Home » The PARIS Forums » PARIS: Main » My Vista Rant. :o)
| My Vista Rant. :o) [message #92550] |
Thu, 08 November 2007 20:20  |
Kim
Messages: 1246
Registered: October 2005
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Senior Member |
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I thought I would share with you some of the things I learned in my first
Windows Vista experience.
Firstly, the basic OS layout seems quite similar to XP and previous Windows
versions. Some things have been graphically shunted around, but conceptually
the menus appeared to be very similar in content. The "Start" button is now
just a ball with a Windows logo on it, but you know what it is from its location
at the bottom left. Other things have changed in a similar way. Clicking
on this "Start" button, which I presume may have a new name as the word "Start"
is now absent, brings up a menu which includes what I think is a fairly nifty
scrolling window, in which your "All Programs" menu appears. Hence "All Programs"
is always visable, and doesn't branch off across your main monitor like it
used to. It's another of the apparently many gui changes which appear to
have been designed fairly well in terms of improving functionality while
having a fairly easy learning curve. At this end the OS is nice it seems.
And then you use it. ;o)
Even if you haven't seen the Mac ads, I'm sure you have heard somebody talk
about...
"An unauthorised program is attempting yada yada - Allow / Decline"
Well, welcome to the future.
I wasn't surprised to get this program when installing software. I had been
warned, and although my mouse click on install was just a fraction of a second
before the Allow / Decline prompt, bringing forth questions as to how quickly
doubt can occur about such things, I accepted that you don't install software
all that often, and being very system critical it doesn't hurt to double
check.
It was a couple of minutes later when I became apparent that people weren't
kidding.
While I was dismayed when the USB stick, which I had just removed from an
XP machine which confirmed files onboard, showed up, but was reported as
empty. That was odd. Removing it, rechecking the files in XP, and then putting
it back, did, for whatever reason, cause Vista to display the files.
One of them was a ZIP file, and I needed to copy some stuff from the ZIP
file to an area where it would no longer be zipped. Initially it was about
1.5MB worth of stuff.
Select.
Copy.
Paste.
An unauthorised program is attempting to...
....huh?
Which program? Windows Vista itself? It seemed so. A simple file copy, admittedly
from a compressed archive, was sufficient to claim that authorisation was
required.
Allow.
Now copying 1.5 meg.
Estimated time remaining: 2 minutes 13 seconds.
Speed: 8.2KB/sec
1.5Meg will take over two minutes? We're getting 8.2KB on a 480,000KB bus?
Even USB 1 is 10,000KB. Nice.
And it didn't disappoint. It really did use the whole 2 minutes.
A later file copy of just over 4 meg achieved a speed of about 70KB/sec,
nearly 10 times faster, and only about 7,000 times slower than expected (literally).
It is, it seems, appropriate, for your own security, that you are inflicted
with constant, annoying, inconvenient checks and tests. It's for your safety.
Sorry sir. Do you have a bomb? You'll have to take your clothes off while
I put on this glove...
....it's for your own safety...
....because all of us...
....would prefer...
....a glove an hour...
....to a bomb that rarely occurs...
Welcome to Windows Fista. The future is more paranoid than ever. The bad
guys will never get us. They can't annoy us. No they can't.
Cheers,
Kim.
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| Re: My Vista Rant. :o) [message #92561 is a reply to message #92550] |
Thu, 08 November 2007 20:57  |
Dedric Terry
Messages: 788
Registered: June 2007
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Senior Member |
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On 11/8/07 9:20 PM, in article 4733d1e8$1@linux, "Kim"
<hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> While I was dismayed when the USB stick, which I had just removed from an
> XP machine which confirmed files onboard, showed up, but was reported as
> empty. That was odd. Removing it, rechecking the files in XP, and then putting
> it back, did, for whatever reason, cause Vista to display the files.
Your USB stick worked? Vista says it can't find drivers for any of mine -
I've tried three; also tried a Logitech webcam that has it's own drivers
that Vista can't find, even when I point directly to them. It randomly
shuts off my USB audio interface for some apps and either mutes it, uses it
for the system, but not apps, or vice versa, or somewhere in the middle....
you get the idea.... yep, when I have time, Vista's getting punted for
Ubuntu, or a Macbook.
> Welcome to Windows Fista. The future is more paranoid than ever. The bad
> guys will never get us. They can't annoy us. No they can't.
"...and we'll shut out the good guys, and pretty much anything you might do
on a computer too.... just in case...."
I turned all of the security crap off on my laptop, but apparently without
it, Vista is as blind as a bat at noon on Venus.
"Windows Vista - ensuring the future for OSX and Linux."
Dedric
>
> Cheers,
> Kim.
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| Re: My Vista Rant & Ubuntu comments [message #92563 is a reply to message #92561] |
Thu, 08 November 2007 23:12 |
Kim
Messages: 1246
Registered: October 2005
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Senior Member |
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>I turned all of the security crap off on my laptop, but apparently without
>it, Vista is as blind as a bat at noon on Venus.
So you can turn it off? Perhaps if they fix this feature the OS might be
usable. I assume driver issues will be fixed in time, as that clearly can't
go on, but this super security really is more than silly.
>"Windows Vista - ensuring the future for OSX and Linux."
Despite the Simpson's quote, this one actually isn't funny because it definitely
seems to be true.
I seriously find it close to unfathomable that they could release something
like this and think, it seems, that it will be successful. Why in the world
would you deliberately design an OS to annoy the daylights out of you? Have
the designers not used it? Have they not gone "Gee, this is annoying?". Are
they such uber geeks that they think the more buttons you are forced to push
the more fun it is?
I simply cannot fathom, no matter how I look at it, how a massive team of
computer experts have gone this way. We've all heard reports of M$ employees
disagreeing with much of Vista's design, so I presume that someone high up,
Bill among others, have forced this as the direction, but why?
I'm guessing that it is possible to make the OS tolerable by deactivating
hyper-security mode, assuming you have direct access to M$ support. Ignoring
the constant stabbing pain in my soul caused by the incessant issues and
prompts, the OS may be an improvement in some respects, but it sure has a
long way to go.
My home Paris box runs an XP partition and a Ubuntu partition now. I like
Ubuntu, though Linux still has some serious usability drawbacks if you push
technology at all. Even simple things like wireless security are very sketchy
if you expect a simple up and go GUI rather than 4 hours reading advice on
editing your configuration files in a text editor, which surprised the daylights
out of me. I spent hours trying to find info which I was confident would
allow me to get WPA working. It was clear that the job was large enough that
I shouldn't start unless I was confident it would work, and I was unable
to google a sufficiently confidence inducing explanation of the required
changes. I ended up back on WEP, wondering why it is that some smart programming
cookie hasn't gone "Ya know, I could almost make a gui for this quicker than
I can manually make the changes".
Still, such issues will be solved in time, and not that much time I imagine,
as high-annoyance issues on Ubuntu are actually not all that common. When
you hit one it can waste hours, but general workflow in the OS is pretty
smooth, and indeed I am surprised constantly by how much smoother than XP
in can be on occasion. Little things like plugging in a printer, camera,
or MP3 player, are almost always totally automated and you're up in seconds,
with all the functionality you do want, and none of the garbage you don't.
Aside from being highly configurable, the GUI can be totally replaced with
multiple options. I'm still coming to terms with the location of system files,
which I think is laid out in a very "geek" fashion and, quite frankly, probably
only makes any sense if you understand the internals of Unix/Linux, which
I have no desire to ever do.
I have a spare HDD partition with some 100+GB of space which might soon gain
the label "MacOS" when I get a spare weekend to google around for the Intel
version and check if it's going to sit OK with my hardware. And I'm quite
willing to pay for it. I wonder how they would go taking you to court because
you're running something you legally own on hardware they don't like. ;o)
We do appear suspiciously close to the end of an era in terms of Windows
popularity though. DRM is another thing of course, which apparently is going
to infiltrate all legally available OS's. I think we all know the Linux community
will fight this fairly hard, and it seems unlikely to me that you won't,
at least, be able to hack DRM from Linux with relative ease for a long time
to come.
If not, it's not impossible that the OS's of the next couple of years will
still be in use for decades, as the final OS's capable of "getting the job
done".
Cheers,
Kim.
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| Re: My Vista Rant & Ubuntu comments [message #92566 is a reply to message #92563] |
Fri, 09 November 2007 04:25 |
Erling
Messages: 156
Registered: October 2008
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Senior Member |
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I believe Vista have a long way to go when thinking of how many years
we have payed to be betatesters for all kind of commercial
software;-(.
By the way, after nearly a year in use, I see the Service Pack One are
on its way for Vista. After that, it's time to wait for Service Pack
Two etc., etc., etc.....;-)
....So, maybe I think I'm old enough to have learned to wait a year or
two before a new product is new for me...
....By the way, I buied Adobe Audition 3 today...
....and it's brand new today...
....I saw something written about it a month ago and wanted to own it
after owning each version from CoolEditPro...
....So where have my logic mind gone???...
....and I looked at this "new" homesite too yesterday:
http://www.intelligentdevices.com/
The only word I don't like to see here is the word "SOON"!!!!
It will be show to see how far away the word "soon" will be here;-)
erlilo
On 9 Nov 2007 17:12:56 +1000, "Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>I turned all of the security crap off on my laptop, but apparently without
>>it, Vista is as blind as a bat at noon on Venus.
>
>So you can turn it off? Perhaps if they fix this feature the OS might be
>usable. I assume driver issues will be fixed in time, as that clearly can't
>go on, but this super security really is more than silly.
>
>>"Windows Vista - ensuring the future for OSX and Linux."
>
>Despite the Simpson's quote, this one actually isn't funny because it definitely
>seems to be true.
>
>I seriously find it close to unfathomable that they could release something
>like this and think, it seems, that it will be successful. Why in the world
>would you deliberately design an OS to annoy the daylights out of you? Have
>the designers not used it? Have they not gone "Gee, this is annoying?". Are
>they such uber geeks that they think the more buttons you are forced to push
>the more fun it is?
>
>I simply cannot fathom, no matter how I look at it, how a massive team of
>computer experts have gone this way. We've all heard reports of M$ employees
>disagreeing with much of Vista's design, so I presume that someone high up,
>Bill among others, have forced this as the direction, but why?
>
>I'm guessing that it is possible to make the OS tolerable by deactivating
>hyper-security mode, assuming you have direct access to M$ support. Ignoring
>the constant stabbing pain in my soul caused by the incessant issues and
>prompts, the OS may be an improvement in some respects, but it sure has a
>long way to go.
>
>My home Paris box runs an XP partition and a Ubuntu partition now. I like
>Ubuntu, though Linux still has some serious usability drawbacks if you push
>technology at all. Even simple things like wireless security are very sketchy
>if you expect a simple up and go GUI rather than 4 hours reading advice on
>editing your configuration files in a text editor, which surprised the daylights
>out of me. I spent hours trying to find info which I was confident would
>allow me to get WPA working. It was clear that the job was large enough that
>I shouldn't start unless I was confident it would work, and I was unable
>to google a sufficiently confidence inducing explanation of the required
>changes. I ended up back on WEP, wondering why it is that some smart programming
>cookie hasn't gone "Ya know, I could almost make a gui for this quicker than
>I can manually make the changes".
>
>Still, such issues will be solved in time, and not that much time I imagine,
>as high-annoyance issues on Ubuntu are actually not all that common. When
>you hit one it can waste hours, but general workflow in the OS is pretty
>smooth, and indeed I am surprised constantly by how much smoother than XP
>in can be on occasion. Little things like plugging in a printer, camera,
>or MP3 player, are almost always totally automated and you're up in seconds,
>with all the functionality you do want, and none of the garbage you don't.
>Aside from being highly configurable, the GUI can be totally replaced with
>multiple options. I'm still coming to terms with the location of system files,
>which I think is laid out in a very "geek" fashion and, quite frankly, probably
>only makes any sense if you understand the internals of Unix/Linux, which
>I have no desire to ever do.
>
>I have a spare HDD partition with some 100+GB of space which might soon gain
>the label "MacOS" when I get a spare weekend to google around for the Intel
>version and check if it's going to sit OK with my hardware. And I'm quite
>willing to pay for it. I wonder how they would go taking you to court because
>you're running something you legally own on hardware they don't like. ;o)
>
>We do appear suspiciously close to the end of an era in terms of Windows
>popularity though. DRM is another thing of course, which apparently is going
>to infiltrate all legally available OS's. I think we all know the Linux community
>will fight this fairly hard, and it seems unlikely to me that you won't,
>at least, be able to hack DRM from Linux with relative ease for a long time
>to come.
>
>If not, it's not impossible that the OS's of the next couple of years will
>still be in use for decades, as the final OS's capable of "getting the job
>done".
>
>Cheers,
>Kim.
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| Re: My Vista Rant & Ubuntu comments [message #92567 is a reply to message #92563] |
Fri, 09 November 2007 08:00 |
TCB
Messages: 1261
Registered: July 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
The wireless issues are a function of the hardware manufacturers, not Ubuntu
or Debain (it's upstream, far geekier parent). If you want to do something
about it you should talk to the people who make your wireless card and tell
them to open their hardware enough so drivers can be written. Trust me, they
will be done within days.
Also, WEP/WAP is a joke. When my DSL line goes down I break into someone
else's 'secure' wireless network to check my email. It takes me five minutes
unless they are doing MAC address filtering, which actually does help a lot.
Pretty much all of the config files for Ubuntu (and nearly all *nix OSs)
are in /etc somewhere. Once you're used to using them you'll never miss a
confusing GUI config tool again, I promise.
Good luck, the Ubuntu forums are excellent and very newbie friendly. The
Debian community is more technical but full of cranky old geeks who mock
at you when you don't get their jokes written in hex.
TCB
"Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>I turned all of the security crap off on my laptop, but apparently without
>>it, Vista is as blind as a bat at noon on Venus.
>
>So you can turn it off? Perhaps if they fix this feature the OS might be
>usable. I assume driver issues will be fixed in time, as that clearly can't
>go on, but this super security really is more than silly.
>
>>"Windows Vista - ensuring the future for OSX and Linux."
>
>Despite the Simpson's quote, this one actually isn't funny because it definitely
>seems to be true.
>
>I seriously find it close to unfathomable that they could release something
>like this and think, it seems, that it will be successful. Why in the world
>would you deliberately design an OS to annoy the daylights out of you? Have
>the designers not used it? Have they not gone "Gee, this is annoying?".
Are
>they such uber geeks that they think the more buttons you are forced to
push
>the more fun it is?
>
>I simply cannot fathom, no matter how I look at it, how a massive team of
>computer experts have gone this way. We've all heard reports of M$ employees
>disagreeing with much of Vista's design, so I presume that someone high
up,
>Bill among others, have forced this as the direction, but why?
>
>I'm guessing that it is possible to make the OS tolerable by deactivating
>hyper-security mode, assuming you have direct access to M$ support. Ignoring
>the constant stabbing pain in my soul caused by the incessant issues and
>prompts, the OS may be an improvement in some respects, but it sure has
a
>long way to go.
>
>My home Paris box runs an XP partition and a Ubuntu partition now. I like
>Ubuntu, though Linux still has some serious usability drawbacks if you push
>technology at all. Even simple things like wireless security are very sketchy
>if you expect a simple up and go GUI rather than 4 hours reading advice
on
>editing your configuration files in a text editor, which surprised the daylights
>out of me. I spent hours trying to find info which I was confident would
>allow me to get WPA working. It was clear that the job was large enough
that
>I shouldn't start unless I was confident it would work, and I was unable
>to google a sufficiently confidence inducing explanation of the required
>changes. I ended up back on WEP, wondering why it is that some smart programming
>cookie hasn't gone "Ya know, I could almost make a gui for this quicker
than
>I can manually make the changes".
>
>Still, such issues will be solved in time, and not that much time I imagine,
>as high-annoyance issues on Ubuntu are actually not all that common. When
>you hit one it can waste hours, but general workflow in the OS is pretty
>smooth, and indeed I am surprised constantly by how much smoother than XP
>in can be on occasion. Little things like plugging in a printer, camera,
>or MP3 player, are almost always totally automated and you're up in seconds,
>with all the functionality you do want, and none of the garbage you don't.
>Aside from being highly configurable, the GUI can be totally replaced with
>multiple options. I'm still coming to terms with the location of system
files,
>which I think is laid out in a very "geek" fashion and, quite frankly, probably
>only makes any sense if you understand the internals of Unix/Linux, which
>I have no desire to ever do.
>
>I have a spare HDD partition with some 100+GB of space which might soon
gain
>the label "MacOS" when I get a spare weekend to google around for the Intel
>version and check if it's going to sit OK with my hardware. And I'm quite
>willing to pay for it. I wonder how they would go taking you to court because
>you're running something you legally own on hardware they don't like. ;o)
>
>We do appear suspiciously close to the end of an era in terms of Windows
>popularity though. DRM is another thing of course, which apparently is going
>to infiltrate all legally available OS's. I think we all know the Linux
community
>will fight this fairly hard, and it seems unlikely to me that you won't,
>at least, be able to hack DRM from Linux with relative ease for a long time
>to come.
>
>If not, it's not impossible that the OS's of the next couple of years will
>still be in use for decades, as the final OS's capable of "getting the job
>done".
>
>Cheers,
>Kim.
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| Re: My Vista Rant. :o) [message #92582 is a reply to message #92550] |
Fri, 09 November 2007 13:44 |
excelav
Messages: 2130
Registered: July 2005
Location: Metro Detroit
|
Senior Member |
|
|
"Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>I thought I would share with you some of the things I learned in my first
>Windows Vista experience.
>
>Firstly, the basic OS layout seems quite similar to XP and previous Windows
>versions. Some things have been graphically shunted around, but conceptually
>the menus appeared to be very similar in content. The "Start" button is
now
>just a ball with a Windows logo on it, but you know what it is from its
location
>at the bottom left. Other things have changed in a similar way. Clicking
>on this "Start" button, which I presume may have a new name as the word
"Start"
>is now absent, brings up a menu which includes what I think is a fairly
nifty
>scrolling window, in which your "All Programs" menu appears. Hence "All
Programs"
>is always visable, and doesn't branch off across your main monitor like
it
>used to. It's another of the apparently many gui changes which appear to
>have been designed fairly well in terms of improving functionality while
>having a fairly easy learning curve. At this end the OS is nice it seems.
>
>And then you use it. ;o)
>
>Even if you haven't seen the Mac ads, I'm sure you have heard somebody talk
>about...
>
>"An unauthorised program is attempting yada yada - Allow / Decline"
>
>Well, welcome to the future.
>
>I wasn't surprised to get this program when installing software. I had been
>warned, and although my mouse click on install was just a fraction of a
second
>before the Allow / Decline prompt, bringing forth questions as to how quickly
>doubt can occur about such things, I accepted that you don't install software
>all that often, and being very system critical it doesn't hurt to double
>check.
>
>It was a couple of minutes later when I became apparent that people weren't
>kidding.
>
>While I was dismayed when the USB stick, which I had just removed from an
>XP machine which confirmed files onboard, showed up, but was reported as
>empty. That was odd. Removing it, rechecking the files in XP, and then putting
>it back, did, for whatever reason, cause Vista to display the files.
>
>One of them was a ZIP file, and I needed to copy some stuff from the ZIP
>file to an area where it would no longer be zipped. Initially it was about
>1.5MB worth of stuff.
>
>Select.
>
>Copy.
>
>Paste.
>
>An unauthorised program is attempting to...
>
>...huh?
>
>Which program? Windows Vista itself? It seemed so. A simple file copy, admittedly
>from a compressed archive, was sufficient to claim that authorisation was
>required.
>
>Allow.
>
>Now copying 1.5 meg.
>Estimated time remaining: 2 minutes 13 seconds.
>Speed: 8.2KB/sec
>
>1.5Meg will take over two minutes? We're getting 8.2KB on a 480,000KB bus?
>Even USB 1 is 10,000KB. Nice.
>
>And it didn't disappoint. It really did use the whole 2 minutes.
>
>A later file copy of just over 4 meg achieved a speed of about 70KB/sec,
>nearly 10 times faster, and only about 7,000 times slower than expected
(literally).
>
>It is, it seems, appropriate, for your own security, that you are inflicted
>with constant, annoying, inconvenient checks and tests. It's for your safety.
>Sorry sir. Do you have a bomb? You'll have to take your clothes off while
>I put on this glove...
>
>...it's for your own safety...
>
>...because all of us...
>
>...would prefer...
>
>...a glove an hour...
>
>...to a bomb that rarely occurs...
>
>Welcome to Windows Fista. The future is more paranoid than ever. The bad
>guys will never get us. They can't annoy us. No they can't.
>
>Cheers,
>Kim.
LOL! What are those guys thinking in Redmond???
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