
>>>
>>>Now, the thing is, you can adjust the Gain/EQ mojo separately for each
>=
>>>band, you can compress with different ratios, thresholds.. whatever =
>>>suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the Paris compressor, be
=
>>>sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, 3=3D4, 5=3D6, =
>>>7=3D8). Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period.=20
>>>
>>>Now then, for more secret sauce beyond the Eq/Gain trick.. put one more
>>=
>>>compressor on the global but do NOT compress with it. Threshold all the
>>=
>>>way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the gain output to beat the
>>=
>>>snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but ... and this is also
>>=
>>>super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5 dB or you'll
=
>>>blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital converters that
=
>>>your stuff will eventually have to suffer.=20
>>>Be careful in all this, you have SO much gain shaping you can turn the
>=
>>>wav into a baby ruth in the repro guy's editor... and no one wants to
=
>>>find a baby ruth floating in their pool of music. Don't smash it so much
>>=
>>>that it only takes 5 bits to play it back faithfully. Again, use your
=
>>>ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will take more abuse than say, a =
>>>ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program material dependant'
=
>>>thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like a Pantera
=
>>>tune, for example.=20
>>>
>>>Essentially you are creating a Waves multiband compressor, only you're
>=
>>>using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, .. better IMO. YMMV. If you
>=
>>>plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and create your own =
>>>template PPJ you can just time lock drag the 'files' to and be on your
>=
>>>way.=20
>>>
>>>For you Mac mastering gurus, just replace the Paris VST EQ with a good
>=
>>>sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band pass and hi pass.
>=
>>>Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain trick in the =
>>>Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris EQ
=
>>>Gain in it's place post eq/compression for each group of channels.
>>>
>>>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I suspect Doug Wellington has it =
>>>posted on his page.
>>>Doug, you still out there man?
>>>
>>>AA,=20
>>>semi kinda not really a mastering dude guy
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------ -------------=
>>>----------------------
>>>
>>>"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:447cb558$1@linux...
>>>>=20
>>>> So what's this trick mastering technique?
>>>>=20
>>>> "Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is somewhere in Tank's
>>=
>>>Steiny
>>>>=20
>>>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did an amazing job of recreating the =
>>>Paris
>>>>=20
>>>>>channel Eq/Gain mojo.
>>>>>AA
>>>>>
>>>>>"chuck duffy" <cxsd@c.com> wrote in message news:447b8639$1@linux...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Don,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the paris eq when phase inverted.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I forced Brian T to try it when he was unconvinced.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I know that everyone is dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for
>>=
>>>months
>>>>>> to ensure that he could perfectly emulate the paris eq.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about
>>=
>>>this
>>>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when on whatever vst
=
>>>forum
>>>> it
>>>>>> was posted in.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I know this won't help anyones perception, but when I hear people=20
>>>>>> wondering
>>>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this plug is it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> CHuck
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinheck.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
>>>>>>>What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
>>>>>>>does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Sounds great though.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>DC
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>>>>>>>Thanks, Edna
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the
>>=
>>>secret
>>>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the =
>>>next
>>>>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to
>=
>>>the
>>>>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
>>>settings.
>>>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do =
>>>this!)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig =
>>>Paris
>>>> VST
>>>>>>>EQ,
>>>>>>>>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried
>>=
>>>the
>>>>>> VST
>>>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>>>>>>>> It doth rock much.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> AA
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message =
>>>news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most
>=
>>>of
>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use
4
>>=
>>>stereo
>>>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the
>>=
>>>secret
>>>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the =
>>>next
>>>>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to
>=
>>>the
>>>>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
>>>settings.
>>>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do =
>>>this!)
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>>>>>>>>> > friggin' fabulous.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>>>>>>>> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>>>>>>>> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it
>=
>>>seems
>>>>>>>>> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message=20
>>>>>>>>> >>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>> Hey all,
>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for
>>=
>>>the
>>>>>>>>> >>>> help with this.
>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar=20
>>>>>>>>> >>>> material
>>>>>>>>> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the
>>=
>>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>> details.
>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>> Paris lives!
>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>> DC
>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>>>>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
>>><HTML><HEAD>
>>><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>>>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
>>><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.5296.0" name=3DGENERATOR>
>>><STYLE></STYLE>
>>></HEAD>
>>><BODY>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><EM>Ok, you asked for it......... PC
=
>>>mastering=20
>>>technique in Paris:</EM></FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Take your 2 track L/R master
=
>>>final mix=20
>>>file. Put the Left mix file on Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left. =
>>>Put the=20
>>>Right mix file on Channels 2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris
>>=
>>>VST EQ,=20
>>>split the files into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will be
>=
>>>low mid=20
>>>band, 5/6 will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary =
>>>depending on=20
>>>taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears, =
>>>nobody can=20
>>>hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with the Sakis=20
>>>Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid =
>>>540-6Khz Hi=20
>>>6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with =
>>>either the=20
>>>Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris VST EQ. The
>=
>>>placement=20
>>>is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together using Grouping on the
=
>>>mixer. Do=20
>>>not for ANY reason split these waves into another editor unless you're
>=
>>>ready to=20
>>>fight phase and time delay demons between submixes. Also, be sure you
=
>>>have=20
>>>everything selected with the time lock tool when you do this - same =
>>>reason about=20
>>>phase/time. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now, the thing is, you can =
>>>adjust the=20
>>>Gain/EQ mojo separately for each band, you can compress with different
>=
>>>ratios,=20
>>>thresholds.. whatever suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the
>=
>>>Paris=20
>>>compressor, be sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, =
>>>3=3D4, 5=3D6, 7=3D8).=20
>>>Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now then, for more secret sauce
>>=
>>>beyond the=20
>>>Eq/Gain trick.. put one more compressor on the global but do NOT =
>>>compress with=20
>>>it. Threshold all the way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the
>=
>>>gain=20
>>>output to beat the snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but
=
>>>... and=20
>>>this is also super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5
dB
>>=
>>>or=20
>>>you'll blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital =
>>>converters=20
>>>that your stuff will eventually have to suffer. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Be careful in all this, you =
>>>have SO much=20
>>>gain shaping you can turn the wav into a baby ruth in the repro=20
>>>guy's editor... and no one wants to find a baby ruth floating in =
>>>their pool=20
>>>of music. Don't smash it so much that it only takes 5 bits to play =
>>>it back=20
>>>faithfully. Again, use your ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will =
>>>take more=20
>>>abuse than say, a ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program =
>>>material=20
>>>dependant' thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like
>a
>>=
>>>Pantera=20
>>>tune, for example</STRONG>. </FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Essentially you are creating a Waves
=
>>>multiband=20
>>>compressor, only you're using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, ..
=
>>>better=20
>>>IMO. YMMV. If you plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and=20
>>>create your own template PPJ you can just time lock drag the =
>>>'files'=20
>>>to and be on your way. </FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>For you Mac mastering gurus, just =
>>>replace the Paris=20
>>>VST EQ with a good sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band
>=
>>>pass and=20
>>>hi pass. Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain =
>>>trick in=20
>>>the Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris
>=
>>>EQ Gain=20
>>>in it's place post eq/compression for each group of =
>>>channels.</FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I =
>>>suspect Doug=20
>>>Wellington has it posted on his page.</FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Doug, you still out there =
>>>man?</FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"=20
>>>size=3D3><EM><STRONG>AA,</STRONG></EM></FONT> </FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>semi kinda not really a mastering dude=20
>>>guy</FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2> ------------------------------------------------------------ ----=
>>>-------------------------------</FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>"John" <</FONT><A =
>>>href=3D"mailto:no@no.com"><FONT=20
>>>face=3DArial size=3D2>no@no.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>>message </FONT><A href=3D"news:447cb558$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>news:447cb558$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>...</FONT></DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> <BR>> So =
>>>what's this=20
>>>trick mastering technique?<BR>> <BR>> "Aaron Allen" <</FONT><A=20
>>>href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>>
=
>>>
>>>wrote:<BR>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is =
>>>somewhere in=20
>>>Tank's Steiny<BR>> <BR>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did =
>>>an=20
>>>amazing job of recreating the Paris<BR>> <BR>>>channel Eq/Gain=20
>>>mojo.<BR>>>AA<BR>>><BR>>>"chuck duffy" <</FONT><A=20
>>>href=3D"mailto:cxsd@c.com"><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>size=3D2>cxsd@c.com</FONT></A><FONT=20
>>>face=3DArial size=3D2>> wrote in message </FONT><A=20
>>>href=3D"news:447b8639$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>news:447b8639$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>...<BR>>>><BR>>>> Hi=20
>>>Don,<BR>>>><BR>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the =
>>>paris eq=20
>>>when phase inverted.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I forced Brian T to =
>>>try it=20
>>>when he was unconvinced.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I know that =
>>>everyone is=20
>>>dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for months<BR>>>> to =
>>>ensure=20
>>>that he could perfectly emulate the paris =
>>>eq.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I=20
>>>am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about=20
>>>this<BR>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when =
>>>on=20
>>>whatever vst forum<BR>> it<BR>>>> was posted=20
>>>in.<BR>>>><BR>>>><BR>>>> I know this won't =
>>>help=20
>>>anyones perception, but when I hear people <BR>>>>=20
>>>wondering<BR>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this =
>>>plug is=20
>>>it.<BR>>>><BR>>>> =
>>>CHuck<BR>>>><BR>>>> "DC"=20
>>><</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinheck.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinheck.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>size=3D2>>=20
>>>wrote:<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>As I understand it, that =
>>>EQ was=20
>>>pretty colored and non-linear.<BR>>>>>What I need is simple, =
>>>clean,=20
>>>accurate band splits. The Paris EQ<BR>>>>>does this =
>>>nicely,=20
>>>but the whole process is tedious to say the=20
>>>least.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>Sounds great=20
>>>though.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>DC<BR>>>>><BR>=
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>"RiverLake=20
>>>Farms" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:edna@texomaonline.com"><FONT =
>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>edna@texomaonline.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>size=3D2>>=20
>>>wrote:<BR>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still=20
>>>available?<BR>>>>>>Thanks,=20
>>>Edna<BR>>>>>><BR>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" =
>>><</FONT><A=20
>>>href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>>
=
>>>wrote in=20
>>>message<BR>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...<BR>>>>&g=
>>>t;>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>> I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
>>>secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
>>>band with=20
>>>EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
>>>all are=20
>>>done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>>>the<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
>>>settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
>>>to just=20
>>>create the files to do=20
>>>this!)<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> DC, this =
>>>can be=20
>>>achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris<BR>>=20
>>>VST<BR>>>>>EQ,<BR>>>>>>> and in real =
>>>timeif you=20
>>>want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the<BR>>>>=20
>>>VST<BR>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application=20
>>>yet?<BR>>>>>>> It doth rock=20
>>>much.<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>AA<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>=
>>>;>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>"DC" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT =
>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>>message </FONT><A href=3D"news:44793f10$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>news:44793f10$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>...<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>><BR>>>>>>> > Ok,=20
>>>here's the short version. I've been working on this most =
>>>of<BR>>=20
>>>the<BR>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so =
>>>this is=20
>>>very incomplete.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>> It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4=20
>>>stereo<BR>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8=20
>>>compressors.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>><BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>>I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
>>>secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
>>>band with=20
>>>EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
>>>all are=20
>>>done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>>>the<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
>>>settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
>>>to just=20
>>>create the files to do this!)<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, =
>>>and a=20
>>>general PITA.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>><BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>>HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results=20
>>>are<BR>>>>>>> > friggin'=20
>>>fabulous.<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>=20
>>>Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing =
>>>really.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. =20
>>>Later. BTW, you must leave some<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>=20
>>>headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but=20
>>>the<BR>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying =
>>>that for=20
>>>years). This technique<BR>>>>>>> > works so =
>>>beautifully=20
>>>with slamming the Paris mix buss that it =
>>>seems<BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>>like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is=20
>>>grinning...<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>=20
>>>Paris for mastering. wadda concept.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>Rob=20
>>>Arsenault" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:mani2@nbnet.nb.ca"><FONT =
>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>mani2@nbnet.nb.ca</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>>=20
>>>wrote:<BR>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do=20
>>>share...!!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <</FONT><A=20
>>>href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>>message <BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Hey=20
>>>all,<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a=20
>>>multiband<BR>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor =
>>>in=20
>>>Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for=20
>>>the<BR>>>>>>> >>>> help with=20
>>>this.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very =
>>>familiar=20
>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>>=20
>>>material<BR>>>>>>> >>>> that are just =
>>>making me=20
>>>grin from ear to ear...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as =
>>>I get=20
>>>this live disc out the door I will post the <BR>>>>>>> =
>>>
>>>>>>> details.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Paris=20
>>>lives!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>> DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>&=
>>>gt;>>>=20
>>>I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and =
>>>you?<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>></FONT><A href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html"><FONT face=3DArial
>>=
>>>
>>>size=3D2>http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html</FONT></A><BR><FONT =
>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>=
>>>>>><BR>>>>>><BR>>>>><BR>>>> =
>>>
>>><BR>>><BR>>><BR>></FONT> </BODY></HTML>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: Multi Band Mastering in Paris [message #68785 is a reply to message #68780] |
Wed, 31 May 2006 07:32 |
DC
Messages: 722
Registered: July 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Kim,
Actually, when setup right, the opposite happens. The stereo
image becomes much more solid and stable and quite improved.
Remember, the left and right settings have to match exactly.
When you do this, it actually corrects for L-R level mismatches
precisely because it is not doing the same thing on both sides.
If you add too much compression, what will happen is a tonal
imbalance between the bands, not a stereo imbalance.
Try it, and you will see what I mean. The stereo image was much
improved and solid and stable as a rock. Linked compressors would
not work for this.
DC
"Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>While I have heard a lot of people more knowledgable than myself talk up
>this method of mastering, one thing has always bothered me...
>
>The Paris compressors are mono. Therefore your left and right channels are
>being processed seperately. Surely your stereo imaging will go all over
the
>place?!? I mean, for starters, anything that's loud in a given frequency
>band, and not centred, will tend to get centred, because the louder channel
>will cop more compression. If, in a given band, the left channel is louder
>than the right channel, everything in that band will get panned further
right,
>because the left channel will get compressed / reduced in level more than
>the right channel. What's more, some sounds will no doubt cover more than
>one frequency band, and as this "repanning" effect is unlikely to be identical
>in all frequency bands, one part of a sound may get panned further right,
>while another band of it stays where it is, or even moves further left depending
>what is in that band.
>
>I would have thought that on material with considerable stereo content,
things
>will end up all over the shop in terms of stereo imaging.
>
>On the other hand, there's a very practicle school of thought which says
>"If it sounds good, just do it"...
>
>Cheers,
>Kim.
>
>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>
>>
>>Ok, you asked for it......... PC mastering technique in Paris:
>>
>>Take your 2 track L/R master final mix file. Put the Left mix file on =
>>Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left. Put the Right mix file on Channels
>=
>>2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris VST EQ, split the files =
>>into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will be low mid band, 5/6
>=
>>will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary depending on =
>>taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears, =
>>nobody can hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with
>=
>>the Sakis Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid 540-6Khz Hi
>=
>>6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with =
>>either the Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris =
>>VST EQ. The placement is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together =
>>using Grouping on the mixer. Do not for ANY reason split these waves =
>>into another editor unless you're ready to fight phase and time delay =
>>demons between submixes. Also, be sure you have everything selected with
>=
>>the time lock tool when you do this - same reason about phase/time.=20
>>
>>Now, the thing is, you can adjust the Gain/EQ mojo separately for each
=
>>band, you can compress with different ratios, thresholds.. whatever =
>>suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the Paris compressor, be =
>>sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, 3=3D4, 5=3D6, =
>>7=3D8). Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period.=20
>>
>>Now then, for more secret sauce beyond the Eq/Gain trick.. put one more
>=
>>compressor on the global but do NOT compress with it. Threshold all the
>=
>>way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the gain output to beat the
>=
>>snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but ... and this is also
>=
>>super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5 dB or you'll =
>>blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital converters that =
>>your stuff will eventually have to suffer.=20
>>Be careful in all this, you have SO much gain shaping you can turn the
=
>>wav into a baby ruth in the repro guy's editor... and no one wants to =
>>find a baby ruth floating in their pool of music. Don't smash it so much
>=
>>that it only takes 5 bits to play it back faithfully. Again, use your =
>>ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will take more abuse than say, a =
>>ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program material dependant' =
>>thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like a Pantera =
>>tune, for example.=20
>>
>>Essentially you are creating a Waves multiband compressor, only you're
=
>>using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, .. better IMO. YMMV. If you
=
>>plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and create your own =
>>template PPJ you can just time lock drag the 'files' to and be on your
=
>>way.=20
>>
>>For you Mac mastering gurus, just replace the Paris VST EQ with a good
=
>>sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band pass and hi pass.
=
>>Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain trick in the =
>>Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris EQ =
>>Gain in it's place post eq/compression for each group of channels.
>>
>>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I suspect Doug Wellington has it =
>>posted on his page.
>>Doug, you still out there man?
>>
>>AA,=20
>>semi kinda not really a mastering dude guy
>> ------------------------------------------------------------ -------------=
>>----------------------
>>
>>"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:447cb558$1@linux...
>>>=20
>>> So what's this trick mastering technique?
>>>=20
>>> "Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is somewhere in Tank's
>=
>>Steiny
>>>=20
>>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did an amazing job of recreating the =
>>Paris
>>>=20
>>>>channel Eq/Gain mojo.
>>>>AA
>>>>
>>>>"chuck duffy" <cxsd@c.com> wrote in message news:447b8639$1@linux...
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi Don,
>>>>>
>>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the paris eq when phase inverted.
>>>>>
>>>>> I forced Brian T to try it when he was unconvinced.
>>>>>
>>>>> I know that everyone is dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for
>=
>>months
>>>>> to ensure that he could perfectly emulate the paris eq.
>>>>>
>>>>> I am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about
>=
>>this
>>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when on whatever vst =
>>forum
>>> it
>>>>> was posted in.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I know this won't help anyones perception, but when I hear people=20
>>>>> wondering
>>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this plug is it.
>>>>>
>>>>> CHuck
>>>>>
>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinheck.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
>>>>>>What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
>>>>>>does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Sounds great though.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>DC
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>>>>>>Thanks, Edna
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the
>=
>>secret
>>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the =
>>next
>>>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to
=
>>the
>>>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
>>settings.
>>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do =
>>this!)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig =
>>Paris
>>> VST
>>>>>>EQ,
>>>>>>>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried
>=
>>the
>>>>> VST
>>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>>>>>>> It doth rock much.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> AA
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message =
>>news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most
=
>>of
>>> the
>>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4
>=
>>stereo
>>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the
>=
>>secret
>>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the =
>>next
>>>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to
=
>>the
>>>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
>>settings.
>>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do =
>>this!)
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>>>>>>>> > friggin' fabulous.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>>>>>>> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>>>>>>> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it
=
>>seems
>>>>>>>> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message=20
>>>>>>>> >>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>> Hey all,
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for
>=
>>the
>>>>>>>> >>>> help with this.
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar=20
>>>>>>>> >>>> material
>>>>>>>> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the
>=
>>
>>>>>>>> >>>> details.
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>> Paris lives!
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>> DC
>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>>>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>=20
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
>><HTML><HEAD>
>><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
>><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.5296.0" name=3DGENERATOR>
>><STYLE></STYLE>
>></HEAD>
>><BODY>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><EM>Ok, you asked for it......... PC =
>>mastering=20
>>technique in Paris:</EM></FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Take your 2 track L/R master =
>>final mix=20
>>file. Put the Left mix file on Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left. =
>>Put the=20
>>Right mix file on Channels 2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris
>=
>>VST EQ,=20
>>split the files into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will be
=
>>low mid=20
>>band, 5/6 will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary =
>>depending on=20
>>taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears, =
>>nobody can=20
>>hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with the Sakis=20
>>Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid =
>>540-6Khz Hi=20
>>6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with =
>>either the=20
>>Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris VST EQ. The
=
>>placement=20
>>is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together using Grouping on the =
>>mixer. Do=20
>>not for ANY reason split these waves into another editor unless you're
=
>>ready to=20
>>fight phase and time delay demons between submixes. Also, be sure you =
>>have=20
>>everything selected with the time lock tool when you do this - same =
>>reason about=20
>>phase/time. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now, the thing is, you can =
>>adjust the=20
>>Gain/EQ mojo separately for each band, you can compress with different
=
>>ratios,=20
>>thresholds.. whatever suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the
=
>>Paris=20
>>compressor, be sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, =
>>3=3D4, 5=3D6, 7=3D8).=20
>>Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now then, for more secret sauce
>=
>>beyond the=20
>>Eq/Gain trick.. put one more compressor on the global but do NOT =
>>compress with=20
>>it. Threshold all the way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the
=
>>gain=20
>>output to beat the snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but =
>>... and=20
>>this is also super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5 dB
>=
>>or=20
>>you'll blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital =
>>converters=20
>>that your stuff will eventually have to suffer. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Be careful in all this, you =
>>have SO much=20
>>gain shaping you can turn the wav into a baby ruth in the repro=20
>>guy's editor... and no one wants to find a baby ruth floating in =
>>their pool=20
>>of music. Don't smash it so much that it only takes 5 bits to play =
>>it back=20
>>faithfully. Again, use your ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will =
>>take more=20
>>abuse than say, a ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program =
>>material=20
>>dependant' thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like
a
>=
>>Pantera=20
>>tune, for example</STRONG>. </FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Essentially you are creating a Waves =
>>multiband=20
>>compressor, only you're using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, .. =
>>better=20
>>IMO. YMMV. If you plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and=20
>>create your own template PPJ you can just time lock drag the =
>>'files'=20
>>to and be on your way. </FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>For you Mac mastering gurus, just =
>>replace the Paris=20
>>VST EQ with a good sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band
=
>>pass and=20
>>hi pass. Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain =
>>trick in=20
>>the Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris
=
>>EQ Gain=20
>>in it's place post eq/compression for each group of =
>>channels.</FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I =
>>suspect Doug=20
>>Wellington has it posted on his page.</FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Doug, you still out there =
>>man?</FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"=20
>>size=3D3><EM><STRONG>AA,</STRONG></EM></FONT> </FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>semi kinda not really a mastering dude=20
>>guy</FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2> ------------------------------------------------------------ ----=
>>-------------------------------</FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>"John" <</FONT><A =
>>href=3D"mailto:no@no.com"><FONT=20
>>face=3DArial size=3D2>no@no.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>message </FONT><A href=3D"news:447cb558$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>news:447cb558$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>...</FONT></DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> <BR>> So =
>>what's this=20
>>trick mastering technique?<BR>> <BR>> "Aaron Allen" <</FONT><A=20
>>href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> =
>>
>>wrote:<BR>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is =
>>somewhere in=20
>>Tank's Steiny<BR>> <BR>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did =
>>an=20
>>amazing job of recreating the Paris<BR>> <BR>>>channel Eq/Gain=20
>>mojo.<BR>>>AA<BR>>><BR>>>"chuck duffy" <</FONT><A=20
>>href=3D"mailto:cxsd@c.com"><FONT face=3DArial =
>>size=3D2>cxsd@c.com</FONT></A><FONT=20
>>face=3DArial size=3D2>> wrote in message </FONT><A=20
>>href=3D"news:447b8639$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>news:447b8639$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>...<BR>>>><BR>>>> Hi=20
>>Don,<BR>>>><BR>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the =
>>paris eq=20
>>when phase inverted.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I forced Brian T to =
>>try it=20
>>when he was unconvinced.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I know that =
>>everyone is=20
>>dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for months<BR>>>> to =
>>ensure=20
>>that he could perfectly emulate the paris =
>>eq.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I=20
>>am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about=20
>>this<BR>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when =
>>on=20
>>whatever vst forum<BR>> it<BR>>>> was posted=20
>>in.<BR>>>><BR>>>><BR>>>> I know this won't =
>>help=20
>>anyones perception, but when I hear people <BR>>>>=20
>>wondering<BR>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this =
>>plug is=20
>>it.<BR>>>><BR>>>> =
>>CHuck<BR>>>><BR>>>> "DC"=20
>><</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinheck.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinheck.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>size=3D2>>=20
>>wrote:<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>As I understand it, that =
>>EQ was=20
>>pretty colored and non-linear.<BR>>>>>What I need is simple, =
>>clean,=20
>>accurate band splits. The Paris EQ<BR>>>>>does this =
>>nicely,=20
>>but the whole process is tedious to say the=20
>>least.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>Sounds great=20
>>though.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>DC<BR>>>>><BR>=
>>>>>><BR>>>>>"RiverLake=20
>>Farms" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:edna@texomaonline.com"><FONT =
>>face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>edna@texomaonline.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>size=3D2>>=20
>>wrote:<BR>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still=20
>>available?<BR>>>>>>Thanks,=20
>>Edna<BR>>>>>><BR>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" =
>><</FONT><A=20
>>href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> =
>>wrote in=20
>>message<BR>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...<BR>>>>&g=
>>t;>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>> I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
>>secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
>>band with=20
>>EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
>>all are=20
>>done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>>the<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
>>settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
>>to just=20
>>create the files to do=20
>>this!)<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> DC, this =
>>can be=20
>>achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris<BR>>=20
>>VST<BR>>>>>EQ,<BR>>>>>>> and in real =
>>timeif you=20
>>want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the<BR>>>>=20
>>VST<BR>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application=20
>>yet?<BR>>>>>>> It doth rock=20
>>much.<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>AA<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>=
>>;>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>"DC" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT =
>>face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>message </FONT><A href=3D"news:44793f10$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>news:44793f10$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>...<BR>>>>>>> =
>>><BR>>>>>>> > Ok,=20
>>here's the short version. I've been working on this most =
>>of<BR>>=20
>>the<BR>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so =
>>this is=20
>>very incomplete.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>> It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4=20
>>stereo<BR>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8=20
>>compressors.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>><BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
>>secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
>>band with=20
>>EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
>>all are=20
>>done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>>the<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
>>settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
>>to just=20
>>create the files to do this!)<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>><BR>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, =
>>and a=20
>>general PITA.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>><BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results=20
>>are<BR>>>>>>> > friggin'=20
>>fabulous.<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>=20
>>Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing =
>>really.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>><BR>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. =20
>>Later. BTW, you must leave some<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>=20
>>headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but=20
>>the<BR>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying =
>>that for=20
>>years). This technique<BR>>>>>>> > works so =
>>beautifully=20
>>with slamming the Paris mix buss that it =
>>seems<BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is=20
>>grinning...<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>=20
>>Paris for mastering. wadda concept.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>><BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>Rob=20
>>Arsenault" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:mani2@nbnet.nb.ca"><FONT =
>>face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>mani2@nbnet.nb.ca</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>>=20
>>wrote:<BR>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do=20
>>share...!!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <</FONT><A=20
>>href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>message <BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Hey=20
>>all,<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a=20
>>multiband<BR>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor =
>>in=20
>>Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for=20
>>the<BR>>>>>>> >>>> help with=20
>>this.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very =
>>familiar=20
>><BR>>>>>>> >>>>=20
>>material<BR>>>>>>> >>>> that are just =
>>making me=20
>>grin from ear to ear...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as =
>>I get=20
>>this live disc out the door I will post the <BR>>>>>>> =
>>
>>>>>> details.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Paris=20
>>lives!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>&=
>>gt;>>>=20
>>I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and =
>>you?<BR>>>>>>>=20
>></FONT><A href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html"><FONT face=3DArial
>=
>>
>>size=3D2>http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html</FONT></A><BR><FONT =
>>face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>=
>>>>><BR>>>>>><BR>>>>><BR>>>> =
>>
>><BR>>><BR>>><BR>></FONT> </BODY></HTML>
>>
>>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: Multi Band Mastering in Paris [message #68787 is a reply to message #68778] |
Wed, 31 May 2006 08:56 |
Rich[3]
Messages: 132
Registered: January 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Thank you!! Man there is a wealth of info on this board. It would be great
to someone take some of the How To stuff like this and make a reference of
some sort... I'd buy it! Thanks again for all the help along the way!!
What about a weekly post on a subject to discuss some technique / hardware/software
on. For instance I've been reading about the Mside st. miking but I never
see (never say never) it used for drum overheads - why is that??
"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>
>
>Ok, you asked for it......... PC mastering technique in Paris:
>
>Take your 2 track L/R master final mix file. Put the Left mix file on =
>Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left. Put the Right mix file on Channels
=
>2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris VST EQ, split the files =
>into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will be low mid band, 5/6
=
>will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary depending on =
>taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears, =
>nobody can hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with
=
>the Sakis Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid 540-6Khz Hi
=
>6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with =
>either the Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris =
>VST EQ. The placement is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together =
>using Grouping on the mixer. Do not for ANY reason split these waves =
>into another editor unless you're ready to fight phase and time delay =
>demons between submixes. Also, be sure you have everything selected with
=
>the time lock tool when you do this - same reason about phase/time.=20
>
>Now, the thing is, you can adjust the Gain/EQ mojo separately for each =
>band, you can compress with different ratios, thresholds.. whatever =
>suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the Paris compressor, be =
>sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, 3=3D4, 5=3D6, =
>7=3D8). Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period.=20
>
>Now then, for more secret sauce beyond the Eq/Gain trick.. put one more
=
>compressor on the global but do NOT compress with it. Threshold all the
=
>way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the gain output to beat the
=
>snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but ... and this is also
=
>super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5 dB or you'll =
>blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital converters that =
>your stuff will eventually have to suffer.=20
>Be careful in all this, you have SO much gain shaping you can turn the =
>wav into a baby ruth in the repro guy's editor... and no one wants to =
>find a baby ruth floating in their pool of music. Don't smash it so much
=
>that it only takes 5 bits to play it back faithfully. Again, use your =
>ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will take more abuse than say, a =
>ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program material dependant' =
>thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like a Pantera =
>tune, for example.=20
>
>Essentially you are creating a Waves multiband compressor, only you're =
>using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, .. better IMO. YMMV. If you =
>plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and create your own =
>template PPJ you can just time lock drag the 'files' to and be on your =
>way.=20
>
>For you Mac mastering gurus, just replace the Paris VST EQ with a good =
>sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band pass and hi pass. =
>Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain trick in the =
>Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris EQ =
>Gain in it's place post eq/compression for each group of channels.
>
>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I suspect Doug Wellington has it =
>posted on his page.
>Doug, you still out there man?
>
>AA,=20
>semi kinda not really a mastering dude guy
> ------------------------------------------------------------ -------------=
>----------------------
>
>"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:447cb558$1@linux...
>>=20
>> So what's this trick mastering technique?
>>=20
>> "Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is somewhere in Tank's
=
>Steiny
>>=20
>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did an amazing job of recreating the =
>Paris
>>=20
>>>channel Eq/Gain mojo.
>>>AA
>>>
>>>"chuck duffy" <cxsd@c.com> wrote in message news:447b8639$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> Hi Don,
>>>>
>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the paris eq when phase inverted.
>>>>
>>>> I forced Brian T to try it when he was unconvinced.
>>>>
>>>> I know that everyone is dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for
=
>months
>>>> to ensure that he could perfectly emulate the paris eq.
>>>>
>>>> I am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about
=
>this
>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when on whatever vst =
>forum
>> it
>>>> was posted in.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I know this won't help anyones perception, but when I hear people=20
>>>> wondering
>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this plug is it.
>>>>
>>>> CHuck
>>>>
>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinheck.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
>>>>>What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
>>>>>does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>>>>>
>>>>>Sounds great though.
>>>>>
>>>>>DC
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>"RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>>>>>Thanks, Edna
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the
=
>secret
>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the =
>next
>>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>the
>>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
>settings.
>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do =
>this!)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig =
>Paris
>> VST
>>>>>EQ,
>>>>>>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried
=
>the
>>>> VST
>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>>>>>> It doth rock much.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> AA
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message =
>news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most =
>of
>> the
>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4
=
>stereo
>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the
=
>secret
>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the =
>next
>>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>the
>>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
>settings.
>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do =
>this!)
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>>>>>>> > friggin' fabulous.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>>>>>> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>>>>>> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it =
>seems
>>>>>>> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message=20
>>>>>>> >>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>> >>>> Hey all,
>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for
=
>the
>>>>>>> >>>> help with this.
>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar=20
>>>>>>> >>>> material
>>>>>>> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the
=
>
>>>>>>> >>>> details.
>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>> >>>> Paris lives!
>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>> >>>> DC
>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>=20
>>>
>>>
>>
>
><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
><HTML><HEAD>
><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.5296.0" name=3DGENERATOR>
><STYLE></STYLE>
></HEAD>
><BODY>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><EM>Ok, you asked for it......... PC =
>mastering=20
>technique in Paris:</EM></FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Take your 2 track L/R master =
>final mix=20
>file. Put the Left mix file on Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left. =
>Put the=20
>Right mix file on Channels 2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris
=
>VST EQ,=20
>split the files into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will be =
>low mid=20
>band, 5/6 will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary =
>depending on=20
>taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears, =
>nobody can=20
>hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with the Sakis=20
>Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid =
>540-6Khz Hi=20
>6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with =
>either the=20
>Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris VST EQ. The =
>placement=20
>is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together using Grouping on the =
>mixer. Do=20
>not for ANY reason split these waves into another editor unless you're =
>ready to=20
>fight phase and time delay demons between submixes. Also, be sure you =
>have=20
>everything selected with the time lock tool when you do this - same =
>reason about=20
>phase/time. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now, the thing is, you can =
>adjust the=20
>Gain/EQ mojo separately for each band, you can compress with different =
>ratios,=20
>thresholds.. whatever suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the =
>Paris=20
>compressor, be sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, =
>3=3D4, 5=3D6, 7=3D8).=20
>Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now then, for more secret sauce
=
>beyond the=20
>Eq/Gain trick.. put one more compressor on the global but do NOT =
>compress with=20
>it. Threshold all the way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the =
>gain=20
>output to beat the snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but =
>... and=20
>this is also super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5 dB
=
>or=20
>you'll blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital =
>converters=20
>that your stuff will eventually have to suffer. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Be careful in all this, you =
>have SO much=20
>gain shaping you can turn the wav into a baby ruth in the repro=20
>guy's editor... and no one wants to find a baby ruth floating in =
>their pool=20
>of music. Don't smash it so much that it only takes 5 bits to play =
>it back=20
>faithfully. Again, use your ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will =
>take more=20
>abuse than say, a ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program =
>material=20
>dependant' thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like a
=
>Pantera=20
>tune, for example</STRONG>. </FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Essentially you are creating a Waves =
>multiband=20
>compressor, only you're using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, .. =
>better=20
>IMO. YMMV. If you plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and=20
>create your own template PPJ you can just time lock drag the =
>'files'=20
>to and be on your way. </FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>For you Mac mastering gurus, just =
>replace the Paris=20
>VST EQ with a good sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band =
>pass and=20
>hi pass. Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain =
>trick in=20
>the Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris =
>EQ Gain=20
>in it's place post eq/compression for each group of =
>channels.</FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I =
>suspect Doug=20
>Wellington has it posted on his page.</FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Doug, you still out there =
>man?</FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"=20
>size=3D3><EM><STRONG>AA,</STRONG></EM></FONT> </FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>semi kinda not really a mastering dude=20
>guy</FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2> ------------------------------------------------------------ ----=
>-------------------------------</FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>"John" <</FONT><A =
>href=3D"mailto:no@no.com"><FONT=20
>face=3DArial size=3D2>no@no.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>message </FONT><A href=3D"news:447cb558$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>news:447cb558$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>...</FONT></DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> <BR>> So =
>what's this=20
>trick mastering technique?<BR>> <BR>> "Aaron Allen" <</FONT><A=20
>href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> =
>
>wrote:<BR>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is =
>somewhere in=20
>Tank's Steiny<BR>> <BR>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did =
>an=20
>amazing job of recreating the Paris<BR>> <BR>>>channel Eq/Gain=20
>mojo.<BR>>>AA<BR>>><BR>>>"chuck duffy" <</FONT><A=20
>href=3D"mailto:cxsd@c.com"><FONT face=3DArial =
>size=3D2>cxsd@c.com</FONT></A><FONT=20
>face=3DArial size=3D2>> wrote in message </FONT><A=20
>href=3D"news:447b8639$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>news:447b8639$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>...<BR>>>><BR>>>> Hi=20
>Don,<BR>>>><BR>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the =
>paris eq=20
>when phase inverted.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I forced Brian T to =
>try it=20
>when he was unconvinced.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I know that =
>everyone is=20
>dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for months<BR>>>> to =
>ensure=20
>that he could perfectly emulate the paris =
>eq.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I=20
>am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about=20
>this<BR>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when =
>on=20
>whatever vst forum<BR>> it<BR>>>> was posted=20
>in.<BR>>>><BR>>>><BR>>>> I know this won't =
>help=20
>anyones perception, but when I hear people <BR>>>>=20
>wondering<BR>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this =
>plug is=20
>it.<BR>>>><BR>>>> =
>CHuck<BR>>>><BR>>>> "DC"=20
><</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinheck.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>dc@spammersinheck.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>size=3D2>>=20
>wrote:<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>As I understand it, that =
>EQ was=20
>pretty colored and non-linear.<BR>>>>>What I need is simple, =
>clean,=20
>accurate band splits. The Paris EQ<BR>>>>>does this =
>nicely,=20
>but the whole process is tedious to say the=20
>least.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>Sounds great=20
>though.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>DC<BR>>>>><BR>=
>>>>><BR>>>>>"RiverLake=20
>Farms" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:edna@texomaonline.com"><FONT =
>face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>edna@texomaonline.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>size=3D2>>=20
>wrote:<BR>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still=20
>available?<BR>>>>>>Thanks,=20
>Edna<BR>>>>>><BR>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" =
><</FONT><A=20
>href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> =
>wrote in=20
>message<BR>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...<BR>>>>&g=
>t;>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>> I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
>secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
>band with=20
>EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
>all are=20
>done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>the<BR>>>>>>>=20
>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
>settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
>to just=20
>create the files to do=20
>this!)<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> DC, this =
>can be=20
>achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris<BR>>=20
>VST<BR>>>>>EQ,<BR>>>>>>> and in real =
>timeif you=20
>want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the<BR>>>>=20
>VST<BR>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application=20
>yet?<BR>>>>>>> It doth rock=20
>much.<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>AA<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>=
>;>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>"DC" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT =
>face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>message </FONT><A href=3D"news:44793f10$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>news:44793f10$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>...<BR>>>>>>> =
>><BR>>>>>>> > Ok,=20
>here's the short version. I've been working on this most =
>of<BR>>=20
>the<BR>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so =
>this is=20
>very incomplete.<BR>>>>>>> =
>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>> It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4=20
>stereo<BR>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8=20
>compressors.<BR>>>>>>> =
>><BR>>>>>>> >=20
>I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
>secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
>band with=20
>EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
>all are=20
>done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>the<BR>>>>>>>=20
>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
>settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
>to just=20
>create the files to do this!)<BR>>>>>>>=20
>><BR>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, =
>and a=20
>general PITA.<BR>>>>>>> =
>><BR>>>>>>> >=20
>HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results=20
>are<BR>>>>>>> > friggin'=20
>fabulous.<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>=20
>Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing =
>really.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>><BR>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. =20
>Later. BTW, you must leave some<BR>>>>>>> =
>>=20
>headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but=20
>the<BR>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying =
>that for=20
>years). This technique<BR>>>>>>> > works so =
>beautifully=20
>with slamming the Paris mix buss that it =
>seems<BR>>>>>>> >=20
>like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is=20
>grinning...<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>=20
>Paris for mastering. wadda concept.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>><BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>Rob=20
>Arsenault" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:mani2@nbnet.nb.ca"><FONT =
>face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>mani2@nbnet.nb.ca</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>>=20
>wrote:<BR>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do=20
>share...!!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <</FONT><A=20
>href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>message <BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Hey=20
>all,<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a=20
>multiband<BR>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor =
>in=20
>Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for=20
>the<BR>>>>>>> >>>> help with=20
>this.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very =
>familiar=20
><BR>>>>>>> >>>>=20
>material<BR>>>>>>> >>>> that are just =
>making me=20
>grin from ear to ear...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as =
>I get=20
>this live disc out the door I will post the <BR>>>>>>> =
>
>>>>> details.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Paris=20
>lives!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>> DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>> =
>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>&=
>gt;>>>=20
>I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and =
>you?<BR>>>>>>>=20
></FONT><A href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html"><FONT face=3DArial
=
>
>size=3D2>http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html</FONT></A><BR><FONT =
>face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>=
>>>><BR>>>>>><BR>>>>><BR>>>> =
>
><BR>>><BR>>><BR>></FONT> </BODY></HTML>
>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: Multi Band Mastering in Paris [message #68790 is a reply to message #68784] |
Wed, 31 May 2006 14:39 |
Kim
Messages: 1246
Registered: October 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Exactly! I never new Matt Craig had a compressor released?!?
Gimme gimme! ;o)
Cheers,
Kim.
"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>I've got Matt Craig's Paris EQ some where, but I don't have his comp. Can
>somebody email me Matt Craig's comp?
>
>Thanks
>James
>
>excelsm@hotmail.com
>
>
>"Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com> wrote:
>>
>>Kim, I have experimented with mastering this way a lot. And yes, sometimes
>>that does happen. What I notice is, stereo imaging will jump around. I
know
>>Sakis uses this method, with success so it's probably a matter of getting
>>every set right. I'm just not that good!
>>Now here's the good news for PC guys. Using Matt Craig's comp. you check
>>the stereo box and have a stereo Paris comp...pre eq.
>>Rod
>>
>>"Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>While I have heard a lot of people more knowledgable than myself talk
up
>>>this method of mastering, one thing has always bothered me...
>>>
>>>The Paris compressors are mono. Therefore your left and right channels
>are
>>>being processed seperately. Surely your stereo imaging will go all over
>>the
>>>place?!? I mean, for starters, anything that's loud in a given frequency
>>>band, and not centred, will tend to get centred, because the louder channel
>>>will cop more compression. If, in a given band, the left channel is louder
>>>than the right channel, everything in that band will get panned further
>>right,
>>>because the left channel will get compressed / reduced in level more than
>>>the right channel. What's more, some sounds will no doubt cover more than
>>>one frequency band, and as this "repanning" effect is unlikely to be identical
>>>in all frequency bands, one part of a sound may get panned further right,
>>>while another band of it stays where it is, or even moves further left
>depending
>>>what is in that band.
>>>
>>>I would have thought that on material with considerable stereo content,
>>things
>>>will end up all over the shop in terms of stereo imaging.
>>>
>>>On the other hand, there's a very practicle school of thought which says
>>>"If it sounds good, just do it"...
>>>
>>>Cheers,
>>>Kim.
>>>
>>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Ok, you asked for it......... PC mastering technique in Paris:
>>>>
>>>>Take your 2 track L/R master final mix file. Put the Left mix file on
>=
>>>>Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left. Put the Right mix file on Channels
>>>=
>>>>2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris VST EQ, split the files
=
>>>>into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will be low mid band,
5/6
>>>=
>>>>will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary depending on
>=
>>>>taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears,
=
>>>>nobody can hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with
>>>=
>>>>the Sakis Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid 540-6Khz
>Hi
>>>=
>>>>6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with =
>>>>either the Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris
>=
>>>>VST EQ. The placement is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together
>=
>>>>using Grouping on the mixer. Do not for ANY reason split these waves
=
>>>>into another editor unless you're ready to fight phase and time delay
>=
>>>>demons between submixes. Also, be sure you have everything selected with
>>>=
>>>>the time lock tool when you do this - same reason about phase/time.=20
>>>>
>>>>Now, the thing is, you can adjust the Gain/EQ mojo separately for each
>>=
>>>>band, you can compress with different ratios, thresholds.. whatever =
>>>>suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the Paris compressor, be
>=
>>>>sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, 3=3D4, 5=3D6, =
>>>>7=3D8). Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period.=20
>>>>
>>>>Now then, for more secret sauce beyond the Eq/Gain trick.. put one more
>>>=
>>>>compressor on the global but do NOT compress with it. Threshold all the
>>>=
>>>>way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the gain output to beat
the
>>>=
>>>>snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but ... and this is also
>>>=
>>>>super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5 dB or you'll
>=
>>>>blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital converters that
>=
>>>>your stuff will eventually have to suffer.=20
>>>>Be careful in all this, you have SO much gain shaping you can turn the
>>=
>>>>wav into a baby ruth in the repro guy's editor... and no one wants to
>=
>>>>find a baby ruth floating in their pool of music. Don't smash it so much
>>>=
>>>>that it only takes 5 bits to play it back faithfully. Again, use your
>=
>>>>ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will take more abuse than say, a
=
>>>>ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program material dependant'
>=
>>>>thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like a Pantera
>=
>>>>tune, for example.=20
>>>>
>>>>Essentially you are creating a Waves multiband compressor, only you're
>>=
>>>>using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, .. better IMO. YMMV. If you
>>=
>>>>plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and create your own
=
>>>>template PPJ you can just time lock drag the 'files' to and be on your
>>=
>>>>way.=20
>>>>
>>>>For you Mac mastering gurus, just replace the Paris VST EQ with a good
>>=
>>>>sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band pass and hi pass.
>
>>=
>>>>Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain trick in the =
>>>>Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris EQ
>=
>>>>Gain in it's place post eq/compression for each group of channels.
>>>>
>>>>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I suspect Doug Wellington has it =
>>>>posted on his page.
>>>>Doug, you still out there man?
>>>>
>>>>AA,=20
>>>>semi kinda not really a mastering dude guy
>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------ -------------=
>>>>----------------------
>>>>
>>>>"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:447cb558$1@linux...
>>>>>=20
>>>>> So what's this trick mastering technique?
>>>>>=20
>>>>> "Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is somewhere in Tank's
>>>=
>>>>Steiny
>>>>>=20
>>>>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did an amazing job of recreating the
=
>>>>Paris
>>>>>=20
>>>>>>channel Eq/Gain mojo.
>>>>>>AA
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"chuck duffy" <cxsd@c.com> wrote in message news:447b8639$1@linux...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi Don,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the paris eq when phase inverted.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I forced Brian T to try it when he was unconvinced.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I know that everyone is dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for
>>>=
>>>>months
>>>>>>> to ensure that he could perfectly emulate the paris eq.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about
>>>=
>>>>this
>>>>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when on whatever vst
>=
>>>>forum
>>>>> it
>>>>>>> was posted in.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I know this won't help anyones perception, but when I hear people=20
>>>>>>> wondering
>>>>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this plug is it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> CHuck
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinheck.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
>>>>>>>>What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
>>>>>>>>does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Sounds great though.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>DC
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>"RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>>>>>>>>Thanks, Edna
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the
>>>=
>>>>secret
>>>>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the
=
>>>>next
>>>>>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to
>>=
>>>>the
>>>>>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
>>>>settings.
>>>>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do
=
>>>>this!)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig =
>>>>Paris
>>>>> VST
>>>>>>>>EQ,
>>>>>>>>>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried
>>>=
>>>>the
>>>>>>> VST
>>>>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>>>>>>>>> It doth rock much.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> AA
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message =
>>>>news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most
>>=
>>>>of
>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use
>4
>>>=
>>>>stereo
>>>>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the
>>>=
>>>>secret
>>>>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the
=
>>>>next
>>>>>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to
>>=
>>>>the
>>>>>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
>>>>settings.
>>>>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do
=
>>>>this!)
>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>>>>>>>>>> > friggin' fabulous.
>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>>>>>>>>> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>>>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>>>>>>>>> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it
>>=
>>>>seems
>>>>>>>>>> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message=20
>>>>>>>>>> >>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>> >>>> Hey all,
>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej
for
>>>=
>>>>the
>>>>>>>>>> >>>> help with this.
>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar=20
>>>>>>>>>> >>>> material
>>>>>>>>>> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post
the
>>>=
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> >>>> details.
>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>> >>>> Paris lives!
>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>> >>>> DC
>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>>>>>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
>>>><HTML><HEAD>
>>>><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>>>>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
>>>><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.5296.0" name=3DGENERATOR>
>>>><STYLE></STYLE>
>>>></HEAD>
>>>><BODY>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><EM>Ok, you asked for it......... PC
>=
>>>>mastering=20
>>>>technique in Paris:</EM></FONT></DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Take your 2 track L/R master
>=
>>>>final mix=20
>>>>file. Put the Left mix file on Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left. =
>>>>Put the=20
>>>>Right mix file on Channels 2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris
>>>=
>>>>VST EQ,=20
>>>>split the files into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will be
>>=
>>>>low mid=20
>>>>band, 5/6 will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary =
>>>>depending on=20
>>>>taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears,
=
>>>>nobody can=20
>>>>hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with the Sakis=20
>>>>Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid =
>>>>540-6Khz Hi=20
>>>>6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with =
>>>>either the=20
>>>>Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris VST EQ. The
>>=
>>>>placement=20
>>>>is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together using Grouping on the
>=
>>>>mixer. Do=20
>>>>not for ANY reason split these waves into another editor unless you're
>>=
>>>>ready to=20
>>>>fight phase and time delay demons between submixes. Also, be sure you
>=
>>>>have=20
>>>>everything selected with the time lock tool when you do this - same =
>>>>reason about=20
>>>>phase/time. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now, the thing is, you can =
>>>>adjust the=20
>>>>Gain/EQ mojo separately for each band, you can compress with different
>>=
>>>>ratios,=20
>>>>thresholds.. whatever suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the
>>=
>>>>Paris=20
>>>>compressor, be sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, =
>>>>3=3D4, 5=3D6, 7=3D8).=20
>>>>Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now then, for more secret sauce
>>>=
>>>>beyond the=20
>>>>Eq/Gain trick.. put one more compressor on the global but do NOT =
>>>>compress with=20
>>>>it. Threshold all the way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the
>>=
>>>>gain=20
>>>>output to beat the snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but
>=
>>>>... and=20
>>>>this is also super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5
>dB
>>>=
>>>>or=20
>>>>you'll blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital =
>>>>converters=20
>>>>that your stuff will eventually have to suffer. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Be careful in all this, you
=
>>>>have SO much=20
>>>>gain shaping you can turn the wav into a baby ruth in the repro=20
>>>>guy's editor... and no one wants to find a baby ruth floating in =
>>>>their pool=20
>>>>of music. Don't smash it so much that it only takes 5 bits to play =
>>>>it back=20
>>>>faithfully. Again, use your ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will
=
>>>>take more=20
>>>>abuse than say, a ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program =
>>>>material=20
>>>>dependant' thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like
>>a
>>>=
>>>>Pantera=20
>>>>tune, for example</STRONG>. </FONT></DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Essentially you are creating a Waves
>=
>>>>multiband=20
>>>>compressor, only you're using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, ..
>=
>>>>better=20
>>>>IMO. YMMV. If you plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and=20
>>>>create your own template PPJ you can just time lock drag the =
>>>>'files'=20
>>>>to and be on your way. </FONT></DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>For you Mac mastering gurus, just =
>>>>replace the Paris=20
>>>>VST EQ with a good sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band
>>=
>>>>pass and=20
>>>>hi pass. Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain =
>>>>trick in=20
>>>>the Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris
>>=
>>>>EQ Gain=20
>>>>in it's place post eq/compression for each group of =
>>>>channels.</FONT></DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I
=
>>>>suspect Doug=20
>>>>Wellington has it posted on his page.</FONT></DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Doug, you still out there =
>>>>man?</FONT></DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"=20
>>>>size=3D3><EM><STRONG>AA,</STRONG></EM></FONT> </FONT></DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>semi kinda not really a mastering dude=20
>>>>guy</FONT></DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>size=3D2> ------------------------------------------------------------ ----=
>>>>-------------------------------</FONT></DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>"John" <</FONT><A =
>>>>href=3D"mailto:no@no.com"><FONT=20
>>>>face=3DArial size=3D2>no@no.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>>>message </FONT><A href=3D"news:447cb558$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>size=3D2>news:447cb558$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>size=3D2>...</FONT></DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> <BR>> So =
>>>>what's this=20
>>>>trick mastering technique?<BR>> <BR>> "Aaron Allen" <</FONT><A=20
>>>>href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>>
>=
>>>>
>>>>wrote:<BR>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is =
>>>>somewhere in=20
>>>>Tank's Steiny<BR>> <BR>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did =
>>>>an=20
>>>>amazing job of recreating the Paris<BR>> <BR>>>channel Eq/Gain=20
>>>>mojo.<BR>>>AA<BR>>><BR>>>"chuck duffy" <</FONT><A=20
>>>>href=3D"mailto:cxsd@c.com"><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>>size=3D2>cxsd@c.com</FONT></A><FONT=20
>>>>face=3DArial size=3D2>> wrote in message </FONT><A=20
>>>>href=3D"news:447b8639$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>size=3D2>news:447b8639$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>size=3D2>...<BR>>>><BR>>>> Hi=20
>>>>Don,<BR>>>><BR>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the =
>>>>paris eq=20
>>>>when phase inverted.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I forced Brian T to =
>>>>try it=20
>>>>when he was unconvinced.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I know that =
>>>>everyone is=20
>>>>dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for months<BR>>>> to =
>>>>ensure=20
>>>>that he could perfectly emulate the paris =
>>>>eq.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I=20
>>>>am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about=20
>>>>this<BR>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when =
>>>>on=20
>>>>whatever vst forum<BR>> it<BR>>>> was posted=20
>>>>in.<BR>>>><BR>>>><BR>>>> I know this won't =
>>>>help=20
>>>>anyones perception, but when I hear people <BR>>>>=20
>>>>wondering<BR>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this =
>>>>plug is=20
>>>>it.<BR>>>><BR>>>> =
>>>>CHuck<BR>>>><BR>>>> "DC"=20
>>>><</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinheck.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinheck.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>>size=3D2>>=20
>>>>wrote:<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>As I understand it, that =
>>>>EQ was=20
>>>>pretty colored and non-linear.<BR>>>>>What I need is simple, =
>>>>clean,=20
>>>>accurate band splits. The Paris EQ<BR>>>>>does this =
>>>>nicely,=20
>>>>but the whole process is tedious to say the=20
>>>>least.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>Sounds great=20
>>>>though.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>DC<BR>>>>><BR>=
>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>"RiverLake=20
>>>>Farms" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:edna@texomaonline.com"><FONT =
>>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>>size=3D2>edna@texomaonline.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>>size=3D2>>=20
>>>>wrote:<BR>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still=20
>>>>available?<BR>>>>>>Thanks,=20
>>>>Edna<BR>>>>>><BR>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" =
>>>><</FONT><A=20
>>>>href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>>
>=
>>>>wrote in=20
>>>>message<BR>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...<BR>>>>&g=
>>>>t;>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>> I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
>>>>secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
>>>>band with=20
>>>>EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
>>>>all are=20
>>>>done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>>>>the<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
>>>>settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
>>>>to just=20
>>>>create the files to do=20
>>>>this!)<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> DC, this =
>>>>can be=20
>>>>achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris<BR>>=20
>>>>VST<BR>>>>>EQ,<BR>>>>>>> and in real =
>>>>timeif you=20
>>>>want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the<BR>>>>=20
>>>>VST<BR>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application=20
>>>>yet?<BR>>>>>>> It doth rock=20
>>>>much.<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>AA<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>=
>>>>;>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>"DC" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT =
>>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>>>message </FONT><A href=3D"news:44793f10$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>size=3D2>news:44793f10$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>size=3D2>...<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> > Ok,=20
>>>>here's the short version. I've been working on this most =
>>>>of<BR>>=20
>>>>the<BR>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so =
>>>>this is=20
>>>>very incomplete.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>> It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4=20
>>>>stereo<BR>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8=20
>>>>compressors.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>>>I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
>>>>secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
>>>>band with=20
>>>>EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
>>>>all are=20
>>>>done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>>>>the<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
>>>>settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
>>>>to just=20
>>>>create the files to do this!)<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, =
>>>>and a=20
>>>>general PITA.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>>>HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results=20
>>>>are<BR>>>>>>> > friggin'=20
>>>>fabulous.<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>=20
>>>>Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing =
>>>>really.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. =20
>>>>Later. BTW, you must leave some<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>=20
>>>>headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but=20
>>>>the<BR>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying =
>>>>that for=20
>>>>years). This technique<BR>>>>>>> > works so =
>>>>beautifully=20
>>>>with slamming the Paris mix buss that it =
>>>>seems<BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>>>like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is=20
>>>>grinning...<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>=20
>>>>Paris for mastering. wadda concept.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>Rob=20
>>>>Arsenault" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:mani2@nbnet.nb.ca"><FONT =
>>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>>size=3D2>mani2@nbnet.nb.ca</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>>=20
>>>>wrote:<BR>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do=20
>>>>share...!!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <</FONT><A=20
>>>>href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>>>message <BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Hey=20
>>>>all,<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a=20
>>>>multiband<BR>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor =
>>>>in=20
>>>>Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for=20
>>>>the<BR>>>>>>> >>>> help with=20
>>>>this.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very =
>>>>familiar=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>>=20
>>>>material<BR>>>>>>> >>>> that are just =
>>>>making me=20
>>>>grin from ear to ear...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as =
>>>>I get=20
>>>>this live disc out the door I will post the <BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>
>>>>>>>> details.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Paris=20
>>>>lives!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>> DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>&=
>>>>gt;>>>=20
>>>>I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and =
>>>>you?<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>></FONT><A href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html"><FONT face=3DArial
>>>=
>>>>
>>>>size=3D2>http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html</FONT></A><BR><FONT =
>>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>>size=3D2>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>=
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>><BR>>>>><BR>>>> =
>>>>
>>>><BR>>><BR>>><BR>></FONT> </BODY></HTML>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: Multi Band Mastering in Paris [message #68791 is a reply to message #68790] |
Wed, 31 May 2006 15:26 |
Rod Lincoln
Messages: 883
Registered: September 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Yeah, as you probably know, I was having a Mad Cow moment, there is obviously
no Matt Craig Paris comp. I meant to say that you could check the stereo
box in Matt Craig's EQ and have a Paris stereo EQ, before the comp. But that
doesn't really matter now does it? DOH!!
Rod
"Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>Exactly! I never new Matt Craig had a compressor released?!?
>
>Gimme gimme! ;o)
>
>Cheers,
>Kim.
>
>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>I've got Matt Craig's Paris EQ some where, but I don't have his comp.
Can
>>somebody email me Matt Craig's comp?
>>
>>Thanks
>>James
>>
>>excelsm@hotmail.com
>>
>>
>>"Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Kim, I have experimented with mastering this way a lot. And yes, sometimes
>>>that does happen. What I notice is, stereo imaging will jump around. I
>know
>>>Sakis uses this method, with success so it's probably a matter of getting
>>>every set right. I'm just not that good!
>>>Now here's the good news for PC guys. Using Matt Craig's comp. you check
>>>the stereo box and have a stereo Paris comp...pre eq.
>>>Rod
>>>
>>>"Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>While I have heard a lot of people more knowledgable than myself talk
>up
>>>>this method of mastering, one thing has always bothered me...
>>>>
>>>>The Paris compressors are mono. Therefore your left and right channels
>>are
>>>>being processed seperately. Surely your stereo imaging will go all over
>>>the
>>>>place?!? I mean, for starters, anything that's loud in a given frequency
>>>>band, and not centred, will tend to get centred, because the louder channel
>>>>will cop more compression. If, in a given band, the left channel is louder
>>>>than the right channel, everything in that band will get panned further
>>>right,
>>>>because the left channel will get compressed / reduced in level more
than
>>>>the right channel. What's more, some sounds will no doubt cover more
than
>>>>one frequency band, and as this "repanning" effect is unlikely to be
identical
>>>>in all frequency bands, one part of a sound may get panned further right,
>>>>while another band of it stays where it is, or even moves further left
>>depending
>>>>what is in that band.
>>>>
>>>>I would have thought that on material with considerable stereo content,
>>>things
>>>>will end up all over the shop in terms of stereo imaging.
>>>>
>>>>On the other hand, there's a very practicle school of thought which says
>>>>"If it sounds good, just do it"...
>>>>
>>>>Cheers,
>>>>Kim.
>>>>
>>>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Ok, you asked for it......... PC mastering technique in Paris:
>>>>>
>>>>>Take your 2 track L/R master final mix file. Put the Left mix file on
>>=
>>>>>Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left. Put the Right mix file on Channels
>>>>=
>>>>>2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris VST EQ, split the files
>=
>>>>>into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will be low mid band,
>5/6
>>>>=
>>>>>will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary depending on
>>=
>>>>>taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears,
>=
>>>>>nobody can hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with
>>>>=
>>>>>the Sakis Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid 540-6Khz
>
>>Hi
>>>>=
>>>>>6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with =
>>>>>either the Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris
>>=
>>>>>VST EQ. The placement is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together
>>=
>>>>>using Grouping on the mixer. Do not for ANY reason split these waves
>=
>>>>>into another editor unless you're ready to fight phase and time delay
>>=
>>>>>demons between submixes. Also, be sure you have everything selected
with
>>>>=
>>>>>the time lock tool when you do this - same reason about phase/time.=20
>>>>>
>>>>>Now, the thing is, you can adjust the Gain/EQ mojo separately for each
>>>=
>>>>>band, you can compress with different ratios, thresholds.. whatever
=
>>>>>suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the Paris compressor, be
>>=
>>>>>sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, 3=3D4, 5=3D6, =
>>>>>7=3D8). Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period.=20
>>>>>
>>>>>Now then, for more secret sauce beyond the Eq/Gain trick.. put one more
>>>>=
>>>>>compressor on the global but do NOT compress with it. Threshold all
the
>>>>=
>>>>>way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the gain output to beat
>the
>>>>=
>>>>>snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but ... and this is also
>>>>=
>>>>>super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5 dB or you'll
>>=
>>>>>blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital converters that
>>=
>>>>>your stuff will eventually have to suffer.=20
>>>>>Be careful in all this, you have SO much gain shaping you can turn the
>>>=
>>>>>wav into a baby ruth in the repro guy's editor... and no one wants to
>>=
>>>>>find a baby ruth floating in their pool of music. Don't smash it so
much
>>>>=
>>>>>that it only takes 5 bits to play it back faithfully. Again, use your
>>=
>>>>>ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will take more abuse than say, a
>=
>>>>>ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program material dependant'
>>=
>>>>>thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like a Pantera
>>=
>>>>>tune, for example.=20
>>>>>
>>>>>Essentially you are creating a Waves multiband compressor, only you're
>>>=
>>>>>using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, .. better IMO. YMMV. If you
>>>=
>>>>>plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and create your own
>=
>>>>>template PPJ you can just time lock drag the 'files' to and be on your
>>>=
>>>>>way.=20
>>>>>
>>>>>For you Mac mastering gurus, just replace the Paris VST EQ with a good
>>>=
>>>>>sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band pass and hi pass.
>>
>>>=
>>>>>Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain trick in the
=
>>>>>Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris EQ
>>=
>>>>>Gain in it's place post eq/compression for each group of channels.
>>>>>
>>>>>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I suspect Doug Wellington has it =
>>>>>posted on his page.
>>>>>Doug, you still out there man?
>>>>>
>>>>>AA,=20
>>>>>semi kinda not really a mastering dude guy
>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------ -------------=
>>>>>----------------------
>>>>>
>>>>>"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:447cb558$1@linux...
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> So what's this trick mastering technique?
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> "Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>>>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is somewhere in Tank's
>>>>=
>>>>>Steiny
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did an amazing job of recreating the
>=
>>>>>Paris
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>channel Eq/Gain mojo.
>>>>>>>AA
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"chuck duffy" <cxsd@c.com> wrote in message news:447b8639$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi Don,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the paris eq when phase inverted.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I forced Brian T to try it when he was unconvinced.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I know that everyone is dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day
for
>>>>=
>>>>>months
>>>>>>>> to ensure that he could perfectly emulate the paris eq.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about
>>>>=
>>>>>this
>>>>>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when on whatever vst
>>=
>>>>>forum
>>>>>> it
>>>>>>>> was posted in.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I know this won't help anyones perception, but when I hear people=20
>>>>>>>> wondering
>>>>>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this plug is it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> CHuck
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinheck.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
>>>>>>>>>What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
>>>>>>>>>does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Sounds great though.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>DC
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>"RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>>>>>>>>>Thanks, Edna
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that
the
>>>>=
>>>>>secret
>>>>>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the
>=
>>>>>next
>>>>>>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back
to
>>>=
>>>>>the
>>>>>>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
>>>>>settings.
>>>>>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do
>=
>>>>>this!)
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig
=
>>>>>Paris
>>>>>> VST
>>>>>>>>>EQ,
>>>>>>>>>>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried
>>>>=
>>>>>the
>>>>>>>> VST
>>>>>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>>>>>>>>>> It doth rock much.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> AA
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message =
>>>>>news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most
>>>=
>>>>>of
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use
>>4
>>>>=
>>>>>stereo
>>>>>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that
the
>>>>=
>>>>>secret
>>>>>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the
>=
>>>>>next
>>>>>>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back
to
>>>=
>>>>>the
>>>>>>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
>>>>>settings.
>>>>>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do
>=
>>>>>this!)
>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results
are
>>>>>>>>>>> > friggin' fabulous.
>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>>>>>>>>>> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>>>>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>>>>>>>>>> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that
it
>>>=
>>>>>seems
>>>>>>>>>>> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message=20
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> Hey all,
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej
>for
>>>>=
>>>>>the
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> help with this.
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar=20
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> material
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post
>the
>>>>=
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> details.
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> Paris lives!
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> DC
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
>>>>><HTML><HEAD>
>>>>><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>>>>>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
>>>>><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.5296.0" name=3DGENERATOR>
>>>>><STYLE></STYLE>
>>>>></HEAD>
>>>>><BODY>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><EM>Ok, you asked for it......... PC
>>=
>>>>>mastering=20
>>>>>technique in Paris:</EM></FONT></DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Take your 2 track L/R master
>>=
>>>>>final mix=20
>>>>>file. Put the Left mix file on Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left.
=
>>>>>Put the=20
>>>>>Right mix file on Channels 2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris
>>>>=
>>>>>VST EQ,=20
>>>>>split the files into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will
be
>>>=
>>>>>low mid=20
>>>>>band, 5/6 will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary =
>>>>>depending on=20
>>>>>taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears,
>=
>>>>>nobody can=20
>>>>>hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with the Sakis=20
>>>>>Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid =
>>>>>540-6Khz Hi=20
>>>>>6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with =
>>>>>either the=20
>>>>>Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris VST EQ. The
>>>=
>>>>>placement=20
>>>>>is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together using Grouping on the
>>=
>>>>>mixer. Do=20
>>>>>not for ANY reason split these waves into another editor unless you're
>>>=
>>>>>ready to=20
>>>>>fight phase and time delay demons between submixes. Also, be sure you
>>=
>>>>>have=20
>>>>>everything selected with the time lock tool when you do this - same
=
>>>>>reason about=20
>>>>>phase/time. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now, the thing is, you can
=
>>>>>adjust the=20
>>>>>Gain/EQ mojo separately for each band, you can compress with different
>>>=
>>>>>ratios,=20
>>>>>thresholds.. whatever suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the
>>>=
>>>>>Paris=20
>>>>>compressor, be sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, =
>>>>>3=3D4, 5=3D6, 7=3D8).=20
>>>>>Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now then, for more secret sauce
>>>>=
>>>>>beyond the=20
>>>>>Eq/Gain trick.. put one more compressor on the global but do NOT =
>>>>>compress with=20
>>>>>it. Threshold all the way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the
>>>=
>>>>>gain=20
>>>>>output to beat the snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but
>>=
>>>>>... and=20
>>>>>this is also super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5
>>dB
>>>>=
>>>>>or=20
>>>>>you'll blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital =
>>>>>converters=20
>>>>>that your stuff will eventually have to suffer. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Be careful in all this, you
>=
>>>>>have SO much=20
>>>>>gain shaping you can turn the wav into a baby ruth in the repro=20
>>>>>guy's editor... and no one wants to find a baby ruth floating in =
>>>>>their pool=20
>>>>>of music. Don't smash it so much that it only takes 5 bits to play =
>>>>>it back=20
>>>>>faithfully. Again, use your ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will
>=
>>>>>take more=20
>>>>>abuse than say, a ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program
=
>>>>>material=20
>>>>>dependant' thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like
>>>a
>>>>=
>>>>>Pantera=20
>>>>>tune, for example</STRONG>. </FONT></DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Essentially you are creating a Waves
>>=
>>>>>multiband=20
>>>>>compressor, only you're using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, ..
>>=
>>>>>better=20
>>>>>IMO. YMMV. If you plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and=20
>>>>>create your own template PPJ you can just time lock drag the =
>>>>>'files'=20
>>>>>to and be on your way. </FONT></DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>For you Mac mastering gurus, just =
>>>>>replace the Paris=20
>>>>>VST EQ with a good sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band
>>>=
>>>>>pass and=20
>>>>>hi pass. Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain =
>>>>>trick in=20
>>>>>the Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris
>>>=
>>>>>EQ Gain=20
>>>>>in it's place post eq/compression for each group of =
>>>>>channels.</FONT></DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I
>=
>>>>>suspect Doug=20
>>>>>Wellington has it posted on his page.</FONT></DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Doug, you still out there =
>>>>>man?</FONT></DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"=20
>>>>>size=3D3><EM><STRONG>AA,</STRONG></EM></FONT> </FONT></DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>semi kinda not really a mastering dude=20
>>>>>guy</FONT></DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>size=3D2> ------------------------------------------------------------ ----=
>>>>>-------------------------------</FONT></DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>"John" <</FONT><A =
>>>>>href=3D"mailto:no@no.com"><FONT=20
>>>>>face=3DArial size=3D2>no@no.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>>>>message </FONT><A href=3D"news:447cb558$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>size=3D2>news:447cb558$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>size=3D2>...</FONT></DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> <BR>> So =
>>>>>what's this=20
>>>>>trick mastering technique?<BR>> <BR>> "Aaron Allen" <</FONT><A=20
>>>>>href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>>
>>=
>>>>>
>>>>>wrote:<BR>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is =
>>>>>somewhere in=20
>>>>>Tank's Steiny<BR>> <BR>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did =
>>>>>an=20
>>>>>amazing job of recreating the Paris<BR>> <BR>>>channel Eq/Gain=20
>>>>>mojo.<BR>>>AA<BR>>><BR>>>"chuck duffy" <</FONT><A=20
>>>>>href=3D"mailto:cxsd@c.com"><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>>>size=3D2>cxsd@c.com</FONT></A><FONT=20
>>>>>face=3DArial size=3D2>> wrote in message </FONT><A=20
>>>>>href=3D"news:447b8639$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>size=3D2>news:447b8639$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>size=3D2>...<BR>>>><BR>>>> Hi=20
>>>>>Don,<BR>>>><BR>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the =
>>>>>paris eq=20
>>>>>when phase inverted.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I forced Brian T to =
>>>>>try it=20
>>>>>when he was unconvinced.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I know that =
>>>>>everyone is=20
>>>>>dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for months<BR>>>> to =
>>>>>ensure=20
>>>>>that he could perfectly emulate the paris =
>>>>>eq.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I=20
>>>>>am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about=20
>>>>>this<BR>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when =
>>>>>on=20
>>>>>whatever vst forum<BR>> it<BR>>>> was posted=20
>>>>>in.<BR>>>><BR>>>><BR>>>> I know this won't =
>>>>>help=20
>>>>>anyones perception, but when I hear people <BR>>>>=20
>>>>>wondering<BR>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this =
>>>>>plug is=20
>>>>>it.<BR>>>><BR>>>> =
>>>>>CHuck<BR>>>><BR>>>> "DC"=20
>>>>><</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinheck.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinheck.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>>>size=3D2>>=20
>>>>>wrote:<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>As I understand it, that =
>>>>>EQ was=20
>>>>>pretty colored and non-linear.<BR>>>>>What I need is simple, =
>>>>>clean,=20
>>>>>accurate band splits. The Paris EQ<BR>>>>>does this =
>>>>>nicely,=20
>>>>>but the whole process is tedious to say the=20
>>>>>least.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>Sounds great=20
>>>>>though.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>DC<BR>>>>><BR>=
>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>"RiverLake=20
>>>>>Farms" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:edna@texomaonline.com"><FONT =
>>>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>>>size=3D2>edna@texomaonline.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>>>size=3D2>>=20
>>>>>wrote:<BR>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still=20
>>>>>available?<BR>>>>>>Thanks,=20
>>>>>Edna<BR>>>>>><BR>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" =
>>>>><</FONT><A=20
>>>>>href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>>
>>=
>>>>>wrote in=20
>>>>>message<BR>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...<BR>>>>&g=
>>>>>t;>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
>>>>>secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
>>>>>band with=20
>>>>>EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
>>>>>all are=20
>>>>>done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>>>>>the<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
>>>>>settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
>>>>>to just=20
>>>>>create the files to do=20
>>>>>this!)<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> DC, this =
>>>>>can be=20
>>>>>achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris<BR>>=20
>>>>>VST<BR>>>>>EQ,<BR>>>>>>> and in real =
>>>>>timeif you=20
>>>>>want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the<BR>>>>=20
>>>>>VST<BR>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application=20
>>>>>yet?<BR>>>>>>> It doth rock=20
>>>>>much.<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>AA<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>=
>>>>>;>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>"DC" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT =
>>>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>>>>message </FONT><A href=3D"news:44793f10$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>size=3D2>news:44793f10$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>size=3D2>...<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> > Ok,=20
>>>>>here's the short version. I've been working on this most =
>>>>>of<BR>>=20
>>>>>the<BR>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so =
>>>>>this is=20
>>>>>very incomplete.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4=20
>>>>>stereo<BR>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8=20
>>>>>compressors.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>>>>I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
>>>>>secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
>>>>>band with=20
>>>>>EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
>>>>>all are=20
>>>>>done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>>>>>the<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
>>>>>settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
>>>>>to just=20
>>>>>create the files to do this!)<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, =
>>>>>and a=20
>>>>>general PITA.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>>>>HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results=20
>>>>>are<BR>>>>>>> > friggin'=20
>>>>>fabulous.<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing =
>>>>>really.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. =20
>>>>>Later. BTW, you must leave some<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but=20
>>>>>the<BR>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying =
>>>>>that for=20
>>>>>years). This technique<BR>>>>>>> > works so =
>>>>>beautifully=20
>>>>>with slamming the Paris mix buss that it =
>>>>>seems<BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>>>>like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is=20
>>>>>grinning...<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>Paris for mastering. wadda concept.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>>Rob=20
>>>>>Arsenault" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:mani2@nbnet.nb.ca"><FONT =
>>>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>>>size=3D2>mani2@nbnet.nb.ca</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>>=20
>>>>>wrote:<BR>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do=20
>>>>>share...!!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <</FONT><A=20
>>>>>href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>>>>message <BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Hey=20
>>>>>all,<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a=20
>>>>>multiband<BR>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor =
>>>>>in=20
>>>>>Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for=20
>>>>>the<BR>>>>>>> >>>> help with=20
>>>>>this.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very =
>>>>>familiar=20
>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>>=20
>>>>>material<BR>>>>>>> >>>> that are just =
>>>>>making me=20
>>>>>grin from ear to ear...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as =
>>>>>I get=20
>>>>>this live disc out the door I will post the <BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> details.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Paris=20
>>>>>lives!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>> DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>&=
>>>>>gt;>>>=20
>>>>>I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and =
>>>>>you?<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>></FONT><A href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html"><FONT face=3DArial
>>>>=
>>>>>
>>>>>size=3D2>http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html</FONT></A><BR><FONT =
>>>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>>>size=3D2>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>=
>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>><BR>>>>><BR>>>> =
>>>>>
>>>>><BR>>><BR>>><BR>></FONT> </BODY></HTML>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: Multi Band Mastering in Paris [message #68792 is a reply to message #68785] |
Wed, 31 May 2006 15:33 |
Kim
Messages: 1246
Registered: October 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
"DC" <dc@spammersmasteringlab.biz> wrote:
>Remember, the left and right settings have to match exactly.
>When you do this, it actually corrects for L-R level mismatches
>precisely because it is not doing the same thing on both sides.
It corrects for L-R level mismatches. This is my point. If you have something
panned to 3 o'clock, you don't want the level mismatch corrected. Correcting
the level mismatch will cause the panned sound to move toward the centre,
and then, as volume (and compression) decreases, the panned item will move
back toward 3 o'clock.
Whenever one side is compressed more than the other, that frequency band
will be panned toward the less compressed side until the compressions subsides.
Unless there's something I'm missing, but I can't see a way around this.
Cheers,
Kim.
|
|
|
|
| Re: Multi Band Mastering in Paris [message #68794 is a reply to message #68791] |
Wed, 31 May 2006 15:34 |
Kim
Messages: 1246
Registered: October 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Double DOH!!
Cheers,
Kim.
"Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com> wrote:
>
>Yeah, as you probably know, I was having a Mad Cow moment, there is obviously
>no Matt Craig Paris comp. I meant to say that you could check the stereo
>box in Matt Craig's EQ and have a Paris stereo EQ, before the comp. But
that
>doesn't really matter now does it? DOH!!
>Rod
>"Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>Exactly! I never new Matt Craig had a compressor released?!?
>>
>>Gimme gimme! ;o)
>>
>>Cheers,
>>Kim.
>>
>>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>I've got Matt Craig's Paris EQ some where, but I don't have his comp.
>Can
>>>somebody email me Matt Craig's comp?
>>>
>>>Thanks
>>>James
>>>
>>>excelsm@hotmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>>"Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Kim, I have experimented with mastering this way a lot. And yes, sometimes
>>>>that does happen. What I notice is, stereo imaging will jump around.
I
>>know
>>>>Sakis uses this method, with success so it's probably a matter of getting
>>>>every set right. I'm just not that good!
>>>>Now here's the good news for PC guys. Using Matt Craig's comp. you check
>>>>the stereo box and have a stereo Paris comp...pre eq.
>>>>Rod
>>>>
>>>>"Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>While I have heard a lot of people more knowledgable than myself talk
>>up
>>>>>this method of mastering, one thing has always bothered me...
>>>>>
>>>>>The Paris compressors are mono. Therefore your left and right channels
>>>are
>>>>>being processed seperately. Surely your stereo imaging will go all over
>>>>the
>>>>>place?!? I mean, for starters, anything that's loud in a given frequency
>>>>>band, and not centred, will tend to get centred, because the louder
channel
>>>>>will cop more compression. If, in a given band, the left channel is
louder
>>>>>than the right channel, everything in that band will get panned further
>>>>right,
>>>>>because the left channel will get compressed / reduced in level more
>than
>>>>>the right channel. What's more, some sounds will no doubt cover more
>than
>>>>>one frequency band, and as this "repanning" effect is unlikely to be
>identical
>>>>>in all frequency bands, one part of a sound may get panned further right,
>>>>>while another band of it stays where it is, or even moves further left
>>>depending
>>>>>what is in that band.
>>>>>
>>>>>I would have thought that on material with considerable stereo content,
>>>>things
>>>>>will end up all over the shop in terms of stereo imaging.
>>>>>
>>>>>On the other hand, there's a very practicle school of thought which
says
>>>>>"If it sounds good, just do it"...
>>>>>
>>>>>Cheers,
>>>>>Kim.
>>>>>
>>>>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Ok, you asked for it......... PC mastering technique in Paris:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Take your 2 track L/R master final mix file. Put the Left mix file
on
>>>=
>>>>>>Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left. Put the Right mix file on Channels
>>>>>=
>>>>>>2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris VST EQ, split the files
>>=
>>>>>>into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will be low mid band,
>>5/6
>>>>>=
>>>>>>will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary depending
on
>>>=
>>>>>>taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears,
>>=
>>>>>>nobody can hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start
with
>>>>>=
>>>>>>the Sakis Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid 540-6Khz
>>
>>>Hi
>>>>>=
>>>>>>6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with
=
>>>>>>either the Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris
>>>=
>>>>>>VST EQ. The placement is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together
>>>=
>>>>>>using Grouping on the mixer. Do not for ANY reason split these waves
>>=
>>>>>>into another editor unless you're ready to fight phase and time delay
>>>=
>>>>>>demons between submixes. Also, be sure you have everything selected
>with
>>>>>=
>>>>>>the time lock tool when you do this - same reason about phase/time.=20
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Now, the thing is, you can adjust the Gain/EQ mojo separately for each
>>>>=
>>>>>>band, you can compress with different ratios, thresholds.. whatever
>=
>>>>>>suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the Paris compressor,
be
>>>=
>>>>>>sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, 3=3D4, 5=3D6, =
>>>>>>7=3D8). Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period.=20
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Now then, for more secret sauce beyond the Eq/Gain trick.. put one
more
>>>>>=
>>>>>>compressor on the global but do NOT compress with it. Threshold all
>the
>>>>>=
>>>>>>way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the gain output to beat
>>the
>>>>>=
>>>>>>snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but ... and this is
also
>>>>>=
>>>>>>super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5 dB or you'll
>>>=
>>>>>>blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital converters that
>>>=
>>>>>>your stuff will eventually have to suffer.=20
>>>>>>Be careful in all this, you have SO much gain shaping you can turn
the
>>>>=
>>>>>>wav into a baby ruth in the repro guy's editor... and no one wants
to
>>>=
>>>>>>find a baby ruth floating in their pool of music. Don't smash it so
>much
>>>>>=
>>>>>>that it only takes 5 bits to play it back faithfully. Again, use your
>>>=
>>>>>>ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will take more abuse than say,
a
>>=
>>>>>>ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program material dependant'
>>>=
>>>>>>thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like a Pantera
>>>=
>>>>>>tune, for example.=20
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Essentially you are creating a Waves multiband compressor, only you're
>>>>=
>>>>>>using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, .. better IMO. YMMV. If
you
>>>>=
>>>>>>plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and create your own
>>=
>>>>>>template PPJ you can just time lock drag the 'files' to and be on your
>>>>=
>>>>>>way.=20
>>>>>>
>>>>>>For you Mac mastering gurus, just replace the Paris VST EQ with a good
>>>>=
>>>>>>sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band pass and hi pass.
>>>
>>>>=
>>>>>>Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain trick in the
>=
>>>>>>Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris
EQ
>>>=
>>>>>>Gain in it's place post eq/compression for each group of channels.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I suspect Doug Wellington has it
=
>>>>>>posted on his page.
>>>>>>Doug, you still out there man?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>AA,=20
>>>>>>semi kinda not really a mastering dude guy
>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------ -------------=
>>>>>>----------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:447cb558$1@linux...
>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>> So what's this trick mastering technique?
>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>> "Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>>>>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is somewhere in Tank's
>>>>>=
>>>>>>Steiny
>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did an amazing job of recreating the
>>=
>>>>>>Paris
>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>channel Eq/Gain mojo.
>>>>>>>>AA
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>"chuck duffy" <cxsd@c.com> wrote in message news:447b8639$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hi Don,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the paris eq when phase inverted.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I forced Brian T to try it when he was unconvinced.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I know that everyone is dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day
>for
>>>>>=
>>>>>>months
>>>>>>>>> to ensure that he could perfectly emulate the paris eq.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment
about
>>>>>=
>>>>>>this
>>>>>>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when on whatever vst
>>>=
>>>>>>forum
>>>>>>> it
>>>>>>>>> was posted in.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I know this won't help anyones perception, but when I hear people=20
>>>>>>>>> wondering
>>>>>>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this plug is it.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> CHuck
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinheck.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
>>>>>>>>>>What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris
EQ
>>>>>>>>>>does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Sounds great though.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>DC
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>"RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>>>>>>>>>>Thanks, Edna
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that
>the
>>>>>=
>>>>>>secret
>>>>>>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the
>>=
>>>>>>next
>>>>>>>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back
>to
>>>>=
>>>>>>the
>>>>>>>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
>>>>>>settings.
>>>>>>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do
>>=
>>>>>>this!)
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig
>=
>>>>>>Paris
>>>>>>> VST
>>>>>>>>>>EQ,
>>>>>>>>>>>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried
>>>>>=
>>>>>>the
>>>>>>>>> VST
>>>>>>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>>>>>>>>>>> It doth rock much.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> AA
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message =
>>>>>>news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>>> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most
>>>>=
>>>>>>of
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>>> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use
>>>4
>>>>>=
>>>>>>stereo
>>>>>>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that
>the
>>>>>=
>>>>>>secret
>>>>>>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the
>>=
>>>>>>next
>>>>>>>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back
>to
>>>>=
>>>>>>the
>>>>>>>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
>>>>>>settings.
>>>>>>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do
>>=
>>>>>>this!)
>>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>>> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results
>are
>>>>>>>>>>>> > friggin' fabulous.
>>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>>> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>>>>>>>>>>> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>>>>>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>>>>>>>>>>> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that
>it
>>>>=
>>>>>>seems
>>>>>>>>>>>> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>>> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message=20
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> Hey all,
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej
>>for
>>>>>=
>>>>>>the
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> help with this.
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar=20
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> material
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post
>>the
>>>>>=
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> details.
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> Paris lives!
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>> DC
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
>>>>>><HTML><HEAD>
>>>>>><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>>>>>>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
>>>>>><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.5296.0" name=3DGENERATOR>
>>>>>><STYLE></STYLE>
>>>>>></HEAD>
>>>>>><BODY>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><EM>Ok, you asked for it.........
PC
>>>=
>>>>>>mastering=20
>>>>>>technique in Paris:</EM></FONT></DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Take your 2 track L/R master
>>>=
>>>>>>final mix=20
>>>>>>file. Put the Left mix file on Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left.
>=
>>>>>>Put the=20
>>>>>>Right mix file on Channels 2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris
>>>>>=
>>>>>>VST EQ,=20
>>>>>>split the files into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will
>be
>>>>=
>>>>>>low mid=20
>>>>>>band, 5/6 will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary
=
>>>>>>depending on=20
>>>>>>taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears,
>>=
>>>>>>nobody can=20
>>>>>>hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with the Sakis=20
>>>>>>Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid =
>>>>>>540-6Khz Hi=20
>>>>>>6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with
=
>>>>>>either the=20
>>>>>>Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris VST EQ.
The
>>>>=
>>>>>>placement=20
>>>>>>is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together using Grouping on the
>>>=
>>>>>>mixer. Do=20
>>>>>>not for ANY reason split these waves into another editor unless you're
>>>>=
>>>>>>ready to=20
>>>>>>fight phase and time delay demons between submixes. Also, be sure you
>>>=
>>>>>>have=20
>>>>>>everything selected with the time lock tool when you do this - same
>=
>>>>>>reason about=20
>>>>>>phase/time. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now, the thing is, you can
>=
>>>>>>adjust the=20
>>>>>>Gain/EQ mojo separately for each band, you can compress with different
>>>>=
>>>>>>ratios,=20
>>>>>>thresholds.. whatever suits the material, all in Paris. If you use
the
>>>>=
>>>>>>Paris=20
>>>>>>compressor, be sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2,
=
>>>>>>3=3D4, 5=3D6, 7=3D8).=20
>>>>>>Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now then, for more secret
sauce
>>>>>=
>>>>>>beyond the=20
>>>>>>Eq/Gain trick.. put one more compressor on the global but do NOT =
>>>>>>compress with=20
>>>>>>it. Threshold all the way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use
the
>>>>=
>>>>>>gain=20
>>>>>>output to beat the snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but
>>>=
>>>>>>... and=20
>>>>>>this is also super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5
>>>dB
>>>>>=
>>>>>>or=20
>>>>>>you'll blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital =
>>>>>>converters=20
>>>>>>that your stuff will eventually have to suffer. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Be careful in all this, you
>>=
>>>>>>have SO much=20
>>>>>>gain shaping you can turn the wav into a baby ruth in the repro=20
>>>>>>guy's editor... and no one wants to find a baby ruth floating in =
>>>>>>their pool=20
>>>>>>of music. Don't smash it so much that it only takes 5 bits to play
=
>>>>>>it back=20
>>>>>>faithfully. Again, use your ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will
>>=
>>>>>>take more=20
>>>>>>abuse than say, a ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program
>=
>>>>>>material=20
>>>>>>dependant' thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like
>>>>a
>>>>>=
>>>>>>Pantera=20
>>>>>>tune, for example</STRONG>. </FONT></DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Essentially you are creating a Waves
>>>=
>>>>>>multiband=20
>>>>>>compressor, only you're using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well,
..
>>>=
>>>>>>better=20
>>>>>>IMO. YMMV. If you plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor
and=20
>>>>>>create your own template PPJ you can just time lock drag the =
>>>>>>'files'=20
>>>>>>to and be on your way. </FONT></DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>For you Mac mastering gurus, just
=
>>>>>>replace the Paris=20
>>>>>>VST EQ with a good sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band
>>>>=
>>>>>>pass and=20
>>>>>>hi pass. Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain =
>>>>>>trick in=20
>>>>>>the Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris
>>>>=
>>>>>>EQ Gain=20
>>>>>>in it's place post eq/compression for each group of =
>>>>>>channels.</FONT></DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ,
I
>>=
>>>>>>suspect Doug=20
>>>>>>Wellington has it posted on his page.</FONT></DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Doug, you still out there =
>>>>>>man?</FONT></DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"=20
>>>>>>size=3D3><EM><STRONG>AA,</STRONG></EM></FONT> </FONT></DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>semi kinda not really a mastering
dude=20
>>>>>>guy</FONT></DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>>size=3D2> ------------------------------------------------------------ ----=
>>>>>>-------------------------------</FONT></DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>>>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>"John" <</FONT><A =
>>>>>>href=3D"mailto:no@no.com"><FONT=20
>>>>>>face=3DArial size=3D2>no@no.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>>>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>>>>>message </FONT><A href=3D"news:447cb558$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>>size=3D2>news:447cb558$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>>size=3D2>...</FONT></DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> <BR>> So =
>>>>>>what's this=20
>>>>>>trick mastering technique?<BR>> <BR>> "Aaron Allen" <</FONT><A=20
>>>>>>href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>>size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>>
>>>=
>>>>>>
>>>>>>wrote:<BR>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is =
>>>>>>somewhere in=20
>>>>>>Tank's Steiny<BR>> <BR>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did =
>>>>>>an=20
>>>>>>amazing job of recreating the Paris<BR>> <BR>>>channel Eq/Gain=20
>>>>>>mojo.<BR>>>AA<BR>>><BR>>>"chuck duffy" <</FONT><A=20
>>>>>>href=3D"mailto:cxsd@c.com"><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>>>>size=3D2>cxsd@c.com</FONT></A><FONT=20
>>>>>>face=3DArial size=3D2>> wrote in message </FONT><A=20
>>>>>>href=3D"news:447b8639$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>>size=3D2>news:447b8639$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>>size=3D2>...<BR>>>><BR>>>> Hi=20
>>>>>>Don,<BR>>>><BR>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the =
>>>>>>paris eq=20
>>>>>>when phase inverted.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I forced Brian T to =
>>>>>>try it=20
>>>>>>when he was unconvinced.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I know that =
>>>>>>everyone is=20
>>>>>>dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for months<BR>>>> to =
>>>>>>ensure=20
>>>>>>that he could perfectly emulate the paris =
>>>>>>eq.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I=20
>>>>>>am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about=20
>>>>>>this<BR>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when =
>>>>>>on=20
>>>>>>whatever vst forum<BR>> it<BR>>>> was posted=20
>>>>>>in.<BR>>>><BR>>>><BR>>>> I know this won't =
>>>>>>help=20
>>>>>>anyones perception, but when I hear people <BR>>>>=20
>>>>>>wondering<BR>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this =
>>>>>>plug is=20
>>>>>>it.<BR>>>><BR>>>> =
>>>>>>CHuck<BR>>>><BR>>>> "DC"=20
>>>>>><</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinheck.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinheck.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>>>>size=3D2>>=20
>>>>>>wrote:<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>As I understand it, that =
>>>>>>EQ was=20
>>>>>>pretty colored and non-linear.<BR>>>>>What I need is simple, =
>>>>>>clean,=20
>>>>>>accurate band splits. The Paris EQ<BR>>>>>does this =
>>>>>>nicely,=20
>>>>>>but the whole process is tedious to say the=20
>>>>>>least.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>Sounds great=20
>>>>>>though.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>DC<BR>>>>><BR>=
>>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>"RiverLake=20
>>>>>>Farms" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:edna@texomaonline.com"><FONT =
>>>>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>>>>size=3D2>edna@texomaonline.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>>>>size=3D2>>=20
>>>>>>wrote:<BR>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still=20
>>>>>>available?<BR>>>>>>Thanks,=20
>>>>>>Edna<BR>>>>>><BR>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" =
>>>>>><</FONT><A=20
>>>>>>href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>>size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>>
>>>=
>>>>>>wrote in=20
>>>>>>message<BR>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...<BR>>>>&g=
>>>>>>t;>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>> I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
>>>>>>secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
>>>>>>band with=20
>>>>>>EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
>>>>>>all are=20
>>>>>>done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>>>>>>the<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
>>>>>>settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
>>>>>>to just=20
>>>>>>create the files to do=20
>>>>>>this!)<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> DC, this =
>>>>>>can be=20
>>>>>>achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris<BR>>=20
>>>>>>VST<BR>>>>>EQ,<BR>>>>>>> and in real =
>>>>>>timeif you=20
>>>>>>want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the<BR>>>>=20
>>>>>>VST<BR>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application=20
>>>>>>yet?<BR>>>>>>> It doth rock=20
>>>>>>much.<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>AA<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>=
>>>>>>;>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>"DC" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT =
>>>>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>>>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>>>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>>>>>message </FONT><A href=3D"news:44793f10$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>>size=3D2>news:44793f10$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>>size=3D2>...<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> > Ok,=20
>>>>>>here's the short version. I've been working on this most =
>>>>>>of<BR>>=20
>>>>>>the<BR>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so =
>>>>>>this is=20
>>>>>>very incomplete.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>> It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4=20
>>>>>>stereo<BR>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8=20
>>>>>>compressors.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>>>>>I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
>>>>>>secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
>>>>>>band with=20
>>>>>>EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
>>>>>>all are=20
>>>>>>done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>>>>>>the<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
>>>>>>settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
>>>>>>to just=20
>>>>>>create the files to do this!)<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, =
>>>>>>and a=20
>>>>>>general PITA.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>>>>>HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results=20
>>>>>>are<BR>>>>>>> > friggin'=20
>>>>>>fabulous.<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing =
>>>>>>really.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. =20
>>>>>>Later. BTW, you must leave some<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but=20
>>>>>>the<BR>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying =
>>>>>>that for=20
>>>>>>years). This technique<BR>>>>>>> > works so =
>>>>>>beautifully=20
>>>>>>with slamming the Paris mix buss that it =
>>>>>>seems<BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>>>>>like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is=20
>>>>>>grinning...<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>Paris for mastering. wadda concept.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>>>Rob=20
>>>>>>Arsenault" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:mani2@nbnet.nb.ca"><FONT =
>>>>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>>>>size=3D2>mani2@nbnet.nb.ca</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>>=20
>>>>>>wrote:<BR>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do=20
>>>>>>share...!!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <</FONT><A=20
>>>>>>href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>>>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>>>>>message <BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Hey=20
>>>>>>all,<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a=20
>>>>>>multiband<BR>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor =
>>>>>>in=20
>>>>>>Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for=20
>>>>>>the<BR>>>>>>> >>>> help with=20
>>>>>>this.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very =
>>>>>>familiar=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>>=20
>>>>>>material<BR>>>>>>> >>>> that are just =
>>>>>>making me=20
>>>>>>grin from ear to ear...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as =
>>>>>>I get=20
>>>>>>this live disc out the door I will post the <BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> details.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Paris=20
>>>>>>lives!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>>> DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>&=
>>>>>>gt;>>>=20
>>>>>>I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and =
>>>>>>you?<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>></FONT><A href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html"><FONT face=3DArial
>>>>>=
>>>>>>
>>>>>>size=3D2>http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html</FONT></A><BR><FONT =
>>>>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>>>>size=3D2>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>=
>>>>>>>>><BR>>>>>><BR>>>>><BR>>>> =
>>>>>>
>>>>>><BR>>><BR>>><BR>></FONT> </BODY></HTML>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: Multi Band Mastering in Paris [message #68795 is a reply to message #68785] |
Wed, 31 May 2006 15:42 |
Aaron Allen
Messages: 1988
Registered: May 2008
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Linked compressors would
> not work for this.
.... and actually.. couldn't one use 'wires' to link them?
AA
"DC" <dc@spammersmasteringlab.biz> wrote in message news:447da8e7$1@linux...
>
> Kim,
>
> Actually, when setup right, the opposite happens. The stereo
> image becomes much more solid and stable and quite improved.
>
> Remember, the left and right settings have to match exactly.
> When you do this, it actually corrects for L-R level mismatches
> precisely because it is not doing the same thing on both sides.
>
> If you add too much compression, what will happen is a tonal
> imbalance between the bands, not a stereo imbalance.
>
> Try it, and you will see what I mean. The stereo image was much
> improved and solid and stable as a rock. Linked compressors would
> not work for this.
>
> DC
>
> "Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>While I have heard a lot of people more knowledgable than myself talk up
>>this method of mastering, one thing has always bothered me...
>>
>>The Paris compressors are mono. Therefore your left and right channels are
>>being processed seperately. Surely your stereo imaging will go all over
> the
>>place?!? I mean, for starters, anything that's loud in a given frequency
>>band, and not centred, will tend to get centred, because the louder
>>channel
>>will cop more compression. If, in a given band, the left channel is louder
>>than the right channel, everything in that band will get panned further
> right,
>>because the left channel will get compressed / reduced in level more than
>>the right channel. What's more, some sounds will no doubt cover more than
>>one frequency band, and as this "repanning" effect is unlikely to be
>>identical
>>in all frequency bands, one part of a sound may get panned further right,
>>while another band of it stays where it is, or even moves further left
>>depending
>>what is in that band.
>>
>>I would have thought that on material with considerable stereo content,
> things
>>will end up all over the shop in terms of stereo imaging.
>>
>>On the other hand, there's a very practicle school of thought which says
>>"If it sounds good, just do it"...
>>
>>Cheers,
>>Kim.
>>
>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>Ok, you asked for it......... PC mastering technique in Paris:
>>>
>>>Take your 2 track L/R master final mix file. Put the Left mix file on =
>>>Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left. Put the Right mix file on Channels
>>=
>>>2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris VST EQ, split the files =
>>>into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will be low mid band, 5/6
>>=
>>>will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary depending on =
>>>taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears, =
>>>nobody can hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with
>>=
>>>the Sakis Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid 540-6Khz Hi
>>=
>>>6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with =
>>>either the Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris =
>>>VST EQ. The placement is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together =
>>>using Grouping on the mixer. Do not for ANY reason split these waves =
>>>into another editor unless you're ready to fight phase and time delay =
>>>demons between submixes. Also, be sure you have everything selected with
>>=
>>>the time lock tool when you do this - same reason about phase/time.=20
>>>
>>>Now, the thing is, you can adjust the Gain/EQ mojo separately for each
> =
>>>band, you can compress with different ratios, thresholds.. whatever =
>>>suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the Paris compressor, be =
>>>sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, 3=3D4, 5=3D6, =
>>>7=3D8). Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period.=20
>>>
>>>Now then, for more secret sauce beyond the Eq/Gain trick.. put one more
>>=
>>>compressor on the global but do NOT compress with it. Threshold all the
>>=
>>>way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the gain output to beat the
>>=
>>>snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but ... and this is also
>>=
>>>super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5 dB or you'll =
>>>blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital converters that =
>>>your stuff will eventually have to suffer.=20
>>>Be careful in all this, you have SO much gain shaping you can turn the
> =
>>>wav into a baby ruth in the repro guy's editor... and no one wants to =
>>>find a baby ruth floating in their pool of music. Don't smash it so much
>>=
>>>that it only takes 5 bits to play it back faithfully. Again, use your =
>>>ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will take more abuse than say, a =
>>>ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program material dependant' =
>>>thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like a Pantera =
>>>tune, for example.=20
>>>
>>>Essentially you are creating a Waves multiband compressor, only you're
> =
>>>using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, .. better IMO. YMMV. If you
> =
>>>plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and create your own =
>>>template PPJ you can just time lock drag the 'files' to and be on your
> =
>>>way.=20
>>>
>>>For you Mac mastering gurus, just replace the Paris VST EQ with a good
> =
>>>sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band pass and hi pass.
> =
>>>Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain trick in the =
>>>Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris EQ =
>>>Gain in it's place post eq/compression for each group of channels.
>>>
>>>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I suspect Doug Wellington has it =
>>>posted on his page.
>>>Doug, you still out there man?
>>>
>>>AA,=20
>>>semi kinda not really a mastering dude guy
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------ -------------=
>>>----------------------
>>>
>>>"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:447cb558$1@linux...
>>>>=20
>>>> So what's this trick mastering technique?
>>>>=20
>>>> "Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is somewhere in Tank's
>>=
>>>Steiny
>>>>=20
>>>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did an amazing job of recreating the =
>>>Paris
>>>>=20
>>>>>channel Eq/Gain mojo.
>>>>>AA
>>>>>
>>>>>"chuck duffy" <cxsd@c.com> wrote in message news:447b8639$1@linux...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Don,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the paris eq when phase inverted.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I forced Brian T to try it when he was unconvinced.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I know that everyone is dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for
>>=
>>>months
>>>>>> to ensure that he could perfectly emulate the paris eq.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about
>>=
>>>this
>>>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when on whatever vst =
>>>forum
>>>> it
>>>>>> was posted in.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I know this won't help anyones perception, but when I hear people=20
>>>>>> wondering
>>>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this plug is it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> CHuck
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinheck.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>As I understand it, that EQ was pretty colored and non-linear.
>>>>>>>What I need is simple, clean, accurate band splits. The Paris EQ
>>>>>>>does this nicely, but the whole process is tedious to say the least.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Sounds great though.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>DC
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"RiverLake Farms" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still available?
>>>>>>>>Thanks, Edna
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" <nospam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the
>>=
>>>secret
>>>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the =
>>>next
>>>>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to
> =
>>>the
>>>>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
>>>settings.
>>>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do =
>>>this!)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> DC, this can be achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig =
>>>Paris
>>>> VST
>>>>>>>EQ,
>>>>>>>>> and in real timeif you want to adjust your bands. Have you tried
>>=
>>>the
>>>>>> VST
>>>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application yet?
>>>>>>>>> It doth rock much.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> AA
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message =
>>>news:44793f10$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > Ok, here's the short version. I've been working on this most
> =
>>>of
>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so this is very incomplete.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4
>>=
>>>stereo
>>>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8 compressors.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the
>>=
>>>secret
>>>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq band with EQ only and then the =
>>>next
>>>>>>>>> > set etc until all are done. Then you bring the bands back to
> =
>>>the
>>>>>>>>> > editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp =
>>>settings.
>>>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes to just create the files to do =
>>>this!)
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, and a general PITA.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results are
>>>>>>>>> > friggin' fabulous.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing really.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. Later. BTW, you must leave some
>>>>>>>>> > headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but the
>>>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying that for years). This technique
>>>>>>>>> > works so beautifully with slamming the Paris mix buss that it
> =
>>>seems
>>>>>>>>> > like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is grinning...
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > Paris for mastering. wadda concept.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > DC
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >>Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do share...!!
>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message=20
>>>>>>>>> >>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>> Hey all,
>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a multiband
>>>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor in Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for
>>=
>>>the
>>>>>>>>> >>>> help with this.
>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very familiar=20
>>>>>>>>> >>>> material
>>>>>>>>> >>>> that are just making me grin from ear to ear...
>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as I get this live disc out the door I will post the
>>=
>>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>> details.
>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>> Paris lives!
>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>> DC
>>>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>>>>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
>>><HTML><HEAD>
>>><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>>>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
>>><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.5296.0" name=3DGENERATOR>
>>><STYLE></STYLE>
>>></HEAD>
>>><BODY>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><EM>Ok, you asked for it......... PC =
>>>mastering=20
>>>technique in Paris:</EM></FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Take your 2 track L/R master =
>>>final mix=20
>>>file. Put the Left mix file on Channels 1,3,5 and 7. Pan hard left. =
>>>Put the=20
>>>Right mix file on Channels 2,4,6 and 8. Pan hard right. Using the Paris
>>=
>>>VST EQ,=20
>>>split the files into different bands. 1/2 will be lo pass, 3/4 will be
> =
>>>low mid=20
>>>band, 5/6 will be hi mid band, 7/8 will be hi pass. Freq will vary =
>>>depending on=20
>>>taste and what you're going for and program material. Use your ears, =
>>>nobody can=20
>>>hand you that in text and be completely accurate. Start with the Sakis=20
>>>Frequencies... Lo 20-90hz. Lo-Mid 90-540 Hi-Mid =
>>>540-6Khz Hi=20
>>>6-20Khz. Compress each 'set' of channels (1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8) with =
>>>either the=20
>>>Paris Compressor or with a good sounding native POST Paris VST EQ. The
> =
>>>placement=20
>>>is absolutely critical. Tie all faders together using Grouping on the =
>>>mixer. Do=20
>>>not for ANY reason split these waves into another editor unless you're
> =
>>>ready to=20
>>>fight phase and time delay demons between submixes. Also, be sure you =
>>>have=20
>>>everything selected with the time lock tool when you do this - same =
>>>reason about=20
>>>phase/time. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now, the thing is, you can =
>>>adjust the=20
>>>Gain/EQ mojo separately for each band, you can compress with different
> =
>>>ratios,=20
>>>thresholds.. whatever suits the material, all in Paris. If you use the
> =
>>>Paris=20
>>>compressor, be sure to match each pair of tracks' settings (1=3D2, =
>>>3=3D4, 5=3D6, 7=3D8).=20
>>>Ditto on the eq bands, they must match, period. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG></STRONG></FONT> </DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Now then, for more secret sauce
>>=
>>>beyond the=20
>>>Eq/Gain trick.. put one more compressor on the global but do NOT =
>>>compress with=20
>>>it. Threshold all the way up, ratio all the way down. Instead, use the
> =
>>>gain=20
>>>output to beat the snot out of the signal hitting the global bus, but =
>>>... and=20
>>>this is also super important... keep the global fader at -0.3 or -0.5 dB
>>=
>>>or=20
>>>you'll blister the ^&*#&$ out of the cheapo wal mart digital =
>>>converters=20
>>>that your stuff will eventually have to suffer. </STRONG></FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><STRONG>Be careful in all this, you =
>>>have SO much=20
>>>gain shaping you can turn the wav into a baby ruth in the repro=20
>>>guy's editor... and no one wants to find a baby ruth floating in =
>>>their pool=20
>>>of music. Don't smash it so much that it only takes 5 bits to play =
>>>it back=20
>>>faithfully. Again, use your ears man.. pop and aggressive tunes will =
>>>take more=20
>>>abuse than say, a ballad or classical. This is part of the 'program =
>>>material=20
>>>dependant' thing I mentioned earlier. Don't treat a jazz standard like
> a
>>=
>>>Pantera=20
>>>tune, for example</STRONG>. </FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Essentially you are creating a Waves =
>>>multiband=20
>>>compressor, only you're using Paris to do it and it sounds.. well, .. =
>>>better=20
>>>IMO. YMMV. If you plan to do this a lot, do your self a huge favor and=20
>>>create your own template PPJ you can just time lock drag the =
>>>'files'=20
>>>to and be on your way. </FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>For you Mac mastering gurus, just =
>>>replace the Paris=20
>>>VST EQ with a good sounding phase coherent EQ capable of lo pass, band
> =
>>>pass and=20
>>>hi pass. Sorry, there is no equal that I'm aware of to the gain =
>>>trick in=20
>>>the Paris VST EQ, but you do have the option of using the actual Paris
> =
>>>EQ Gain=20
>>>in it's place post eq/compression for each group of =
>>>channels.</FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>If anyone needs the Paris VST EQ, I =
>>>suspect Doug=20
>>>Wellington has it posted on his page.</FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Doug, you still out there =
>>>man?</FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS"=20
>>>size=3D3><EM><STRONG>AA,</STRONG></EM></FONT> </FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>semi kinda not really a mastering
>>>dude=20
>>>guy</FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2> ------------------------------------------------------------ ----=
>>>-------------------------------</FONT></DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
>>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>"John" <</FONT><A =
>>>href=3D"mailto:no@no.com"><FONT=20
>>>face=3DArial size=3D2>no@no.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>>message </FONT><A href=3D"news:447cb558$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>news:447cb558$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>...</FONT></DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> <BR>> So =
>>>what's this=20
>>>trick mastering technique?<BR>> <BR>> "Aaron Allen" <</FONT><A=20
>>>href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> =
>>>
>>>wrote:<BR>>>Word. I'd be willing to bet that this VST plug is =
>>>somewhere in=20
>>>Tank's Steiny<BR>> <BR>>>arsenal in regular use. Matt did =
>>>an=20
>>>amazing job of recreating the Paris<BR>> <BR>>>channel Eq/Gain=20
>>>mojo.<BR>>>AA<BR>>><BR>>>"chuck duffy" <</FONT><A=20
>>>href=3D"mailto:cxsd@c.com"><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>size=3D2>cxsd@c.com</FONT></A><FONT=20
>>>face=3DArial size=3D2>> wrote in message </FONT><A=20
>>>href=3D"news:447b8639$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>news:447b8639$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>...<BR>>>><BR>>>> Hi=20
>>>Don,<BR>>>><BR>>>> The vst eq bit cancels with the =
>>>paris eq=20
>>>when phase inverted.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I forced Brian T to =
>>>try it=20
>>>when he was unconvinced.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I know that =
>>>everyone is=20
>>>dubious, but matt worked 24 hours a day for months<BR>>>> to =
>>>ensure=20
>>>that he could perfectly emulate the paris =
>>>eq.<BR>>>><BR>>>> I=20
>>>am familiar with the "pretty colored and non-linear" comment about=20
>>>this<BR>>>> plug, as I read and responded to it way back when =
>>>on=20
>>>whatever vst forum<BR>> it<BR>>>> was posted=20
>>>in.<BR>>>><BR>>>><BR>>>> I know this won't =
>>>help=20
>>>anyones perception, but when I hear people <BR>>>>=20
>>>wondering<BR>>>> how to capture the paris special sauce - this =
>>>plug is=20
>>>it.<BR>>>><BR>>>> =
>>>CHuck<BR>>>><BR>>>> "DC"=20
>>><</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinheck.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinheck.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>size=3D2>>=20
>>>wrote:<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>As I understand it, that =
>>>EQ was=20
>>>pretty colored and non-linear.<BR>>>>>What I need is simple, =
>>>clean,=20
>>>accurate band splits. The Paris EQ<BR>>>>>does this =
>>>nicely,=20
>>>but the whole process is tedious to say the=20
>>>least.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>Sounds great=20
>>>though.<BR>>>>><BR>>>>>DC<BR>>>>><BR>=
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>"RiverLake=20
>>>Farms" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:edna@texomaonline.com"><FONT =
>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>edna@texomaonline.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>size=3D2>>=20
>>>wrote:<BR>>>>>>Is the Paris EQ plug still=20
>>>available?<BR>>>>>>Thanks,=20
>>>Edna<BR>>>>>><BR>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" =
>>><</FONT><A=20
>>>href=3D"mailto:nospam@not_here.dude"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>nospam@not_here.dude</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> =
>>>wrote in=20
>>>message<BR>>>>>>news:447948de$1@linux...<BR>>>>&g=
>>>t;>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>> I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
>>>secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
>>>band with=20
>>>EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
>>>all are=20
>>>done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>>>the<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
>>>settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
>>>to just=20
>>>create the files to do=20
>>>this!)<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> DC, this =
>>>can be=20
>>>achieved SO much faster using the Matt Craig Paris<BR>>=20
>>>VST<BR>>>>>EQ,<BR>>>>>>> and in real =
>>>timeif you=20
>>>want to adjust your bands. Have you tried the<BR>>>>=20
>>>VST<BR>>>>>>> Paris EQ for this application=20
>>>yet?<BR>>>>>>> It doth rock=20
>>>much.<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>AA<BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>=
>>>;>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>"DC" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT =
>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>>message </FONT><A href=3D"news:44793f10$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>news:44793f10$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>...<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>><BR>>>>>>> > Ok,=20
>>>here's the short version. I've been working on this most =
>>>of<BR>>=20
>>>the<BR>>>>>>> > day and am about to turn in, so =
>>>this is=20
>>>very incomplete.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>> It is a version of Sakis' band-split technique where you use 4=20
>>>stereo<BR>>>>>>> > bands and 8 channels and 8=20
>>>compressors.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>><BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>>I'm going to skip over a million details and just say that the=20
>>>secret<BR>>>>>>> > is bouncing each stereo freq =
>>>band with=20
>>>EQ only and then the next<BR>>>>>>> > set etc until =
>>>all are=20
>>>done. Then you bring the bands back to =
>>>the<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>> editor, shut off the EQ and start working on your comp=20
>>>settings.<BR>>>>>>> > (yes you have to do 4 passes =
>>>to just=20
>>>create the files to do this!)<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>> > It is complicated, time-consuming, =
>>>and a=20
>>>general PITA.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>><BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>>HOWEVER, if you pay attention and are patient, the results=20
>>>are<BR>>>>>>> > friggin'=20
>>>fabulous.<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>=20
>>>Sweet, huge and detailed. Just amazing =
>>>really.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>> > There is much more to say. =20
>>>Later. BTW, you must leave some<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>=20
>>>headroom in your mixes to get the most out of this (but=20
>>>the<BR>>>>>>> > mastering guys have been saying =
>>>that for=20
>>>years). This technique<BR>>>>>>> > works so =
>>>beautifully=20
>>>with slamming the Paris mix buss that it =
>>>seems<BR>>>>>>> >=20
>>>like it was designed to do this. Somewhere SSC is=20
>>>grinning...<BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>=20
>>>Paris for mastering. wadda concept.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>> > DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>> ><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>Rob=20
>>>Arsenault" <</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:mani2@nbnet.nb.ca"><FONT =
>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>mani2@nbnet.nb.ca</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>>=20
>>>wrote:<BR>>>>>>> >>>Yes DC, please do=20
>>>share...!!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>"DC" <</FONT><A=20
>>>href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
>>>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>>>message <BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>news:4477dc50$1@linux...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Hey=20
>>>all,<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>> I am discovering some *amazing* stuff trying a=20
>>>multiband<BR>>>>>>> >>>> split/compressor =
>>>in=20
>>>Paris. THANK YOU to Sakis and Deej for=20
>>>the<BR>>>>>>> >>>> help with=20
>>>this.<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>> More to follow, but I am getting results, on very =
>>>familiar=20
>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>>=20
>>>material<BR>>>>>>> >>>> that are just =
>>>making me=20
>>>grin from ear to ear...<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> As soon as =
>>>I get=20
>>>this live disc out the door I will post the <BR>>>>>>> =
>>>
>>>>>>> details.<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> >>>> Paris=20
>>>lives!<BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>> DC<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>><BR>>>>>>> =
>>>>><BR>>>>>>>=20
>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>&=
>>>gt;>>>=20
>>>I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and =
>>>you?<BR>>>>>>>=20
>>></FONT><A href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html"><FONT face=3DArial
>>=
>>>
>>>size=3D2>http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html</FONT></A><BR><FONT =
>>>face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>>>>>>><BR>>>>>>><BR>>>=
>>>>>><BR>>>>>><BR>>>>><BR>>>> =
>>>
>>><BR>>><BR>>><BR>></FONT> </BODY></HTML>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
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