Home » The PARIS Forums » PARIS: Main » Paris as a front-end console...
| Paris as a front-end console... [message #84239] |
Wed, 09 May 2007 17:24  |
Neil
Messages: 1645
Registered: April 2006
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Senior Member |
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Referring back to my thread about pushing mic'ed signals
through Paris for EQ tweakage before it hits my Multiface's
convertors going into SX.... well, I'm gonna test this out
tonight on toms & maybe kick & snare. I'll post some clips if
it works well. I'll simply let you know without posting clips if
it doesn't LOL
Neil
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| Re: Paris as a front-end console... UPDATE [message #84252 is a reply to message #84239] |
Wed, 09 May 2007 23:39  |
Neil
Messages: 1645
Registered: April 2006
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Senior Member |
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|
OK, well, I had it working & it sounded fucking great, then it
quit working & I couldn't get it back. At first, I wasn't able
to get it to sync to the digital (lightpipe) input from the MOTU
8-Pre, then I changed the Paris Sync settings a few times
(toggled back & forth between Digital & Internal), got it to
work on "Internal", but was getting some random clicks- toggled
back & forth again a couple times, and finally got it to work
on "internal" - no clicks. Was running the 4 Tom mics into
channels 1-4 of the 8-Pre, then out through lightpipe to Paris'
ADAT module at 44.1k, EQ-ing them, then summing those 4 channels
in Live Mode into a stereo L/R Tom mix with NoLimit slammed
across Paris' 2-Buss... Toms sounded fucking awesome... then
took Paris main analog outs into the Multiface (had to go
analog there since I record in Cubase at 88.2k) and voila'!
Ass-kickin' tom sounds using Paris as a front-end!
Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on how you look at
it), I figured I'd better shut down the system & reboot to make
sure I could get it to work tomorrow when I start recording
this band that's coming in... good thing I did that tonight
intead of waiting until tomorrow & dicking around, looking like
an idiot, because when I rebooted, I couldn't get it to pass a
signal this time. I had saved the project as the very last
thing I did before I shut down, and so nothing was missed - I
even verified connections, etc in the Patch Bay, and toggled
back & forth a few times between Internal & other sync modes
again, but nope... no signal from the 8-Pre was being seen by
Paris... switched the MOTU to 88.2k and routed the lightpipe
into one of my Multifaces & there it was - no problem with the
MOTU digiblah outputs.
SO, I wonder if this is just one of the Paris ADAT card
weirdnesses I've heard so much about? It's a shame because:
a.) The toms were sounding farkin' killer with some Paris EQ &
NoLimit with zero lookahead on it, and:
b.) Now I have to use four tracking channels for Toms (one for
each tom) instead of a stereo L/R submix. A waste of resources.
argh.
More weirdness since installing the ADAT card... when I launch
Paris, I get an error that says it was unable to launch & must
shut down (Paris, not the PC)... first time I booted up tonight
this happened once; relaunched Paris once I didn't get that
error... 2nd time I booted up tonight, I got that error three
times in a row before I was able to relaunch Paris without
seeing it pop up.
"Argh!" again.
Neil
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| Re: Paris as a front-end console... UPDATE [message #84254 is a reply to message #84252] |
Thu, 10 May 2007 01:03 |
Dimitrios
Messages: 1056
Registered: August 2005
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Senior Member |
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Dear Neil,
First of all without even reading your routing scenario please check that
the Nolimit with 0 lookahead is a NO NO thing as the 0.50 !!
Use instead 0.001
The above (0 and 50) will make problems even not working at all.
I will read your routing and will post other thoughts.
Regards,
Dimitrios
"Neil" <OIUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>
>OK, well, I had it working & it sounded fucking great, then it
>quit working & I couldn't get it back. At first, I wasn't able
>to get it to sync to the digital (lightpipe) input from the MOTU
>8-Pre, then I changed the Paris Sync settings a few times
>(toggled back & forth between Digital & Internal), got it to
>work on "Internal", but was getting some random clicks- toggled
>back & forth again a couple times, and finally got it to work
>on "internal" - no clicks. Was running the 4 Tom mics into
>channels 1-4 of the 8-Pre, then out through lightpipe to Paris'
>ADAT module at 44.1k, EQ-ing them, then summing those 4 channels
>in Live Mode into a stereo L/R Tom mix with NoLimit slammed
>across Paris' 2-Buss... Toms sounded fucking awesome... then
>took Paris main analog outs into the Multiface (had to go
>analog there since I record in Cubase at 88.2k) and voila'!
>Ass-kickin' tom sounds using Paris as a front-end!
>
>Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on how you look at
>it), I figured I'd better shut down the system & reboot to make
>sure I could get it to work tomorrow when I start recording
>this band that's coming in... good thing I did that tonight
>intead of waiting until tomorrow & dicking around, looking like
>an idiot, because when I rebooted, I couldn't get it to pass a
>signal this time. I had saved the project as the very last
>thing I did before I shut down, and so nothing was missed - I
>even verified connections, etc in the Patch Bay, and toggled
>back & forth a few times between Internal & other sync modes
>again, but nope... no signal from the 8-Pre was being seen by
>Paris... switched the MOTU to 88.2k and routed the lightpipe
>into one of my Multifaces & there it was - no problem with the
>MOTU digiblah outputs.
>
>SO, I wonder if this is just one of the Paris ADAT card
>weirdnesses I've heard so much about? It's a shame because:
>a.) The toms were sounding farkin' killer with some Paris EQ &
>NoLimit with zero lookahead on it, and:
>b.) Now I have to use four tracking channels for Toms (one for
>each tom) instead of a stereo L/R submix. A waste of resources.
>
>argh.
>
>Paris, I get an error that says it was unable to launch & must
>shut down (Paris, not the PC)... first time I booted up tonight
>this happened once; relaunched Paris once I didn't get that
>error... 2nd time I booted up tonight, I got that error three
>times in a row before I was able to relaunch Paris without
>seeing it pop up.
>
>"Argh!" again.
>
>Neil
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| Re: Paris as a front-end console... UPDATE [message #84271 is a reply to message #84252] |
Thu, 10 May 2007 15:51 |
Aaron Allen
Messages: 1988
Registered: May 2008
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Senior Member |
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Remove no limit.. does it work now?
I think Big D hit it right on the head. all the way to the left or right is
a no no for that plug, and I've seen it feedback or pass zero audio when you
do that at random.
AA
"Neil" <OIUOIU@OIU.com> wrote in message news:4642be39$1@linux...
>
> OK, well, I had it working & it sounded fucking great, then it
> quit working & I couldn't get it back. At first, I wasn't able
> to get it to sync to the digital (lightpipe) input from the MOTU
> 8-Pre, then I changed the Paris Sync settings a few times
> (toggled back & forth between Digital & Internal), got it to
> work on "Internal", but was getting some random clicks- toggled
> back & forth again a couple times, and finally got it to work
> on "internal" - no clicks. Was running the 4 Tom mics into
> channels 1-4 of the 8-Pre, then out through lightpipe to Paris'
> ADAT module at 44.1k, EQ-ing them, then summing those 4 channels
> in Live Mode into a stereo L/R Tom mix with NoLimit slammed
> across Paris' 2-Buss... Toms sounded fucking awesome... then
> took Paris main analog outs into the Multiface (had to go
> analog there since I record in Cubase at 88.2k) and voila'!
> Ass-kickin' tom sounds using Paris as a front-end!
>
> Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on how you look at
> it), I figured I'd better shut down the system & reboot to make
> sure I could get it to work tomorrow when I start recording
> this band that's coming in... good thing I did that tonight
> intead of waiting until tomorrow & dicking around, looking like
> an idiot, because when I rebooted, I couldn't get it to pass a
> signal this time. I had saved the project as the very last
> thing I did before I shut down, and so nothing was missed - I
> even verified connections, etc in the Patch Bay, and toggled
> back & forth a few times between Internal & other sync modes
> again, but nope... no signal from the 8-Pre was being seen by
> Paris... switched the MOTU to 88.2k and routed the lightpipe
> into one of my Multifaces & there it was - no problem with the
> MOTU digiblah outputs.
>
> SO, I wonder if this is just one of the Paris ADAT card
> weirdnesses I've heard so much about? It's a shame because:
> a.) The toms were sounding farkin' killer with some Paris EQ &
> NoLimit with zero lookahead on it, and:
> b.) Now I have to use four tracking channels for Toms (one for
> each tom) instead of a stereo L/R submix. A waste of resources.
>
> argh.
>
> More weirdness since installing the ADAT card... when I launch
> Paris, I get an error that says it was unable to launch & must
> shut down (Paris, not the PC)... first time I booted up tonight
> this happened once; relaunched Paris once I didn't get that
> error... 2nd time I booted up tonight, I got that error three
> times in a row before I was able to relaunch Paris without
> seeing it pop up.
>
> "Argh!" again.
>
> Neil
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| Re: Paris as a front-end console... UPDATE [message #84273 is a reply to message #84271] |
Thu, 10 May 2007 17:16 |
ei
Messages: 7
Registered: January 2007
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Junior Member |
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I'll try that here in a little bit... I also think I might be
able to resolve the clicks by connecting the ADAT module's
lightpipe out to the MOTU lightpipe in & setting Paris to
internal sync & see if the 8-Pre will then slave to Paris.
Neil
"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>Remove no limit.. does it work now?
>I think Big D hit it right on the head. all the way to the left or right
is
>a no no for that plug, and I've seen it feedback or pass zero audio when
you
>do that at random.
>
>AA
>
>
>"Neil" <OIUOIU@OIU.com> wrote in message news:4642be39$1@linux...
>>
>> OK, well, I had it working & it sounded fucking great, then it
>> quit working & I couldn't get it back. At first, I wasn't able
>> to get it to sync to the digital (lightpipe) input from the MOTU
>> 8-Pre, then I changed the Paris Sync settings a few times
>> (toggled back & forth between Digital & Internal), got it to
>> work on "Internal", but was getting some random clicks- toggled
>> back & forth again a couple times, and finally got it to work
>> on "internal" - no clicks. Was running the 4 Tom mics into
>> channels 1-4 of the 8-Pre, then out through lightpipe to Paris'
>> ADAT module at 44.1k, EQ-ing them, then summing those 4 channels
>> in Live Mode into a stereo L/R Tom mix with NoLimit slammed
>> across Paris' 2-Buss... Toms sounded fucking awesome... then
>> took Paris main analog outs into the Multiface (had to go
>> analog there since I record in Cubase at 88.2k) and voila'!
>> Ass-kickin' tom sounds using Paris as a front-end!
>>
>> Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on how you look at
>> it), I figured I'd better shut down the system & reboot to make
>> sure I could get it to work tomorrow when I start recording
>> this band that's coming in... good thing I did that tonight
>> intead of waiting until tomorrow & dicking around, looking like
>> an idiot, because when I rebooted, I couldn't get it to pass a
>> signal this time. I had saved the project as the very last
>> thing I did before I shut down, and so nothing was missed - I
>> even verified connections, etc in the Patch Bay, and toggled
>> back & forth a few times between Internal & other sync modes
>> again, but nope... no signal from the 8-Pre was being seen by
>> Paris... switched the MOTU to 88.2k and routed the lightpipe
>> into one of my Multifaces & there it was - no problem with the
>> MOTU digiblah outputs.
>>
>> SO, I wonder if this is just one of the Paris ADAT card
>> weirdnesses I've heard so much about? It's a shame because:
>> a.) The toms were sounding farkin' killer with some Paris EQ &
>> NoLimit with zero lookahead on it, and:
>> b.) Now I have to use four tracking channels for Toms (one for
>> each tom) instead of a stereo L/R submix. A waste of resources.
>>
>> argh.
>>
>> More weirdness since installing the ADAT card... when I launch
>> Paris, I get an error that says it was unable to launch & must
>> shut down (Paris, not the PC)... first time I booted up tonight
>> this happened once; relaunched Paris once I didn't get that
>> error... 2nd time I booted up tonight, I got that error three
>> times in a row before I was able to relaunch Paris without
>> seeing it pop up.
>>
>> "Argh!" again.
>>
>> Neil
>
>
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| Re: Paris as a front-end console... UPDATE [message #84275 is a reply to message #84252] |
Thu, 10 May 2007 18:32 |
audioguy_editout_
Messages: 249
Registered: December 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
The installation of an adat card always demanded a
re-install of Paris under XP for me...
David.
Neil wrote:
> OK, well, I had it working & it sounded fucking great, then it
> quit working & I couldn't get it back. At first, I wasn't able
> to get it to sync to the digital (lightpipe) input from the MOTU
> 8-Pre, then I changed the Paris Sync settings a few times
> (toggled back & forth between Digital & Internal), got it to
> work on "Internal", but was getting some random clicks- toggled
> back & forth again a couple times, and finally got it to work
> on "internal" - no clicks. Was running the 4 Tom mics into
> channels 1-4 of the 8-Pre, then out through lightpipe to Paris'
> ADAT module at 44.1k, EQ-ing them, then summing those 4 channels
> in Live Mode into a stereo L/R Tom mix with NoLimit slammed
> across Paris' 2-Buss... Toms sounded fucking awesome... then
> took Paris main analog outs into the Multiface (had to go
> analog there since I record in Cubase at 88.2k) and voila'!
> Ass-kickin' tom sounds using Paris as a front-end!
>
> Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on how you look at
> it), I figured I'd better shut down the system & reboot to make
> sure I could get it to work tomorrow when I start recording
> this band that's coming in... good thing I did that tonight
> intead of waiting until tomorrow & dicking around, looking like
> an idiot, because when I rebooted, I couldn't get it to pass a
> signal this time. I had saved the project as the very last
> thing I did before I shut down, and so nothing was missed - I
> even verified connections, etc in the Patch Bay, and toggled
> back & forth a few times between Internal & other sync modes
> again, but nope... no signal from the 8-Pre was being seen by
> Paris... switched the MOTU to 88.2k and routed the lightpipe
> into one of my Multifaces & there it was - no problem with the
> MOTU digiblah outputs.
>
> SO, I wonder if this is just one of the Paris ADAT card
> weirdnesses I've heard so much about? It's a shame because:
> a.) The toms were sounding farkin' killer with some Paris EQ &
> NoLimit with zero lookahead on it, and:
> b.) Now I have to use four tracking channels for Toms (one for
> each tom) instead of a stereo L/R submix. A waste of resources.
>
> argh.
>
> More weirdness since installing the ADAT card... when I launch
> Paris, I get an error that says it was unable to launch & must
> shut down (Paris, not the PC)... first time I booted up tonight
> this happened once; relaunched Paris once I didn't get that
> error... 2nd time I booted up tonight, I got that error three
> times in a row before I was able to relaunch Paris without
> seeing it pop up.
>
> "Argh!" again.
>
> Neil
|
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| Re: Paris as a front-end console... UPDATE [message #84281 is a reply to message #84275] |
Thu, 10 May 2007 19:44 |
Tom Bruhl
Messages: 1368
Registered: June 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_002F_01C79354.C6D5E130
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dave,
Did it just get flakey or did the ADAT card not show up?
I installed a second on my rig and it shows up fine.
Just curious since I'm adding a couple 442s soon.
Mines about the same as yours as I understand it.
Tom
"Dave(EK Sound)" <audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca> wrote in message =
news:4643c91b$1@linux...
The installation of an adat card always demanded a=20
re-install of Paris under XP for me...
David.
Neil wrote:
> OK, well, I had it working & it sounded fucking great, then it
> quit working & I couldn't get it back. At first, I wasn't able
> to get it to sync to the digital (lightpipe) input from the MOTU
> 8-Pre, then I changed the Paris Sync settings a few times
> (toggled back & forth between Digital & Internal), got it to
> work on "Internal", but was getting some random clicks- toggled
> back & forth again a couple times, and finally got it to work
> on "internal" - no clicks. Was running the 4 Tom mics into
> channels 1-4 of the 8-Pre, then out through lightpipe to Paris'
> ADAT module at 44.1k, EQ-ing them, then summing those 4 channels
> in Live Mode into a stereo L/R Tom mix with NoLimit slammed
> across Paris' 2-Buss... Toms sounded fucking awesome... then
> took Paris main analog outs into the Multiface (had to go
> analog there since I record in Cubase at 88.2k) and voila'!=20
> Ass-kickin' tom sounds using Paris as a front-end!
>=20
> Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on how you look at
> it), I figured I'd better shut down the system & reboot to make
> sure I could get it to work tomorrow when I start recording
> this band that's coming in... good thing I did that tonight
> intead of waiting until tomorrow & dicking around, looking like
> an idiot, because when I rebooted, I couldn't get it to pass a
> signal this time. I had saved the project as the very last
> thing I did before I shut down, and so nothing was missed - I
> even verified connections, etc in the Patch Bay, and toggled
> back & forth a few times between Internal & other sync modes
> again, but nope... no signal from the 8-Pre was being seen by
> Paris... switched the MOTU to 88.2k and routed the lightpipe
> into one of my Multifaces & there it was - no problem with the
> MOTU digiblah outputs.
>=20
> SO, I wonder if this is just one of the Paris ADAT card
> weirdnesses I've heard so much about? It's a shame because:
> a.) The toms were sounding farkin' killer with some Paris EQ &
> NoLimit with zero lookahead on it, and:
> b.) Now I have to use four tracking channels for Toms (one for
> each tom) instead of a stereo L/R submix. A waste of resources.
>=20
> argh.
>=20
> More weirdness since installing the ADAT card... when I launch
> Paris, I get an error that says it was unable to launch & must
> shut down (Paris, not the PC)... first time I booted up tonight
> this happened once; relaunched Paris once I didn't get that
> error... 2nd time I booted up tonight, I got that error three
> times in a row before I was able to relaunch Paris without
> seeing it pop up.
>=20
> "Argh!" again.
>=20
> Neil
I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
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</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Dave,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Did it just get flakey or did the ADAT =
card not=20
show up?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I installed a second on my rig and it =
shows up=20
fine.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Just curious since I'm adding a couple =
442s=20
soon.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Mines about the same as yours as I =
understand=20
it.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Tom</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Dave(EK Sound)" <<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca">audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca</A>&g=
t;=20
wrote in message <A=20
href=3D"news:4643c91b$1@linux">news:4643c91b$1@linux</A>...</DIV>The=20
installation of an adat card always demanded a <BR>re-install of Paris =
under=20
XP for me...<BR><BR>David.<BR><BR>Neil wrote:<BR><BR>> OK, well, I =
had it=20
working & it sounded fucking great, then it<BR>> quit working =
& I=20
couldn't get it back. At first, I wasn't able<BR>> to get it to =
sync to the=20
digital (lightpipe) input from the MOTU<BR>> 8-Pre, then I changed =
the=20
Paris Sync settings a few times<BR>> (toggled back & forth =
between=20
Digital & Internal), got it to<BR>> work on "Internal", but was =
getting=20
some random clicks- toggled<BR>> back & forth again a couple =
times, and=20
finally got it to work<BR>> on "internal" - no clicks. Was running =
the 4=20
Tom mics into<BR>> channels 1-4 of the 8-Pre, then out through =
lightpipe to=20
Paris'<BR>> ADAT module at 44.1k, EQ-ing them, then summing those 4 =
channels<BR>> in Live Mode into a stereo L/R Tom mix with NoLimit=20
slammed<BR>> across Paris' 2-Buss... Toms sounded fucking =
awesome...=20
then<BR>> took Paris main analog outs into the Multiface (had to =
go<BR>>=20
analog there since I record in Cubase at 88.2k) and voila'! <BR>>=20
Ass-kickin' tom sounds using Paris as a front-end!<BR>> <BR>>=20
Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on how you look at<BR>> =
it), I=20
figured I'd better shut down the system & reboot to make<BR>> =
sure I=20
could get it to work tomorrow when I start recording<BR>> this band =
that's=20
coming in... good thing I did that tonight<BR>> intead of waiting =
until=20
tomorrow & dicking around, looking like<BR>> an idiot, because =
when I=20
rebooted, I couldn't get it to pass a<BR>> signal this time. I had =
saved=20
the project as the very last<BR>> thing I did before I shut down, =
and so=20
nothing was missed - I<BR>> even verified connections, etc in the =
Patch=20
Bay, and toggled<BR>> back & forth a few times between Internal =
&=20
other sync modes<BR>> again, but nope... no signal from the 8-Pre =
was being=20
seen by<BR>> Paris... switched the MOTU to 88.2k and routed the=20
lightpipe<BR>> into one of my Multifaces & there it was - no =
problem=20
with the<BR>> MOTU digiblah outputs.<BR>> <BR>> SO, I wonder =
if this=20
is just one of the Paris ADAT card<BR>> weirdnesses I've heard so =
much=20
about? It's a shame because:<BR>> a.) The toms were sounding =
farkin' killer=20
with some Paris EQ &<BR>> NoLimit with zero lookahead on it,=20
and:<BR>> b.) Now I have to use four tracking channels for Toms =
(one=20
for<BR>> each tom) instead of a stereo L/R submix. A waste of=20
resources.<BR>> <BR>> argh.<BR>> <BR>> More weirdness =
since=20
installing the ADAT card... when I launch<BR>> Paris, I get an =
error that=20
says it was unable to launch & must<BR>> shut down (Paris, not =
the=20
PC)... first time I booted up tonight<BR>> this happened once; =
relaunched=20
Paris once I didn't get that<BR>> error... 2nd time I booted up =
tonight, I=20
got that error three<BR>> times in a row before I was able to =
relaunch=20
Paris without<BR>> seeing it pop up.<BR>> <BR>> "Argh!"=20
again.<BR>> <BR>> Neil</BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><BR><BR>I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, =
and=20
you?<BR><A=20
href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html">http://www.polesoft.com/refer=
..html</A> </FONT></DIV></BODY ></HTML>
------=_NextPart_000_002F_01C79354.C6D5E130--
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| Re: Paris as a front-end console... UPDATE [message #84292 is a reply to message #84281] |
Thu, 10 May 2007 21:30 |
audioguy_editout_
Messages: 249
Registered: December 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
I would get error messages, or Paris would lock up. Once I
re-installed, it was fine. It seems to me that Paris takes
a hardware inventory the first time it runs.... but I don't
know for sure.
David.
Tom Bruhl wrote:
> Dave,
> Did it just get flakey or did the ADAT card not show up?
> I installed a second on my rig and it shows up fine.
> Just curious since I'm adding a couple 442s soon.
> Mines about the same as yours as I understand it.
> Tom
>
>
> "Dave(EK Sound)" <audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca
> <mailto:audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca>> wrote in message
> news:4643c91b$1@linux...
> The installation of an adat card always demanded a
> re-install of Paris under XP for me...
>
> David.
>
> Neil wrote:
>
> > OK, well, I had it working & it sounded fucking great, then it
> > quit working & I couldn't get it back. At first, I wasn't able
> > to get it to sync to the digital (lightpipe) input from the MOTU
> > 8-Pre, then I changed the Paris Sync settings a few times
> > (toggled back & forth between Digital & Internal), got it to
> > work on "Internal", but was getting some random clicks- toggled
> > back & forth again a couple times, and finally got it to work
> > on "internal" - no clicks. Was running the 4 Tom mics into
> > channels 1-4 of the 8-Pre, then out through lightpipe to Paris'
> > ADAT module at 44.1k, EQ-ing them, then summing those 4 channels
> > in Live Mode into a stereo L/R Tom mix with NoLimit slammed
> > across Paris' 2-Buss... Toms sounded fucking awesome... then
> > took Paris main analog outs into the Multiface (had to go
> > analog there since I record in Cubase at 88.2k) and voila'!
> > Ass-kickin' tom sounds using Paris as a front-end!
> >
> > Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on how you look at
> > it), I figured I'd better shut down the system & reboot to make
> > sure I could get it to work tomorrow when I start recording
> > this band that's coming in... good thing I did that tonight
> > intead of waiting until tomorrow & dicking around, looking like
> > an idiot, because when I rebooted, I couldn't get it to pass a
> > signal this time. I had saved the project as the very last
> > thing I did before I shut down, and so nothing was missed - I
> > even verified connections, etc in the Patch Bay, and toggled
> > back & forth a few times between Internal & other sync modes
> > again, but nope... no signal from the 8-Pre was being seen by
> > Paris... switched the MOTU to 88.2k and routed the lightpipe
> > into one of my Multifaces & there it was - no problem with the
> > MOTU digiblah outputs.
> >
> > SO, I wonder if this is just one of the Paris ADAT card
> > weirdnesses I've heard so much about? It's a shame because:
> > a.) The toms were sounding farkin' killer with some Paris EQ &
> > NoLimit with zero lookahead on it, and:
> > b.) Now I have to use four tracking channels for Toms (one for
> > each tom) instead of a stereo L/R submix. A waste of resources.
> >
> > argh.
> >
> > More weirdness since installing the ADAT card... when I launch
> > Paris, I get an error that says it was unable to launch & must
> > shut down (Paris, not the PC)... first time I booted up tonight
> > this happened once; relaunched Paris once I didn't get that
> > error... 2nd time I booted up tonight, I got that error three
> > times in a row before I was able to relaunch Paris without
> > seeing it pop up.
> >
> > "Argh!" again.
> >
> > Neil
>
>
>
> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
|
|
|
|
| Re: Paris as a front-end console... UPDATE [message #84297 is a reply to message #84292] |
Fri, 11 May 2007 01:25 |
Tom Bruhl
Messages: 1368
Registered: June 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_0082_01C79384.78E5F110
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dave,
That sounds right from what I've learned from Brian, Chris L.
and a few others around here. Deej?
Tom
"Dave(EK Sound)" <audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca> wrote in message =
news:4643f2d4$1@linux...
I would get error messages, or Paris would lock up. Once I=20
re-installed, it was fine. It seems to me that Paris takes=20
a hardware inventory the first time it runs.... but I don't=20
know for sure.
David.
Tom Bruhl wrote:
> Dave,
> Did it just get flakey or did the ADAT card not show up?
> I installed a second on my rig and it shows up fine.
> Just curious since I'm adding a couple 442s soon.
> Mines about the same as yours as I understand it.
> Tom
> =20
>=20
> "Dave(EK Sound)" <audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca
> <mailto:audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca>> wrote in message
> news:4643c91b$1@linux...
> The installation of an adat card always demanded a
> re-install of Paris under XP for me...
>=20
> David.
>=20
> Neil wrote:
>=20
> > OK, well, I had it working & it sounded fucking great, then =
it
> > quit working & I couldn't get it back. At first, I wasn't =
able
> > to get it to sync to the digital (lightpipe) input from the =
MOTU
> > 8-Pre, then I changed the Paris Sync settings a few times
> > (toggled back & forth between Digital & Internal), got it to
> > work on "Internal", but was getting some random clicks- =
toggled
> > back & forth again a couple times, and finally got it to work
> > on "internal" - no clicks. Was running the 4 Tom mics into
> > channels 1-4 of the 8-Pre, then out through lightpipe to =
Paris'
> > ADAT module at 44.1k, EQ-ing them, then summing those 4 =
channels
> > in Live Mode into a stereo L/R Tom mix with NoLimit slammed
> > across Paris' 2-Buss... Toms sounded fucking awesome... then
> > took Paris main analog outs into the Multiface (had to go
> > analog there since I record in Cubase at 88.2k) and voila'!
> > Ass-kickin' tom sounds using Paris as a front-end!
> >
> > Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on how you look at
> > it), I figured I'd better shut down the system & reboot to =
make
> > sure I could get it to work tomorrow when I start recording
> > this band that's coming in... good thing I did that tonight
> > intead of waiting until tomorrow & dicking around, looking =
like
> > an idiot, because when I rebooted, I couldn't get it to pass =
a
> > signal this time. I had saved the project as the very last
> > thing I did before I shut down, and so nothing was missed - I
> > even verified connections, etc in the Patch Bay, and toggled
> > back & forth a few times between Internal & other sync modes
> > again, but nope... no signal from the 8-Pre was being seen by
> > Paris... switched the MOTU to 88.2k and routed the lightpipe
> > into one of my Multifaces & there it was - no problem with =
the
> > MOTU digiblah outputs.
> >
> > SO, I wonder if this is just one of the Paris ADAT card
> > weirdnesses I've heard so much about? It's a shame because:
> > a.) The toms were sounding farkin' killer with some Paris EQ =
&
> > NoLimit with zero lookahead on it, and:
> > b.) Now I have to use four tracking channels for Toms (one =
for
> > each tom) instead of a stereo L/R submix. A waste of =
resources.
> >
> > argh.
> >
> > More weirdness since installing the ADAT card... when I =
launch
> > Paris, I get an error that says it was unable to launch & =
must
> > shut down (Paris, not the PC)... first time I booted up =
tonight
> > this happened once; relaunched Paris once I didn't get that
> > error... 2nd time I booted up tonight, I got that error three
> > times in a row before I was able to relaunch Paris without
> > seeing it pop up.
> >
> > "Argh!" again.
> >
> > Neil
>=20
>=20
>=20
> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
------=_NextPart_000_0082_01C79384.78E5F110
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charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1400" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Dave,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>That sounds right from what I've =
learned from=20
Brian, Chris L.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>and a few others around=20
here. & nbsp; & n=
bsp;=20
Deej?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Tom</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Dave(EK Sound)" <<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca">audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca</A>&g=
t;=20
wrote in message <A=20
href=3D"news:4643f2d4$1@linux">news:4643f2d4$1@linux</A>...</DIV>I =
would get=20
error messages, or Paris would lock up. Once I <BR>re-installed, =
it was=20
fine. It seems to me that Paris takes <BR>a hardware inventory =
the first=20
time it runs.... but I don't <BR>know for =
sure.<BR><BR>David.<BR><BR>Tom Bruhl=20
wrote:<BR>> Dave,<BR>> Did it just get flakey or did the ADAT =
card not=20
show up?<BR>> I installed a second on my rig and it shows up =
fine.<BR>>=20
Just curious since I'm adding a couple 442s soon.<BR>> Mines about =
the same=20
as yours as I understand it.<BR>> Tom<BR>> <BR>>=20
<BR>> "Dave(EK Sound)" <<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca">audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca</A><B=
R>> =20
<<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca">mailto:audioguy_editout_@shaw.c=
a</A>>>=20
wrote in message<BR>> <A=20
=
href=3D"news:4643c91b$1@linux">news:4643c91b$1@linux</A>...<BR>> =
=20
The installation of an adat card always demanded=20
a<BR>> re-install of Paris under XP for=20
me...<BR>> <BR>> David.<BR>>=20
<BR>> Neil wrote:<BR>>=20
<BR>> > OK, well, I had it working =
&=20
it sounded fucking great, then =
it<BR>> >=20
quit working & I couldn't get it back. At first, I wasn't=20
able<BR>> > to get it to sync to =
the=20
digital (lightpipe) input from the =
MOTU<BR> > =2 0
> 8-Pre, then I changed the Paris Sync settings a few=20
times<BR>> > (toggled back & =
forth=20
between Digital & Internal), got it=20
to<BR>> > work on "Internal", but =
was=20
getting some random clicks- =
toggled<BR>> >=20
back & forth again a couple times, and finally got it to=20
work<BR>> > on "internal" - no =
clicks. Was=20
running the 4 Tom mics into<BR>> > =
channels 1-4 of the 8-Pre, then out through lightpipe to=20
Paris'<BR>> > ADAT module at =
44.1k, EQ-ing=20
them, then summing those 4 =
channels<BR>> >=20
in Live Mode into a stereo L/R Tom mix with NoLimit=20
slammed<BR>> > across Paris' =
2-Buss...=20
Toms sounded fucking awesome... =
then<BR> > =2 0
> took Paris main analog outs into the Multiface (had to=20
go<BR>> > analog there since I =
record in=20
Cubase at 88.2k) and voila'!<BR>> =
>=20
Ass-kickin' tom sounds using Paris as a=20
front-end!<BR> > =2 0
><BR>> > Unfortunately (or =
fortunately,=20
depending on how you look at<BR>> =
> it), I=20
figured I'd better shut down the system & reboot to=20
make<BR>> > sure I could get it to =
work=20
tomorrow when I start recording<BR>> =
>=20
this band that's coming in... good thing I did that=20
tonight<BR>> > intead of waiting =
until=20
tomorrow & dicking around, looking=20
like<BR>> > an idiot, because when =
I=20
rebooted, I couldn't get it to pass =
a<BR> > =2 0
> signal this time. I had saved the project as the very=20
last<BR>> > thing I did before I =
shut=20
down, and so nothing was missed - =
I<BR>> >=20
even verified connections, etc in the Patch Bay, and=20
toggled<BR>> > back & forth a =
few=20
times between Internal & other sync=20
modes<BR>> > again, but nope... no =
signal=20
from the 8-Pre was being seen by<BR>> =
>=20
Paris... switched the MOTU to 88.2k and routed the=20
lightpipe<BR>> > into one of my =
Multifaces=20
& there it was - no problem with =
the<BR> > =2 0
> MOTU digiblah outputs.<BR> > =2 0
><BR>> > SO, I wonder if this =
is just=20
one of the Paris ADAT card<BR>> >=20
weirdnesses I've heard so much about? It's a shame=20
because:<BR>> > a.) The toms were =
sounding=20
farkin' killer with some Paris EQ =
&<BR> > =2 0
> NoLimit with zero lookahead on it,=20
and:<BR>> > b.) Now I have to use =
four=20
tracking channels for Toms (one =
for<BR>> >=20
each tom) instead of a stereo L/R submix. A waste of=20
resources.<BR> > =2 0
><BR>> >=20
argh.<BR> > =2 0
><BR>> > More weirdness since=20
installing the ADAT card... when I=20
launch<BR>> > Paris, I get an =
error that=20
says it was unable to launch & =
must<BR> > =2 0
> shut down (Paris, not the PC)... first time I booted up=20
tonight<BR>> > this happened once; =
relaunched Paris once I didn't get =
that<BR> > =2 0
> error... 2nd time I booted up tonight, I got that error=20
three<BR>> > times in a row before =
I was=20
able to relaunch Paris without<BR>> =
>=20
seeing it pop up.<BR> > =2 0
><BR>> > "Argh!"=20
again.<BR> > =2 0
><BR>> > Neil<BR>> <BR>> =
<BR>>=20
<BR>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?<BR>> <A =
=
href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html">http://www.polesoft.com/refer=
..html</A></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
------=_NextPart_000_0082_01C79384.78E5F110--
|
|
|
|
| Re: Paris as a front-end console... UPDATE [message #84302 is a reply to message #84297] |
Fri, 11 May 2007 06:02 |
Neil
Messages: 1645
Registered: April 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
In my case I got that error meassge on startup as Paris was
trying to launch, then Paris would fail to lunch; one time, it
launched just fine on the scond try, the next time it took me
two tries. In each case when it DID launch sucessfully, the
ADAT card did indeed show up (I have an ADAT module & an 8-in
in the same MEC - both of them were showing up).
I didn't get a chance last night to try those tweaks, after
all, tonight I should be able to.
Neil
"Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>Dave,
>That sounds right from what I've learned from Brian, Chris L.
>and a few others around here. Deej?
>Tom
>
>
> "Dave(EK Sound)" <audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca> wrote in message =
>news:4643f2d4$1@linux...
> I would get error messages, or Paris would lock up. Once I=20
> re-installed, it was fine. It seems to me that Paris takes=20
> a hardware inventory the first time it runs.... but I don't=20
> know for sure.
>
> David.
>
> Tom Bruhl wrote:
> > Dave,
> > Did it just get flakey or did the ADAT card not show up?
> > I installed a second on my rig and it shows up fine.
> > Just curious since I'm adding a couple 442s soon.
> > Mines about the same as yours as I understand it.
> > Tom
> > =20
> >=20
> > "Dave(EK Sound)" <audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca
> > <mailto:audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca>> wrote in message
> > news:4643c91b$1@linux...
> > The installation of an adat card always demanded a
> > re-install of Paris under XP for me...
> >=20
> > David.
> >=20
> > Neil wrote:
> >=20
> > > OK, well, I had it working & it sounded fucking great, then =
>it
> > > quit working & I couldn't get it back. At first, I wasn't =
>able
> > > to get it to sync to the digital (lightpipe) input from the =
>MOTU
> > > 8-Pre, then I changed the Paris Sync settings a few times
> > > (toggled back & forth between Digital & Internal), got it to
> > > work on "Internal", but was getting some random clicks- =
>toggled
> > > back & forth again a couple times, and finally got it to work
> > > on "internal" - no clicks. Was running the 4 Tom mics into
> > > channels 1-4 of the 8-Pre, then out through lightpipe to =
>Paris'
> > > ADAT module at 44.1k, EQ-ing them, then summing those 4 =
>channels
> > > in Live Mode into a stereo L/R Tom mix with NoLimit slammed
> > > across Paris' 2-Buss... Toms sounded fucking awesome... then
> > > took Paris main analog outs into the Multiface (had to go
> > > analog there since I record in Cubase at 88.2k) and voila'!
> > > Ass-kickin' tom sounds using Paris as a front-end!
> > >
> > > Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on how you look at
> > > it), I figured I'd better shut down the system & reboot to =
>make
> > > sure I could get it to work tomorrow when I start recording
> > > this band that's coming in... good thing I did that tonight
> > > intead of waiting until tomorrow & dicking around, looking =
>like
> > > an idiot, because when I rebooted, I couldn't get it to pass
=
>a
> > > signal this time. I had saved the project as the very last
> > > thing I did before I shut down, and so nothing was missed - I
> > > even verified connections, etc in the Patch Bay, and toggled
> > > back & forth a few times between Internal & other sync modes
> > > again, but nope... no signal from the 8-Pre was being seen by
> > > Paris... switched the MOTU to 88.2k and routed the lightpipe
> > > into one of my Multifaces & there it was - no problem with =
>the
> > > MOTU digiblah outputs.
> > >
> > > SO, I wonder if this is just one of the Paris ADAT card
> > > weirdnesses I've heard so much about? It's a shame because:
> > > a.) The toms were sounding farkin' killer with some Paris EQ
=
>&
> > > NoLimit with zero lookahead on it, and:
> > > b.) Now I have to use four tracking channels for Toms (one =
>for
> > > each tom) instead of a stereo L/R submix. A waste of =
>resources.
> > >
> > > argh.
> > >
> > > More weirdness since installing the ADAT card... when I =
>launch
> > > Paris, I get an error that says it was unable to launch & =
>must
> > > shut down (Paris, not the PC)... first time I booted up =
>tonight
> > > this happened once; relaunched Paris once I didn't get that
> > > error... 2nd time I booted up tonight, I got that error three
> > > times in a row before I was able to relaunch Paris without
> > > seeing it pop up.
> > >
> > > "Argh!" again.
> > >
> > > Neil
> >=20
> >=20
> >=20
> > I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
> > http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>
><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
><HTML><HEAD>
><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1400" name=3DGENERATOR>
><STYLE></STYLE>
></HEAD>
><BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Dave,</FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>That sounds right from what I've =
>learned from=20
>Brian, Chris L.</FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>and a few others around=20
>here. &n=
>bsp;=20
>Deej?</FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Tom</FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
><BLOCKQUOTE=20
>style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
>BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
> <DIV>"Dave(EK Sound)" <<A=20
> =
>href=3D"mailto:audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca">audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca</A>&g=
>t;=20
> wrote in message <A=20
> href=3D"news:4643f2d4$1@linux">news:4643f2d4$1@linux</A>...</DIV>I =
>would get=20
> error messages, or Paris would lock up. Once I <BR>re-installed, =
>it was=20
> fine. It seems to me that Paris takes <BR>a hardware inventory =
>the first=20
> time it runs.... but I don't <BR>know for =
>sure.<BR><BR>David.<BR><BR>Tom Bruhl=20
> wrote:<BR>> Dave,<BR>> Did it just get flakey or did the ADAT =
>card not=20
> show up?<BR>> I installed a second on my rig and it shows up =
>fine.<BR>>=20
> Just curious since I'm adding a couple 442s soon.<BR>> Mines about =
>the same=20
> as yours as I understand it.<BR>> Tom<BR>> <BR>>=20
> <BR>> "Dave(EK Sound)" <<A=20
> =
>href=3D"mailto:audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca">audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca</A><B=
>R>> =20
> <<A=20
> =
>href=3D"mailto:audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca">mailto:audioguy_editout_@shaw.c=
>a</A>>>=20
> wrote in message<BR>> <A=20
> =
>href=3D"news:4643c91b$1@linux">news:4643c91b$1@linux</A>...<BR>> =
> =20
> The installation of an adat card always demanded=20
> a<BR>> re-install of Paris under XP for=20
> me...<BR>> <BR>> David.<BR>>=20
> <BR>> Neil wrote:<BR>>=20
> <BR>> > OK, well, I had it working =
>&=20
> it sounded fucking great, then =
>it<BR>> >=20
> quit working & I couldn't get it back. At first, I wasn't=20
> able<BR>> > to get it to sync to =
>the=20
> digital (lightpipe) input from the =
>MOTU<BR>> =20
> > 8-Pre, then I changed the Paris Sync settings a few=20
> times<BR>> > (toggled back & =
>forth=20
> between Digital & Internal), got it=20
> to<BR>> > work on "Internal", but =
>was=20
> getting some random clicks- =
>toggled<BR>> >=20
> back & forth again a couple times, and finally got it to=20
> work<BR>> > on "internal" - no =
>clicks. Was=20
> running the 4 Tom mics into<BR>> > =
>
> channels 1-4 of the 8-Pre, then out through lightpipe to=20
> Paris'<BR>> > ADAT module at =
>44.1k, EQ-ing=20
> them, then summing those 4 =
>channels<BR>> >=20
> in Live Mode into a stereo L/R Tom mix with NoLimit=20
> slammed<BR>> > across Paris' =
>2-Buss...=20
> Toms sounded fucking awesome... =
>then<BR>> =20
> > took Paris main analog outs into the Multiface (had to=20
> go<BR>> > analog there since I =
>record in=20
> Cubase at 88.2k) and voila'!<BR>> =
>>=20
> Ass-kickin' tom sounds using Paris as a=20
> front-end!<BR>> =20
> ><BR>> > Unfortunately (or =
>fortunately,=20
> depending on how you look at<BR>> =
>> it), I=20
> figured I'd better shut down the system & reboot to=20
> make<BR>> > sure I could get it to =
>work=20
> tomorrow when I start recording<BR>> =
>>=20
> this band that's coming in... good thing I did that=20
> tonight<BR>> > intead of waiting =
>until=20
> tomorrow & dicking around, looking=20
> like<BR>> > an idiot, because when =
>I=20
> rebooted, I couldn't get it to pass =
>a<BR>> =20
> > signal this time. I had saved the project as the very=20
> last<BR>> > thing I did before I =
>shut=20
> down, and so nothing was missed - =
>I<BR>> >=20
> even verified connections, etc in the Patch Bay, and=20
> toggled<BR>> > back & forth a =
>few=20
> times between Internal & other sync=20
> modes<BR>> > again, but nope... no =
>signal=20
> from the 8-Pre was being seen by<BR>> =
>>=20
> Paris... switched the MOTU to 88.2k and routed the=20
> lightpipe<BR>> > into one of my =
>Multifaces=20
> & there it was - no problem with =
>the<BR>> =20
> > MOTU digiblah outputs.<BR>> =20
> ><BR>> > SO, I wonder if this =
>is just=20
> one of the Paris ADAT card<BR>> >=20
> weirdnesses I've heard so much about? It's a shame=20
> because:<BR>> > a.) The toms were =
>sounding=20
> farkin' killer with some Paris EQ =
>&<BR>> =20
> > NoLimit with zero lookahead on it,=20
> and:<BR>> > b.) Now I have to use =
>four=20
> tracking channels for Toms (one =
>for<BR>> >=20
> each tom) instead of a stereo L/R submix. A waste of=20
> resources.<BR>> =20
> ><BR>> >=20
> argh.<BR>> =20
> ><BR>> > More weirdness since=20
> installing the ADAT card... when I=20
> launch<BR>> > Paris, I get an =
>error that=20
> says it was unable to launch & =
>must<BR>> =20
> > shut down (Paris, not the PC)... first time I booted up=20
> tonight<BR>> > this happened once; =
>
> relaunched Paris once I didn't get =
>that<BR>> =20
> > error... 2nd time I booted up tonight, I got that error=20
> three<BR>> > times in a row before =
>I was=20
> able to relaunch Paris without<BR>> =
>>=20
> seeing it pop up.<BR>> =20
> ><BR>> > "Argh!"=20
> again.<BR>> =20
> ><BR>> > Neil<BR>> <BR>> =
><BR>>=20
> <BR>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?<BR>> <A =
>
> =
>href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html">http://www.polesoft.com/refer=
>.html</A></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
>
>
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