Home » The PARIS Forums » PARIS: Main » Moving to firewire interface: A/D D/A quality vs Paris; RME FF400, Saffire, MH 2882, etc
| Moving to firewire interface: A/D D/A quality vs Paris; RME FF400, Saffire, MH 2882, etc [message #88646] |
Wed, 01 August 2007 03:41  |
Dan B
Messages: 54
Registered: June 2005
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Member |
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Hi,
I'm pretty much decided that I'm after an RME Fireface 400 (with Cubase 4
or SX 3). This will be a supplement to my Paris rig, and I suspect I'll gradually
phase out Paris (sob). Lack of non-native inserts on subgroups and master
bus, lack of latency compensation, no support for 96 k, etc, is getting a
bit frustrating.
Anyone have any experience with the FF400? How does audio quality stand up
to Paris? I'm not too concerned about the pres as I've got a DAV BG2 and
an SPL Gold Mike (Mk 1). Most critical is A/D and D/A quality; also stability
(I'll be using it with a Dell XPS 2.0 ghz 2 gig ram laptop).
Any thoughts / experience on how the converters of the FF stack up against
Paris, Metric Halo 2882, or any of the Firewire interface competition - e.g.
Focusrite Saffire 26 (which seems to have a killer featureset, I'm just worried
about compromise on quality), Makie 400F, etc.
Many thanks,
Dan
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| Re: Moving to firewire interface: A/D D/A quality vs Paris; RME FF400,Saffire, MH 2882, etc [message #88659 is a reply to message #88646] |
Wed, 01 August 2007 09:26  |
Chris Ludwig
Messages: 868
Registered: May 2006
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Senior Member |
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HI Dan,
The lowest latency Firewire device with the most most robust and
supported drivers is the Fireface 400 or 800 series by far.
Sound quality of the AD/DA is excellent for the price range it is in.
As for features RME and MOTU have the most overall functional features.
The closest unit from MOTU that I think compares to the Fireface would
be the 896HD.
RME and MOTU are the only ones able to get stable lower latencies on the
majority of the machines. mainly because they are both proprietary
firewire protocols unlike the rest who all use a couple generic chip and
driver protocols and just slap their logo on it.
In general I think RME and Lynx have the best tech support and driver
development around.
As for overall sound quality on the lower end ones.
I think the these are the best of the bunch.
TC Konnekt 24d (IMHO best sounding of the cheaper ones)
Mackie Onyx 400f
Tascam FW1804
M-Audio FW410 (can be used with the Pro Tools LE M-Powered , Woopie)
M-Audio FW1814 (can be used with the Pro Tools LE M-Powered , Woopie)
They all some combination of hardware compatibility, driver issues,
programs support issues but of course so does Paris.
Chris
dan b wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I'm pretty much decided that I'm after an RME Fireface 400 (with Cubase 4
> or SX 3). This will be a supplement to my Paris rig, and I suspect I'll gradually
> phase out Paris (sob). Lack of non-native inserts on subgroups and master
> bus, lack of latency compensation, no support for 96 k, etc, is getting a
> bit frustrating.
>
> Anyone have any experience with the FF400? How does audio quality stand up
> to Paris? I'm not too concerned about the pres as I've got a DAV BG2 and
> an SPL Gold Mike (Mk 1). Most critical is A/D and D/A quality; also stability
> (I'll be using it with a Dell XPS 2.0 ghz 2 gig ram laptop).
>
> Any thoughts / experience on how the converters of the FF stack up against
> Paris, Metric Halo 2882, or any of the Firewire interface competition - e.g.
> Focusrite Saffire 26 (which seems to have a killer featureset, I'm just worried
> about compromise on quality), Makie 400F, etc.
>
> Many thanks,
> Dan
--
Chris Ludwig
ADK Pro Audio
(859) 635-5762
www.adkproaudio.com
chrisl@adkproaudio.com
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| Re: Moving to firewire interface: A/D D/A quality vs Paris; RME FF400, [message #88675 is a reply to message #88659] |
Thu, 02 August 2007 02:25 |
Dan B
Messages: 54
Registered: June 2005
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Member |
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Thanks Chris. Most helpful. I think it's going to be the FF400 then. I'll
be interested to see how the A/D D/A stacks up against the 24bit Paris 8
I/O cards. I guess I'm also going to spend some time scratching my head over
how best to combine, integrate and sync the two systems (adat sync, clocked
from the RME? lightpipe and spdif audio transfers, i guess)
Chris Ludwig <chrisl@adkproaudio.com> wrote:
>
>HI Dan,
>
>The lowest latency Firewire device with the most most robust and
>supported drivers is the Fireface 400 or 800 series by far.
>Sound quality of the AD/DA is excellent for the price range it is in.
>As for features RME and MOTU have the most overall functional features.
>The closest unit from MOTU that I think compares to the Fireface would
>be the 896HD.
>
>RME and MOTU are the only ones able to get stable lower latencies on the
>majority of the machines. mainly because they are both proprietary
>firewire protocols unlike the rest who all use a couple generic chip and
>driver protocols and just slap their logo on it.
>
>In general I think RME and Lynx have the best tech support and driver
>development around.
>
>As for overall sound quality on the lower end ones.
>I think the these are the best of the bunch.
>TC Konnekt 24d (IMHO best sounding of the cheaper ones)
>Mackie Onyx 400f
>Tascam FW1804
>M-Audio FW410 (can be used with the Pro Tools LE M-Powered , Woopie)
>M-Audio FW1814 (can be used with the Pro Tools LE M-Powered , Woopie)
>
>They all some combination of hardware compatibility, driver issues,
>programs support issues but of course so does Paris.
>
>
>Chris
>
>
>
>dan b wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I'm pretty much decided that I'm after an RME Fireface 400 (with Cubase
4
>> or SX 3). This will be a supplement to my Paris rig, and I suspect I'll
gradually
>> phase out Paris (sob). Lack of non-native inserts on subgroups and master
>> bus, lack of latency compensation, no support for 96 k, etc, is getting
a
>> bit frustrating.
>>
>> Anyone have any experience with the FF400? How does audio quality stand
up
>> to Paris? I'm not too concerned about the pres as I've got a DAV BG2 and
>> an SPL Gold Mike (Mk 1). Most critical is A/D and D/A quality; also stability
>> (I'll be using it with a Dell XPS 2.0 ghz 2 gig ram laptop).
>>
>> Any thoughts / experience on how the converters of the FF stack up against
>> Paris, Metric Halo 2882, or any of the Firewire interface competition
- e.g.
>> Focusrite Saffire 26 (which seems to have a killer featureset, I'm just
worried
>> about compromise on quality), Makie 400F, etc.
>>
>> Many thanks,
>> Dan
>
>--
>Chris Ludwig
>
>ADK Pro Audio
>(859) 635-5762
>www.adkproaudio.com
>chrisl@adkproaudio.com
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| Re: Moving to firewire interface: A/D D/A quality vs Paris; RME FF400, Saffire, MH 2882, etc [message #88676 is a reply to message #88659] |
Thu, 02 August 2007 08:35 |
DJ
Messages: 1124
Registered: July 2005
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Senior Member |
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Chris,
Have you had a chance to try the new Prismsound FW interface? Surely you got
a couple of those just laying around gathering dust, right?
;o)
"Chris Ludwig" <chrisl@adkproaudio.com> wrote in message
news:46b0b621$1@linux...
>
> HI Dan,
>
> The lowest latency Firewire device with the most most robust and supported
> drivers is the Fireface 400 or 800 series by far.
> Sound quality of the AD/DA is excellent for the price range it is in.
> As for features RME and MOTU have the most overall functional features.
> The closest unit from MOTU that I think compares to the Fireface would be
> the 896HD.
>
> RME and MOTU are the only ones able to get stable lower latencies on the
> majority of the machines. mainly because they are both proprietary
> firewire protocols unlike the rest who all use a couple generic chip and
> driver protocols and just slap their logo on it.
>
> In general I think RME and Lynx have the best tech support and driver
> development around.
>
> As for overall sound quality on the lower end ones.
> I think the these are the best of the bunch.
> TC Konnekt 24d (IMHO best sounding of the cheaper ones)
> Mackie Onyx 400f
> Tascam FW1804
> M-Audio FW410 (can be used with the Pro Tools LE M-Powered , Woopie)
> M-Audio FW1814 (can be used with the Pro Tools LE M-Powered , Woopie)
>
> They all some combination of hardware compatibility, driver issues,
> programs support issues but of course so does Paris.
>
>
> Chris
>
>
>
> dan b wrote:
>> Hi, I'm pretty much decided that I'm after an RME Fireface 400 (with
>> Cubase 4
>> or SX 3). This will be a supplement to my Paris rig, and I suspect I'll
>> gradually
>> phase out Paris (sob). Lack of non-native inserts on subgroups and master
>> bus, lack of latency compensation, no support for 96 k, etc, is getting a
>> bit frustrating. Anyone have any experience with the FF400? How does
>> audio quality stand up
>> to Paris? I'm not too concerned about the pres as I've got a DAV BG2 and
>> an SPL Gold Mike (Mk 1). Most critical is A/D and D/A quality; also
>> stability
>> (I'll be using it with a Dell XPS 2.0 ghz 2 gig ram laptop). Any thoughts
>> / experience on how the converters of the FF stack up against
>> Paris, Metric Halo 2882, or any of the Firewire interface competition -
>> e.g.
>> Focusrite Saffire 26 (which seems to have a killer featureset, I'm just
>> worried
>> about compromise on quality), Makie 400F, etc. Many thanks, Dan
>
> --
> Chris Ludwig
>
> ADK Pro Audio
> (859) 635-5762
> www.adkproaudio.com
> chrisl@adkproaudio.com
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| Re: Moving to firewire interface: A/D D/A quality vs Paris; RME FF400,Saffire, MH 2882, etc [message #88677 is a reply to message #88676] |
Thu, 02 August 2007 09:45 |
Chris Ludwig
Messages: 868
Registered: May 2006
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Senior Member |
|
|
HI DJ,
Nope not yet.
Looks like its got some nice converters and such and the DSD function
look interesting.
Their excuse for using a generic firewire chip is lame but otherwise the
thing seems cool. I'd rather it had a AD/DA to use with other hardware
myself.
Chris
DJ wrote:
> Chris,
>
> Have you had a chance to try the new Prismsound FW interface? Surely you got
> a couple of those just laying around gathering dust, right?
>
> ;o)
>
>
> "Chris Ludwig" <chrisl@adkproaudio.com> wrote in message
> news:46b0b621$1@linux...
>> HI Dan,
>>
>> The lowest latency Firewire device with the most most robust and supported
>> drivers is the Fireface 400 or 800 series by far.
>> Sound quality of the AD/DA is excellent for the price range it is in.
>> As for features RME and MOTU have the most overall functional features.
>> The closest unit from MOTU that I think compares to the Fireface would be
>> the 896HD.
>>
>> RME and MOTU are the only ones able to get stable lower latencies on the
>> majority of the machines. mainly because they are both proprietary
>> firewire protocols unlike the rest who all use a couple generic chip and
>> driver protocols and just slap their logo on it.
>>
>> In general I think RME and Lynx have the best tech support and driver
>> development around.
>>
>> As for overall sound quality on the lower end ones.
>> I think the these are the best of the bunch.
>> TC Konnekt 24d (IMHO best sounding of the cheaper ones)
>> Mackie Onyx 400f
>> Tascam FW1804
>> M-Audio FW410 (can be used with the Pro Tools LE M-Powered , Woopie)
>> M-Audio FW1814 (can be used with the Pro Tools LE M-Powered , Woopie)
>>
>> They all some combination of hardware compatibility, driver issues,
>> programs support issues but of course so does Paris.
>>
>>
>> Chris
>>
>>
>>
>> dan b wrote:
>>> Hi, I'm pretty much decided that I'm after an RME Fireface 400 (with
>>> Cubase 4
>>> or SX 3). This will be a supplement to my Paris rig, and I suspect I'll
>>> gradually
>>> phase out Paris (sob). Lack of non-native inserts on subgroups and master
>>> bus, lack of latency compensation, no support for 96 k, etc, is getting a
>>> bit frustrating. Anyone have any experience with the FF400? How does
>>> audio quality stand up
>>> to Paris? I'm not too concerned about the pres as I've got a DAV BG2 and
>>> an SPL Gold Mike (Mk 1). Most critical is A/D and D/A quality; also
>>> stability
>>> (I'll be using it with a Dell XPS 2.0 ghz 2 gig ram laptop). Any thoughts
>>> / experience on how the converters of the FF stack up against
>>> Paris, Metric Halo 2882, or any of the Firewire interface competition -
>>> e.g.
>>> Focusrite Saffire 26 (which seems to have a killer featureset, I'm just
>>> worried
>>> about compromise on quality), Makie 400F, etc. Many thanks, Dan
>> --
>> Chris Ludwig
>>
>> ADK Pro Audio
>> (859) 635-5762
>> www.adkproaudio.com
>> chrisl@adkproaudio.com
>
>
--
Chris Ludwig
ADK Pro Audio
(859) 635-5762
www.adkproaudio.com
chrisl@adkproaudio.com
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| Re: Moving to firewire interface: A/D D/A quality vs Paris; RME FF400, [message #88755 is a reply to message #88677] |
Sun, 05 August 2007 22:08 |
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I agree with you about generic fiewire chipsets.
Most of your boutique hardware companies are not equiped to program great
fiewire drivers. that's why companies like apogee prism lynx all struggle
with adding firewire.. I'm told that writing good firewire drivers is very
complicated.
having said all of that, ilm not impreessed with the sound quality of RME
audio devices..they sound too stale and bland..the converter have no balls
.. But if you like converters with no color, than it cool..
MOtU: strange..But, we have found that motus interfaces really shinw whwn
using their daw DP..that same motu unit , in our case the 896HD sounds generic
and bland when used with other daws(logic,cubase)..Just like paris's I/o
sounded plain jane when used in other audio apps..
but I would say that motus audio hardware when married to their daw (digital)perfomer
sounds as good as anything on the market..I own DP(4) and would use it but
I that daw is too midi first for me.. but a very deep app for sure..
Chris Ludwig <chrisl@adkproaudio.com> wrote:
>HI DJ,
>
>
>Nope not yet.
>Looks like its got some nice converters and such and the DSD function
>look interesting.
>Their excuse for using a generic firewire chip is lame but otherwise the
>thing seems cool. I'd rather it had a AD/DA to use with other hardware
>myself.
>
>Chris
>
>
>DJ wrote:
>> Chris,
>>
>> Have you had a chance to try the new Prismsound FW interface? Surely you
got
>> a couple of those just laying around gathering dust, right?
>>
>> ;o)
>>
>>
>> "Chris Ludwig" <chrisl@adkproaudio.com> wrote in message
>> news:46b0b621$1@linux...
>>> HI Dan,
>>>
>>> The lowest latency Firewire device with the most most robust and supported
>>> drivers is the Fireface 400 or 800 series by far.
>>> Sound quality of the AD/DA is excellent for the price range it is in.
>>> As for features RME and MOTU have the most overall functional features.
>>> The closest unit from MOTU that I think compares to the Fireface would
be
>>> the 896HD.
>>>
>>> RME and MOTU are the only ones able to get stable lower latencies on
the
>>> majority of the machines. mainly because they are both proprietary
>>> firewire protocols unlike the rest who all use a couple generic chip
and
>>> driver protocols and just slap their logo on it.
>>>
>>> In general I think RME and Lynx have the best tech support and driver
>>> development around.
>>>
>>> As for overall sound quality on the lower end ones.
>>> I think the these are the best of the bunch.
>>> TC Konnekt 24d (IMHO best sounding of the cheaper ones)
>>> Mackie Onyx 400f
>>> Tascam FW1804
>>> M-Audio FW410 (can be used with the Pro Tools LE M-Powered , Woopie)
>>> M-Audio FW1814 (can be used with the Pro Tools LE M-Powered , Woopie)
>>>
>>> They all some combination of hardware compatibility, driver issues,
>>> programs support issues but of course so does Paris.
>>>
>>>
>>> Chris
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> dan b wrote:
>>>> Hi, I'm pretty much decided that I'm after an RME Fireface 400 (with
>>>> Cubase 4
>>>> or SX 3). This will be a supplement to my Paris rig, and I suspect I'll
>>>> gradually
>>>> phase out Paris (sob). Lack of non-native inserts on subgroups and master
>>>> bus, lack of latency compensation, no support for 96 k, etc, is getting
a
>>>> bit frustrating. Anyone have any experience with the FF400? How does
>>>> audio quality stand up
>>>> to Paris? I'm not too concerned about the pres as I've got a DAV BG2
and
>>>> an SPL Gold Mike (Mk 1). Most critical is A/D and D/A quality; also
>>>> stability
>>>> (I'll be using it with a Dell XPS 2.0 ghz 2 gig ram laptop). Any thoughts
>>>> / experience on how the converters of the FF stack up against
>>>> Paris, Metric Halo 2882, or any of the Firewire interface competition
-
>>>> e.g.
>>>> Focusrite Saffire 26 (which seems to have a killer featureset, I'm just
>>>> worried
>>>> about compromise on quality), Makie 400F, etc. Many thanks, Dan
>>> --
>>> Chris Ludwig
>>>
>>> ADK Pro Audio
>>> (859) 635-5762
>>> www.adkproaudio.com
>>> chrisl@adkproaudio.com
>>
>>
>
>--
>Chris Ludwig
>
>ADK Pro Audio
>(859) 635-5762
>www.adkproaudio.com
>chrisl@adkproaudio.com
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