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Talk me out of this? [message #97484] Thu, 27 March 2008 11:22 Go to next message
Bill L is currently offline  Bill L   UNITED STATES
Messages: 766
Registered: August 2006
Senior Member
I have a sweet cherry Ibanez Artist "335 style" semi hollow electric. I
think this is the best electric guitar I have ever owned. But when I
play R&B/funk gigs I really have to use my (also sweet) custom strat.
It's no hardship, but I would always prefer to play the Ibanez if possible.

So I got this crazy idea about sticking a single coil in between the
humbuckers. Anyone tried this? I've certainly played guitars with this
config and from my experience, while it will not replace a Strat, it is
useful for getting some lighter tones.
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97485 is a reply to message #97484] Thu, 27 March 2008 13:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dc[3] is currently offline  dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
Senior Member
Here's what you do:

Get a set of these:

http://www.wcrguitar.com/crossroads.html

and order them with the 4-conductor wiring. Then, wire the guitar
to split the coils on both pickups. You can use a switch to
do this, or you can use pull pots in the 2 volume positions.

These are some of the best PU's out there and they split
nicely. You get a big tone improvement over the stock PU's,
and more of a stratty sound with them split.

Call Jim at WCR if you have any questions. He is a great guy and
makes amazing pickups.

DC


Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>I have a sweet cherry Ibanez Artist "335 style" semi hollow electric. I

>think this is the best electric guitar I have ever owned. But when I
>play R&B/funk gigs I really have to use my (also sweet) custom strat.
>It's no hardship, but I would always prefer to play the Ibanez if possible.
>
>So I got this crazy idea about sticking a single coil in between the
>humbuckers. Anyone tried this? I've certainly played guitars with this
>config and from my experience, while it will not replace a Strat, it is

>useful for getting some lighter tones.
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97486 is a reply to message #97484] Thu, 27 March 2008 14:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
neil[1] is currently offline  neil[1]
Messages: 164
Registered: October 2006
Senior Member
Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:

>I think this is the best electric guitar I have ever owned.

There, you just talked yourself out of it. All the more reason
not to mutilate something you feel so strongly about.

I would do what Don suggested & get some coil-split
humbuckers... still not gonna be exactly a Strat sound, but
it'll get you an approximation of it & allow you to not
have to experience "router regret" later.

Neil
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97487 is a reply to message #97486] Thu, 27 March 2008 14:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dc[3] is currently offline  dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
Senior Member
"Neil" <IOUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>allow you to not
>have to experience "router regret" later.
>
>Neil


Hah! I received a lifetime achievement award from the Dremel
Corp. for this very thing!

DC
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97488 is a reply to message #97486] Thu, 27 March 2008 13:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bill L is currently offline  Bill L   UNITED STATES
Messages: 766
Registered: August 2006
Senior Member
I do worry about the pain of "router regret"...

Problem is I've tried splitting coils and it has never worked worth a
damn. It gives a weak, insipid sound, IMHO.

Maybe i need a Roland VG 99.

Neil wrote:
> Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>
>> I think this is the best electric guitar I have ever owned.
>
> There, you just talked yourself out of it. All the more reason
> not to mutilate something you feel so strongly about.
>
> I would do what Don suggested & get some coil-split
> humbuckers... still not gonna be exactly a Strat sound, but
> it'll get you an approximation of it & allow you to not
> have to experience "router regret" later.
>
> Neil
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97489 is a reply to message #97488] Thu, 27 March 2008 15:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dc[3] is currently offline  dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
Senior Member
Try a WCR... Call Jim and tell him of your concerns. He'll be
straight with you. He told me that these split very well.

DC


Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>I do worry about the pain of "router regret"...
>
>Problem is I've tried splitting coils and it has never worked worth a
>damn. It gives a weak, insipid sound, IMHO.
>
>Maybe i need a Roland VG 99.
>
>Neil wrote:
>> Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I think this is the best electric guitar I have ever owned.
>>
>> There, you just talked yourself out of it. All the more reason
>> not to mutilate something you feel so strongly about.
>>
>> I would do what Don suggested & get some coil-split
>> humbuckers... still not gonna be exactly a Strat sound, but
>> it'll get you an approximation of it & allow you to not
>> have to experience "router regret" later.
>>
>> Neil
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97490 is a reply to message #97488] Thu, 27 March 2008 16:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mark McDermott is currently offline  Mark McDermott   
Messages: 204
Registered: February 2006
Location: Portland, OR
Senior Member
Ever considered mounting a single coil adapter?

Here's one source: http://www.guitarpartsresource.com/covers_adapters.htm

I bought a brand spankin' new 1973 Strat when I was 12 and proceeded to mutilate
the body for many years trying various combos of humbuckers, etc. I actually
split the back of the body while chiseling (at 12, I didn't realize what
a bad idea it was) and had to glue and fill to get it back together. Strangely,
the only original part left on that guitar today IS the body. I eventually
installed the EMG David Gilmour pickup assembly and it is now one of the
best sounding strats I've ever heard.

Router bad, adapter good.

My $ .02!

Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>I do worry about the pain of "router regret"...
>
>Problem is I've tried splitting coils and it has never worked worth a
>damn. It gives a weak, insipid sound, IMHO.
>
>Maybe i need a Roland VG 99.
>
>Neil wrote:
>> Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I think this is the best electric guitar I have ever owned.
>>
>> There, you just talked yourself out of it. All the more reason
>> not to mutilate something you feel so strongly about.
>>
>> I would do what Don suggested & get some coil-split
>> humbuckers... still not gonna be exactly a Strat sound, but
>> it'll get you an approximation of it & allow you to not
>> have to experience "router regret" later.
>>
>> Neil
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97491 is a reply to message #97488] Thu, 27 March 2008 15:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jamie K is currently offline  Jamie K   UNITED STATES
Messages: 1115
Registered: July 2006
Senior Member
Bill L wrote:
> I do worry about the pain of "router regret"...
>
> Problem is I've tried splitting coils and it has never worked worth a
> damn. It gives a weak, insipid sound, IMHO.

You could wire 'em like a PRS for a useful range of tones that would
cover your gigs.


> Maybe i need a Roland VG 99.

You know you want it. :^) Let us know what you think when you get one!

Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com



> Neil wrote:
>> Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I think this is the best electric guitar I have ever owned.
>>
>> There, you just talked yourself out of it. All the more reason
>> not to mutilate something you feel so strongly about.
>>
>> I would do what Don suggested & get some coil-split
>> humbuckers... still not gonna be exactly a Strat sound, but
>> it'll get you an approximation of it & allow you to not
>> have to experience "router regret" later.
>>
>> Neil
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97494 is a reply to message #97491] Thu, 27 March 2008 18:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Gantt Kushner is currently offline  Gantt Kushner   
Messages: 545
Registered: June 2006
Location: Silver Spring, Maryland, ...
Senior Member

I have a PRS for which I came up with a trick circuit for pickups with all
four conductors available - mine are made by Tom Holmes. I have a regular
3 position PU selector and a 4 pole/double throw mini switch. W/ the mini
switch in one position I have a normal 2 humbucking guitar. Flip the switch
and the treble position becomes the outside coils in series, the bass position
becomes the inside coils in parallel (PRS calls this "Parallel Strat") and
the middle position combines those two hybrid pickups. The series outside
sound is my all time favorite - it has the power of a humbucking PU w/ the
bright, round sound of both pickups. If you're interested I'll find my scan
of the schematic and post it. I'd probably suggest having an experienced
guitar tech do the wiring because it can be a pain getting the wires straight
so it works as I described.

Gantt

Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:

>You could wire 'em like a PRS for a useful range of tones that would
>cover your gigs.

>Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.com


Gantt Kushner
Gizmo Recording Company
Silver Spring, MD
www.gizmorecording.com
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97495 is a reply to message #97484] Thu, 27 March 2008 17:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Aaron Allen is currently offline  Aaron Allen   UNITED STATES
Messages: 1988
Registered: May 2008
Senior Member
why wouldn't you just phase tap your existing pickups in the Iby? If you
replace the volume pot with a push/pull you can tap 'em on demand and not
drill up your gtr... 100% reversible customization.

AA


"Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message news:47ebe8ac$1@linux...
>I have a sweet cherry Ibanez Artist "335 style" semi hollow electric. I
>think this is the best electric guitar I have ever owned. But when I play
>R&B/funk gigs I really have to use my (also sweet) custom strat. It's no
>hardship, but I would always prefer to play the Ibanez if possible.
>
> So I got this crazy idea about sticking a single coil in between the
> humbuckers. Anyone tried this? I've certainly played guitars with this
> config and from my experience, while it will not replace a Strat, it is
> useful for getting some lighter tones.
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97496 is a reply to message #97488] Thu, 27 March 2008 17:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Aaron Allen is currently offline  Aaron Allen   UNITED STATES
Messages: 1988
Registered: May 2008
Senior Member
You might be able to get the strat thing by installing a phase wire switch
(again, use a push/pull pot here) and then blend the 2 pickups together,
asssuming they each have a volume knob. If not, you could rewire/tap/switch
in some manor, or if you're really feeling industrious you could even
buy/build some electronic circuits to do what you need, on demand. I'm not
sure I'm being clear enough due to text limitations, let me know if that's
the case.

AA


"Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message news:47ec0ae2@linux...
>I do worry about the pain of "router regret"...
>
> Problem is I've tried splitting coils and it has never worked worth a
> damn. It gives a weak, insipid sound, IMHO.
>
> Maybe i need a Roland VG 99.
>
> Neil wrote:
>> Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I think this is the best electric guitar I have ever owned.
>>
>> There, you just talked yourself out of it. All the more reason
>> not to mutilate something you feel so strongly about.
>>
>> I would do what Don suggested & get some coil-split
>> humbuckers... still not gonna be exactly a Strat sound, but
>> it'll get you an approximation of it & allow you to not
>> have to experience "router regret" later.
>>
>> Neil
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97499 is a reply to message #97496] Thu, 27 March 2008 19:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Neil is currently offline  Neil
Messages: 1645
Registered: April 2006
Senior Member
Or, just buy one of these...

http://www.guitarcenter.com/Gibson-Custom-Shop-Alvin-Lee--Bi g-Red--ES-335-Electric-Guitar-517310-i1149282.gc

LOL! Strat p'up built right in, baby! :D

Neil



"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>You might be able to get the strat thing by installing a phase wire switch

>(again, use a push/pull pot here) and then blend the 2 pickups together,

>asssuming they each have a volume knob. If not, you could rewire/tap/switch

>in some manor, or if you're really feeling industrious you could even
>buy/build some electronic circuits to do what you need, on demand. I'm not

>sure I'm being clear enough due to text limitations, let me know if that's

>the case.
>
>AA
>
>
>"Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message news:47ec0ae2@linux...
>>I do worry about the pain of "router regret"...
>>
>> Problem is I've tried splitting coils and it has never worked worth a

>> damn. It gives a weak, insipid sound, IMHO.
>>
>> Maybe i need a Roland VG 99.
>>
>> Neil wrote:
>>> Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I think this is the best electric guitar I have ever owned.
>>>
>>> There, you just talked yourself out of it. All the more reason
>>> not to mutilate something you feel so strongly about.
>>>
>>> I would do what Don suggested & get some coil-split
>>> humbuckers... still not gonna be exactly a Strat sound, but
>>> it'll get you an approximation of it & allow you to not
>>> have to experience "router regret" later.
>>>
>>> Neil
>
>
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97504 is a reply to message #97494] Thu, 27 March 2008 22:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jamie K is currently offline  Jamie K   UNITED STATES
Messages: 1115
Registered: July 2006
Senior Member
Heck yeah Gantt, post your pickup schematic!

Thanks,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com


Gantt Kushner wrote:
> I have a PRS for which I came up with a trick circuit for pickups with all
> four conductors available - mine are made by Tom Holmes. I have a regular
> 3 position PU selector and a 4 pole/double throw mini switch. W/ the mini
> switch in one position I have a normal 2 humbucking guitar. Flip the switch
> and the treble position becomes the outside coils in series, the bass position
> becomes the inside coils in parallel (PRS calls this "Parallel Strat") and
> the middle position combines those two hybrid pickups. The series outside
> sound is my all time favorite - it has the power of a humbucking PU w/ the
> bright, round sound of both pickups. If you're interested I'll find my scan
> of the schematic and post it. I'd probably suggest having an experienced
> guitar tech do the wiring because it can be a pain getting the wires straight
> so it works as I described.
>
> Gantt
>
> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>
>> You could wire 'em like a PRS for a useful range of tones that would
>> cover your gigs.
>
>> Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97515 is a reply to message #97484] Fri, 28 March 2008 09:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
TCB is currently offline  TCB
Messages: 1261
Registered: July 2007
Senior Member
Carry two guitars, Bill. I always do. It's easy to switch between songs for
the right sound and as a bonus you'll have backup if you break a string.
I carry two guitars and two small amps to every gig for just this reason,
I'd have to have more than one amp and one guitar blow up for there to be
a problem. My back is a little more sore but I don't worry about hardware
failures.

Interestingly I only carry one computer go a gig. Guess that shows what I'm
confident I can keep running, eh?

TCB

Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>I have a sweet cherry Ibanez Artist "335 style" semi hollow electric. I

>think this is the best electric guitar I have ever owned. But when I
>play R&B/funk gigs I really have to use my (also sweet) custom strat.
>It's no hardship, but I would always prefer to play the Ibanez if possible.
>
>So I got this crazy idea about sticking a single coil in between the
>humbuckers. Anyone tried this? I've certainly played guitars with this
>config and from my experience, while it will not replace a Strat, it is

>useful for getting some lighter tones.
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97528 is a reply to message #97491] Fri, 28 March 2008 13:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bill L is currently offline  Bill L   UNITED STATES
Messages: 766
Registered: August 2006
Senior Member
How does the PRS wiring work?

Jamie K wrote:
> Bill L wrote:
>> I do worry about the pain of "router regret"...
>>
>> Problem is I've tried splitting coils and it has never worked worth a
>> damn. It gives a weak, insipid sound, IMHO.
>
> You could wire 'em like a PRS for a useful range of tones that would
> cover your gigs.
>
>
>> Maybe i need a Roland VG 99.
>
> You know you want it. :^) Let us know what you think when you get one!
>
> Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
>
>
>> Neil wrote:
>>> Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I think this is the best electric guitar I have ever owned.
>>>
>>> There, you just talked yourself out of it. All the more reason
>>> not to mutilate something you feel so strongly about.
>>>
>>> I would do what Don suggested & get some coil-split
>>> humbuckers... still not gonna be exactly a Strat sound, but
>>> it'll get you an approximation of it & allow you to not
>>> have to experience "router regret" later.
>>>
>>> Neil
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97529 is a reply to message #97494] Fri, 28 March 2008 13:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bill L is currently offline  Bill L   UNITED STATES
Messages: 766
Registered: August 2006
Senior Member
I'm very interested. Do you know if the PRS pickups have any unique
characteristics that make this system work?

Gantt Kushner wrote:
> I have a PRS for which I came up with a trick circuit for pickups with all
> four conductors available - mine are made by Tom Holmes. I have a regular
> 3 position PU selector and a 4 pole/double throw mini switch. W/ the mini
> switch in one position I have a normal 2 humbucking guitar. Flip the switch
> and the treble position becomes the outside coils in series, the bass position
> becomes the inside coils in parallel (PRS calls this "Parallel Strat") and
> the middle position combines those two hybrid pickups. The series outside
> sound is my all time favorite - it has the power of a humbucking PU w/ the
> bright, round sound of both pickups. If you're interested I'll find my scan
> of the schematic and post it. I'd probably suggest having an experienced
> guitar tech do the wiring because it can be a pain getting the wires straight
> so it works as I described.
>
> Gantt
>
> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>
>> You could wire 'em like a PRS for a useful range of tones that would
>> cover your gigs.
>
>> Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97531 is a reply to message #97495] Fri, 28 March 2008 13:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bill L is currently offline  Bill L   UNITED STATES
Messages: 766
Registered: August 2006
Senior Member
Is there a way I could do that? Or do I need a tech to open them up?

Aaron Allen wrote:
> why wouldn't you just phase tap your existing pickups in the Iby? If you
> replace the volume pot with a push/pull you can tap 'em on demand and not
> drill up your gtr... 100% reversible customization.
>
> AA
>
>
> "Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message news:47ebe8ac$1@linux...
>> I have a sweet cherry Ibanez Artist "335 style" semi hollow electric. I
>> think this is the best electric guitar I have ever owned. But when I play
>> R&B/funk gigs I really have to use my (also sweet) custom strat. It's no
>> hardship, but I would always prefer to play the Ibanez if possible.
>>
>> So I got this crazy idea about sticking a single coil in between the
>> humbuckers. Anyone tried this? I've certainly played guitars with this
>> config and from my experience, while it will not replace a Strat, it is
>> useful for getting some lighter tones.
>
>
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97533 is a reply to message #97529] Fri, 28 March 2008 15:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
TCB is currently offline  TCB
Messages: 1261
Registered: July 2007
Senior Member
It's still going to sound like a split coil humbucker on a carved top solid
maple/mahogany body with a shorter scale set neck, which is closer to a strat
but it's still not a strat. I like technology as much as the next guy but
either you use it like Leo made it or you don't get the sound. You can get
closer, but if you put a big fat 'bucker on the neck pickup of your Tele
will it sound like a Les Paul?

It might be good enough for government work but there's a lot more to making
a strat sound like a strat than the pickup wiring.

TCB

Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>I'm very interested. Do you know if the PRS pickups have any unique
>characteristics that make this system work?
>
>Gantt Kushner wrote:
>> I have a PRS for which I came up with a trick circuit for pickups with
all
>> four conductors available - mine are made by Tom Holmes. I have a regular
>> 3 position PU selector and a 4 pole/double throw mini switch. W/ the
mini
>> switch in one position I have a normal 2 humbucking guitar. Flip the
switch
>> and the treble position becomes the outside coils in series, the bass
position
>> becomes the inside coils in parallel (PRS calls this "Parallel Strat")
and
>> the middle position combines those two hybrid pickups. The series outside
>> sound is my all time favorite - it has the power of a humbucking PU w/
the
>> bright, round sound of both pickups. If you're interested I'll find my
scan
>> of the schematic and post it. I'd probably suggest having an experienced
>> guitar tech do the wiring because it can be a pain getting the wires straight
>> so it works as I described.
>>
>> Gantt
>>
>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>
>>> You could wire 'em like a PRS for a useful range of tones that would

>>> cover your gigs.
>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> -Jamie
>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97536 is a reply to message #97528] Fri, 28 March 2008 15:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jamie K is currently offline  Jamie K   UNITED STATES
Messages: 1115
Registered: July 2006
Senior Member
Bill L wrote:
> How does the PRS wiring work?

Googling...

http://www.stewmac.com/freeinfo/Electronics/Wiring_diagrams/ i-0207.html

Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com



> Jamie K wrote:
>> Bill L wrote:
>>> I do worry about the pain of "router regret"...
>>>
>>> Problem is I've tried splitting coils and it has never worked worth a
>>> damn. It gives a weak, insipid sound, IMHO.
>>
>> You could wire 'em like a PRS for a useful range of tones that would
>> cover your gigs.
>>
>>
>>> Maybe i need a Roland VG 99.
>>
>> You know you want it. :^) Let us know what you think when you get one!
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
>>
>>
>>> Neil wrote:
>>>> Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I think this is the best electric guitar I have ever owned.
>>>>
>>>> There, you just talked yourself out of it. All the more reason
>>>> not to mutilate something you feel so strongly about.
>>>>
>>>> I would do what Don suggested & get some coil-split
>>>> humbuckers... still not gonna be exactly a Strat sound, but
>>>> it'll get you an approximation of it & allow you to not
>>>> have to experience "router regret" later.
>>>>
>>>> Neil
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97537 is a reply to message #97533] Fri, 28 March 2008 15:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bill L is currently offline  Bill L   UNITED STATES
Messages: 766
Registered: August 2006
Senior Member
Thad, I couldn't agree more with your points, but in the real world I
just don't want to bring 2 guitars AND i want to comp with a lighter
sound, and then have my big fat neck position tone for soloing. Plus the
335 plays so nice and comfortably nothing else compares. I'm looking for
some kind of compromise.

I was looking at some EMGs that "are both single coil and dual coil
pickups".

http://www.emginc.com/displayproducts.asp?section=Guitar& ;categoryid=6&catalogid=6

I wonder how they work? I would think active electronics would be a good
way to accomplish a dual sound, if there is a way at all. I use EMGs on
my strat and I'm satisfied with them.

TCB wrote:
> It's still going to sound like a split coil humbucker on a carved top solid
> maple/mahogany body with a shorter scale set neck, which is closer to a strat
> but it's still not a strat. I like technology as much as the next guy but
> either you use it like Leo made it or you don't get the sound. You can get
> closer, but if you put a big fat 'bucker on the neck pickup of your Tele
> will it sound like a Les Paul?
>
> It might be good enough for government work but there's a lot more to making
> a strat sound like a strat than the pickup wiring.
>
> TCB
>
> Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>> I'm very interested. Do you know if the PRS pickups have any unique
>> characteristics that make this system work?
>>
>> Gantt Kushner wrote:
>>> I have a PRS for which I came up with a trick circuit for pickups with
> all
>>> four conductors available - mine are made by Tom Holmes. I have a regular
>>> 3 position PU selector and a 4 pole/double throw mini switch. W/ the
> mini
>>> switch in one position I have a normal 2 humbucking guitar. Flip the
> switch
>>> and the treble position becomes the outside coils in series, the bass
> position
>>> becomes the inside coils in parallel (PRS calls this "Parallel Strat")
> and
>>> the middle position combines those two hybrid pickups. The series outside
>>> sound is my all time favorite - it has the power of a humbucking PU w/
> the
>>> bright, round sound of both pickups. If you're interested I'll find my
> scan
>>> of the schematic and post it. I'd probably suggest having an experienced
>>> guitar tech do the wiring because it can be a pain getting the wires straight
>>> so it works as I described.
>>>
>>> Gantt
>>>
>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> You could wire 'em like a PRS for a useful range of tones that would
>
>>>> cover your gigs.
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> -Jamie
>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97539 is a reply to message #97533] Fri, 28 March 2008 17:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Gantt Kushner is currently offline  Gantt Kushner   
Messages: 545
Registered: June 2006
Location: Silver Spring, Maryland, ...
Senior Member

My circuit doesn't use any single coil split. It has a couple of humbucking
combinations of coils that standard 2 PU wiring doesn't get.

Gantt

"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>
>It's still going to sound like a split coil humbucker on a carved top solid
>maple/mahogany body with a shorter scale set neck, which is closer to a
strat
>but it's still not a strat. I like technology as much as the next guy but
>either you use it like Leo made it or you don't get the sound. You can get
>closer, but if you put a big fat 'bucker on the neck pickup of your Tele
>will it sound like a Les Paul?
>
>It might be good enough for government work but there's a lot more to making
>a strat sound like a strat than the pickup wiring.
>
>TCB
>
>Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>I'm very interested. Do you know if the PRS pickups have any unique
>>characteristics that make this system work?
>>
>>Gantt Kushner wrote:
>>> I have a PRS for which I came up with a trick circuit for pickups with
>all
>>> four conductors available - mine are made by Tom Holmes. I have a regular
>>> 3 position PU selector and a 4 pole/double throw mini switch. W/ the
>mini
>>> switch in one position I have a normal 2 humbucking guitar. Flip the
>switch
>>> and the treble position becomes the outside coils in series, the bass
>position
>>> becomes the inside coils in parallel (PRS calls this "Parallel Strat")
>and
>>> the middle position combines those two hybrid pickups. The series outside
>>> sound is my all time favorite - it has the power of a humbucking PU w/
>the
>>> bright, round sound of both pickups. If you're interested I'll find
my
>scan
>>> of the schematic and post it. I'd probably suggest having an experienced
>>> guitar tech do the wiring because it can be a pain getting the wires
straight
>>> so it works as I described.
>>>
>>> Gantt
>>>
>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> You could wire 'em like a PRS for a useful range of tones that would
>
>>>> cover your gigs.
>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> -Jamie
>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>
>


Gantt Kushner
Gizmo Recording Company
Silver Spring, MD
www.gizmorecording.com
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97540 is a reply to message #97504] Fri, 28 March 2008 18:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Gantt Kushner is currently offline  Gantt Kushner   
Messages: 545
Registered: June 2006
Location: Silver Spring, Maryland, ...
Senior Member

It's too big to attach. Here's a link:

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj139/ganttmann/GanttsGui tar1.jpg

I hope this works!

Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>
>Heck yeah Gantt, post your pickup schematic!
>
>Thanks,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
>
>Gantt Kushner wrote:
>> I have a PRS for which I came up with a trick circuit for pickups with
all
>> four conductors available - mine are made by Tom Holmes. I have a regular
>> 3 position PU selector and a 4 pole/double throw mini switch. W/ the
mini
>> switch in one position I have a normal 2 humbucking guitar. Flip the
switch
>> and the treble position becomes the outside coils in series, the bass
position
>> becomes the inside coils in parallel (PRS calls this "Parallel Strat")
and
>> the middle position combines those two hybrid pickups. The series outside
>> sound is my all time favorite - it has the power of a humbucking PU w/
the
>> bright, round sound of both pickups. If you're interested I'll find my
scan
>> of the schematic and post it. I'd probably suggest having an experienced
>> guitar tech do the wiring because it can be a pain getting the wires straight
>> so it works as I described.
>>
>> Gantt
>>
>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>
>>> You could wire 'em like a PRS for a useful range of tones that would

>>> cover your gigs.
>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> -Jamie
>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>


Gantt Kushner
Gizmo Recording Company
Silver Spring, MD
www.gizmorecording.com
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97543 is a reply to message #97531] Fri, 28 March 2008 17:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Aaron Allen is currently offline  Aaron Allen   UNITED STATES
Messages: 1988
Registered: May 2008
Senior Member
depends on the pickup and how it's built but yes you can do that. Most the
double coil types fall under the following catagories that I've seen:
Wax wrapped with tape.
Potted
Encased in a metal closure

If you can open it w/o destroying the pickup, your chances are pretty good
IMO. Most the time a humbucker is nothing more than 2 single coils mounted
either side by side or on top of each other. All you need to do to tap them
is put a on/off switch on the wire from coil to coil that shunts to ground.
Typically, I've seen manu's use a post on the plate of the pickup to join
the 2 coils. Just tap a solder point to the switch/ground mech and you're
there.

AA


"Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message news:47ed5720$1@linux...
> Is there a way I could do that? Or do I need a tech to open them up?
>
> Aaron Allen wrote:
>> why wouldn't you just phase tap your existing pickups in the Iby? If you
>> replace the volume pot with a push/pull you can tap 'em on demand and not
>> drill up your gtr... 100% reversible customization.
>>
>> AA
>>
>>
>> "Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message
>> news:47ebe8ac$1@linux...
>>> I have a sweet cherry Ibanez Artist "335 style" semi hollow electric. I
>>> think this is the best electric guitar I have ever owned. But when I
>>> play R&B/funk gigs I really have to use my (also sweet) custom strat.
>>> It's no hardship, but I would always prefer to play the Ibanez if
>>> possible.
>>>
>>> So I got this crazy idea about sticking a single coil in between the
>>> humbuckers. Anyone tried this? I've certainly played guitars with this
>>> config and from my experience, while it will not replace a Strat, it is
>>> useful for getting some lighter tones.
>>
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97552 is a reply to message #97540] Sat, 29 March 2008 06:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bill L is currently offline  Bill L   UNITED STATES
Messages: 766
Registered: August 2006
Senior Member
Thanks, Gantt.

It's been years since played a PRS .I will go into a store and play one
to get an idea of what the extra sounds are like.

Gantt Kushner wrote:
> It's too big to attach. Here's a link:
>
> http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj139/ganttmann/GanttsGui tar1.jpg
>
> I hope this works!
>
> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>> Heck yeah Gantt, post your pickup schematic!
>>
>> Thanks,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
>>
>> Gantt Kushner wrote:
>>> I have a PRS for which I came up with a trick circuit for pickups with
> all
>>> four conductors available - mine are made by Tom Holmes. I have a regular
>>> 3 position PU selector and a 4 pole/double throw mini switch. W/ the
> mini
>>> switch in one position I have a normal 2 humbucking guitar. Flip the
> switch
>>> and the treble position becomes the outside coils in series, the bass
> position
>>> becomes the inside coils in parallel (PRS calls this "Parallel Strat")
> and
>>> the middle position combines those two hybrid pickups. The series outside
>>> sound is my all time favorite - it has the power of a humbucking PU w/
> the
>>> bright, round sound of both pickups. If you're interested I'll find my
> scan
>>> of the schematic and post it. I'd probably suggest having an experienced
>>> guitar tech do the wiring because it can be a pain getting the wires straight
>>> so it works as I described.
>>>
>>> Gantt
>>>
>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> You could wire 'em like a PRS for a useful range of tones that would
>
>>>> cover your gigs.
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> -Jamie
>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97553 is a reply to message #97536] Sat, 29 March 2008 06:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bill L is currently offline  Bill L   UNITED STATES
Messages: 766
Registered: August 2006
Senior Member
Nice! Thanks!

Jamie K wrote:
> Bill L wrote:
>> How does the PRS wiring work?
>
> Googling...
>
> http://www.stewmac.com/freeinfo/Electronics/Wiring_diagrams/ i-0207.html
>
> Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
>
>
>> Jamie K wrote:
>>> Bill L wrote:
>>>> I do worry about the pain of "router regret"...
>>>>
>>>> Problem is I've tried splitting coils and it has never worked worth
>>>> a damn. It gives a weak, insipid sound, IMHO.
>>>
>>> You could wire 'em like a PRS for a useful range of tones that would
>>> cover your gigs.
>>>
>>>
>>>> Maybe i need a Roland VG 99.
>>>
>>> You know you want it. :^) Let us know what you think when you get one!
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> -Jamie
>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> Neil wrote:
>>>>> Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I think this is the best electric guitar I have ever owned.
>>>>>
>>>>> There, you just talked yourself out of it. All the more reason
>>>>> not to mutilate something you feel so strongly about.
>>>>>
>>>>> I would do what Don suggested & get some coil-split
>>>>> humbuckers... still not gonna be exactly a Strat sound, but
>>>>> it'll get you an approximation of it & allow you to not
>>>>> have to experience "router regret" later.
>>>>>
>>>>> Neil
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97554 is a reply to message #97494] Sat, 29 March 2008 06:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bill L is currently offline  Bill L   UNITED STATES
Messages: 766
Registered: August 2006
Senior Member
I just reread your original post and I have a couple more questions:

1. Do you have the 5 position rotary switch on your PRS, or are you
using a 3 position toggle?
2. Can you describe the sounds you get with this rig, and what the
advantages are over the regular PRS 5 position switching?

This looks like a pretty cool option, and I could do it without any
drilling or routing, just using the bridge pickup tone control hole for
the mini toggle. I never use that one anyway.

Gantt Kushner wrote:
> I have a PRS for which I came up with a trick circuit for pickups with all
> four conductors available - mine are made by Tom Holmes. I have a regular
> 3 position PU selector and a 4 pole/double throw mini switch. W/ the mini
> switch in one position I have a normal 2 humbucking guitar. Flip the switch
> and the treble position becomes the outside coils in series, the bass position
> becomes the inside coils in parallel (PRS calls this "Parallel Strat") and
> the middle position combines those two hybrid pickups. The series outside
> sound is my all time favorite - it has the power of a humbucking PU w/ the
> bright, round sound of both pickups. If you're interested I'll find my scan
> of the schematic and post it. I'd probably suggest having an experienced
> guitar tech do the wiring because it can be a pain getting the wires straight
> so it works as I described.
>
> Gantt
>
> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>
>> You could wire 'em like a PRS for a useful range of tones that would
>> cover your gigs.
>
>> Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97602 is a reply to message #97537] Sun, 30 March 2008 09:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
TCB is currently offline  TCB
Messages: 1261
Registered: July 2007
Senior Member
I'm also not a big fan of EMGs, but they do have some options for more strat-like
sounds.

I agree it's annoying to carry two guitars but I'm happy to deal with it
for the reasons I mentioned.

One of the reasons I'm such a luddite re: guitars is that I think Leo Fender
was a stone cold genius. How many other pieces of electric music technology
remain essentially unimproved after 50 years? The only thing about my '62
reissue strat that is different than the original is that I put super jumbo
fretwire on it and bent the trem bar. It has _slightly_ overwound_ pickups.
I remember Lindy Fralin once in an interview talking about overwinding and
he said something like, 'You don't want to do it too much, Leo got it pretty
much right the first time.'

Anywho, good luck, and I'd certainly do the split buckers over cutting a
hole in the top of the 335.

TCB

Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>Thad, I couldn't agree more with your points, but in the real world I
>just don't want to bring 2 guitars AND i want to comp with a lighter
>sound, and then have my big fat neck position tone for soloing. Plus the

>335 plays so nice and comfortably nothing else compares. I'm looking for

>some kind of compromise.
>
>I was looking at some EMGs that "are both single coil and dual coil
>pickups".
>
> http://www.emginc.com/displayproducts.asp?section=Guitar& ;categoryid=6&catalogid=6
>
>I wonder how they work? I would think active electronics would be a good

>way to accomplish a dual sound, if there is a way at all. I use EMGs on

>my strat and I'm satisfied with them.
>
>TCB wrote:
>> It's still going to sound like a split coil humbucker on a carved top
solid
>> maple/mahogany body with a shorter scale set neck, which is closer to
a strat
>> but it's still not a strat. I like technology as much as the next guy
but
>> either you use it like Leo made it or you don't get the sound. You can
get
>> closer, but if you put a big fat 'bucker on the neck pickup of your Tele
>> will it sound like a Les Paul?
>>
>> It might be good enough for government work but there's a lot more to
making
>> a strat sound like a strat than the pickup wiring.
>>
>> TCB
>>
>> Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>> I'm very interested. Do you know if the PRS pickups have any unique
>>> characteristics that make this system work?
>>>
>>> Gantt Kushner wrote:
>>>> I have a PRS for which I came up with a trick circuit for pickups with
>> all
>>>> four conductors available - mine are made by Tom Holmes. I have a regular
>>>> 3 position PU selector and a 4 pole/double throw mini switch. W/ the
>> mini
>>>> switch in one position I have a normal 2 humbucking guitar. Flip the
>> switch
>>>> and the treble position becomes the outside coils in series, the bass
>> position
>>>> becomes the inside coils in parallel (PRS calls this "Parallel Strat")
>> and
>>>> the middle position combines those two hybrid pickups. The series outside
>>>> sound is my all time favorite - it has the power of a humbucking PU
w/
>> the
>>>> bright, round sound of both pickups. If you're interested I'll find
my
>> scan
>>>> of the schematic and post it. I'd probably suggest having an experienced
>>>> guitar tech do the wiring because it can be a pain getting the wires
straight
>>>> so it works as I described.
>>>>
>>>> Gantt
>>>>
>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> You could wire 'em like a PRS for a useful range of tones that would
>>
>>>>> cover your gigs.
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97640 is a reply to message #97602] Sun, 30 March 2008 21:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bill L is currently offline  Bill L   UNITED STATES
Messages: 766
Registered: August 2006
Senior Member
Yeah, Les Paul was no slouch either!

I went and played a PRS today to get a feel for what their system does,
and it actually sounds pretty good. I think they use some pretty hot
pickups (this was one of their original style guitars), so the split
prolly works better than it would on a weaker pup. Anyway someone posted
a link to a store that sells the PRS wiring harness. That's the way I'm
going.

TCB wrote:
> I'm also not a big fan of EMGs, but they do have some options for more strat-like
> sounds.
>
> I agree it's annoying to carry two guitars but I'm happy to deal with it
> for the reasons I mentioned.
>
> One of the reasons I'm such a luddite re: guitars is that I think Leo Fender
> was a stone cold genius. How many other pieces of electric music technology
> remain essentially unimproved after 50 years? The only thing about my '62
> reissue strat that is different than the original is that I put super jumbo
> fretwire on it and bent the trem bar. It has _slightly_ overwound_ pickups.
> I remember Lindy Fralin once in an interview talking about overwinding and
> he said something like, 'You don't want to do it too much, Leo got it pretty
> much right the first time.'
>
> Anywho, good luck, and I'd certainly do the split buckers over cutting a
> hole in the top of the 335.
>
> TCB
>
> Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>> Thad, I couldn't agree more with your points, but in the real world I
>> just don't want to bring 2 guitars AND i want to comp with a lighter
>> sound, and then have my big fat neck position tone for soloing. Plus the
>
>> 335 plays so nice and comfortably nothing else compares. I'm looking for
>
>> some kind of compromise.
>>
>> I was looking at some EMGs that "are both single coil and dual coil
>> pickups".
>>
>> http://www.emginc.com/displayproducts.asp?section=Guitar& ;categoryid=6&catalogid=6
>>
>> I wonder how they work? I would think active electronics would be a good
>
>> way to accomplish a dual sound, if there is a way at all. I use EMGs on
>
>> my strat and I'm satisfied with them.
>>
>> TCB wrote:
>>> It's still going to sound like a split coil humbucker on a carved top
> solid
>>> maple/mahogany body with a shorter scale set neck, which is closer to
> a strat
>>> but it's still not a strat. I like technology as much as the next guy
> but
>>> either you use it like Leo made it or you don't get the sound. You can
> get
>>> closer, but if you put a big fat 'bucker on the neck pickup of your Tele
>>> will it sound like a Les Paul?
>>>
>>> It might be good enough for government work but there's a lot more to
> making
>>> a strat sound like a strat than the pickup wiring.
>>>
>>> TCB
>>>
>>> Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>>> I'm very interested. Do you know if the PRS pickups have any unique
>>>> characteristics that make this system work?
>>>>
>>>> Gantt Kushner wrote:
>>>>> I have a PRS for which I came up with a trick circuit for pickups with
>>> all
>>>>> four conductors available - mine are made by Tom Holmes. I have a regular
>>>>> 3 position PU selector and a 4 pole/double throw mini switch. W/ the
>>> mini
>>>>> switch in one position I have a normal 2 humbucking guitar. Flip the
>>> switch
>>>>> and the treble position becomes the outside coils in series, the bass
>>> position
>>>>> becomes the inside coils in parallel (PRS calls this "Parallel Strat")
>>> and
>>>>> the middle position combines those two hybrid pickups. The series outside
>>>>> sound is my all time favorite - it has the power of a humbucking PU
> w/
>>> the
>>>>> bright, round sound of both pickups. If you're interested I'll find
> my
>>> scan
>>>>> of the schematic and post it. I'd probably suggest having an experienced
>>>>> guitar tech do the wiring because it can be a pain getting the wires
> straight
>>>>> so it works as I described.
>>>>>
>>>>> Gantt
>>>>>
>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> You could wire 'em like a PRS for a useful range of tones that would
>>>>>> cover your gigs.
>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
Re: Talk me out of this? [message #97645 is a reply to message #97640] Sun, 30 March 2008 23:01 Go to previous message
Jamie K is currently offline  Jamie K   UNITED STATES
Messages: 1115
Registered: July 2006
Senior Member
Bill L wrote:
> Yeah, Les Paul was no slouch either!
>
> I went and played a PRS today to get a feel for what their system does,
> and it actually sounds pretty good. I think they use some pretty hot
> pickups (this was one of their original style guitars), so the split
> prolly works better than it would on a weaker pup. Anyway someone posted
> a link to a store that sells the PRS wiring harness. That's the way I'm
> going.

Glad you found it useful Bill, let us know how it works out on your axe.

Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com



> TCB wrote:
>> I'm also not a big fan of EMGs, but they do have some options for more
>> strat-like
>> sounds.
>> I agree it's annoying to carry two guitars but I'm happy to deal with it
>> for the reasons I mentioned.
>> One of the reasons I'm such a luddite re: guitars is that I think Leo
>> Fender
>> was a stone cold genius. How many other pieces of electric music
>> technology
>> remain essentially unimproved after 50 years? The only thing about my '62
>> reissue strat that is different than the original is that I put super
>> jumbo
>> fretwire on it and bent the trem bar. It has _slightly_ overwound_
>> pickups.
>> I remember Lindy Fralin once in an interview talking about overwinding
>> and
>> he said something like, 'You don't want to do it too much, Leo got it
>> pretty
>> much right the first time.'
>>
>> Anywho, good luck, and I'd certainly do the split buckers over cutting a
>> hole in the top of the 335.
>> TCB
>>
>> Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>> Thad, I couldn't agree more with your points, but in the real world I
>>> just don't want to bring 2 guitars AND i want to comp with a lighter
>>> sound, and then have my big fat neck position tone for soloing. Plus the
>>
>>> 335 plays so nice and comfortably nothing else compares. I'm looking for
>>
>>> some kind of compromise.
>>>
>>> I was looking at some EMGs that "are both single coil and dual coil
>>> pickups".
>>>
>>> http://www.emginc.com/displayproducts.asp?section=Guitar& ;categoryid=6&catalogid=6
>>>
>>>
>>> I wonder how they work? I would think active electronics would be a good
>>
>>> way to accomplish a dual sound, if there is a way at all. I use EMGs on
>>
>>> my strat and I'm satisfied with them.
>>>
>>> TCB wrote:
>>>> It's still going to sound like a split coil humbucker on a carved top
>> solid
>>>> maple/mahogany body with a shorter scale set neck, which is closer to
>> a strat
>>>> but it's still not a strat. I like technology as much as the next guy
>> but
>>>> either you use it like Leo made it or you don't get the sound. You can
>> get
>>>> closer, but if you put a big fat 'bucker on the neck pickup of your
>>>> Tele
>>>> will it sound like a Les Paul?
>>>>
>>>> It might be good enough for government work but there's a lot more to
>> making
>>>> a strat sound like a strat than the pickup wiring.
>>>> TCB
>>>>
>>>> Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>>>> I'm very interested. Do you know if the PRS pickups have any unique
>>>>> characteristics that make this system work?
>>>>>
>>>>> Gantt Kushner wrote:
>>>>>> I have a PRS for which I came up with a trick circuit for pickups
>>>>>> with
>>>> all
>>>>>> four conductors available - mine are made by Tom Holmes. I have a
>>>>>> regular
>>>>>> 3 position PU selector and a 4 pole/double throw mini switch. W/ the
>>>> mini
>>>>>> switch in one position I have a normal 2 humbucking guitar. Flip the
>>>> switch
>>>>>> and the treble position becomes the outside coils in series, the bass
>>>> position
>>>>>> becomes the inside coils in parallel (PRS calls this "Parallel
>>>>>> Strat")
>>>> and
>>>>>> the middle position combines those two hybrid pickups. The series
>>>>>> outside
>>>>>> sound is my all time favorite - it has the power of a humbucking PU
>> w/
>>>> the
>>>>>> bright, round sound of both pickups. If you're interested I'll find
>> my
>>>> scan
>>>>>> of the schematic and post it. I'd probably suggest having an
>>>>>> experienced
>>>>>> guitar tech do the wiring because it can be a pain getting the wires
>> straight
>>>>>> so it works as I described.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Gantt
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You could wire 'em like a PRS for a useful range of tones that would
>>>>>>> cover your gigs.
>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
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