Home » The PARIS Forums » PARIS: Main » OT: FYI BYOC guitar pedals deal
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| Rant: Boutique/Vintage BS,... [message #91451 is a reply to message #91433] |
Mon, 15 October 2007 07:38   |
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I checked out one of those Behringer Pedals, and they sound 'Better' than
Roland-Boss pedals. Hands down.
Note: I've been playing the guitar for over 30 years now and I've owned pretty
every boss pedal thru the years. My point:
Boss pedals we're not that good then. And you purchased them when you could
not afford a MRX or Elect-Harmonix pedal unit.
Boss prices are outlandish!! Even more, so is this new so-called boutique
fx pedal market. $200-300 hundred for a distortion box.. Pleassee!!
This whole boutique/vintage market BS that's being perpetrated on the pro-audio
world is just that BS. The fact that some of us buy this stuff and Feel like
a king when we make such ridiculous purchases. 5K-7K for a Mic that sound
wise can be had today for around $500.00 bucks.
I think this whole boutique /Vinatge market push being pushed by the old-guard
engineers that does not wnat to let go of:
-Work flow methods
-Sound of recordings
Let's take soudn of recording..Most of the pro-audio market is being held
hostage by this old guard and these guys live in a 1960-70's sound quality
mind-set. Real innovation and technology has been held hostage by companies
trying to accomodate this audience.
Even though great sounding records can and Are being made using new tools
and high sample rates (Neil comes to mind) with In The Box summing, the old
guard companies like SSL, Neve, Trident have rose from the dead and are trying
to sell 100k feature-less mixers. Once again, insistng that we turn the clock
around and accomodate these old farts :)..
Hey, do'nt get me wrong, I like a trained on the old stuff from the 70's
and 80's. I have that sound imprinted in my head. But, If I'm honest, a good
mondern mix kills any of those mixes by leaps and bounds. Problem is, we
have to start mixing by the rules of digital..
Okay Rant off..
"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>
>
>Buy any 4 kits, get any 4 kits free. Free kits will be of equal or =
>lesser value. One day only! Oct 15th. While supplies last. No =
>rainchecks. Add all 8 kits to your cart. Enter "moving sale" in the =
>coupon code at checkout. 4 free kit limit.
>
>
>http://www.buildyourownclone.com
>
>I built/use their MXR90 clone, they are good pedals. If you're in the =
>market to build, this is the time to do it.
>AA
>
><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
><HTML><HEAD>
><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.6000.16544" name=3DGENERATOR>
><STYLE></STYLE>
></HEAD>
><BODY>
><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>29px"><FONT=20
>face=3DArial size=3D2>Buy any 4 kits, get any 4 kits free. Free =
>kits will be=20
>of equal or lesser value. One day only! Oct 15th. =
> While=20
>supplies last. No rainchecks. Add all 8 kits to your=20
>cart. Enter "moving sale" in the coupon code at checkout. =
> 4=20
>free kit limit.</FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>29px"><FONT=20
>face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>29px"><FONT=20
>face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>29px"><A=20
>href=3D"http://www.buildyourownclone.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>http://www.buildyourownclone.com</FONT></A></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>29px"><FONT=20
>face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>29px"><FONT=20
>face=3DArial size=3D2><EM>I built/use their MXR90 clone, they are good =
>pedals. If=20
>you're in the market to build, this is the time to do=20
>it.</EM></FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>29px"><EM><FONT=20
>face=3DArial size=3D2>AA</FONT></EM></SPAN></SPAN></DIV></BODY></HTML >
>
>
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| Re: Rant: Boutique/Vintage BS,... [message #91461 is a reply to message #91451] |
Mon, 15 October 2007 12:46 |
Bill L
Messages: 766
Registered: August 2006
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Senior Member |
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Don't get me started...
Actually, since the '80s when I built my first guitar rack, I haven't
used any pedals except midi controllers, wah and volume.
Hey, but different strokes, right?
LaMont wrote:
> I checked out one of those Behringer Pedals, and they sound 'Better' than
> Roland-Boss pedals. Hands down.
>
> Note: I've been playing the guitar for over 30 years now and I've owned pretty
> every boss pedal thru the years. My point:
>
> Boss pedals we're not that good then. And you purchased them when you could
> not afford a MRX or Elect-Harmonix pedal unit.
>
> Boss prices are outlandish!! Even more, so is this new so-called boutique
> fx pedal market. $200-300 hundred for a distortion box.. Pleassee!!
>
> This whole boutique/vintage market BS that's being perpetrated on the pro-audio
> world is just that BS. The fact that some of us buy this stuff and Feel like
> a king when we make such ridiculous purchases. 5K-7K for a Mic that sound
> wise can be had today for around $500.00 bucks.
>
> I think this whole boutique /Vinatge market push being pushed by the old-guard
> engineers that does not wnat to let go of:
>
> -Work flow methods
> -Sound of recordings
>
> Let's take soudn of recording..Most of the pro-audio market is being held
> hostage by this old guard and these guys live in a 1960-70's sound quality
> mind-set. Real innovation and technology has been held hostage by companies
> trying to accomodate this audience.
>
> Even though great sounding records can and Are being made using new tools
> and high sample rates (Neil comes to mind) with In The Box summing, the old
> guard companies like SSL, Neve, Trident have rose from the dead and are trying
> to sell 100k feature-less mixers. Once again, insistng that we turn the clock
> around and accomodate these old farts :)..
>
> Hey, do'nt get me wrong, I like a trained on the old stuff from the 70's
> and 80's. I have that sound imprinted in my head. But, If I'm honest, a good
> mondern mix kills any of those mixes by leaps and bounds. Problem is, we
> have to start mixing by the rules of digital..
>
> Okay Rant off..
>
>
>
> "Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>
>> Buy any 4 kits, get any 4 kits free. Free kits will be of equal or =
>> lesser value. One day only! Oct 15th. While supplies last. No =
>> rainchecks. Add all 8 kits to your cart. Enter "moving sale" in the =
>> coupon code at checkout. 4 free kit limit.
>>
>>
>> http://www.buildyourownclone.com
>>
>> I built/use their MXR90 clone, they are good pedals. If you're in the =
>> market to build, this is the time to do it.
>> AA
>>
>> <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
>> <HTML><HEAD>
>> <META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>> charset=3Diso-8859-1">
>> <META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.6000.16544" name=3DGENERATOR>
>> <STYLE></STYLE>
>> </HEAD>
>> <BODY>
>> <DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>> 29px"><FONT=20
>> face=3DArial size=3D2>Buy any 4 kits, get any 4 kits free. Free =
>> kits will be=20
>> of equal or lesser value. One day only! Oct 15th. =
>> While=20
>> supplies last. No rainchecks. Add all 8 kits to your=20
>> cart. Enter "moving sale" in the coupon code at checkout. =
>> 4=20
>> free kit limit.</FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
>> <DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>> 29px"><FONT=20
>> face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
>> <DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>> 29px"><FONT=20
>> face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
>> <DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>> 29px"><A=20
>> href=3D"http://www.buildyourownclone.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>> size=3D2>http://www.buildyourownclone.com</FONT></A></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
>> <DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>> 29px"><FONT=20
>> face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
>> <DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>> 29px"><FONT=20
>> face=3DArial size=3D2><EM>I built/use their MXR90 clone, they are good =
>> pedals. If=20
>> you're in the market to build, this is the time to do=20
>> it.</EM></FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
>> <DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>> 29px"><EM><FONT=20
>> face=3DArial size=3D2>AA</FONT></EM></SPAN></SPAN></DIV></BODY></HTML >
>>
>>
>
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| Re: Boutique/Vintage BS,... [message #91471 is a reply to message #91451] |
Mon, 15 October 2007 15:55 |
Aaron Allen
Messages: 1988
Registered: May 2008
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Senior Member |
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You've missed my point. This is for the DIY gearhead types that aren't
looking to pay several hundred bucks for a *used* vintage pedal on ebay when
it can be had/built new for $70.... or did I miss the point you are making?
AA
"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote in message news:47137b63@linux...
>
> I checked out one of those Behringer Pedals, and they sound 'Better' than
> Roland-Boss pedals. Hands down.
>
> Note: I've been playing the guitar for over 30 years now and I've owned
> pretty
> every boss pedal thru the years. My point:
>
> Boss pedals we're not that good then. And you purchased them when you
> could
> not afford a MRX or Elect-Harmonix pedal unit.
>
> Boss prices are outlandish!! Even more, so is this new so-called boutique
> fx pedal market. $200-300 hundred for a distortion box.. Pleassee!!
>
> This whole boutique/vintage market BS that's being perpetrated on the
> pro-audio
> world is just that BS. The fact that some of us buy this stuff and Feel
> like
> a king when we make such ridiculous purchases. 5K-7K for a Mic that sound
> wise can be had today for around $500.00 bucks.
>
> I think this whole boutique /Vinatge market push being pushed by the
> old-guard
> engineers that does not wnat to let go of:
>
> -Work flow methods
> -Sound of recordings
>
> Let's take soudn of recording..Most of the pro-audio market is being held
> hostage by this old guard and these guys live in a 1960-70's sound
> quality
> mind-set. Real innovation and technology has been held hostage by
> companies
> trying to accomodate this audience.
>
> Even though great sounding records can and Are being made using new tools
> and high sample rates (Neil comes to mind) with In The Box summing, the
> old
> guard companies like SSL, Neve, Trident have rose from the dead and are
> trying
> to sell 100k feature-less mixers. Once again, insistng that we turn the
> clock
> around and accomodate these old farts :)..
>
> Hey, do'nt get me wrong, I like a trained on the old stuff from the 70's
> and 80's. I have that sound imprinted in my head. But, If I'm honest, a
> good
> mondern mix kills any of those mixes by leaps and bounds. Problem is, we
> have to start mixing by the rules of digital..
>
> Okay Rant off..
>
>
>
> "Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>
>>
>>Buy any 4 kits, get any 4 kits free. Free kits will be of equal or =
>>lesser value. One day only! Oct 15th. While supplies last. No =
>>rainchecks. Add all 8 kits to your cart. Enter "moving sale" in the =
>>coupon code at checkout. 4 free kit limit.
>>
>>
>>http://www.buildyourownclone.com
>>
>>I built/use their MXR90 clone, they are good pedals. If you're in the =
>>market to build, this is the time to do it.
>>AA
>>
>><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
>><HTML><HEAD>
>><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
>><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.6000.16544" name=3DGENERATOR>
>><STYLE></STYLE>
>></HEAD>
>><BODY>
>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>29px"><FONT=20
>>face=3DArial size=3D2>Buy any 4 kits, get any 4 kits free. Free =
>>kits will be=20
>>of equal or lesser value. One day only! Oct 15th. =
>> While=20
>>supplies last. No rainchecks. Add all 8 kits to your=20
>>cart. Enter "moving sale" in the coupon code at checkout. =
>> 4=20
>>free kit limit.</FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>29px"><FONT=20
>>face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>29px"><FONT=20
>>face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>29px"><A=20
>>href=3D"http://www.buildyourownclone.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>http://www.buildyourownclone.com</FONT></A></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>29px"><FONT=20
>>face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>29px"><FONT=20
>>face=3DArial size=3D2><EM>I built/use their MXR90 clone, they are good =
>>pedals. If=20
>>you're in the market to build, this is the time to do=20
>>it.</EM></FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>29px"><EM><FONT=20
>>face=3DArial size=3D2>AA</FONT></EM></SPAN></SPAN></DIV></BODY></HTML >
>>
>>
>
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| Re: Rant: Boutique/Vintage BS,... [message #91475 is a reply to message #91451] |
Mon, 15 October 2007 17:45 |
Neil
Messages: 1645
Registered: April 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>I checked out one of those Behringer Pedals, and they
>sound 'Better' than Roland-Boss pedals. Hands down.
AND... they now come with their own built-in halon dispensing
systems inside! lol :D
>Note: I've been playing the guitar for over 30 years now and
>I've owned pretty every boss pedal thru the years. My point:
>
>Boss pedals we're not that good then. And you purchased them
>when you could not afford a MRX or Elect-Harmonix pedal unit.
Actually, ISTR that E-H had a good amount of stuff that was
cheaper than some of the Boss units "back in the day". The
bigger E-H goodies like the Deluxe Memory Man - yeah those were
kinda pricey. The Boss stuff right outta the box sounded
CLEANER, though... the Electro-Harmonix Noise Gate was the only
noise gate ever made that actually ADDED noise lol.
I think it was the sound quality & lack of having something
that sounded like you were mic'ing a bagful of bees & snakes
and mixing it in with your guitar signal that got Boss
widespread usage. MXR = different type of sound - their stuff
all had a certain not-too-versatile signature kinda sound... IOW
it sounded good, but if you used their Distortion+, it had one
tone to it, no matter where you set it, same with their
phaser; so when Boss & Ibanez, etc. came out with useful, more
versatile AND affordable good-sounding EFX, they took off.
>This whole boutique/vintage market BS that's being perpetrated on the pro-audio
>world is just that BS. The fact that some of us buy this stuff and Feel
like
>a king when we make such ridiculous purchases. 5K-7K for a Mic that sound
>wise can be had today for around $500.00 bucks.
I'm with ya there - which is why I own what I own & don't have
even a single veentagee' mic (although i don't know about your
choice of the $500 price point as a reference).
>I think this whole boutique /Vinatge market push being pushed
>by the old-guard engineers that does not wnat to let go of:
>-Work flow methods
>-Sound of recordings
Personally I have a feeling that a BIG part of the whole "OTB"
mixing penchant has less to do with the sound, it's just
that if you're a big-name producer/mixerguy & you mix
exclusivly ITB, then some hack second engineer can simply copy
all your channel settings & "learn" how to mix just like you
do... and then if he's successful at it, he can then go around &
undercut you & get the same results. The real chance of this
individual actually being able to replicate someone's style
simply by doing this = pretty slim, indeed. The fear of this
happening = pretty significant, I betcha.
TotalRecall may capture every knob position on your SSL, but it
doesn't know squat about what outboard gear you used & how it
was set, and that's a big part of the sound of a mix,
but "Copy all Channel Settings" on a completely ITB mix sure
does!
>Let's take soudn of recording..Most of the pro-audio market is
>being held hostage by this old guard and these guys live in a
>1960-70's sound quality mind-set. Real innovation and
>technology has been held hostage by companies trying to
>accomodate this audience.
I agree & disagree at the same time. there is a lot of old-
skewl mentality around, but I wouldn't say it's holding anyone
hostage - there's nothing to stop anyone from moving in their
own direction, and there's plenty of gear out there that will
accommodate this. Get some high-rez mics, pres & convertors,
some kind of setup on the recording side that will handle
plenty of tracks at high sample rates, and as many VSTi's as
you want to run, and you're about as far away from that old
school as you can get (whether there are oleanders growing
outside your door or not lol!).
Personally, I think part of it is just a longing for a certain
sound - a sound that's practically as good as gone as a dated
genre of music in & of itself. Tape sounded a certain way,
digital sounds another way, I like aspects of both & I miss
tape in a way, but hey, it's a new century.
>Even though great sounding records can and Are being made
>using new tools and high sample rates (Neil comes to mind)
>with In The Box summing,
Why, thank you! lol :D
>the old guard companies like SSL, Neve, Trident have rose from
>the dead and are trying to sell 100k feature-less mixers.
Yeah, but since technology marches forward bringing costs down,
NOW you can also get $3k mixers that - if the hype on the new
MTA stuff is true (check out various gearslutz threads on
these) - sound like some of the baddest mofo desks EVER!
>Hey, do'nt get me wrong, I like a trained on the old stuff
>from the 70's and 80's. I have that sound imprinted in my
>head. But, If I'm honest, a good mondern mix kills any of
>those mixes by leaps and bounds.
I like a lot of modern mixes, but I also still like - and will
probably always like - a lot of the older stuff, too. Example:
the other day I'm driving in the car & the Manfred Mann cover
of "Blinded by the Light" comes on, as I was going along
listening it occured to me what a great mix that is - I don't
think you could make that mix any better no matter
where/how/when, and on what format you recorded it to. It's
just a killer mix! Could it be "different"? Sure, but what
could make it "better", nothing - I really think they nailed it.
>Problem is, we have to start mixing by the rules of digital..
Not if guys like Charles Dye continue to preach their gospel.
"Mix it Like a Record", basically means: "take EVERY wonderful
aspect of the current of modern digital recording, like greater
resolution, better clarity, SNR's so high that they don't even
matter anymore.... and ADD A BUNCH OF NOISY SHIT TO IT!"
He advocates adding a little bit of distortion to every track...
I mean, C'mon! Why do we have 24-bit convertors, then? We
should just seek out some old 12-bit ones! :D
Neil
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| Re: Boutique/Vintage BS,... [message #91481 is a reply to message #91471] |
Mon, 15 October 2007 19:42 |
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Hi Aaron, I'm sorry, I did not mean rant about your post..Rather,
I'm praising the DYI effort. I think this is as Boutique as any of todays
offerings which are outrageous to say the least..
"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>You've missed my point. This is for the DIY gearhead types that aren't
>looking to pay several hundred bucks for a *used* vintage pedal on ebay
when
>it can be had/built new for $70.... or did I miss the point you are making?
>
>AA
>
>"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote in message news:47137b63@linux...
>>
>> I checked out one of those Behringer Pedals, and they sound 'Better' than
>> Roland-Boss pedals. Hands down.
>>
>> Note: I've been playing the guitar for over 30 years now and I've owned
>> pretty
>> every boss pedal thru the years. My point:
>>
>> Boss pedals we're not that good then. And you purchased them when you
>> could
>> not afford a MRX or Elect-Harmonix pedal unit.
>>
>> Boss prices are outlandish!! Even more, so is this new so-called boutique
>> fx pedal market. $200-300 hundred for a distortion box.. Pleassee!!
>>
>> This whole boutique/vintage market BS that's being perpetrated on the
>> pro-audio
>> world is just that BS. The fact that some of us buy this stuff and Feel
>> like
>> a king when we make such ridiculous purchases. 5K-7K for a Mic that sound
>> wise can be had today for around $500.00 bucks.
>>
>> I think this whole boutique /Vinatge market push being pushed by the
>> old-guard
>> engineers that does not wnat to let go of:
>>
>> -Work flow methods
>> -Sound of recordings
>>
>> Let's take soudn of recording..Most of the pro-audio market is being held
>> hostage by this old guard and these guys live in a 1960-70's sound
>> quality
>> mind-set. Real innovation and technology has been held hostage by
>> companies
>> trying to accomodate this audience.
>>
>> Even though great sounding records can and Are being made using new tools
>> and high sample rates (Neil comes to mind) with In The Box summing, the
>> old
>> guard companies like SSL, Neve, Trident have rose from the dead and are
>> trying
>> to sell 100k feature-less mixers. Once again, insistng that we turn the
>> clock
>> around and accomodate these old farts :)..
>>
>> Hey, do'nt get me wrong, I like a trained on the old stuff from the 70's
>> and 80's. I have that sound imprinted in my head. But, If I'm honest,
a
>> good
>> mondern mix kills any of those mixes by leaps and bounds. Problem is,
we
>> have to start mixing by the rules of digital..
>>
>> Okay Rant off..
>>
>>
>>
>> "Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>Buy any 4 kits, get any 4 kits free. Free kits will be of equal or =
>>>lesser value. One day only! Oct 15th. While supplies last. No =
>>>rainchecks. Add all 8 kits to your cart. Enter "moving sale" in the
=
>>>coupon code at checkout. 4 free kit limit.
>>>
>>>
>>>http://www.buildyourownclone.com
>>>
>>>I built/use their MXR90 clone, they are good pedals. If you're in the
=
>>>market to build, this is the time to do it.
>>>AA
>>>
>>><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
>>><HTML><HEAD>
>>><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>>>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
>>><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.6000.16544" name=3DGENERATOR>
>>><STYLE></STYLE>
>>></HEAD>
>>><BODY>
>>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>>29px"><FONT=20
>>>face=3DArial size=3D2>Buy any 4 kits, get any 4 kits free. Free =
>>>kits will be=20
>>>of equal or lesser value. One day only! Oct 15th. =
>>> While=20
>>>supplies last. No rainchecks. Add all 8 kits to your=20
>>>cart. Enter "moving sale" in the coupon code at checkout. =
>>> 4=20
>>>free kit limit.</FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
>>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>>29px"><FONT=20
>>>face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
>>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>>29px"><FONT=20
>>>face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
>>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>>29px"><A=20
>>>href=3D"http://www.buildyourownclone.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>size=3D2>http://www.buildyourownclone.com</FONT></A></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
>>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>>29px"><FONT=20
>>>face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
>>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>>29px"><FONT=20
>>>face=3DArial size=3D2><EM>I built/use their MXR90 clone, they are good
=
>>>pedals. If=20
>>>you're in the market to build, this is the time to do=20
>>>it.</EM></FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
>>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>>29px"><EM><FONT=20
>>>face=3DArial size=3D2>AA</FONT></EM></SPAN></SPAN></DIV></BODY></HTML >
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
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| Re: Rant: Boutique/Vintage BS,... [message #91482 is a reply to message #91475] |
Mon, 15 October 2007 20:05 |
|
|
Neil, good pos.. You are right, those 80's ibanez pedals did ound pretty good..
In my pedal rack, I still use (don;t laugh) this Axiom (stereo) analog delay
pedal. It has that old tape sound down pat. and it only cost $39.00 bucks..
I work in alot in the boring smooth jazz genre,and some of the mixes are
simply stunning.Most all are ITB. Artistlike Chuck Loeb, Marcus Miller, George
Duke, Benson, Joe Sample..etc But, you are right ..When I think about Benson's
1976 Breezing album. It's sound's like it's current.
My buddy gave a copy of Dyes' Mix It Like a Record DVDs and yes, he does
specify that you insert a analog channel plugin on every or most channels
(Tracking & Mixing) including the mix buss..
I don;t think the plugins he used are that good (McDsp analog gain). I think
that "Antress" free Analog plugin will give you wayy better results..for
what he is trying to achieve.
But, I agree, mixing like this, will kill the dynamics.. But, he is going
for a sound.
My wish, is that we get back to the basics. Write the best song..Record and
mix using the tools we have. Let's stop living in the Past. It's funny ,
but in the 70's thoe engineers where not trying to recapture the Motown sound
or Phil Spector's wall of sound. They were trying to go to a new level..
It's like todays american radio which lives in our past musical glories.
We, the makers of todays music have to realize that i's the Song and pure
Talent and not the tools that moves people.
A great singer in any Genre (Luther Vandross, Freddy Mercury,Yolanda Adams,
Celine Dionne, Marion Anderson) can be recorded on a Radio shack mic using
a peavey mixer recorded to a cassette, with a great song will out do an
ok singer with an ok song, using Westlake (LA) studios witha full mic & pre
cabinet.
"Neil" <OIOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>
>"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>I checked out one of those Behringer Pedals, and they
>>sound 'Better' than Roland-Boss pedals. Hands down.
>
>AND... they now come with their own built-in halon dispensing
>systems inside! lol :D
>
>
>>Note: I've been playing the guitar for over 30 years now and
>>I've owned pretty every boss pedal thru the years. My point:
>>
>>Boss pedals we're not that good then. And you purchased them
>>when you could not afford a MRX or Elect-Harmonix pedal unit.
>
>Actually, ISTR that E-H had a good amount of stuff that was
>cheaper than some of the Boss units "back in the day". The
>bigger E-H goodies like the Deluxe Memory Man - yeah those were
>kinda pricey. The Boss stuff right outta the box sounded
>CLEANER, though... the Electro-Harmonix Noise Gate was the only
>noise gate ever made that actually ADDED noise lol.
>I think it was the sound quality & lack of having something
>that sounded like you were mic'ing a bagful of bees & snakes
>and mixing it in with your guitar signal that got Boss
>widespread usage. MXR = different type of sound - their stuff
>all had a certain not-too-versatile signature kinda sound... IOW
>it sounded good, but if you used their Distortion+, it had one
>tone to it, no matter where you set it, same with their
>phaser; so when Boss & Ibanez, etc. came out with useful, more
>versatile AND affordable good-sounding EFX, they took off.
>
>
>>This whole boutique/vintage market BS that's being perpetrated on the pro-audio
>>world is just that BS. The fact that some of us buy this stuff and Feel
>like
>>a king when we make such ridiculous purchases. 5K-7K for a Mic that sound
>>wise can be had today for around $500.00 bucks.
>
>I'm with ya there - which is why I own what I own & don't have
>even a single veentagee' mic (although i don't know about your
>choice of the $500 price point as a reference).
>
>>I think this whole boutique /Vinatge market push being pushed
>>by the old-guard engineers that does not wnat to let go of:
>
>>-Work flow methods
>>-Sound of recordings
>
>Personally I have a feeling that a BIG part of the whole "OTB"
>mixing penchant has less to do with the sound, it's just
>that if you're a big-name producer/mixerguy & you mix
>exclusivly ITB, then some hack second engineer can simply copy
>all your channel settings & "learn" how to mix just like you
>do... and then if he's successful at it, he can then go around &
>undercut you & get the same results. The real chance of this
>individual actually being able to replicate someone's style
>simply by doing this = pretty slim, indeed. The fear of this
>happening = pretty significant, I betcha.
>TotalRecall may capture every knob position on your SSL, but it
>doesn't know squat about what outboard gear you used & how it
>was set, and that's a big part of the sound of a mix,
>but "Copy all Channel Settings" on a completely ITB mix sure
>does!
>
>
>>Let's take soudn of recording..Most of the pro-audio market is
>>being held hostage by this old guard and these guys live in a
>>1960-70's sound quality mind-set. Real innovation and
>>technology has been held hostage by companies trying to
>>accomodate this audience.
>
>I agree & disagree at the same time. there is a lot of old-
>skewl mentality around, but I wouldn't say it's holding anyone
>hostage - there's nothing to stop anyone from moving in their
>own direction, and there's plenty of gear out there that will
>accommodate this. Get some high-rez mics, pres & convertors,
>some kind of setup on the recording side that will handle
>plenty of tracks at high sample rates, and as many VSTi's as
>you want to run, and you're about as far away from that old
>school as you can get (whether there are oleanders growing
>outside your door or not lol!).
>
>Personally, I think part of it is just a longing for a certain
>sound - a sound that's practically as good as gone as a dated
>genre of music in & of itself. Tape sounded a certain way,
>digital sounds another way, I like aspects of both & I miss
>tape in a way, but hey, it's a new century.
>
>
>
>>Even though great sounding records can and Are being made
>>using new tools and high sample rates (Neil comes to mind)
>>with In The Box summing,
>
>Why, thank you! lol :D
>
>
>>the old guard companies like SSL, Neve, Trident have rose from
>>the dead and are trying to sell 100k feature-less mixers.
>
>Yeah, but since technology marches forward bringing costs down,
>NOW you can also get $3k mixers that - if the hype on the new
>MTA stuff is true (check out various gearslutz threads on
>these) - sound like some of the baddest mofo desks EVER!
>
>>Hey, do'nt get me wrong, I like a trained on the old stuff
>>from the 70's and 80's. I have that sound imprinted in my
>>head. But, If I'm honest, a good mondern mix kills any of
>>those mixes by leaps and bounds.
>
>I like a lot of modern mixes, but I also still like - and will
>probably always like - a lot of the older stuff, too. Example:
>the other day I'm driving in the car & the Manfred Mann cover
>of "Blinded by the Light" comes on, as I was going along
>listening it occured to me what a great mix that is - I don't
>think you could make that mix any better no matter
>where/how/when, and on what format you recorded it to. It's
>just a killer mix! Could it be "different"? Sure, but what
>could make it "better", nothing - I really think they nailed it.
>
>>Problem is, we have to start mixing by the rules of digital..
>
>Not if guys like Charles Dye continue to preach their gospel.
>"Mix it Like a Record", basically means: "take EVERY wonderful
>aspect of the current of modern digital recording, like greater
>resolution, better clarity, SNR's so high that they don't even
>matter anymore.... and ADD A BUNCH OF NOISY SHIT TO IT!"
>He advocates adding a little bit of distortion to every track...
>I mean, C'mon! Why do we have 24-bit convertors, then? We
>should just seek out some old 12-bit ones! :D
>
>Neil
|
|
|
|
| Re: Boutique/Vintage BS,... [message #91485 is a reply to message #91481] |
Mon, 15 October 2007 23:03 |
Aaron Allen
Messages: 1988
Registered: May 2008
|
Senior Member |
|
|
I was hoping that I misunderstood, and it appears I have. Apologies, and
yup.. we agree on this 'botique' thing and the current state of tools
available to musicians and engineers. I believe it has much, much more to do
with the music and the vibe and the skill than if a tool is a certain age or
the price tag. Good sounds and vibe are good sounds an' vibe, regardless of
how they made it onto your iPOD.
AA
"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote in message news:47142515$1@linux...
>
> Hi Aaron, I'm sorry, I did not mean rant about your post..Rather,
> I'm praising the DYI effort. I think this is as Boutique as any of todays
> offerings which are outrageous to say the least..
>
> "Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>You've missed my point. This is for the DIY gearhead types that aren't
>>looking to pay several hundred bucks for a *used* vintage pedal on ebay
> when
>>it can be had/built new for $70.... or did I miss the point you are
>>making?
>>
>>AA
>>
>>"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote in message news:47137b63@linux...
>>>
>>> I checked out one of those Behringer Pedals, and they sound 'Better'
>>> than
>>> Roland-Boss pedals. Hands down.
>>>
>>> Note: I've been playing the guitar for over 30 years now and I've owned
>
>>> pretty
>>> every boss pedal thru the years. My point:
>>>
>>> Boss pedals we're not that good then. And you purchased them when you
>
>>> could
>>> not afford a MRX or Elect-Harmonix pedal unit.
>>>
>>> Boss prices are outlandish!! Even more, so is this new so-called
>>> boutique
>>> fx pedal market. $200-300 hundred for a distortion box.. Pleassee!!
>>>
>>> This whole boutique/vintage market BS that's being perpetrated on the
>
>>> pro-audio
>>> world is just that BS. The fact that some of us buy this stuff and Feel
>
>>> like
>>> a king when we make such ridiculous purchases. 5K-7K for a Mic that
>>> sound
>>> wise can be had today for around $500.00 bucks.
>>>
>>> I think this whole boutique /Vinatge market push being pushed by the
>>> old-guard
>>> engineers that does not wnat to let go of:
>>>
>>> -Work flow methods
>>> -Sound of recordings
>>>
>>> Let's take soudn of recording..Most of the pro-audio market is being
>>> held
>>> hostage by this old guard and these guys live in a 1960-70's sound
>>> quality
>>> mind-set. Real innovation and technology has been held hostage by
>>> companies
>>> trying to accomodate this audience.
>>>
>>> Even though great sounding records can and Are being made using new
>>> tools
>>> and high sample rates (Neil comes to mind) with In The Box summing, the
>
>>> old
>>> guard companies like SSL, Neve, Trident have rose from the dead and are
>
>>> trying
>>> to sell 100k feature-less mixers. Once again, insistng that we turn the
>
>>> clock
>>> around and accomodate these old farts :)..
>>>
>>> Hey, do'nt get me wrong, I like a trained on the old stuff from the 70's
>>> and 80's. I have that sound imprinted in my head. But, If I'm honest,
> a
>>> good
>>> mondern mix kills any of those mixes by leaps and bounds. Problem is,
> we
>>> have to start mixing by the rules of digital..
>>>
>>> Okay Rant off..
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Buy any 4 kits, get any 4 kits free. Free kits will be of equal or =
>>>>lesser value. One day only! Oct 15th. While supplies last. No =
>>>>rainchecks. Add all 8 kits to your cart. Enter "moving sale" in the
> =
>>>>coupon code at checkout. 4 free kit limit.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>http://www.buildyourownclone.com
>>>>
>>>>I built/use their MXR90 clone, they are good pedals. If you're in the
> =
>>>>market to build, this is the time to do it.
>>>>AA
>>>>
>>>><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
>>>><HTML><HEAD>
>>>><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>>>>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
>>>><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.6000.16544" name=3DGENERATOR>
>>>><STYLE></STYLE>
>>>></HEAD>
>>>><BODY>
>>>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>>>29px"><FONT=20
>>>>face=3DArial size=3D2>Buy any 4 kits, get any 4 kits free. Free =
>>>>kits will be=20
>>>>of equal or lesser value. One day only! Oct 15th. =
>>>> While=20
>>>>supplies last. No rainchecks. Add all 8 kits to your=20
>>>>cart. Enter "moving sale" in the coupon code at checkout. =
>>>> 4=20
>>>>free kit limit.</FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
>>>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>>>29px"><FONT=20
>>>>face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
>>>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>>>29px"><FONT=20
>>>>face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
>>>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>>>29px"><A=20
>>>>href=3D"http://www.buildyourownclone.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>>>size=3D2>http://www.buildyourownclone.com</FONT></A></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
>>>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>>>29px"><FONT=20
>>>>face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
>>>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>>>29px"><FONT=20
>>>>face=3DArial size=3D2><EM>I built/use their MXR90 clone, they are good
> =
>>>>pedals. If=20
>>>>you're in the market to build, this is the time to do=20
>>>>it.</EM></FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
>>>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>>>29px"><EM><FONT=20
>>>>face=3DArial size=3D2>AA</FONT></EM></SPAN></SPAN></DIV></BODY></HTML >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
|
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| Re: Rant: Boutique/Vintage BS,... [message #91491 is a reply to message #91451] |
Tue, 16 October 2007 06:28 |
TCB
Messages: 1261
Registered: July 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
While I agree with your general attitude, and think the land of $500 power
cords is sick, with guitars I don't know so much. I was looking for a really
good fuzz pedal for a long, long time and nothing did the job. Eventually
I found the Sybil from Retroman. Pretty boutique though not oulandishly priced,
about $250 for what is in essence two pedals. It sounds flat out better than
anything else I've found. So I guess I'd say it's get your boutique thing
on only in those specific places where it's necessary.
TCB
"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>I checked out one of those Behringer Pedals, and they sound 'Better' than
>Roland-Boss pedals. Hands down.
>
>Note: I've been playing the guitar for over 30 years now and I've owned
pretty
>every boss pedal thru the years. My point:
>
>Boss pedals we're not that good then. And you purchased them when you could
>not afford a MRX or Elect-Harmonix pedal unit.
>
>Boss prices are outlandish!! Even more, so is this new so-called boutique
>fx pedal market. $200-300 hundred for a distortion box.. Pleassee!!
>
>This whole boutique/vintage market BS that's being perpetrated on the pro-audio
>world is just that BS. The fact that some of us buy this stuff and Feel
like
>a king when we make such ridiculous purchases. 5K-7K for a Mic that sound
>wise can be had today for around $500.00 bucks.
>
>I think this whole boutique /Vinatge market push being pushed by the old-guard
>engineers that does not wnat to let go of:
>
>-Work flow methods
>-Sound of recordings
>
>Let's take soudn of recording..Most of the pro-audio market is being held
>hostage by this old guard and these guys live in a 1960-70's sound quality
>mind-set. Real innovation and technology has been held hostage by companies
>trying to accomodate this audience.
>
>Even though great sounding records can and Are being made using new tools
>and high sample rates (Neil comes to mind) with In The Box summing, the
old
>guard companies like SSL, Neve, Trident have rose from the dead and are
trying
>to sell 100k feature-less mixers. Once again, insistng that we turn the
clock
>around and accomodate these old farts :)..
>
>Hey, do'nt get me wrong, I like a trained on the old stuff from the 70's
>and 80's. I have that sound imprinted in my head. But, If I'm honest, a
good
>mondern mix kills any of those mixes by leaps and bounds. Problem is, we
>have to start mixing by the rules of digital..
>
>Okay Rant off..
>
>
>
>"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>
>>
>>Buy any 4 kits, get any 4 kits free. Free kits will be of equal or =
>>lesser value. One day only! Oct 15th. While supplies last. No =
>>rainchecks. Add all 8 kits to your cart. Enter "moving sale" in the =
>>coupon code at checkout. 4 free kit limit.
>>
>>
>>http://www.buildyourownclone.com
>>
>>I built/use their MXR90 clone, they are good pedals. If you're in the =
>>market to build, this is the time to do it.
>>AA
>>
>><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
>><HTML><HEAD>
>><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
>><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.6000.16544" name=3DGENERATOR>
>><STYLE></STYLE>
>></HEAD>
>><BODY>
>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>29px"><FONT=20
>>face=3DArial size=3D2>Buy any 4 kits, get any 4 kits free. Free =
>>kits will be=20
>>of equal or lesser value. One day only! Oct 15th. =
>> While=20
>>supplies last. No rainchecks. Add all 8 kits to your=20
>>cart. Enter "moving sale" in the coupon code at checkout. =
>> 4=20
>>free kit limit.</FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>29px"><FONT=20
>>face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>29px"><FONT=20
>>face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>29px"><A=20
>>href=3D"http://www.buildyourownclone.com"><FONT face=3DArial=20
>>size=3D2>http://www.buildyourownclone.com</FONT></A></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>29px"><FONT=20
>>face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>29px"><FONT=20
>>face=3DArial size=3D2><EM>I built/use their MXR90 clone, they are good
=
>>pedals. If=20
>>you're in the market to build, this is the time to do=20
>>it.</EM></FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
>><DIV><SPAN class=3Dtext><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 24px; LINE-HEIGHT: =
>>29px"><EM><FONT=20
>>face=3DArial size=3D2>AA</FONT></EM></SPAN></SPAN></DIV></BODY></HTML >
>>
>>
>
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| Re: Rant: Boutique/Vintage BS,... [message #91515 is a reply to message #91493] |
Tue, 16 October 2007 14:57 |
|
|
Yes.Ill give it a shot..but, I have to say that Berhinger pedals can hang
with a lot of big buck pedals out there..Yesm they are made in china, so
they can sell these pedals at rediculous prices..But, I American manufacturers
has to roll up their sleeves and at least get to the 50 percent mark of china
brand products..to get market share..I would buy a good pedal for $50 bucks.
the Carl martins are a joke to me..Martin charges rack mounted prices( which
sound better) than any pedal.insane. That's why the Line 6 last pedal offering
did not fair well..cost too much for digtal bad sounding pedal..
"DC" <dc@spammpersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>Well you simply cannot run a company with pricing
>estimated from parts costs. No one ever has.
>
>Barber makes better stuff than they other guys sell for
>much more. Seems reasonable to me.
>
>Are you going to try one of the kits? Sounds like fun if
>you can make the time.
>
>DC
>
>
>"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>Don, what's so cheap about $150.00 bucks for some radio shack parts?
>>
>>
>>
>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Well here is a boutique guy, who makes fabulous sounding pedals
>>>at ridiculously low prices. All of his stuff is just stellar, and you
>>>will swear you paid 500.00 bucks for it. His Tone Press parallel
>>>compressor is the best pedal comp in the world IMO.
>>>
>>>http://www.barberelectronics.com/
>>>
>>>DC
>>>
>>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: Rant: Boutique/Vintage BS,... [message #91516 is a reply to message #91515] |
Tue, 16 October 2007 15:04 |
dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
What isn't made in China today? Amazing isn't it?
Hey any time you can get what you need for cheaper, I am all
for it. My problem with Behringer is them re-silkscreening
a mackie 8-Buss and showing it as the new Eurodesk. and
stealing the whole circuit of some of Aphex' gear. I won't
use their stuff, but I will listen to you use it!
The Carl Martin stuff is real nice but expensive without a doubt.
They also have some exchange-rate issues I think.
DC
"lamont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>Yes.Ill give it a shot..but, I have to say that Berhinger pedals can hang
>with a lot of big buck pedals out there..Yesm they are made in china, so
>they can sell these pedals at rediculous prices..But, I American manufacturers
>has to roll up their sleeves and at least get to the 50 percent mark of
china
>brand products..to get market share..I would buy a good pedal for $50 bucks.
>the Carl martins are a joke to me..Martin charges rack mounted prices( which
>sound better) than any pedal.insane. That's why the Line 6 last pedal offering
>did not fair well..cost too much for digtal bad sounding pedal..
>
>
>"DC" <dc@spammpersinhell.com> wrote:
>>
>>Well you simply cannot run a company with pricing
>>estimated from parts costs. No one ever has.
>>
>>Barber makes better stuff than they other guys sell for
>>much more. Seems reasonable to me.
>>
>>Are you going to try one of the kits? Sounds like fun if
>>you can make the time.
>>
>>DC
>>
>>
>>"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Don, what's so cheap about $150.00 bucks for some radio shack parts?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Well here is a boutique guy, who makes fabulous sounding pedals
>>>>at ridiculously low prices. All of his stuff is just stellar, and you
>>>>will swear you paid 500.00 bucks for it. His Tone Press parallel
>>>>compressor is the best pedal comp in the world IMO.
>>>>
>>>>http://www.barberelectronics.com/
>>>>
>>>>DC
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
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