Home » The PARIS Forums » PARIS: Main » Anyone familiar with the Yammy P2201 or P2700 power amp?
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| Re: Anyone familiar with the Yammy P2201 or P2700 power amp? [message #71791 is a reply to message #71786] |
Sun, 27 August 2006 20:56   |
John Macy
Messages: 242
Registered: April 2006
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Senior Member |
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I run my NS10's on a 2201, and it makes a perfect mate for them. And there
are no fans on the 2201, nice, quiet and powerful. The 2200 had the meters
on the front, and I always heard that there was something in the meter circuit
that messed with the sound. The 2201 is the same amp sans meters...
Best amp I ever heard on them, and believe me, I tried a lot of them...
"Dubya Mark Wilson" <mark.xspam@avidrecording.com> wrote:
>Yes on the fans. Loud enough to be a problem in a CR.
>M
>
>"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote in message
>news:44f21ae0@linux...
>> One of my clients may be swapping me a pair of NS10m's and a power amp
for
>> some studio time. He's also got a Yamaha P2700 power amp and, I thnk a
>> P2201
>> as well.
>>
>> I've been out of the power amp loop for many years as I was using powered
>> monitors before I switched to NHT A-20's which have a proprietary power
>> amp.........sooo.........what's a good amp for NS10M's? I don't weant
to
>> underdrive these and since they are *rated* at 150, I firure I'm going
to
>> need 250 into 8ohms to get the goods out of them.
>>
>> I think both of these power amps will provide this, and then
>> some.......but
>> both the P2201 and P2700 have big fans IIRC. Are these especially loud?
I
>> guess I could power this from the machine room, but it would be much more
>> convenient if it was close by. I'll probably need to run it from another
>> circuit in the house somewhere too (PITA......can you say HUMMMM) since
>> the
>> 15 amps on the studio circuit is pretty well gobbled up by the stuff I'm
>> running during a mix if I use a lot of outboard. I've got a Henry
>> Engineering Matchbox that *might* be able to solve this problem though.
>>
>> I'll likely be trying them both, but I wanted to run this by y'all to
see
>> if
>> there were any *gotchas* or if I should be lookiing at a different power
>> amp.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Deej
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Deej
>>
>>
>
>
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| Re: Anyone familiar with the Yammy P2201 or P2700 power amp? [message #71792 is a reply to message #71786] |
Sun, 27 August 2006 20:54 |
Deej [1]
Messages: 2149
Registered: January 2006
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Senior Member |
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Back in the late 70's one of my buddies got an Adcom GFA-1 amp. I recall
driving his big Klipsch towers with these and we were just floored by the
punch and fidelity of this little amp. I just picked one of these up for a
good price on EBay. If I don't like it, I have another use for it, but if
it's got what I seem to remember it having, this little brick may be all I
need. It's rated 200WPC into 8 ohms and IIRC, that 200WPC rating may
actually be a bit conservative. It's got a fan too, but I'll be keeping this
pup in the machine room anyway.
"Dubya Mark Wilson" <mark.xspam@avidrecording.com> wrote in message
news:44f23bc5@linux...
> Yes on the fans. Loud enough to be a problem in a CR.
> M
>
> "DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote in message
> news:44f21ae0@linux...
> > One of my clients may be swapping me a pair of NS10m's and a power amp
for
> > some studio time. He's also got a Yamaha P2700 power amp and, I thnk a
> > P2201
> > as well.
> >
> > I've been out of the power amp loop for many years as I was using
powered
> > monitors before I switched to NHT A-20's which have a proprietary power
> > amp.........sooo.........what's a good amp for NS10M's? I don't weant to
> > underdrive these and since they are *rated* at 150, I firure I'm going
to
> > need 250 into 8ohms to get the goods out of them.
> >
> > I think both of these power amps will provide this, and then
> > some.......but
> > both the P2201 and P2700 have big fans IIRC. Are these especially loud?
I
> > guess I could power this from the machine room, but it would be much
more
> > convenient if it was close by. I'll probably need to run it from another
> > circuit in the house somewhere too (PITA......can you say HUMMMM) since
> > the
> > 15 amps on the studio circuit is pretty well gobbled up by the stuff I'm
> > running during a mix if I use a lot of outboard. I've got a Henry
> > Engineering Matchbox that *might* be able to solve this problem though.
> >
> > I'll likely be trying them both, but I wanted to run this by y'all to
see
> > if
> > there were any *gotchas* or if I should be lookiing at a different power
> > amp.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Deej
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Deej
> >
> >
>
>
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| Re: Anyone familiar with the Yammy P2201 or P2700 power amp? [message #71793 is a reply to message #71791] |
Sun, 27 August 2006 20:57 |
Deej [1]
Messages: 2149
Registered: January 2006
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Senior Member |
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Thanks John. Good info there. These 2201's are going for around $250.00
these days. Not bad.
Deej
"John Macy" <spamlessjohn@johnmacy.com> wrote in message
news:44f26969$1@linux...
>
> I run my NS10's on a 2201, and it makes a perfect mate for them. And
there
> are no fans on the 2201, nice, quiet and powerful. The 2200 had the
meters
> on the front, and I always heard that there was something in the meter
circuit
> that messed with the sound. The 2201 is the same amp sans meters...
>
> Best amp I ever heard on them, and believe me, I tried a lot of them...
>
> "Dubya Mark Wilson" <mark.xspam@avidrecording.com> wrote:
> >Yes on the fans. Loud enough to be a problem in a CR.
> >M
> >
> >"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote in message
> >news:44f21ae0@linux...
> >> One of my clients may be swapping me a pair of NS10m's and a power amp
> for
> >> some studio time. He's also got a Yamaha P2700 power amp and, I thnk a
>
> >> P2201
> >> as well.
> >>
> >> I've been out of the power amp loop for many years as I was using
powered
> >> monitors before I switched to NHT A-20's which have a proprietary power
> >> amp.........sooo.........what's a good amp for NS10M's? I don't weant
> to
> >> underdrive these and since they are *rated* at 150, I firure I'm going
> to
> >> need 250 into 8ohms to get the goods out of them.
> >>
> >> I think both of these power amps will provide this, and then
> >> some.......but
> >> both the P2201 and P2700 have big fans IIRC. Are these especially loud?
> I
> >> guess I could power this from the machine room, but it would be much
more
> >> convenient if it was close by. I'll probably need to run it from
another
> >> circuit in the house somewhere too (PITA......can you say HUMMMM) since
>
> >> the
> >> 15 amps on the studio circuit is pretty well gobbled up by the stuff
I'm
> >> running during a mix if I use a lot of outboard. I've got a Henry
> >> Engineering Matchbox that *might* be able to solve this problem though.
> >>
> >> I'll likely be trying them both, but I wanted to run this by y'all to
> see
> >> if
> >> there were any *gotchas* or if I should be lookiing at a different
power
> >> amp.
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >> Deej
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >>
> >> Deej
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>
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| Re: Anyone familiar with the Yammy P2201 or P2700 power amp? [message #71794 is a reply to message #71783] |
Sun, 27 August 2006 21:08 |
Neil
Messages: 1645
Registered: April 2006
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Senior Member |
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If you can find an old/used Macintosh tube amp, get that for
the NS-10's - good combo there - less harshness & ear fatigue
with those speakers that way, and you don't need to tape tissue
over the tweets. Or a used Rotel might work, too.
Neil
"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>One of my clients may be swapping me a pair of NS10m's and a power amp for
>some studio time. He's also got a Yamaha P2700 power amp and, I thnk a P2201
>as well.
>
>I've been out of the power amp loop for many years as I was using powered
>monitors before I switched to NHT A-20's which have a proprietary power
>amp.........sooo.........what's a good amp for NS10M's? I don't weant to
>underdrive these and since they are *rated* at 150, I firure I'm going to
>need 250 into 8ohms to get the goods out of them.
>
>I think both of these power amps will provide this, and then some.......but
>both the P2201 and P2700 have big fans IIRC. Are these especially loud?
I
>guess I could power this from the machine room, but it would be much more
>convenient if it was close by. I'll probably need to run it from another
>circuit in the house somewhere too (PITA......can you say HUMMMM) since
the
>15 amps on the studio circuit is pretty well gobbled up by the stuff I'm
>running during a mix if I use a lot of outboard. I've got a Henry
>Engineering Matchbox that *might* be able to solve this problem though.
>
>I'll likely be trying them both, but I wanted to run this by y'all to see
if
>there were any *gotchas* or if I should be lookiing at a different power
>amp.
>
>Thanks,
>Deej
>
>Thanks,
>
>Deej
>
>
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| Re: Anyone familiar with the Yammy P2201 or P2700 power amp? [message #71795 is a reply to message #71783] |
Sun, 27 August 2006 21:11 |
gene lennon
Messages: 565
Registered: July 2006
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Senior Member |
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"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>One of my clients may be swapping me a pair of NS10m's and a power amp for
>some studio time. He's also got a Yamaha P2700 power amp and, I thnk a P2201
>as well.
>
>I've been out of the power amp loop for many years as I was using powered
>monitors before I switched to NHT A-20's which have a proprietary power
>amp.........sooo.........what's a good amp for NS10M's? I don't weant to
>underdrive these and since they are *rated* at 150, I firure I'm going to
>need 250 into 8ohms to get the goods out of them.
>
>I think both of these power amps will provide this, and then some.......but
>both the P2201 and P2700 have big fans IIRC. Are these especially loud?
I
>guess I could power this from the machine room, but it would be much more
>convenient if it was close by. I'll probably need to run it from another
>circuit in the house somewhere too (PITA......can you say HUMMMM) since
the
>15 amps on the studio circuit is pretty well gobbled up by the stuff I'm
>running during a mix if I use a lot of outboard. I've got a Henry
>Engineering Matchbox that *might* be able to solve this problem though.
>
>I'll likely be trying them both, but I wanted to run this by y'all to see
if
>there were any *gotchas* or if I should be lookiing at a different power
>amp.
>
>Thanks,
>Deej
>
>Thanks,
>
>Deej
>
>
I used a 2201 on my NS10s with excellent results. I also liked MacIntosh
60s, Adcoms, Brystons and even Hot House, but I think the 2201 was the best
match. A dedicated 20A circuit is always a good idea. (ROMEX 12/3 NM-B minimum).
Gene
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| Re: Anyone familiar with the Yammy P2201 or P2700 power amp? [message #71796 is a reply to message #71795] |
Sun, 27 August 2006 21:22 |
John Macy
Messages: 242
Registered: April 2006
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Senior Member |
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I'm with Gene--I trired Macs, Brystons, Hot House, Hafler and others, and
the 2201 still smoked them. Iheard some time ago about a mod that made them
even better--anyone hear of this???
"gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSPmyrealbox.com> wrote:
>
>"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>>One of my clients may be swapping me a pair of NS10m's and a power amp
for
>>some studio time. He's also got a Yamaha P2700 power amp and, I thnk a
P2201
>>as well.
>>
>>I've been out of the power amp loop for many years as I was using powered
>>monitors before I switched to NHT A-20's which have a proprietary power
>>amp.........sooo.........what's a good amp for NS10M's? I don't weant to
>>underdrive these and since they are *rated* at 150, I firure I'm going
to
>>need 250 into 8ohms to get the goods out of them.
>>
>>I think both of these power amps will provide this, and then some.......but
>>both the P2201 and P2700 have big fans IIRC. Are these especially loud?
>I
>>guess I could power this from the machine room, but it would be much more
>>convenient if it was close by. I'll probably need to run it from another
>>circuit in the house somewhere too (PITA......can you say HUMMMM) since
>the
>>15 amps on the studio circuit is pretty well gobbled up by the stuff I'm
>>running during a mix if I use a lot of outboard. I've got a Henry
>>Engineering Matchbox that *might* be able to solve this problem though.
>>
>>I'll likely be trying them both, but I wanted to run this by y'all to see
>if
>>there were any *gotchas* or if I should be lookiing at a different power
>>amp.
>>
>>Thanks,
>>Deej
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Deej
>>
>>
>I used a 2201 on my NS10s with excellent results. I also liked MacIntosh
>60s, Adcoms, Brystons and even Hot House, but I think the 2201 was the best
>match. A dedicated 20A circuit is always a good idea. (ROMEX 12/3 NM-B minimum).
>Gene
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| Re: Anyone familiar with the Yammy P2201 or P2700 power amp? [message #71799 is a reply to message #71796] |
Sun, 27 August 2006 22:18 |
Deej [1]
Messages: 2149
Registered: January 2006
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Senior Member |
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I've always been partial to Adcoms. Very open sounding with smooth mids. I
was sort of thinking about the situation with the mids in the NS-10M's when
I decided to pick this one up. I don't know how the GFA-1 will compare to
the later 545 (100WPC) or 555. The 555 also has 200WPC, like the GFA-1. I
think the GFA-1, being their first power amp, may be a bit of a minimalist
design, which is what (I think) I want . I'll be strapping a PVC between the
unbalanced outputs of my DAC-1 and the Adcom since it doesn't have any means
of attenuation.. This one is coming from an estate and according to the
seller, it was used on a regular basis so hopefully the caps are still in
good shape and haven't dried out. I'll A/B it against the 2201 (if he has a
2201......I think his second amp is a 2201 IIRC)
Deej
"John Macy" <spamlessjohn@johnmacy.com> wrote in message
news:44f26f9d$1@linux...
>
> I'm with Gene--I trired Macs, Brystons, Hot House, Hafler and others, and
> the 2201 still smoked them. Iheard some time ago about a mod that made
them
> even better--anyone hear of this???
>
> "gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSPmyrealbox.com> wrote:
> >
> >"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
> >>One of my clients may be swapping me a pair of NS10m's and a power amp
> for
> >>some studio time. He's also got a Yamaha P2700 power amp and, I thnk a
> P2201
> >>as well.
> >>
> >>I've been out of the power amp loop for many years as I was using
powered
> >>monitors before I switched to NHT A-20's which have a proprietary power
> >>amp.........sooo.........what's a good amp for NS10M's? I don't weant to
> >>underdrive these and since they are *rated* at 150, I firure I'm going
> to
> >>need 250 into 8ohms to get the goods out of them.
> >>
> >>I think both of these power amps will provide this, and then
some.......but
> >>both the P2201 and P2700 have big fans IIRC. Are these especially loud?
> >I
> >>guess I could power this from the machine room, but it would be much
more
> >>convenient if it was close by. I'll probably need to run it from another
> >>circuit in the house somewhere too (PITA......can you say HUMMMM) since
> >the
> >>15 amps on the studio circuit is pretty well gobbled up by the stuff I'm
> >>running during a mix if I use a lot of outboard. I've got a Henry
> >>Engineering Matchbox that *might* be able to solve this problem though.
> >>
> >>I'll likely be trying them both, but I wanted to run this by y'all to
see
> >if
> >>there were any *gotchas* or if I should be lookiing at a different power
> >>amp.
> >>
> >>Thanks,
> >>Deej
> >>
> >>Thanks,
> >>
> >>Deej
> >>
> >>
> >I used a 2201 on my NS10s with excellent results. I also liked MacIntosh
> >60s, Adcoms, Brystons and even Hot House, but I think the 2201 was the
best
> >match. A dedicated 20A circuit is always a good idea. (ROMEX 12/3 NM-B
minimum).
> >Gene
>
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| Re: Anyone familiar with the Yammy P2201 or P2700 power amp? [message #71813 is a reply to message #71801] |
Mon, 28 August 2006 06:27 |
dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
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Senior Member |
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Hi Gene,
One thing you said caught my eye:
"gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSPmyrealbox.com> wrote:
>Most
>200w per channel power amps will draw 20 amps when cruising and will “call”
>for 30 amps at peaks.
Actually, amps use far less current than this, which is why you see
poorly engineered sound systems, with 8 amplifiers all running off
one 15-amp circuit.
The QSC website has a page where you can download a document
listing the current draw of all their amps.
http://www.qscaudio.com/support/technical_support/current_co nsumption_heat_loss.htm
For a PL236 (one of their most powerful amps, at 725w/ch. into
8ohms) the idle current is only 1 amp and the pink noise level
(1/8 power) that best represents cranked music with light
clipping only draws 7.8 amps. A PL218 with 310w/ch into
8ohms, idles at .7 and draws 4.9 amps at cranked levels.
A dedicated line (preferably 3-4 of them) is a great idea, and they
should be isolated-ground, and the panel should be securely
earth-grounded as well. IG (isolated ground) means a real green
wire in the pipe for each circuit, and no use of the conduit itself
for ground.
best,
DC
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| Re: Anyone familiar with the Yammy P2201 or P2700 power amp? [message #71814 is a reply to message #71813] |
Mon, 28 August 2006 06:38 |
DC
Messages: 722
Registered: July 2005
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Senior Member |
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BTW, the spec plate on the back of amps listing the voltage and
current draw, is complete rubbish, and represents a total dissipation
rating for electricians and lawyers to CYA (cover their butts).
Amps never, ever use that much current to make music. Years ago,
we knew there was a huge discrepency between the plate rating and
the actual draw, and some of the company techies would tell you
what the amps actually drew, but not "for the record".
This silliness resulted in new systems going in with a 20-amp circuit
for each power amp (that never drew more than 5 amps each, and
usually more like 1.5) so everyone had their legal butts covered.
Today, several of the manufacturers actually publish the data on
current use in the real world. It's about time.
DC
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| Re: Anyone familiar with the Yammy P2201 or P2700 power amp? [message #71819 is a reply to message #71783] |
Mon, 28 August 2006 09:34 |
Wayne Carson
Messages: 86
Registered: June 2007
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Member |
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DJ,
I'm not familiar with the yammies but I've used my NS-10s with an Alesis
RA-100 amp since '96. Both are supposed to be flat across the board. The
amp is clean and quiet (no fan, uses rear fins) but per John Macy's postings
(yours 8/28 and 8/19-20 under NS-10m) I may be underpowered. My NS-10s
carry mids so I slightly boost the highs and lows (playback thru a Mackie
1604vlz) for a more pleasing sound w/o altering the mix much. NS-10s are
IMO very good to hear bit parts and pretty realistic to what you'll get
except the lows. I added a power'd sub to fatten the feel. Prior to the
sub I really pushed the lows but the mix was boomy on every home/car stereo
I put it on.
Wayne
"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote in message
news:44f21ae0@linux...
> One of my clients may be swapping me a pair of NS10m's and a power amp for
> some studio time. He's also got a Yamaha P2700 power amp and, I thnk a
> P2201
> as well.
>
> I've been out of the power amp loop for many years as I was using powered
> monitors before I switched to NHT A-20's which have a proprietary power
> amp.........sooo.........what's a good amp for NS10M's? I don't weant to
> underdrive these and since they are *rated* at 150, I firure I'm going to
> need 250 into 8ohms to get the goods out of them.
>
> I think both of these power amps will provide this, and then
> some.......but
> both the P2201 and P2700 have big fans IIRC. Are these especially loud? I
> guess I could power this from the machine room, but it would be much more
> convenient if it was close by. I'll probably need to run it from another
> circuit in the house somewhere too (PITA......can you say HUMMMM) since
> the
> 15 amps on the studio circuit is pretty well gobbled up by the stuff I'm
> running during a mix if I use a lot of outboard. I've got a Henry
> Engineering Matchbox that *might* be able to solve this problem though.
>
> I'll likely be trying them both, but I wanted to run this by y'all to see
> if
> there were any *gotchas* or if I should be lookiing at a different power
> amp.
>
> Thanks,
> Deej
>
> Thanks,
>
> Deej
>
>
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| Re: Anyone familiar with the Yammy P2201 or P2700 power amp? [message #71841 is a reply to message #71813] |
Mon, 28 August 2006 17:12 |
gene Lennon[3]
Messages: 40
Registered: June 2006
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Member |
|
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"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>Hi Gene,
>
>One thing you said caught my eye:
>
>"gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSPmyrealbox.com> wrote:
>>Most
>>200w per channel power amps will draw 20 amps when cruising and will “call”
>>for 30 amps at peaks.
>
>
>Actually, amps use far less current than this, which is why you see
>poorly engineered sound systems, with 8 amplifiers all running off
>one 15-amp circuit.
>
>The QSC website has a page where you can download a document
>listing the current draw of all their amps.
>
> http://www.qscaudio.com/support/technical_support/current_co nsumption_heat_loss.htm
>
>For a PL236 (one of their most powerful amps, at 725w/ch. into
>8ohms) the idle current is only 1 amp and the pink noise level
>(1/8 power) that best represents cranked music with light
>clipping only draws 7.8 amps. A PL218 with 310w/ch into
>8ohms, idles at .7 and draws 4.9 amps at cranked levels.
>
>
>A dedicated line (preferably 3-4 of them) is a great idea, and they
>should be isolated-ground, and the panel should be securely
>earth-grounded as well. IG (isolated ground) means a real green
>wire in the pipe for each circuit, and no use of the conduit itself
>for ground.
>
>best,
>
>DC
DC,
I have great respect for your knowledge and I certainly don’t want to get
into a pissing match here, but just in case you have left others with the
impression that this is a non-issue, I need to make a few points.
It is true that many modern power amps have changed to switching power supplies
and as a result RMS power usage can be closer to 4 or 5 amps for a 200/side
power amp.
QSC was one of earliest and remains one of the leaders in high efficiency
power amps. The chart you refer to reflects that efficiency.
“QSC's PowerLight 9.0PFC, released in 1998, was the first to amp include
Power Factor Correction in its power supply. PFC can reduce the amplifier's
average AC current consumption by as much as 40%, and peak requirements by
as much as 80%.”
From:
http://mixonline.com/mag/audio_whats_next_power/
Many older amps, particularly Crown DC amps, but also many others, do not
have high efficiency power use, and most large amps still spec 20 amps (even
if it’s for peak consumption) – If this is to keep lawyers happy, it because
they don’t want to be sued after the fire.
But the real issue is not arguing over 6 amps or 12 amps when running hot.
The point I was trying to make was about the need to supply proper power
to the amp.
Here are a few points I hope we all can agree on.
1. Power starving an amp will reduce its dynamic range.
2. A dedicated supply line will give maximum headroom and will have low resistance
on the AC line. Both are beneficial to maximizing critical monitor amplification.
3. Proper AC wiring is not sexy like a new preamp, but it is generally a
very low percentage of the total cost of building a studio. It’s an inappropriate
place to save money. Large consoles, power amps, multi-track recorders and
other big power consumers should have dedicated lines that are designed with
reasonable headroom, for safety and sound quality.
Talk to Stephen Morris at Crown or the technical staff at the manufacturer
of your power amps or powered monitors and you will get similar recommendations
or talk to any well know studio designer or the maintenance head at ANY large
studio..They will all tell you the same thing. We Need More Power, Captain!
Gene
|
|
|
|
| Re: Anyone familiar with the Yammy P2201 or P2700 power amp? [message #71845 is a reply to message #71841] |
Mon, 28 August 2006 19:27 |
Deej [1]
Messages: 2149
Registered: January 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_008E_01C6CAE0.5A7463A0
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charset="iso-8859-1"
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Hmmm.....welllll.....letsee here. This old house has electric wall =
heaters in every room. They are all on 20amp circuits and are no longer =
being used because trhe house was converted to natural gas. I guess I =
could get an electrician to come in, bypass a couple of these and wire =
them up to a couple of wall sockets. I have been doing some testing and =
the grounding in this place is very friendly. I don't get any 60Hz noise =
when plugging some gear into 110 outlets in one of my tracking rooms or =
my office and interfacing it with the gear that is coming from the =
outlet in my control room. I've also got a 220v heavy duty appliance =
outlet in the garage, directly below my machine room. The plug blades =
look sorta like this:
--I ---
O
=20
It's on a 20 amp fuse. It would be easy to just run a 10ga extension =
for the 8' it would take to reach the machine room. Is there some sort =
of 220v to 110v step down transformer that would work for this?=20
;o)
"gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSP.com> wrote in message =
news:44f3865e$1@linux...
>=20
> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
> >
> >Hi Gene,
> >
> >One thing you said caught my eye:
> >
> >"gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSPmyrealbox.com> wrote:
> >>Most
> >>200w per channel power amps will draw 20 amps when cruising and will =
"call"
> >>for 30 amps at peaks.=20
> >
> >
> >Actually, amps use far less current than this, which is why you see
> >poorly engineered sound systems, with 8 amplifiers all running off
> >one 15-amp circuit.
> >
> >The QSC website has a page where you can download a document
> >listing the current draw of all their amps.
> >
> =
> http://www.qscaudio.com/support/technical_support/current_co nsumption_he=
at_loss.htm
> >
> >For a PL236 (one of their most powerful amps, at 725w/ch. into
> >8ohms) the idle current is only 1 amp and the pink noise level
> >(1/8 power) that best represents cranked music with light
> >clipping only draws 7.8 amps. A PL218 with 310w/ch into
> >8ohms, idles at .7 and draws 4.9 amps at cranked levels.
> >
> >
> >A dedicated line (preferably 3-4 of them) is a great idea, and they
> >should be isolated-ground, and the panel should be securely=20
> >earth-grounded as well. IG (isolated ground) means a real green
> >wire in the pipe for each circuit, and no use of the conduit itself
> >for ground.
> >
> >best,
> >
> >DC
>=20
> DC,
> I have great respect for your knowledge and I certainly don't want to =
get
> into a pissing match here, but just in case you have left others with =
the
> impression that this is a non-issue, I need to make a few points.
>=20
> It is true that many modern power amps have changed to switching power =
supplies
> and as a result RMS power usage can be closer to 4 or 5 amps for a =
200/side
> power amp.
>=20
> QSC was one of earliest and remains one of the leaders in high =
efficiency
> power amps. The chart you refer to reflects that efficiency.
>=20
> "QSC's PowerLight 9.0PFC, released in 1998, was the first to amp =
include
> Power Factor Correction in its power supply. PFC can reduce the =
amplifier's
> average AC current consumption by as much as 40%, and peak =
requirements by
> as much as 80%."=20
> From:
> http://mixonline.com/mag/audio_whats_next_power/
>=20
> Many older amps, particularly Crown DC amps, but also many others, do =
not
> have high efficiency power use, and most large amps still spec 20 amps =
(even
> if it's for peak consumption) - If this is to keep lawyers happy, it =
because
> they don't want to be sued after the fire.=20
>=20
> But the real issue is not arguing over 6 amps or 12 amps when running =
hot.
> The point I was trying to make was about the need to supply proper =
power
> to the amp.=20
>=20
> Here are a few points I hope we all can agree on.
>=20
> 1. Power starving an amp will reduce its dynamic range.
> 2. A dedicated supply line will give maximum headroom and will have =
low resistance
> on the AC line. Both are beneficial to maximizing critical monitor =
amplification.
> 3. Proper AC wiring is not sexy like a new preamp, but it is generally =
a
> very low percentage of the total cost of building a studio. It's an =
inappropriate
> place to save money. Large consoles, power amps, multi-track =
recorders and
> other big power consumers should have dedicated lines that are =
designed with
> reasonable headroom, for safety and sound quality.
>=20
> Talk to Stephen Morris at Crown or the technical staff at the =
manufacturer
> of your power amps or powered monitors and you will get similar =
recommendations
> or talk to any well know studio designer or the maintenance head at =
ANY large
> studio..They will all tell you the same thing. We Need More Power, =
Captain!
>=20
> Gene
>
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<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1106" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Hmmm.....welllll.....letsee here. This =
old house=20
has electric wall heaters in every room. They are all on 20amp circuits =
and are=20
no longer being used because trhe house was converted to natural gas. I =
guess I=20
could get an electrician to come in, bypass a couple of these and wire =
them up=20
to a couple of wall sockets. I have been doing some testing and the =
grounding in=20
this place is very friendly. I don't get any 60Hz noise when plugging =
some gear=20
into 110 outlets in one of my tracking rooms or my office and =
interfacing it=20
with the gear that is coming from the outlet in my control room. I've =
also got a=20
220v heavy duty appliance outlet in the garage, directly below my =
machine=20
room. The plug blades look sorta like this:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT><STRONG><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D4> --I &nb sp; &=
nbsp; =20
---</FONT></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><FONT face=3DArial size=3D4></FONT></STRONG> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D4> =
O</FONT></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><FONT face=3DArial size=3D4> =20
</FONT></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> It's on a 20 amp fuse. It would =
be easy to=20
just run a 10ga extension for the 8' it would take to reach the machine =
room. Is=20
there some sort of 220v to 110v step down transformer that would work =
for this?=20
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>;o)</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV></FONT>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>"gene Lennon" <</FONT><A=20
href=3D"mailto:glennon@NOSP.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>glennon@NOSP.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> =
wrote in message=20
</FONT><A href=3D"news:44f3865e$1@linux"><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>news:44f3865e$1@linux</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>...</FONT></DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>> <BR>> "DC" =
<</FONT><A=20
href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>>=20
wrote:<BR>> ><BR>> >Hi Gene,<BR>> ><BR>> >One =
thing you=20
said caught my eye:<BR>> ><BR>> >"gene Lennon" <</FONT><A =
href=3D"mailto:glennon@NOSPmyrealbox.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>glennon@NOSPmyrealbox.com</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>>=20
wrote:<BR>> >>Most<BR>> >>200w per channel power amps =
will=20
draw 20 amps when cruising and will "call"<BR>> >>for 30 amps =
at peaks.=20
<BR>> ><BR>> ><BR>> >Actually, amps use far less =
current than=20
this, which is why you see<BR>> >poorly engineered sound systems, =
with 8=20
amplifiers all running off<BR>> >one 15-amp circuit.<BR>> =
><BR>>=20
>The QSC website has a page where you can download a document<BR>> =
>listing the current draw of all their amps.<BR>> ><BR>>=20
> http://www.qscaudio.com/support/technical_support/current_co nsumption=
_heat_loss.htm<BR>>=20
><BR>> >For a PL236 (one of their most powerful amps, at =
725w/ch.=20
into<BR>> >8ohms) the idle current is only 1 amp and the pink =
noise=20
level<BR>> >(1/8 power) that best represents cranked music with=20
light<BR>> >clipping only draws 7.8 amps. A PL218 with =
310w/ch=20
into<BR>> >8ohms, idles at .7 and draws 4.9 amps at cranked=20
levels.<BR>> ><BR>> ><BR>> >A dedicated line =
(preferably 3-4=20
of them) is a great idea, and they<BR>> >should be =
isolated-ground, and=20
the panel should be securely <BR>> >earth-grounded as well. =
IG=20
(isolated ground) means a real green<BR>> >wire in the pipe for =
each=20
circuit, and no use of the conduit itself<BR>> >for =
ground.<BR>>=20
><BR>> >best,<BR>> ><BR>> >DC<BR>> <BR>> =
DC,<BR>>=20
I have great respect for your knowledge and I certainly don't want to=20
get<BR>> into a pissing match here, but just in case you have left =
others=20
with the<BR>> impression that this is a non-issue, I need to make a =
few=20
points.<BR>> <BR>> It is true that many modern power amps have =
changed to=20
switching power supplies<BR>> and as a result RMS power usage can be =
closer=20
to 4 or 5 amps for a 200/side<BR>> power amp.<BR>> <BR>> QSC =
was one of=20
earliest and remains one of the leaders in high efficiency<BR>> power =
amps.=20
The chart you refer to reflects that efficiency.<BR>> <BR>> "QSC's =
PowerLight 9.0PFC, released in 1998, was the first to amp =
include<BR>> Power=20
Factor Correction in its power supply. PFC can reduce the =
amplifier's<BR>>=20
average AC current consumption by as much as 40%, and peak requirements=20
by<BR>> as much as 80%." <BR>> From:<BR>> </FONT><A=20
href=3D"http://mixonline.com/mag/audio_whats_next_power/"><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>http://mixonline.com/mag/audio_whats_next_power/</FONT></A><BR><=
FONT=20
face=3DArial size=3D2>> <BR>> Many older amps, particularly Crown =
DC amps, but=20
also many others, do not<BR>> have high efficiency power use, and =
most large=20
amps still spec 20 amps (even<BR>> if it's for peak consumption) - If =
this is=20
to keep lawyers happy, it because<BR>> they don't want to be sued =
after the=20
fire. <BR>> <BR>> But the real issue is not arguing over 6 amps or =
12 amps=20
when running hot.<BR>> The point I was trying to make was about the =
need to=20
supply proper power<BR>> to the amp. <BR>> <BR>> Here are a few =
points=20
I hope we all can agree on.<BR>> <BR>> 1. Power starving an amp =
will=20
reduce its dynamic range.<BR>> 2. A dedicated supply line will give =
maximum=20
headroom and will have low resistance<BR>> on the AC line. Both are=20
beneficial to maximizing critical monitor amplification.<BR>> 3. =
Proper AC=20
wiring is not sexy like a new preamp, but it is generally a<BR>> very =
low=20
percentage of the total cost of building a studio. It's an =
inappropriate<BR>>=20
place to save money. Large consoles, power amps, multi-track =
recorders=20
and<BR>> other big power consumers should have dedicated lines that =
are=20
designed with<BR>> reasonable headroom, for safety and sound =
quality.<BR>>=20
<BR>> Talk to Stephen Morris at Crown or the technical staff at the=20
manufacturer<BR>> of your power amps or powered monitors and you will =
get=20
similar recommendations<BR>> or talk to any well know studio designer =
or the=20
maintenance head at ANY large<BR>> studio..They will all tell you the =
same=20
thing. We Need More Power, Captain!<BR>> <BR>> Gene<BR>>=20
</FONT></BODY></HTML>
------=_NextPart_000_008E_01C6CAE0.5A7463A0--
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| Re: Anyone familiar with the Yammy P2201 or P2700 power amp? [message #71849 is a reply to message #71819] |
Mon, 28 August 2006 20:07 |
Dubya Mark Wilson
Messages: 108
Registered: May 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Wayne, to each his own but I don't think I've heard but just a few amps that
were worse for referencing. I wonder what your tens would sound like,
comparatively speaking, with some other amps.
W.
"Wayne Carson" <carson_wayne@msn.com> wrote in message
news:44f3198f@linux...
> DJ,
>
> I'm not familiar with the yammies but I've used my NS-10s with an Alesis
> RA-100 amp since '96. Both are supposed to be flat across the board. The
> amp is clean and quiet (no fan, uses rear fins) but per John Macy's
> postings (yours 8/28 and 8/19-20 under NS-10m) I may be underpowered. My
> NS-10s carry mids so I slightly boost the highs and lows (playback thru a
> Mackie 1604vlz) for a more pleasing sound w/o altering the mix much.
> NS-10s are IMO very good to hear bit parts and pretty realistic to what
> you'll get except the lows. I added a power'd sub to fatten the feel.
> Prior to the sub I really pushed the lows but the mix was boomy on every
> home/car stereo I put it on.
>
> Wayne
>
>
> "DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote in message
> news:44f21ae0@linux...
>> One of my clients may be swapping me a pair of NS10m's and a power amp
>> for
>> some studio time. He's also got a Yamaha P2700 power amp and, I thnk a
>> P2201
>> as well.
>>
>> I've been out of the power amp loop for many years as I was using powered
>> monitors before I switched to NHT A-20's which have a proprietary power
>> amp.........sooo.........what's a good amp for NS10M's? I don't weant to
>> underdrive these and since they are *rated* at 150, I firure I'm going to
>> need 250 into 8ohms to get the goods out of them.
>>
>> I think both of these power amps will provide this, and then
>> some.......but
>> both the P2201 and P2700 have big fans IIRC. Are these especially loud? I
>> guess I could power this from the machine room, but it would be much more
>> convenient if it was close by. I'll probably need to run it from another
>> circuit in the house somewhere too (PITA......can you say HUMMMM) since
>> the
>> 15 amps on the studio circuit is pretty well gobbled up by the stuff I'm
>> running during a mix if I use a lot of outboard. I've got a Henry
>> Engineering Matchbox that *might* be able to solve this problem though.
>>
>> I'll likely be trying them both, but I wanted to run this by y'all to see
>> if
>> there were any *gotchas* or if I should be lookiing at a different power
>> amp.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Deej
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Deej
>>
>>
>
>
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| Re: Anyone familiar with the Yammy P2201 or P2700 power amp? [message #71857 is a reply to message #71841] |
Mon, 28 August 2006 22:50 |
DC
Messages: 722
Registered: July 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
"gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSP.com> wrote:
>but just in case you have left others with the
>impression that this is a non-issue, I need to make a few points.
Wait a minute. There are 2 seperate point to be made here.
Just because amplifiers do not draw 20amps at idle, does not mean
that they do not get current starved at high levels with lots of
transients.
You are absolutely right about that, but the spec you gave on
current draw was simply way off. BTW, it was Crown who first
got me started learning about this, and they were the ones who
would not speak on the record, ten years ago.
Their Macro-tech amps, which have power transformers, (I know,
I picked one up recently!) have specs for current draw on their
website at:
http://www.crownaudio.com/amp_htm/ampinfo.htm
(scroll down) Even the mighty MA-3600VZ with 1120W/side into
8ohms, only draws 10.3 amps at full power with "full range rock
music". The figure of 20amps at idle is simply wrong for any
amp in current production, regardless of power supply.
As I said, none of that means that amplifiers don't sound better
with stouter AC, they do. Personally, I think if studios installed
better AC service, they would never sell another "magic power
cable" again. You know, those 1000.00 fancy power cables that
are supposed to improve your audio? Spend the money on your
AC and get a good amplifier instead.
We really don't disagree here, you simply got a spec wrong.
No biggie, as far as I am concerned.
>Many older amps, particularly Crown DC amps, but also many others, do not
>have high efficiency power use, and most large amps still spec 20 amps (even
>if it’s for peak consumption) – If this is to keep lawyers happy, it because
>they don’t want to be sued after the fire.
See, this is where so many, (even seasoned pros like yourself)
get this wrong. The DC series amps will never ever
draw 20 amps at idle. We think that because the spec plate
says so. The (Crown) engineer I had that conversation with 10
years ago said that the spec is derived from the total dissipation
rating of the output devices, and no "the amp will never draw
that", nor will there be a fire, which is why so many cheapskate
club owners are still running racks of Crowns to this day, off of
one 15amp circuit, and nothing catches fire. Ever. Do they sound
as good as they could? No. But that plate rating means *nothing*
zero, zilch, nada, as far as actual current draw.
I will be happy to put a Fluke current meter on any DC series amp
you can name. (and no sneaking some tubes in there either!)
>But the real issue is not arguing over 6 amps or 12 amps when running hot.
>The point I was trying to make was about the need to supply proper power
>to the amp.
Agreed.
>Here are a few points I hope we all can agree on.
>
>1. Power starving an amp will reduce its dynamic range.
>2. A dedicated supply line will give maximum headroom and will have low
resistance
>on the AC line. Both are beneficial to maximizing critical monitor amplification.
>3. Proper AC wiring is not sexy like a new preamp, but it is generally a
>very low percentage of the total cost of building a studio. It’s an inappropriate
>place to save money. Large consoles, power amps, multi-track recorders
and
>other big power consumers should have dedicated lines that are designed
with
>reasonable headroom, for safety and sound quality.
Bang-zoom! Home run.
best,
DC
|
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|
| Re: Anyone familiar with the Yammy P2201 or P2700 power amp? [message #72052 is a reply to message #71799] |
Tue, 05 September 2006 08:39 |
EK Sound
Messages: 939
Registered: June 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
In the older Yamaha gear, there were several Bi-Polar electrolytics in
the audio path that should be replaced regardless. This will improve
the low end response dramatically. They are usually located just
before the buffer amps. Look for "BP" on the case... and replace with
as close a value as you can find. If you can't find Bi-Polar caps,
you can make them out of two standard electrolytics back to back (the
caps will have to have double the value you want to end up with).
David.
DJ wrote:
> I've always been partial to Adcoms. Very open sounding with smooth mids. I
> was sort of thinking about the situation with the mids in the NS-10M's when
> I decided to pick this one up. I don't know how the GFA-1 will compare to
> the later 545 (100WPC) or 555. The 555 also has 200WPC, like the GFA-1. I
> think the GFA-1, being their first power amp, may be a bit of a minimalist
> design, which is what (I think) I want . I'll be strapping a PVC between the
> unbalanced outputs of my DAC-1 and the Adcom since it doesn't have any means
> of attenuation.. This one is coming from an estate and according to the
> seller, it was used on a regular basis so hopefully the caps are still in
> good shape and haven't dried out. I'll A/B it against the 2201 (if he has a
> 2201......I think his second amp is a 2201 IIRC)
>
> Deej
>
> "John Macy" <spamlessjohn@johnmacy.com> wrote in message
> news:44f26f9d$1@linux...
>
>>I'm with Gene--I trired Macs, Brystons, Hot House, Hafler and others, and
>>the 2201 still smoked them. Iheard some time ago about a mod that made
>
> them
>
>>even better--anyone hear of this???
>>
>>"gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSPmyrealbox.com> wrote:
>>
>>>"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>One of my clients may be swapping me a pair of NS10m's and a power amp
>>
>>for
>>
>>>>some studio time. He's also got a Yamaha P2700 power amp and, I thnk a
>>
>>P2201
>>
>>>>as well.
>>>>
>>>>I've been out of the power amp loop for many years as I was using
>
> powered
>
>>>>monitors before I switched to NHT A-20's which have a proprietary power
>>>>amp.........sooo.........what's a good amp for NS10M's? I don't weant to
>>>>underdrive these and since they are *rated* at 150, I firure I'm going
>>
>>to
>>
>>>>need 250 into 8ohms to get the goods out of them.
>>>>
>>>>I think both of these power amps will provide this, and then
>
> some.......but
>
>>>>both the P2201 and P2700 have big fans IIRC. Are these especially loud?
>>>
>>>I
>>>
>>>>guess I could power this from the machine room, but it would be much
>
> more
>
>>>>convenient if it was close by. I'll probably need to run it from another
>>>>circuit in the house somewhere too (PITA......can you say HUMMMM) since
>>>
>>>the
>>>
>>>>15 amps on the studio circuit is pretty well gobbled up by the stuff I'm
>>>>running during a mix if I use a lot of outboard. I've got a Henry
>>>>Engineering Matchbox that *might* be able to solve this problem though.
>>>>
>>>>I'll likely be trying them both, but I wanted to run this by y'all to
>
> see
>
>>>if
>>>
>>>>there were any *gotchas* or if I should be lookiing at a different power
>>>>amp.
>>>>
>>>>Thanks,
>>>>Deej
>>>>
>>>>Thanks,
>>>>
>>>>Deej
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>I used a 2201 on my NS10s with excellent results. I also liked MacIntosh
>>>60s, Adcoms, Brystons and even Hot House, but I think the 2201 was the
>
> best
>
>>>match. A dedicated 20A circuit is always a good idea. (ROMEX 12/3 NM-B
>
> minimum).
>
>>>Gene
>>
>
>
|
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| Re: Anyone familiar with the Yammy P2201 or P2700 power amp? [message #72063 is a reply to message #72052] |
Tue, 05 September 2006 13:12 |
John Macy
Messages: 242
Registered: April 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Thanks, Dave. As usual, you are an amazing source of information... :)
EK Sound <askme@nospam.com> wrote:
>In the older Yamaha gear, there were several Bi-Polar electrolytics in
>the audio path that should be replaced regardless. This will improve
>the low end response dramatically. They are usually located just
>before the buffer amps. Look for "BP" on the case... and replace with
>as close a value as you can find. If you can't find Bi-Polar caps,
>you can make them out of two standard electrolytics back to back (the
>caps will have to have double the value you want to end up with).
>
>David.
>
>
>
>DJ wrote:
>> I've always been partial to Adcoms. Very open sounding with smooth mids.
I
>> was sort of thinking about the situation with the mids in the NS-10M's
when
>> I decided to pick this one up. I don't know how the GFA-1 will compare
to
>> the later 545 (100WPC) or 555. The 555 also has 200WPC, like the GFA-1.
I
>> think the GFA-1, being their first power amp, may be a bit of a minimalist
>> design, which is what (I think) I want . I'll be strapping a PVC between
the
>> unbalanced outputs of my DAC-1 and the Adcom since it doesn't have any
means
>> of attenuation.. This one is coming from an estate and according to the
>> seller, it was used on a regular basis so hopefully the caps are still
in
>> good shape and haven't dried out. I'll A/B it against the 2201 (if he
has a
>> 2201......I think his second amp is a 2201 IIRC)
>>
>> Deej
>>
>> "John Macy" <spamlessjohn@johnmacy.com> wrote in message
>> news:44f26f9d$1@linux...
>>
>>>I'm with Gene--I trired Macs, Brystons, Hot House, Hafler and others,
and
>>>the 2201 still smoked them. Iheard some time ago about a mod that made
>>
>> them
>>
>>>even better--anyone hear of this???
>>>
>>>"gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSPmyrealbox.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>One of my clients may be swapping me a pair of NS10m's and a power amp
>>>
>>>for
>>>
>>>>>some studio time. He's also got a Yamaha P2700 power amp and, I thnk
a
>>>
>>>P2201
>>>
>>>>>as well.
>>>>>
>>>>>I've been out of the power amp loop for many years as I was using
>>
>> powered
>>
>>>>>monitors before I switched to NHT A-20's which have a proprietary power
>>>>>amp.........sooo.........what's a good amp for NS10M's? I don't weant
to
>>>>>underdrive these and since they are *rated* at 150, I firure I'm going
>>>
>>>to
>>>
>>>>>need 250 into 8ohms to get the goods out of them.
>>>>>
>>>>>I think both of these power amps will provide this, and then
>>
>> some.......but
>>
>>>>>both the P2201 and P2700 have big fans IIRC. Are these especially loud?
>>>>
>>>>I
>>>>
>>>>>guess I could power this from the machine room, but it would be much
>>
>> more
>>
>>>>>convenient if it was close by. I'll probably need to run it from another
>>>>>circuit in the house somewhere too (PITA......can you say HUMMMM) since
>>>>
>>>>the
>>>>
>>>>>15 amps on the studio circuit is pretty well gobbled up by the stuff
I'm
>>>>>running during a mix if I use a lot of outboard. I've got a Henry
>>>>>Engineering Matchbox that *might* be able to solve this problem though.
>>>>>
>>>>>I'll likely be trying them both, but I wanted to run this by y'all to
>>
>> see
>>
>>>>if
>>>>
>>>>>there were any *gotchas* or if I should be lookiing at a different power
>>>>>amp.
>>>>>
>>>>>Thanks,
>>>>>Deej
>>>>>
>>>>>Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>>Deej
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I used a 2201 on my NS10s with excellent results. I also liked MacIntosh
>>>>60s, Adcoms, Brystons and even Hot House, but I think the 2201 was the
>>
>> best
>>
>>>>match. A dedicated 20A circuit is always a good idea. (ROMEX 12/3 NM-B
>>
>> minimum).
>>
>>>>Gene
>>>
>>
>>
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