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| Re: LOGIC PRO Drivers for PARIS Controllers? [message #105286 is a reply to message #105285] |
Wed, 05 May 2010 11:52   |
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The news as far as I understand it: Doug Wellington did investigations into the OSX side of PARIS years back and had some good initial progress. If I'm recalling our conversation correctly he told me that he'd ported the PSCL (part of the driver structure) to OSX with no problem; he also built a "black box" which went inline between the C16 and the EDS card and eavesdropped on the signals it was sending. As far as I know, no deal-breakers were found - it was just a question of Doug moving on to other projects (amongst them the building of some extremely cool looking TR808 clones).
Although this is unlikely to be a deal-breaker as well, it's good to bear in mind that there's a hardware issue that would need to be addressed by the end-user too. Macs with PARIS-compatible PCI slots haven't been in production for the better part of a decade, so to make this feasible you'd have to put the EDS cards in an expansion chassis (Magma, Virtuavia).
On the PC side there are positive indicators. Mike Audet has investigated the messages the C16 sends and says they're a form of MIDI with higher resolution (1024 steps instead of 127 perhaps?) and it's very feasible to turn them into MIDI controllers (ie usable by other apps) via revamped PARIS drivers. If a Mac OSX coder stepped up to the plate I'm certain Mike would be happy to share insights, he's very supportive of PARIS development.
What would be *really* cool (and I'm guessing possibly fairly practical) would be to take the schematics for Doug's "black box", build a "C16 > MIDI" translator into it and stick a "MIDI Out" port in the side of it. Such a box could be produced at low cost - it leverages insights already gained in the course of other research, and it doesn't need to be "pretty" since it's an "under the desk" box anyway. It might even have multiple Ethernet jacks to accommodate those with multiple C16s and EDS cards (and each C16's output being assignable to a discrete MIDI channel). That would allow the recycling of potentially hundreds of C16s back into use with other DAWs. And if it could be flash or sysex upgradable as more was discovered, it'd be bonus. That'd be so far out of my own skillset it's not even funny, but it'd be a interesting angle on the whole C16 thing - platform independent too.
"... being bitter is like swallowing poison and waiting for the other guy to die..." - anon
[Updated on: Wed, 05 May 2010 11:59] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: LOGIC PRO Drivers for PARIS Controllers? [message #105288 is a reply to message #105287] |
Wed, 05 May 2010 12:17 |
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A pass-through "black box" would eliminate the need for an EDS. You'd cable from the C16 to the box and then MIDI from there to a MIDI interface. No need to connect the Ethernet "thru" connector to an EDS if you didn't have one.
If you went the Ethernet way, you'd have to deal with how the messages got received in the target computer. That means drivers - and making them work with different OS and platforms.
On the other hand, if it's simply delivered in MIDI form from the git-go, you're done. It'd be 100% driverless and platform-independent. You get your MIDI messages done right, once, and then a million apps can read MIDI messages showing up at an input and translate it into whatever else you like. It's future-proofed at that point, it'd literally be valid until the day MIDI disappears. You'd never see, for example, a Mac user having to deal with their support being dropped (which I have no doubt would be an incredibly refreshing proposition for PARIS' long-suffering Mac users).
Doug did mention it wasn't quite as simple as that - not all the C16's messages are understood, and there'd definitely be lots of work to do. But it'd be a pretty cool angle to pursue.
"... being bitter is like swallowing poison and waiting for the other guy to die..." - anon
[Updated on: Wed, 05 May 2010 12:22] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: LOGIC PRO Drivers for PARIS Controllers? [message #105360 is a reply to message #105359] |
Sun, 20 June 2010 19:01 |
TC11
Messages: 32
Registered: March 2009
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You can certainly use pafwav to do what you need, converting to 24 bit..
I'm working the opposite way of you. I do all my tracking in logic, and mixing in Paris.
I've got the 2 systems synced via MTC so I can automate mixes, and in Logic I've set up an aggregate audio device consisiting of a motu 2408 mkii with a 424 pcie card, and an aes16e with a Lynx aurora 16 connected. Channels are sent to Paris from Logic at unity via the 3 adat banks on the 2408, into 3 Mec adat cards (in 2 mecs).. If I picked up another 2408mkii (which are dirt cheap on ebay) I could do 48 tracks to Paris via lightpipe if I wanted to get really crazy.
Maybe not the simplest way, but it works for me, and I think Paris' strenght is mixing and the sound it imparts, so that's what I want to exploit. This way I'm still using all my plugins and outboard in logic.
Now if I could just use a controller with Paris other than the C16, it would be almost perfect..
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| Re: LOGIC PRO Drivers for PARIS Controllers? [message #105361 is a reply to message #105359] |
Wed, 23 June 2010 14:40 |
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| Quote: | Anyways, my hope is to track in Paris and dump all the tracks into Logic Pro 9. Is there a quick way to dump these tracks into Logic Pro 9?
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Yes, there's a brand new and absoulutely *killer* option to pull that off nowadays. Thanks to the recent hard work of developer Michael Rooney, AATranslator (the $59 standard version will suffice) can now correctly import PARIS OMFs. This means they're finally usable for the purpose they were originally designed for. It's PC only, but it doesn't really need much for resources so I'm guessing you could probably run it in an emulator like Virtual PC instead of having to reboot into a Win OS through BootCamp etc.
After your tracking/overdubbing in PARIS, go to the "File" menu in PARIS and hit "export as OMF" (should only take a few seconds). Open AAT and have it translate the PARIS OMF into OpenTL which Logic should be able to import fine.
All tracks and regions from your PARIS session will now import perfectly, and properly labeled. You don't have to muck about with frame rates either - PARIS OMFs take their timing reference from the number of samples since song start, so all audio regions will land in the sample-accurate positions in which they were tracked without any need for reference to a frame rate (made perfect sense when I first discovered it did it this way - after all, what the heck should a "frame of film" have to do with sending a bunch of audio tracks between two DAWs?).
Better still - as you can see from their site you can use AAT to translate your OMFs to a ton of other formats as well, so you can now send your PARIS tracking sessions out already converted into Reaper, Cubase, Nuendo or a ton of other formats for the convenience of clients, collaborators, mixers or remixers. If you get in the habit of exporting all your PARIS sessions as OMF as soon as you're done, there's a peace-of-mind benefit too - the OMFs make great archival versions of the performances - you won't have to worry about getting completely hosed by PARIS hardware or software failure, or by a corrupted PPJ leaving you with a folder full of unsyncable PAF punch-ins.
There are a few minor quirks - you have to pay slightly closer attention to what you name things in PARIS. This is a PARIS issue, not an AAT bug - PARIS has no problem letting you name, say, an audio region or track with characters that it later chokes on while exporting an OMF (simple alphanumeric characters are fine - things like slashes and periods seem to give it problems). Also your fades or crossfades will have the right positions and lengths but their *type* will default to "linear" - for most situations a trivial irritant.
This app completely changed my PARIS workflow.
"... being bitter is like swallowing poison and waiting for the other guy to die..." - anon
[Updated on: Wed, 23 June 2010 14:50] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: LOGIC PRO Drivers for PARIS Controllers? [message #105419 is a reply to message #105418] |
Thu, 15 July 2010 16:00 |
TC11
Messages: 32
Registered: March 2009
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You should have no problem sending via lightpipe that way. The Motu 2408 MKII can do up to 24 channels of adat at a time, so the limitation for simultaneous tracks just depends on how many adat cards and mecs you have.
If you are doing multiple passes with a single card, you'll probably want to sync the two systems up via mtc..
That's a different can of worms, as you might need some specific hardware to get tight sync between the two. My experience is limited to the Unitor 8 with Logic (usb), and previously the Opcode studio64 XTC (mine was serial port) with Paris/WinXP synced to other systems (pro tools etc). (The opcode was great back in the day, as I think it also had an adat sync port on it that you could use with the mec adat cards..)
Trying to get tight sync with logic and Paris with standard midi interfaces (without a master mtc gen) is sometimes a crapshoot (which has more to do with logic I think..)
[Updated on: Thu, 15 July 2010 16:01] Report message to a moderator |
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