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Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing hype? [message #96280]

Mon, 25 February 2008 15:46

Dedric Terry

Messages: 788
Registered: June 2007

Senior Member

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http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=3D6693909 #6693909 =
(should take you to the next to last post on that page)

Apparently Apogee's numbers are only while tracking. Sounds like they =
only posted part of the story with their great low latency figures.
It is hard to say if this is the case for everyone though, except for =
Apogee's response when the user called, but since I brought it up in the =
Vista thread, I thought I would pass it along to try and sort through =
marketing myth and real world facts. I was actually kind of hoping the =
Apogee Symphony would smoke at low latency with Core audio and any app, =
just because it would be cool to have such a breakthrough, but this =
really just shows that ASIO is pushing the limits of current OSs =
already, and we haven't really exceeded it yet.

The reports on Nuendo performance is quite a bit faster on XP and ASIO2, =
but it's running fine at low latency on
OSX/core audio - just about 20-30% higher (my adjusted estimate) plugin =
load on the same hardware, same latency: it's really 76 Nuendo multiband =
comps at 64 samples on XP/ASIO, vs 45 on OSX/core audio at 64, which is =
almost 50% more, but I'm assuming there are other plugins in that =
benchmark test to compensate for, and vary part of that loading (I'll =
have to find out for sure when I have more time) - same dual quad =
hardware configs in both cases. I don't know for sure if some of this =
is Nuendo not being optimized for the lower level OSX code base (maybe =
already), or still on Cocoa or whatever - or if it is truly a limitation =
of OSX and core audio. Based on the Logic thread, the latter seems to =
have a bit more weight than it being a Nuendo-only performance issue.

Fwiw,
Dedric

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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><A=20
href=3D" http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=3D6693909 #6693=
909"> http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=3D6693909 #6693909=
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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Apparently Apogee's numbers =
are only=20
while tracking.  Sounds like they only posted part of the story =
with their=20
great low latency figures.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>It is hard to say if this is the case =
for everyone=20
though, except for Apogee's response when the user called, but since I =
brought=20
it up in the Vista thread, I thought I would pass it along to try and =
sort=20
through marketing myth and real world facts.  I was actually kind =
of hoping=20
the Apogee Symphony would smoke at low latency with </FONT><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>Core audio and any app, just because it would be cool to have =
such a=20
breakthrough, but this really </FONT><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>just =
shows that=20
ASIO is pushing the limits of current OSs already, and we haven't really =

exceeded it yet.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The reports on Nuendo performance is =
quite a bit=20
faster on XP and ASIO2, but it's running fine at low latency =
on</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>OSX/core audio - just about 20-30% =
higher (my=20
adjusted estimate) plugin load on the same hardware, same=20
latency: it's really 76 Nuendo multiband comps at 64 samples on =
XP/ASIO, vs=20
45 on OSX/core audio at 64, which is almost 50% more, </FONT><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>but I'm assuming there are other plugins in that =
benchmark test to=20
compensate for, and vary part of that loading (I'll have to find =
out for=20
sure when I have more time) - same dual quad hardware configs in =
both=20
cases.  I don't know for sure if some of this is Nuendo not being =
optimized=20
for the lower level OSX code base (maybe already), or still on Cocoa or =
whatever=20
- or if it is truly a limitation of OSX and core audio.  Based on =
the Logic=20
thread, the latter seems to have a bit more weight than it being a =
Nuendo-only=20
performance issue.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Fwiw,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Dedric</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><BR clear=3Dleft><BR></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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[Message index]

		Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing hype? By: Dedric Terry on Mon, 25 February 2008 15:46
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing hype? By: excelav on Mon, 25 February 2008 17:30
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or marketing hype? By: Dedric Terry on Mon, 25 February 2008 17:11
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or marketing hype? By: excelav on Mon, 25 February 2008 19:15
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or marketing hype? By: Dedric Terry on Mon, 25 February 2008 18:34
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or marketing hype? By: excelav on Mon, 25 February 2008 20:14
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeinghype? By: Chris Ludwig on Mon, 25 February 2008 21:20
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing hype? By: Deej [5] on Mon, 25 February 2008 21:38
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing hype? By: Deej [5] on Mon, 25 February 2008 21:39
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeinghype? By: Chris Ludwig on Tue, 26 February 2008 10:10
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: LaMontt on Tue, 26 February 2008 18:22
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: Dedric Terry on Tue, 26 February 2008 17:34
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: Aaron Allen on Tue, 26 February 2008 19:01
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: Neil on Wed, 27 February 2008 00:58
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: LaMontt on Wed, 27 February 2008 09:40
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: Neil on Wed, 27 February 2008 10:33
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: LaMontt on Wed, 27 February 2008 10:48
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: Deej [5] on Wed, 27 February 2008 09:25
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: LaMontt on Wed, 27 February 2008 10:56
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: Bill L on Wed, 27 February 2008 11:50
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: LaMontt on Wed, 27 February 2008 13:58
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: TCB on Wed, 27 February 2008 16:23
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: LaMont on Thu, 28 February 2008 08:41
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: Dedric Terry on Thu, 28 February 2008 08:33
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: LaMontt on Thu, 28 February 2008 10:46
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: TCB on Thu, 28 February 2008 11:34
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: excelav on Tue, 26 February 2008 21:46
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: TCB on Wed, 27 February 2008 07:57
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: AlexPlasko on Thu, 28 February 2008 11:00
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: LaMontt on Thu, 28 February 2008 12:35
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: AlexPlasko on Thu, 28 February 2008 11:43
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: LaMontt on Thu, 28 February 2008 17:22
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: AlexPlasko on Fri, 29 February 2008 07:54
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: LaMontt on Fri, 29 February 2008 09:14
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: AlexPlasko on Fri, 29 February 2008 13:43
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: Neil on Fri, 29 February 2008 17:17
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: AlexPlasko on Fri, 29 February 2008 17:46
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: LaMontt on Fri, 29 February 2008 20:23
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: LaMontt on Fri, 29 February 2008 19:44
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: Dedric Terry on Thu, 28 February 2008 12:21
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: LaMontt on Thu, 28 February 2008 17:24
		Re: Apogee with Core audio - low latency breakthrough or markeing By: LaMontt on Thu, 28 February 2008 17:34

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