Home » The PARIS Forums » PARIS: Main » Creamware first impressions
| Creamware first impressions [message #77368] |
Sat, 23 December 2006 14:01  |
TCB
Messages: 1261
Registered: July 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Hey all,
This should be taken with some grains of salt, which if you remember are
quite a bit larger than the ticks on a 100 mm fader using a 14 bit MIDI stream,
but so far I'm really knocked out by the Creamware card. Keep in mind that
it's been shown here that I'm deaf, not a 'pro,' and can't hear the difference
between different brands of USB flash drives. I use a PNY when some people
claim the SanDisks are punchier. The big problem I had with the CW gear before
was stability, and it's only been a day but so far absolutely rock solid.
'Cause I'm deaf I only use 44.1 so I don't have clocking issues.
I remembered the synths as being spectacular and they are much better than
I remember. Frankly I don't think I've heard digital synthesis done better,
with the possible exception of the OASYS PCI card, but I think I'd still
give the CW gear the edge. Keep in mind I've owned a fair amount of Waldorf,
Access, Nord, and Clavia gear over the years. There's no reason why it should
sound better than native, DSP code is DSP code, and I wonder if maybe it's
precisely because the gear is a little old that it sounds so good. Expectations
were a little lower back then. In any case, they clearly went for sonic quality
over polyphony with the synths. The Prophet is absolutely killer, the wavetable
synths spit out psycho bells that are to die for, the minimoog is ripping.
The B3 is very nice as well, and it can do thin and cheesey as well as it
does big and crushing which I like because I tend to use organ sounds as
minor decoration.
The software has also gotten easier to use. I'd say it would make it a lot
easier if someone had a bit of experience with modular synths, but I managed
to get everything running and making noises without reading the manual. I'll
have to get to that soon. I think it will be a minor hassle to get used to
running the Scope environment while using Live/SX and I'm not sure how I'm
going to bounce tracks to audio when I start hitting the wall on the DSP
on the Scope board. Probably just run one of the ADAT outputs to one of the
ADAT inputs. Having the big display and being able to use keyboard shortcuts
to switch virtual desktops will help a good bit.
Which also brings up the one complaint I have about the CW card, the DSPs
do get chewed up pretty quickly and they don't seem too smart. That is, if
I open up a Prophet the DSP load goes up even when it's not doing anything.
Most native plugs these days only take resources when they have something
to do. I'm quite sure I could use two 14 DSP cards without trying too hard.
Again, it will just involve a little time learning to manage the workflow
and I'm willing to do that for synths and f/x this good.
Paired up with a UAD card it's a damned impressive system. I might spring
for another one of each, using the UAD for vintage type f/x and the CW for
mixing and synths. I gotta say, it's a pretty enjoyable, creative combination.
Now that I like it, we'll see CW out of business soon.
TCB
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| Re: Creamware first impressions [message #77371 is a reply to message #77368] |
Sat, 23 December 2006 14:41  |
DJ
Messages: 1124
Registered: July 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Glad you are liking it Thad. After all my cheerleading and then Neil's
experience, I've sorta been dreading what would happen next and I've been
having dreams of my lurching through cobblestoned streets in a Carpathian
mountain village muttering guturally while being pursued by an enraged mob
of Parisites dressed as impoverished Bavarian elves, waving torches and
brandishing axes and pitchforks.
;o)
"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:458d9913$1@linux...
>
> Hey all,
>
> This should be taken with some grains of salt, which if you remember are
> quite a bit larger than the ticks on a 100 mm fader using a 14 bit MIDI
> stream,
> but so far I'm really knocked out by the Creamware card. Keep in mind that
> it's been shown here that I'm deaf, not a 'pro,' and can't hear the
> difference
> between different brands of USB flash drives. I use a PNY when some people
> claim the SanDisks are punchier. The big problem I had with the CW gear
> before
> was stability, and it's only been a day but so far absolutely rock solid.
> 'Cause I'm deaf I only use 44.1 so I don't have clocking issues.
>
> I remembered the synths as being spectacular and they are much better than
> I remember. Frankly I don't think I've heard digital synthesis done
> better,
> with the possible exception of the OASYS PCI card, but I think I'd still
> give the CW gear the edge. Keep in mind I've owned a fair amount of
> Waldorf,
> Access, Nord, and Clavia gear over the years. There's no reason why it
> should
> sound better than native, DSP code is DSP code, and I wonder if maybe it's
> precisely because the gear is a little old that it sounds so good.
> Expectations
> were a little lower back then. In any case, they clearly went for sonic
> quality
> over polyphony with the synths. The Prophet is absolutely killer, the
> wavetable
> synths spit out psycho bells that are to die for, the minimoog is ripping.
> The B3 is very nice as well, and it can do thin and cheesey as well as it
> does big and crushing which I like because I tend to use organ sounds as
> minor decoration.
>
> The software has also gotten easier to use. I'd say it would make it a lot
> easier if someone had a bit of experience with modular synths, but I
> managed
> to get everything running and making noises without reading the manual.
> I'll
> have to get to that soon. I think it will be a minor hassle to get used to
> running the Scope environment while using Live/SX and I'm not sure how I'm
> going to bounce tracks to audio when I start hitting the wall on the DSP
> on the Scope board. Probably just run one of the ADAT outputs to one of
> the
> ADAT inputs. Having the big display and being able to use keyboard
> shortcuts
> to switch virtual desktops will help a good bit.
>
> Which also brings up the one complaint I have about the CW card, the DSPs
> do get chewed up pretty quickly and they don't seem too smart. That is, if
> I open up a Prophet the DSP load goes up even when it's not doing
> anything.
> Most native plugs these days only take resources when they have something
> to do. I'm quite sure I could use two 14 DSP cards without trying too
> hard.
> Again, it will just involve a little time learning to manage the workflow
> and I'm willing to do that for synths and f/x this good.
>
> Paired up with a UAD card it's a damned impressive system. I might spring
> for another one of each, using the UAD for vintage type f/x and the CW for
> mixing and synths. I gotta say, it's a pretty enjoyable, creative
> combination.
>
>
> Now that I like it, we'll see CW out of business soon.
>
> TCB
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| Re: Creamware first impressions [message #77376 is a reply to message #77371] |
Sat, 23 December 2006 16:41 |
TCB
Messages: 1261
Registered: July 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop. I've been working on songs for the
past few hours again and it's a devilishly enjoyable system. This is all
on my own electronic stuff. The CW gear might fade into the background a
bit if I start mixing Mold Monkies tunes, but then again it might not. I
can see the delays and reverbs on the CW card being useful in that context.
Thanks for doing the ranger work on this one. I was talking once to a Yale
computer person about a very young free software project I was using in production.
He said an early adopter was a person who crossed the bridge first, but that
I was ploughing straight through the river in a shitty old jeep. I took that
as a compliment though I don't think it was intended as one. You did the
jeep work on this one and I appreciate it.
TCB
"DJ" <nowayjose@dude.net> wrote:
>Glad you are liking it Thad. After all my cheerleading and then Neil's
>experience, I've sorta been dreading what would happen next and I've been
>having dreams of my lurching through cobblestoned streets in a Carpathian
>mountain village muttering guturally while being pursued by an enraged mob
>of Parisites dressed as impoverished Bavarian elves, waving torches and
>brandishing axes and pitchforks.
>
>;o)
>
>
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:458d9913$1@linux...
>>
>> Hey all,
>>
>> This should be taken with some grains of salt, which if you remember are
>> quite a bit larger than the ticks on a 100 mm fader using a 14 bit MIDI
>> stream,
>> but so far I'm really knocked out by the Creamware card. Keep in mind
that
>> it's been shown here that I'm deaf, not a 'pro,' and can't hear the
>> difference
>> between different brands of USB flash drives. I use a PNY when some people
>> claim the SanDisks are punchier. The big problem I had with the CW gear
>> before
>> was stability, and it's only been a day but so far absolutely rock solid.
>> 'Cause I'm deaf I only use 44.1 so I don't have clocking issues.
>>
>> I remembered the synths as being spectacular and they are much better
than
>> I remember. Frankly I don't think I've heard digital synthesis done
>> better,
>> with the possible exception of the OASYS PCI card, but I think I'd still
>> give the CW gear the edge. Keep in mind I've owned a fair amount of
>> Waldorf,
>> Access, Nord, and Clavia gear over the years. There's no reason why it
>> should
>> sound better than native, DSP code is DSP code, and I wonder if maybe
it's
>> precisely because the gear is a little old that it sounds so good.
>> Expectations
>> were a little lower back then. In any case, they clearly went for sonic
>> quality
>> over polyphony with the synths. The Prophet is absolutely killer, the
>> wavetable
>> synths spit out psycho bells that are to die for, the minimoog is ripping.
>> The B3 is very nice as well, and it can do thin and cheesey as well as
it
>> does big and crushing which I like because I tend to use organ sounds
as
>> minor decoration.
>>
>> The software has also gotten easier to use. I'd say it would make it a
lot
>> easier if someone had a bit of experience with modular synths, but I
>> managed
>> to get everything running and making noises without reading the manual.
>> I'll
>> have to get to that soon. I think it will be a minor hassle to get used
to
>> running the Scope environment while using Live/SX and I'm not sure how
I'm
>> going to bounce tracks to audio when I start hitting the wall on the DSP
>> on the Scope board. Probably just run one of the ADAT outputs to one of
>> the
>> ADAT inputs. Having the big display and being able to use keyboard
>> shortcuts
>> to switch virtual desktops will help a good bit.
>>
>> Which also brings up the one complaint I have about the CW card, the DSPs
>> do get chewed up pretty quickly and they don't seem too smart. That is,
if
>> I open up a Prophet the DSP load goes up even when it's not doing
>> anything.
>> Most native plugs these days only take resources when they have something
>> to do. I'm quite sure I could use two 14 DSP cards without trying too
>> hard.
>> Again, it will just involve a little time learning to manage the workflow
>> and I'm willing to do that for synths and f/x this good.
>>
>> Paired up with a UAD card it's a damned impressive system. I might spring
>> for another one of each, using the UAD for vintage type f/x and the CW
for
>> mixing and synths. I gotta say, it's a pretty enjoyable, creative
>> combination.
>>
>>
>> Now that I like it, we'll see CW out of business soon.
>>
>> TCB
>
>
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| Re: Creamware first impressions [message #77377 is a reply to message #77376] |
Sat, 23 December 2006 16:28 |
DJ
Messages: 1124
Registered: July 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
well, thanks ;o).............but as is always the case with just about
anything, there was an ancient predecessor......in this case, our Greek
compadre, Dimitrios. He's been using this system for years and had it not
been for him, neither one of us might be grinnin' right now. I've got a free
IRQ and I'm seriously considering getting a 4th card m'self. If I do, it's
likely to be a "pro" version. The more DSP, the better, especially with this
platform. I'm not a synth guy, but these synths are nice. I like the
aggressive character that seems present in every one I have tried so far.
It's like no matter how much you scoop your velocity curve, it still seems
to want to knock down a wall.
Cheers,
Deej
"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:458dbe99$1@linux...
>
> I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop. I've been working on songs for the
> past few hours again and it's a devilishly enjoyable system. This is all
> on my own electronic stuff. The CW gear might fade into the background a
> bit if I start mixing Mold Monkies tunes, but then again it might not. I
> can see the delays and reverbs on the CW card being useful in that
> context.
>
>
> Thanks for doing the ranger work on this one. I was talking once to a Yale
> computer person about a very young free software project I was using in
> production.
> He said an early adopter was a person who crossed the bridge first, but
> that
> I was ploughing straight through the river in a shitty old jeep. I took
> that
> as a compliment though I don't think it was intended as one. You did the
> jeep work on this one and I appreciate it.
>
> TCB
>
> "DJ" <nowayjose@dude.net> wrote:
>>Glad you are liking it Thad. After all my cheerleading and then Neil's
>>experience, I've sorta been dreading what would happen next and I've been
>
>>having dreams of my lurching through cobblestoned streets in a Carpathian
>
>>mountain village muttering guturally while being pursued by an enraged mob
>
>>of Parisites dressed as impoverished Bavarian elves, waving torches and
>
>>brandishing axes and pitchforks.
>>
>>;o)
>>
>>
>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:458d9913$1@linux...
>>>
>>> Hey all,
>>>
>>> This should be taken with some grains of salt, which if you remember are
>>> quite a bit larger than the ticks on a 100 mm fader using a 14 bit MIDI
>
>>> stream,
>>> but so far I'm really knocked out by the Creamware card. Keep in mind
> that
>>> it's been shown here that I'm deaf, not a 'pro,' and can't hear the
>>> difference
>>> between different brands of USB flash drives. I use a PNY when some
>>> people
>>> claim the SanDisks are punchier. The big problem I had with the CW gear
>
>>> before
>>> was stability, and it's only been a day but so far absolutely rock
>>> solid.
>>> 'Cause I'm deaf I only use 44.1 so I don't have clocking issues.
>>>
>>> I remembered the synths as being spectacular and they are much better
> than
>>> I remember. Frankly I don't think I've heard digital synthesis done
>>> better,
>>> with the possible exception of the OASYS PCI card, but I think I'd still
>>> give the CW gear the edge. Keep in mind I've owned a fair amount of
>>> Waldorf,
>>> Access, Nord, and Clavia gear over the years. There's no reason why it
>
>>> should
>>> sound better than native, DSP code is DSP code, and I wonder if maybe
> it's
>>> precisely because the gear is a little old that it sounds so good.
>>> Expectations
>>> were a little lower back then. In any case, they clearly went for sonic
>
>>> quality
>>> over polyphony with the synths. The Prophet is absolutely killer, the
>
>>> wavetable
>>> synths spit out psycho bells that are to die for, the minimoog is
>>> ripping.
>>> The B3 is very nice as well, and it can do thin and cheesey as well as
> it
>>> does big and crushing which I like because I tend to use organ sounds
> as
>>> minor decoration.
>>>
>>> The software has also gotten easier to use. I'd say it would make it a
> lot
>>> easier if someone had a bit of experience with modular synths, but I
>>> managed
>>> to get everything running and making noises without reading the manual.
>
>>> I'll
>>> have to get to that soon. I think it will be a minor hassle to get used
> to
>>> running the Scope environment while using Live/SX and I'm not sure how
> I'm
>>> going to bounce tracks to audio when I start hitting the wall on the DSP
>>> on the Scope board. Probably just run one of the ADAT outputs to one of
>
>>> the
>>> ADAT inputs. Having the big display and being able to use keyboard
>>> shortcuts
>>> to switch virtual desktops will help a good bit.
>>>
>>> Which also brings up the one complaint I have about the CW card, the
>>> DSPs
>>> do get chewed up pretty quickly and they don't seem too smart. That is,
> if
>>> I open up a Prophet the DSP load goes up even when it's not doing
>>> anything.
>>> Most native plugs these days only take resources when they have
>>> something
>>> to do. I'm quite sure I could use two 14 DSP cards without trying too
>
>>> hard.
>>> Again, it will just involve a little time learning to manage the
>>> workflow
>>> and I'm willing to do that for synths and f/x this good.
>>>
>>> Paired up with a UAD card it's a damned impressive system. I might
>>> spring
>>> for another one of each, using the UAD for vintage type f/x and the CW
> for
>>> mixing and synths. I gotta say, it's a pretty enjoyable, creative
>>> combination.
>>>
>>>
>>> Now that I like it, we'll see CW out of business soon.
>>>
>>> TCB
>>
>>
>
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| Re: Creamware first impressions [message #77379 is a reply to message #77371] |
Sat, 23 December 2006 18:44 |
Neil
Messages: 1645
Registered: April 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
"DJ" <nowayjose@dude.net> wrote:
>Glad you are liking it Thad. After all my cheerleading and
>then Neil's experience, I've sorta been dreading what would
>happen next
Well, my experience has now changed... I finished the install
of the Pulsar card into the same PC as is running my Paris rig
WinME machine,and it gave me some shit at first (driver loaded
fine, but the install files didn't want to run.... kinda like
that guy over on the Pulsar forum), anyway, finally got it to
install, and once it did it went smoothly from there.
This thing is running fine AND.... (wait for it) CLOCKING
PERFECTLY AT 88.2K!!! Yes, sir, I can get it to clock via both
S/Mux (lightpipe) OR Word Clock, and no it doesn't register
88.2k on the readout, it says "96k", but I get not one but TWO
little red lock lights (one for each lightpipe input perhaps?).
Now, considering it's working now, perhaps my problems with
this card on the other machine had more to do with two ASIO
drivers being present... it seems weird that even with one of
them disabled (the RME's) this card would act up, but perhaps
there was some kind of conflict nonetheless - I dunno. Or maybe
it just likes WinME better than XP.
In any event, yep, I can back Deej & Thad up on the stability
- at least on this current setup I've got... I've been trying
various plugins & whatnot & overloading the DSP's (not
purposely, just from dicking around & trying different plugs at
once), and it gives me caution messages, but hasn't crashed
once. As for the sound? Too early to tell if it's going to
improve my situation in the limited capacity I'm able to use
it for what I'm trying to accomplish, but do far I can tell you
that the sound certainly sucketh not.
Yea, verily.
I'll tell you this much, though... if you're looking to do some
serious plug-in insertion counts on this stuff, then don't dick
around, get the Pro Card... YMMV, but that's my advice.
Neil
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| Re: Creamware first impressions [message #77384 is a reply to message #77381] |
Sat, 23 December 2006 21:16 |
Tom Bruhl
Messages: 1368
Registered: June 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C726F0.C0C4D4C0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hey Neil,
I finally got ADATs, XTC and MIDI functioning (no crashes)
with Scope not even running. That's step one for my implementation
of the hardware. Once all was set the XTC seemed to work like regular
VSTi plugins. It has become RME plus. Once I get this into the
control room I'll listen to the audio and really put it through some =
paces.
I am getting closer and closer. Thanks for the help!
Tom
"Neil" <IOUOIU@OIU.com> wrote in message news:458dfa7a$1@linux...
"Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>I'm glad every one is getting somewhere. I'm a little stumped at =
this =3D
>moment.
>
>I have most of my plugs authorized manually now. I have been
>reading the manual and futzing around but can't seem to get the
>ADAT routing or XTC working with SX2 on the same comp. Cubase
has the list of plugs from Scope but they won't start up.
Yeah, you have to enable them manually - sucks, huh? First of
all, make sure XTC mode is enabled in Pulsar...
"Set"/"Settings"/"Global" submenu drop-down), then go into your
Plugin Information window in SX & manually click on all the
brown highlighted Pulsar plugins (or just the ones you want to
try out for now), then close that window & they'll all of a
sudden appear & be available for insertion under the XTC plugin
folder. Unless Deej knows a quicker way, this is how you gotta
do it.=20
They do in Scope though. The =3D
>ADAT
>modules (2) don't show up in VST Connections in Cubase nor does the =
=3D
>SPDIF. =3D20
>Creamware MIDI and analog does though. I dragged the ADAT modules =
onto
=3D
>the=3D20
>Routing Window along with the MIDI modules in Scope. I even =
connected =3D
>the ADAT=3D20
>wires to the STM 1632 in and out just to see. I've booted Scope =
first =3D
>but no change=3D20
>in Cubase. It isn't seeing the hardware.
Are you selecting the Scope ASIO driver as the master driver in
Cubase (Device Setup/VST Audiobay/then select the Scope driver
as the master off to the upper right of that window - Deej had
to help me with this the first time... I was stumped on this
one, too.)
Then make sure you refresh your connections under VST Inputs &
VST Outputs before you cloe that out... they all SHOULD show up
in your connection options at that time.
Neil
I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C726F0.C0C4D4C0
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charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1400" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Hey Neil,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I finally got ADATs, XTC and MIDI =
functioning (no=20
crashes)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>with Scope not even running. =
That's step one=20
for my implementation</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>of the hardware. Once all was set =
the XTC=20
seemed to work like regular</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>VSTi plugins. It has become RME =
plus. =20
Once I get this into the</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>control room I'll listen to the audio =
and really=20
put it through some paces.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I am getting closer and closer. =
</FONT><FONT=20
face=3DArial size=3D2>Thanks for the help!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Tom</FONT></DIV></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Neil" <<A =
href=3D"mailto:IOUOIU@OIU.com">IOUOIU@OIU.com</A>> wrote=20
in message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:458dfa7a$1@linux">news:458dfa7a$1@linux</A>...</DIV><BR>"Tom=
Bruhl"=20
<<A href=3D"mailto:arpegio@comcast.net">arpegio@comcast.net</A>> =
wrote:<BR>><BR>><BR>>I'm glad every one is getting =
somewhere. =20
I'm a little stumped at this =3D<BR>>moment.<BR>><BR>>I have =
most of my=20
plugs authorized manually now. I have been<BR>>reading the =
manual and=20
futzing around but can't seem to get the<BR>>ADAT routing or XTC =
working=20
with SX2 on the same comp. Cubase<BR>has the list of plugs from =
Scope=20
but they won't start up.<BR><BR>Yeah, you have to enable them manually =
-=20
sucks, huh? First of<BR>all, make sure XTC mode is enabled in=20
Pulsar...<BR>"Set"/"Settings"/"Global" submenu drop-down), then go =
into=20
your<BR>Plugin Information window in SX & manually click on all=20
the<BR>brown highlighted Pulsar plugins (or just the ones you want =
to<BR>try=20
out for now), then close that window & they'll all of a<BR>sudden =
appear=20
& be available for insertion under the XTC plugin<BR>folder. =
Unless Deej=20
knows a quicker way, this is how you gotta<BR>do it. =
<BR><BR><BR><BR> =20
They do in Scope though. The =3D<BR>>ADAT<BR>>modules (2) =
don't show=20
up in VST Connections in Cubase nor does the =3D<BR>>SPDIF.=20
=3D20<BR>>Creamware MIDI and analog does though. I dragged =
the ADAT=20
modules onto<BR>=3D<BR>>the=3D20<BR>>Routing Window along with =
the MIDI=20
modules in Scope. I even connected =3D<BR>>the =
ADAT=3D20<BR>>wires to=20
the STM 1632 in and out just to see. I've booted Scope first=20
=3D<BR>>but no change=3D20<BR>>in Cubase. It isn't seeing =
the=20
hardware.<BR><BR>Are you selecting the Scope ASIO driver as the master =
driver=20
in<BR>Cubase (Device Setup/VST Audiobay/then select the Scope =
driver<BR>as the=20
master off to the upper right of that window - Deej had<BR>to help me =
with=20
this the first time... I was stumped on this<BR>one, too.)<BR><BR>Then =
make=20
sure you refresh your connections under VST Inputs &<BR>VST =
Outputs before=20
you cloe that out... they all SHOULD show up<BR>in your connection =
options at=20
that time.<BR><BR>Neil</BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><BR><BR>I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, =
and=20
you?<BR><A=20
href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html">http://www.polesoft.com/refer=
..html</A> </FONT></DIV></BODY ></HTML>
------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C726F0.C0C4D4C0--
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| Re: Creamware first impressions [message #77397 is a reply to message #77379] |
Sun, 24 December 2006 07:28 |
DJ
Messages: 1124
Registered: July 2005
|
Senior Member |
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>Too early to tell if it's going to
improve my situation in the limited capacity I'm able to use
it for what I'm trying to accomplish, but do far I can tell you
that the sound certainly sucketh not.<
Muhahaha!!!1...........this means that a "Pro" card with an ADAT interface
(12 stereo stems @ 88.1!!!!) is just around the corner, right Neil?
:oD
"Neil" <IUOI@OIU.com> wrote in message news:458ddb68$1@linux...
>
> "DJ" <nowayjose@dude.net> wrote:
>
>>Glad you are liking it Thad. After all my cheerleading and
>>then Neil's experience, I've sorta been dreading what would
>>happen next
>
> Well, my experience has now changed... I finished the install
> of the Pulsar card into the same PC as is running my Paris rig
> WinME machine,and it gave me some shit at first (driver loaded
> fine, but the install files didn't want to run.... kinda like
> that guy over on the Pulsar forum), anyway, finally got it to
> install, and once it did it went smoothly from there.
>
> This thing is running fine AND.... (wait for it) CLOCKING
> PERFECTLY AT 88.2K!!! Yes, sir, I can get it to clock via both
> S/Mux (lightpipe) OR Word Clock, and no it doesn't register
> 88.2k on the readout, it says "96k", but I get not one but TWO
> little red lock lights (one for each lightpipe input perhaps?).
>
> Now, considering it's working now, perhaps my problems with
> this card on the other machine had more to do with two ASIO
> drivers being present... it seems weird that even with one of
> them disabled (the RME's) this card would act up, but perhaps
> there was some kind of conflict nonetheless - I dunno. Or maybe
> it just likes WinME better than XP.
>
> In any event, yep, I can back Deej & Thad up on the stability
> - at least on this current setup I've got... I've been trying
> various plugins & whatnot & overloading the DSP's (not
> purposely, just from dicking around & trying different plugs at
> once), and it gives me caution messages, but hasn't crashed
> once. As for the sound? Too early to tell if it's going to
> improve my situation in the limited capacity I'm able to use
> it for what I'm trying to accomplish, but do far I can tell you
> that the sound certainly sucketh not.
>
> Yea, verily.
>
> I'll tell you this much, though... if you're looking to do some
> serious plug-in insertion counts on this stuff, then don't dick
> around, get the Pro Card... YMMV, but that's my advice.
>
> Neil
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| Re: Creamware first impressions [message #77398 is a reply to message #77397] |
Sun, 24 December 2006 08:56 |
Neil
Messages: 1645
Registered: April 2006
|
Senior Member |
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"DJ" <nowayjose@dude.net> wrote:
>>Too early to tell if it's going to
>improve my situation in the limited capacity I'm able to use
>it for what I'm trying to accomplish, but do far I can tell you
>that the sound certainly sucketh not.<
>
>Muhahaha!!!1...........this means that a "Pro" card with an ADAT interface
>(12 stereo stems @ 88.1!!!!) is just around the corner, right Neil?
Actually, I'd be better off just getting one of their ADAT
chainer card thingies for more lightpipe inputs, but no -
although I'd like to get more inputs, I still wouldn't be able
to get more OUTputs unless I added another Multiface or some
other kind of interface onto the Cubase PC (remember, at 88.2k,
I can get a max of four channels of lightpipe out of each of my
two Multifaces... errr.... Multifascia?)
HOWEVER......... having said all that, I actually think I might
be getting what I needed out of this setup - I hate to say it &
jinx it, but check this out:
http://www.saqqararecords.com/MiscAudio/DracoClip-ITBvsStemm edIntoPulsar.mp3
This clip contains two versions of the same section of the same
song... he first version that goes up to about :50 seconds into
the file is the best ITB mix I can get on this song. The second
cut, that goes from about :50 on, is the same mix, stemmed out
of Cubase via lightpipe into four separate submixes & summed in
Pulsar.
Here's what I'm hearing on these two cuts... now, if you're
listening on PC speakers you may not hear what I'm talking
about here, but remember I said that I was like 98%-99%
there, and I was looking for that 1 or two percent difference -
I think this might be it...
Anyway, comparing the first cut to the second cut, what I hear
about the 2nd cut that I like better is that it has a little
more "substance" in the lows/low mids now, and the high's, while
still quite present, are perhaps a little bit smoother than
those on the first clip. Vox seem a bit smoother, too;
or maybe just sit a little better in the mix. IME, the second
clip has a little more impact, and there's also something about
it that just "feels better" to listen to.
To me this is similar on the lower end to what I was getting
when I tried summing through Paris, but it also doesn't lose
the top-end clarity - I presume partly due to the fact that I'm
able to keep everything in the digital domain via lightpipe,
rather than having to go out into Analog to sum in Paris via the
8-in Module.
What do you think?
Neil
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| Re: Creamware first impressions [message #77403 is a reply to message #77377] |
Sun, 24 December 2006 13:53 |
TCB
Messages: 1261
Registered: July 2007
|
Senior Member |
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Good point, I owe Dimitrios a shout out as well. So, big up Dimitrios, I really
appreciate it.
The audiophile world is, for me, ninety nine percent nonsense, but one of
the few things they have come up with in that other one percent is describing
gear as 'fast.' And it actually makes sense and stands up under scrutiny.
The slightly more technical term with amps is 'slew rate' which is how quickly
an op amp can change its output. Some amps are 'faster' than others, and
some speakers, notably planar speakers, are also 'fast.' The CW synths are
fast as a Shelby Cobra. Fast fast fast. Of course the envelopes can be modified
to change how the synth works but that is true of any synth, slow is easy
fast is tough. Slowing them down is easy, but the CW synths have that feel
that the best hardware does, which is that the thing is just waiting for
you to press the key so it can open the gate and scream.
In case you haven't noticed I really like the CW card ;-)
Thanks again,
TCB
"DJ" <nowayjose@dude.net> wrote:
>well, thanks ;o).............but as is always the case with just about
>anything, there was an ancient predecessor......in this case, our Greek
>compadre, Dimitrios. He's been using this system for years and had it not
>been for him, neither one of us might be grinnin' right now. I've got a
free
>IRQ and I'm seriously considering getting a 4th card m'self. If I do, it's
>likely to be a "pro" version. The more DSP, the better, especially with
this
>platform. I'm not a synth guy, but these synths are nice. I like the
>aggressive character that seems present in every one I have tried so far.
>It's like no matter how much you scoop your velocity curve, it still seems
>to want to knock down a wall.
>
>Cheers,
>
>Deej
>
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:458dbe99$1@linux...
>>
>> I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop. I've been working on songs for
the
>> past few hours again and it's a devilishly enjoyable system. This is all
>> on my own electronic stuff. The CW gear might fade into the background
a
>> bit if I start mixing Mold Monkies tunes, but then again it might not.
I
>> can see the delays and reverbs on the CW card being useful in that
>> context.
>>
>>
>> Thanks for doing the ranger work on this one. I was talking once to a
Yale
>> computer person about a very young free software project I was using in
>> production.
>> He said an early adopter was a person who crossed the bridge first, but
>> that
>> I was ploughing straight through the river in a shitty old jeep. I took
>> that
>> as a compliment though I don't think it was intended as one. You did the
>> jeep work on this one and I appreciate it.
>>
>> TCB
>>
>> "DJ" <nowayjose@dude.net> wrote:
>>>Glad you are liking it Thad. After all my cheerleading and then Neil's
>>>experience, I've sorta been dreading what would happen next and I've been
>>
>>>having dreams of my lurching through cobblestoned streets in a Carpathian
>>
>>>mountain village muttering guturally while being pursued by an enraged
mob
>>
>>>of Parisites dressed as impoverished Bavarian elves, waving torches and
>>
>>>brandishing axes and pitchforks.
>>>
>>>;o)
>>>
>>>
>>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:458d9913$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> Hey all,
>>>>
>>>> This should be taken with some grains of salt, which if you remember
are
>>>> quite a bit larger than the ticks on a 100 mm fader using a 14 bit MIDI
>>
>>>> stream,
>>>> but so far I'm really knocked out by the Creamware card. Keep in mind
>> that
>>>> it's been shown here that I'm deaf, not a 'pro,' and can't hear the
>>>> difference
>>>> between different brands of USB flash drives. I use a PNY when some
>>>> people
>>>> claim the SanDisks are punchier. The big problem I had with the CW gear
>>
>>>> before
>>>> was stability, and it's only been a day but so far absolutely rock
>>>> solid.
>>>> 'Cause I'm deaf I only use 44.1 so I don't have clocking issues.
>>>>
>>>> I remembered the synths as being spectacular and they are much better
>> than
>>>> I remember. Frankly I don't think I've heard digital synthesis done
>>>> better,
>>>> with the possible exception of the OASYS PCI card, but I think I'd still
>>>> give the CW gear the edge. Keep in mind I've owned a fair amount of
>>>> Waldorf,
>>>> Access, Nord, and Clavia gear over the years. There's no reason why
it
>>
>>>> should
>>>> sound better than native, DSP code is DSP code, and I wonder if maybe
>> it's
>>>> precisely because the gear is a little old that it sounds so good.
>>>> Expectations
>>>> were a little lower back then. In any case, they clearly went for sonic
>>
>>>> quality
>>>> over polyphony with the synths. The Prophet is absolutely killer, the
>>
>>>> wavetable
>>>> synths spit out psycho bells that are to die for, the minimoog is
>>>> ripping.
>>>> The B3 is very nice as well, and it can do thin and cheesey as well
as
>> it
>>>> does big and crushing which I like because I tend to use organ sounds
>> as
>>>> minor decoration.
>>>>
>>>> The software has also gotten easier to use. I'd say it would make it
a
>> lot
>>>> easier if someone had a bit of experience with modular synths, but I
>>>> managed
>>>> to get everything running and making noises without reading the manual.
>>
>>>> I'll
>>>> have to get to that soon. I think it will be a minor hassle to get used
>> to
>>>> running the Scope environment while using Live/SX and I'm not sure how
>> I'm
>>>> going to bounce tracks to audio when I start hitting the wall on the
DSP
>>>> on the Scope board. Probably just run one of the ADAT outputs to one
of
>>
>>>> the
>>>> ADAT inputs. Having the big display and being able to use keyboard
>>>> shortcuts
>>>> to switch virtual desktops will help a good bit.
>>>>
>>>> Which also brings up the one complaint I have about the CW card, the
>>>> DSPs
>>>> do get chewed up pretty quickly and they don't seem too smart. That
is,
>> if
>>>> I open up a Prophet the DSP load goes up even when it's not doing
>>>> anything.
>>>> Most native plugs these days only take resources when they have
>>>> something
>>>> to do. I'm quite sure I could use two 14 DSP cards without trying too
>>
>>>> hard.
>>>> Again, it will just involve a little time learning to manage the
>>>> workflow
>>>> and I'm willing to do that for synths and f/x this good.
>>>>
>>>> Paired up with a UAD card it's a damned impressive system. I might
>>>> spring
>>>> for another one of each, using the UAD for vintage type f/x and the
CW
>> for
>>>> mixing and synths. I gotta say, it's a pretty enjoyable, creative
>>>> combination.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Now that I like it, we'll see CW out of business soon.
>>>>
>>>> TCB
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
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| Re: Creamware first impressions [message #77405 is a reply to message #77398] |
Sun, 24 December 2006 14:46 |
Ted Gerber
Messages: 705
Registered: January 2009
|
Senior Member |
|
|
"Neil" <OUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>Anyway, comparing the first cut to the second cut, what I hear
>about the 2nd cut that I like better is that it has a little
>more "substance" in the lows/low mids now, and the high's, while
>still quite present, are perhaps a little bit smoother than
>those on the first clip. Vox seem a bit smoother, too;
>or maybe just sit a little better in the mix. IME, the second
>clip has a little more impact, and there's also something about
>it that just "feels better" to listen to.
>
>To me this is similar on the lower end to what I was getting
>when I tried summing through Paris, but it also doesn't lose
>the top-end clarity - I presume partly due to the fact that I'm
>able to keep everything in the digital domain via lightpipe,
>rather than having to go out into Analog to sum in Paris via the
>8-in Module.
>
>What do you think?
>
>Neil
Well-
Impressive- lots of energy. Great example of this type of music.
I hear most everything as more defined in the second mix.
The bass/kick are punchier, and I agree that the uppers are quite
present. Vocals seem to me to have moved forward...
Thanks again for sharing generously.
Ted
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| Re: Creamware first impressions [message #77441 is a reply to message #77398] |
Mon, 25 December 2006 17:27 |
Bill Lorentzen
Messages: 140
Registered: June 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
The second bit is much more defined. Is it not louder too or does it just
seem louder? If that's the Pulsar vs Cubase summing, then it's waaaaay the
heck better. Is that what you bought it for?
Bill L
"Neil" <OUOIU@OIU.com> wrote in message news:458ea322$1@linux...
>
> "DJ" <nowayjose@dude.net> wrote:
>>>Too early to tell if it's going to
>>improve my situation in the limited capacity I'm able to use
>>it for what I'm trying to accomplish, but do far I can tell you
>>that the sound certainly sucketh not.<
>>
>>Muhahaha!!!1...........this means that a "Pro" card with an ADAT interface
>
>>(12 stereo stems @ 88.1!!!!) is just around the corner, right Neil?
>
> Actually, I'd be better off just getting one of their ADAT
> chainer card thingies for more lightpipe inputs, but no -
> although I'd like to get more inputs, I still wouldn't be able
> to get more OUTputs unless I added another Multiface or some
> other kind of interface onto the Cubase PC (remember, at 88.2k,
> I can get a max of four channels of lightpipe out of each of my
> two Multifaces... errr.... Multifascia?)
>
> HOWEVER......... having said all that, I actually think I might
> be getting what I needed out of this setup - I hate to say it &
> jinx it, but check this out:
>
> http://www.saqqararecords.com/MiscAudio/DracoClip-ITBvsStemm edIntoPulsar.mp3
>
> This clip contains two versions of the same section of the same
> song... he first version that goes up to about :50 seconds into
> the file is the best ITB mix I can get on this song. The second
> cut, that goes from about :50 on, is the same mix, stemmed out
> of Cubase via lightpipe into four separate submixes & summed in
> Pulsar.
>
> Here's what I'm hearing on these two cuts... now, if you're
> listening on PC speakers you may not hear what I'm talking
> about here, but remember I said that I was like 98%-99%
> there, and I was looking for that 1 or two percent difference -
> I think this might be it...
> Anyway, comparing the first cut to the second cut, what I hear
> about the 2nd cut that I like better is that it has a little
> more "substance" in the lows/low mids now, and the high's, while
> still quite present, are perhaps a little bit smoother than
> those on the first clip. Vox seem a bit smoother, too;
> or maybe just sit a little better in the mix. IME, the second
> clip has a little more impact, and there's also something about
> it that just "feels better" to listen to.
>
> To me this is similar on the lower end to what I was getting
> when I tried summing through Paris, but it also doesn't lose
> the top-end clarity - I presume partly due to the fact that I'm
> able to keep everything in the digital domain via lightpipe,
> rather than having to go out into Analog to sum in Paris via the
> 8-in Module.
>
> What do you think?
>
> Neil
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