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Apple sucks [message #92276] Fri, 02 November 2007 12:07 Go to next message
dc[3] is currently offline  dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
Senior Member
Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
tower?

Want to upgrade to Leopard?

You're screwed.

No CD-Rom version exists.

So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.

Stupid, stupid, stupid...

Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...

This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
Nobel...

Computer companies suck... all of them.
DC
Re: Apple sucks [message #92277 is a reply to message #92276] Fri, 02 November 2007 12:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
excelav is currently offline  excelav   
Messages: 2130
Registered: July 2005
Location: Metro Detroit
Senior Member
DC, I believe your wrong about installing from an external DVD drive. Yes
Apple sucks; ) Sometimes.

James

"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>tower?
>
>Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>
>You're screwed.
>
>No CD-Rom version exists.
>
>So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>
>Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>
>Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>
>This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>Nobel...
>
>Computer companies suck... all of them.
>DC
Re: Apple sucks [message #92278 is a reply to message #92277] Fri, 02 November 2007 12:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dc[3] is currently offline  dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
Senior Member
Show me a bootable external DVD drive compatible with
an older iBook FW400/USB 1.0.

Never seen such a thing.

And while we are talking about Apple, why does every damn
new folder come up with an effing toolbar? What do I need
a nav toolbar on every folder for anyway?

grrrr

DC

"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>DC, I believe your wrong about installing from an external DVD drive. Yes
>Apple sucks; ) Sometimes.
>
>James
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>
>>Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>>tower?
>>
>>Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>>
>>You're screwed.
>>
>>No CD-Rom version exists.
>>
>>So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>>an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>>because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>>
>>Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>>
>>Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>>
>>This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>>new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>>Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>>Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>>Nobel...
>>
>>Computer companies suck... all of them.
>>DC
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92279 is a reply to message #92276] Fri, 02 November 2007 12:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Steve Helm is currently offline  Steve Helm
Messages: 37
Registered: April 2006
Member
Relax...
MacFixit.com has a workaround:

"Run Leopard (Mac OS X 10.5) on pre-867MHz systems

Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard) requires Mac with an Intel, PowerPC G5, or PowerPC
G4 processor running at 867MHz or faster, and will refuse to install on any
systems running at a lower clock speed (even dual 800 MHz systems are excluded).
However, there's an easy way to trick your lower-than-867 MHz Mac into running
Leopard: install the operating system on an external FireWire hard drive
using a computer that does meet the minimum clock speed requirements. You
can then use that drive to boot a Mac running at less than 867 MHz (see the
screenshot below for proof).

Better yet, you can hook a pre-867 MHz Mac up to a Mac that does meet official
Leopard requirements and boot it in Target Disk Mode, then install Leopard
directly. This should (we haven't yet tested this method) allow you to boot
Leopard from the system's internal hard drive.

For more information on installing Leopard on a FireWire drive, see this
article.

Obviously, performance for some features will be somewhat sluggish on older
processors, but we've already received reports indicating normal operation.

MacFixIt reader Jim writes:

"(I) hooked a Leopard drive to a 533 Mhz G4. It boots and runs fine. I don't
know why Apple limited it to 867 or above. Maybe something will show up down
the road but so far I don't see any slowdown in speed or any anomalies. QT
movies and trailers play, Flip4Mac plays fine. It has only been a short while
on it, but so far I don't get why they cut it off where they did."

"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>tower?
>
>Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>
>You're screwed.
>
>No CD-Rom version exists.
>
>So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>
>Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>
>Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>
>This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>Nobel...
>
>Computer companies suck... all of them.
>DC
Re: Apple sucks [message #92280 is a reply to message #92276] Fri, 02 November 2007 11:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jamie K is currently offline  Jamie K   UNITED STATES
Messages: 1115
Registered: July 2006
Senior Member
All computers suck. All computers are great. Which is not to imply that
all computers are the same.

BTW, love him or hate him, Al Gore's name is two words. People can
generally spell your name correctly once you win half the Nobel - and
please don't forget all the scientists who share the prize, some of whom
are here in Colorado.

Anyhoo, planned obsolescence does suck. OTOH, there's some argument to
made for a cutoff point before which computers are too slow to
reasonably handle new features.

Apple's approach for OSX 1.5 is, from what I remember, that for this
release G3s are not supported. G4s under a certain clock speed are also
not supported, although I've heard if you change a line on the install
script it will still work. I quibble with this cutoff, all G4s should be
supported IMO.

How old does a CD drive have to be in order to not support _reading_ a
DVD? I would bet that all the supported computers can read a DVD.

I wasn't aware that you can't boot from an outboard drive. Another
alternative might be over a firewire direct connection from the reader
on another Mac, might be worth a try if you're attempting to install on
a non-supported system.

If that doesn't work and you have an old G3, OSX 1.4 is still very viable.

I'm waiting on the update to OSX 1.5, just in case, to allow a bit of
time for developers to catch up and any first release bugs to be addressed.

Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com


DC wrote:
> Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
> tower?
>
> Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>
> You're screwed.
>
> No CD-Rom version exists.
>
> So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
> an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
> because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.

> Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>
> Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>
> This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
> new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
> Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
> Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
> Nobel...
>
> Computer companies suck... all of them.
> DC
Re: Apple sucks [message #92281 is a reply to message #92276] Fri, 02 November 2007 12:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
LaMontt  is currently offline  LaMontt   
Messages: 424
Registered: January 2007
Senior Member

DC, Leopard would not run that good anyway on a G3 or G4. That OS what built
for Dual core/Core Dual Intels. Not that old motorola stuff..


"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>tower?
>
>Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>
>You're screwed.
>
>No CD-Rom version exists.
>
>So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>
>Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>
>Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>
>This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>Nobel...
>
>Computer companies suck... all of them.
>DC
Re: Apple sucks [message #92282 is a reply to message #92281] Fri, 02 November 2007 11:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jamie K is currently offline  Jamie K   UNITED STATES
Messages: 1115
Registered: July 2006
Senior Member
LaMont wrote:
> DC, Leopard would not run that good anyway on a G3 or G4. That OS what built
> for Dual core/Core Dual Intels. Not that old motorola stuff..

I haven't tried it yet but reports are that it runs fine on G4 boxes.
Probably better on dual processor boxes, like you say, but single
processor machines are also supported.

Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com


> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>> Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>> tower?
>>
>> Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>>
>> You're screwed.
>>
>> No CD-Rom version exists.
>>
>> So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>> an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>> because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>>
>> Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>>
>> Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>>
>> This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>> new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>> Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>> Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>> Nobel...
>>
>> Computer companies suck... all of them.
>> DC
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92284 is a reply to message #92281] Fri, 02 November 2007 12:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dc[3] is currently offline  dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
Senior Member
"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>DC, Leopard would not run that good anyway on a G3 or G4. That OS what built
>for Dual core/Core Dual Intels. Not that old motorola stuff..

I will probably stay with 10.2.8 for now and see how some
of the hacks for installing Leopard work out on the older
machines. You have a point.

DC

>
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>
>>Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>>tower?
>>
>>Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>>
>>You're screwed.
>>
>>No CD-Rom version exists.
>>
>>So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>>an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>>because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>>
>>Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>>
>>Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>>
>>This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>>new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>>Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>>Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>>Nobel...
>>
>>Computer companies suck... all of them.
>>DC
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92285 is a reply to message #92279] Fri, 02 November 2007 12:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dc[3] is currently offline  dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
Senior Member
thanks Steve! Do you have the url for that article?

DC


"Steve Helm" <shelm@radford.edu> wrote:
>
>Relax...
>MacFixit.com has a workaround:
>
>"Run Leopard (Mac OS X 10.5) on pre-867MHz systems
>
>Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard) requires Mac with an Intel, PowerPC G5, or PowerPC
>G4 processor running at 867MHz or faster, and will refuse to install on
any
>systems running at a lower clock speed (even dual 800 MHz systems are excluded).
>However, there's an easy way to trick your lower-than-867 MHz Mac into running
>Leopard: install the operating system on an external FireWire hard drive
>using a computer that does meet the minimum clock speed requirements. You
>can then use that drive to boot a Mac running at less than 867 MHz (see
the
>screenshot below for proof).
>
>Better yet, you can hook a pre-867 MHz Mac up to a Mac that does meet official
>Leopard requirements and boot it in Target Disk Mode, then install Leopard
>directly. This should (we haven't yet tested this method) allow you to boot
>Leopard from the system's internal hard drive.
>
>For more information on installing Leopard on a FireWire drive, see this
>article.
>
>Obviously, performance for some features will be somewhat sluggish on older
>processors, but we've already received reports indicating normal operation.
>
>MacFixIt reader Jim writes:
>
>"(I) hooked a Leopard drive to a 533 Mhz G4. It boots and runs fine. I don't
>know why Apple limited it to 867 or above. Maybe something will show up
down
>the road but so far I don't see any slowdown in speed or any anomalies.
QT
>movies and trailers play, Flip4Mac plays fine. It has only been a short
while
>on it, but so far I don't get why they cut it off where they did."
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>
>>Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>>tower?
>>
>>Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>>
>>You're screwed.
>>
>>No CD-Rom version exists.
>>
>>So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>>an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>>because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>>
>>Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>>
>>Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>>
>>This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>>new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>>Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>>Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>>Nobel...
>>
>>Computer companies suck... all of them.
>>DC
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92286 is a reply to message #92284] Fri, 02 November 2007 12:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jamie K is currently offline  Jamie K   UNITED STATES
Messages: 1115
Registered: July 2006
Senior Member
DC wrote:
> "LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>> DC, Leopard would not run that good anyway on a G3 or G4. That OS what built
>> for Dual core/Core Dual Intels. Not that old motorola stuff..
>
> I will probably stay with 10.2.8 for now and see how some
> of the hacks for installing Leopard work out on the older
> machines. You have a point.

You're still at 10.2?

If 10.5 doesn't work out for that box, you might consider upgrading to
10.4. It would be a noticable improvement.

Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com


> DC
>
>>
>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>> Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>>> tower?
>>>
>>> Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>>>
>>> You're screwed.
>>>
>>> No CD-Rom version exists.
>>>
>>> So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>>> an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>>> because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>>>
>>> Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>>>
>>> Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>>>
>>> This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>>> new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>>> Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>>> Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>>> Nobel...
>>>
>>> Computer companies suck... all of them.
>>> DC
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92287 is a reply to message #92276] Fri, 02 November 2007 13:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dc[3] is currently offline  dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
Senior Member
BTW, is anyone actually using Dashboard and the widgets etc?

I have had Tiger on the Mini here for a coiuple of weeks now and
I am not using these "features" at all. I went and set them up,
but I nver use them.

Anyone use them?

DC
Re: Apple sucks [message #92289 is a reply to message #92281] Fri, 02 November 2007 13:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
excelav is currently offline  excelav   
Messages: 2130
Registered: July 2005
Location: Metro Detroit
Senior Member
Come on LaMont, you don't know that to be true. It runs on G4s, G5s, and
intel.

"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>DC, Leopard would not run that good anyway on a G3 or G4. That OS what built
>for Dual core/Core Dual Intels. Not that old motorola stuff..
>
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>
>>Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>>tower?
>>
>>Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>>
>>You're screwed.
>>
>>No CD-Rom version exists.
>>
>>So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>>an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>>because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>>
>>Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>>
>>Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>>
>>This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>>new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>>Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>>Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>>Nobel...
>>
>>Computer companies suck... all of them.
>>DC
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92290 is a reply to message #92289] Fri, 02 November 2007 13:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dc[3] is currently offline  dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
Senior Member
I think he means it is bloated and slow for those machines
because the OS is doing so many tricks these days. 2.3 gig on
the install CD btw. That's really big for an OS.

DC

"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>Come on LaMont, you don't know that to be true. It runs on G4s, G5s, and
>intel.
>
>"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>DC, Leopard would not run that good anyway on a G3 or G4. That OS what
built
>>for Dual core/Core Dual Intels. Not that old motorola stuff..
>>
>>
>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>>>tower?
>>>
>>>Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>>>
>>>You're screwed.
>>>
>>>No CD-Rom version exists.
>>>
>>>So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>>>an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>>>because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>>>
>>>Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>>>
>>>Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>>>
>>>This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>>>new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>>>Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>>>Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>>>Nobel...
>>>
>>>Computer companies suck... all of them.
>>>DC
>>
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92291 is a reply to message #92287] Fri, 02 November 2007 12:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jamie K is currently offline  Jamie K   UNITED STATES
Messages: 1115
Registered: July 2006
Senior Member
DC wrote:
> BTW, is anyone actually using Dashboard and the widgets etc?

Yep. There are a handful I find useful.

Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com


> I have had Tiger on the Mini here for a coiuple of weeks now and
> I am not using these "features" at all. I went and set them up,
> but I nver use them.
>
> Anyone use them?
>
> DC
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92292 is a reply to message #92287] Fri, 02 November 2007 13:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
excelav is currently offline  excelav   
Messages: 2130
Registered: July 2005
Location: Metro Detroit
Senior Member
I use them on occasion. I use one for local gas prices, one for weather,
yellow pages, ebay watcher, a converter, a one off envelope address printer,
cord computer, a tuner, a NIX manual, Dictionary Thesaurus, sticky notes,
etc.

Lots of cool stuff out there.

James

"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>BTW, is anyone actually using Dashboard and the widgets etc?
>
>I have had Tiger on the Mini here for a coiuple of weeks now and
>I am not using these "features" at all. I went and set them up,
>but I nver use them.
>
>Anyone use them?
>
>DC
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92294 is a reply to message #92290] Fri, 02 November 2007 14:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
excelav is currently offline  excelav   
Messages: 2130
Registered: July 2005
Location: Metro Detroit
Senior Member
Have you looked at the size of Vista?

"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>I think he means it is bloated and slow for those machines
>because the OS is doing so many tricks these days. 2.3 gig on
>the install CD btw. That's really big for an OS.
>
>DC
>
>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>Come on LaMont, you don't know that to be true. It runs on G4s, G5s, and
>>intel.
>>
>>"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>DC, Leopard would not run that good anyway on a G3 or G4. That OS what
>built
>>>for Dual core/Core Dual Intels. Not that old motorola stuff..
>>>
>>>
>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>>>>tower?
>>>>
>>>>Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>>>>
>>>>You're screwed.
>>>>
>>>>No CD-Rom version exists.
>>>>
>>>>So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>>>>an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>>>>because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>>>>
>>>>Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>>>>
>>>>Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>>>>
>>>>This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>>>>new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>>>>Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>>>>Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>>>>Nobel...
>>>>
>>>>Computer companies suck... all of them.
>>>>DC
>>>
>>
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92295 is a reply to message #92292] Fri, 02 November 2007 14:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dc[3] is currently offline  dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
Senior Member
That's it. If I remember, they do those things well. Instead,
I usually use a web resource.

I wish they would do a production professional OS. Stripped
down to just what we really need. It used to be easy to make
your own with OS9, but today we are struggling with
stuff meant for consumers, because the computer outfits
see production as simply another app instead of something
you dedicate a machine to.


DC


.. It's not a matter of making
a whole new one, it's just a matter of throwing out 2/3's of
the current one...

DC


"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>I use them on occasion. I use one for local gas prices, one for weather,
>yellow pages, ebay watcher, a converter, a one off envelope address printer,
>cord computer, a tuner, a NIX manual, Dictionary Thesaurus, sticky notes,
>etc.
>
>Lots of cool stuff out there.
>
>James
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>
>>BTW, is anyone actually using Dashboard and the widgets etc?
>>
>>I have had Tiger on the Mini here for a coiuple of weeks now and
>>I am not using these "features" at all. I went and set them up,
>>but I nver use them.
>>
>>Anyone use them?
>>
>>DC
>>
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92296 is a reply to message #92289] Fri, 02 November 2007 14:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
LaMontt  is currently offline  LaMontt   
Messages: 424
Registered: January 2007
Senior Member

Please, that what's worng with you Mac Only folks. PC guys/gals, understand
that with a New OS update, you need more CPU/RAM juice.

Mac guy/Gal still want to run Leopard of a Mac Quadra (LoL!!).. Yes, we know
how much you have invested $$$.Let it go. Stay with the OS is was primed
for..

Get a new Mac. A Current Mac. They're great.


"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>Come on LaMont, you don't know that to be true. It runs on G4s, G5s, and
>intel.
>
>"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>DC, Leopard would not run that good anyway on a G3 or G4. That OS what
built
>>for Dual core/Core Dual Intels. Not that old motorola stuff..
>>
>>
>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>>>tower?
>>>
>>>Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>>>
>>>You're screwed.
>>>
>>>No CD-Rom version exists.
>>>
>>>So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>>>an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>>>because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>>>
>>>Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>>>
>>>Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>>>
>>>This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>>>new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>>>Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>>>Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>>>Nobel...
>>>
>>>Computer companies suck... all of them.
>>>DC
>>
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92297 is a reply to message #92294] Fri, 02 November 2007 14:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dc[3] is currently offline  dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
Senior Member
No, have you?

I certainly wouldn't wan't to defend apple by saying "it's no
worse than Vista" though...

Know what I mean?

DC


"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>Have you looked at the size of Vista?
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>
>>I think he means it is bloated and slow for those machines
>>because the OS is doing so many tricks these days. 2.3 gig on
>>the install CD btw. That's really big for an OS.
>>
>>DC
>>
>>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Come on LaMont, you don't know that to be true. It runs on G4s, G5s,
and
>>>intel.
>>>
>>>"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>DC, Leopard would not run that good anyway on a G3 or G4. That OS what
>>built
>>>>for Dual core/Core Dual Intels. Not that old motorola stuff..
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>>>>>tower?
>>>>>
>>>>>Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>>>>>
>>>>>You're screwed.
>>>>>
>>>>>No CD-Rom version exists.
>>>>>
>>>>>So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>>>>>an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>>>>>because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>>>>>
>>>>>Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>>>>>
>>>>>Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>>>>>
>>>>>This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>>>>>new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>>>>>Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>>>>>Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>>>>>Nobel...
>>>>>
>>>>>Computer companies suck... all of them.
>>>>>DC
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92298 is a reply to message #92296] Fri, 02 November 2007 14:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dc[3] is currently offline  dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
Senior Member
"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:

>Mac guy/Gal still want to run Leopard of a Mac Quadra (LoL!!)..

That's what goes inherently against our interests. The idea that
there is something wrong with using an older machine!

I can still
Run Sonic Solutions on a Quadra and OS6xx and do world class
mastering. If you bought the resulting CD, you would not go
"oh-hey this was made on a Quadra" you would go "good CD!"
Same with editing movies and TV on a 9600 and Avid.

But the computer puds see it
as just another app and no matter WHAT you can do with an
older machine you are supposed to pony up (or bend over)
every few years for new machines.


The military guys have an acronym for everything.

My favorite is BOHICA. Bend Over, Here it Comes Again...

We Paris users are the "Last of the Bohicans"

heh heh

DC
Re: Apple sucks [message #92299 is a reply to message #92295] Fri, 02 November 2007 14:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
excelav is currently offline  excelav   
Messages: 2130
Registered: July 2005
Location: Metro Detroit
Senior Member
This sounds familiar, hmmmm...! I personally think it's unnecessary to strip
Mac OS for running pro apps. You can strip it, you just have to know how.
There are web sites that have info on optimizing Mac OS. It's just not
necessary to dedicate a Mac to just one app.

Apple has always geared their OS to consumers, including pro audio guys;
)

"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>That's it. If I remember, they do those things well. Instead,
>I usually use a web resource.
>
>I wish they would do a production professional OS. Stripped
>down to just what we really need. It used to be easy to make
>your own with OS9, but today we are struggling with
>stuff meant for consumers, because the computer outfits
>see production as simply another app instead of something
>you dedicate a machine to.
>
>
>DC
>
>
>. It's not a matter of making
>a whole new one, it's just a matter of throwing out 2/3's of
>the current one...
>
>DC
>
>
>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>I use them on occasion. I use one for local gas prices, one for weather,
>>yellow pages, ebay watcher, a converter, a one off envelope address printer,
>>cord computer, a tuner, a NIX manual, Dictionary Thesaurus, sticky notes,
>>etc.
>>
>>Lots of cool stuff out there.
>>
>>James
>>
>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>BTW, is anyone actually using Dashboard and the widgets etc?
>>>
>>>I have had Tiger on the Mini here for a coiuple of weeks now and
>>>I am not using these "features" at all. I went and set them up,
>>>but I nver use them.
>>>
>>>Anyone use them?
>>>
>>>DC
>>>
>>
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92300 is a reply to message #92296] Fri, 02 November 2007 14:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
excelav is currently offline  excelav   
Messages: 2130
Registered: July 2005
Location: Metro Detroit
Senior Member
I don't think anybody expects to be able to run Leopard on a 16-17 year old
Quadra, anymore than running Windows Vista on a 286-386. It does suck that
Apple drew the line where they did, summer 2001, but they have to draw the
line some where. Some Mac users would use old machines forever if they didn't.
I won't up grade until I have to; )

"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>Please, that what's worng with you Mac Only folks. PC guys/gals, understand
>that with a New OS update, you need more CPU/RAM juice.
>
>Mac guy/Gal still want to run Leopard of a Mac Quadra (LoL!!).. Yes, we
know
>how much you have invested $$$.Let it go. Stay with the OS is was primed
>for..
>
>Get a new Mac. A Current Mac. They're great.
>
>
>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>Come on LaMont, you don't know that to be true. It runs on G4s, G5s, and
>>intel.
>>
>>"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>DC, Leopard would not run that good anyway on a G3 or G4. That OS what
>built
>>>for Dual core/Core Dual Intels. Not that old motorola stuff..
>>>
>>>
>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>>>>tower?
>>>>
>>>>Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>>>>
>>>>You're screwed.
>>>>
>>>>No CD-Rom version exists.
>>>>
>>>>So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>>>>an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>>>>because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>>>>
>>>>Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>>>>
>>>>Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>>>>
>>>>This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>>>>new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>>>>Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>>>>Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>>>>Nobel...
>>>>
>>>>Computer companies suck... all of them.
>>>>DC
>>>
>>
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92301 is a reply to message #92297] Fri, 02 November 2007 14:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
excelav is currently offline  excelav   
Messages: 2130
Registered: July 2005
Location: Metro Detroit
Senior Member
I'm not trying to defend Apple, you were saying that Mac OS is big for an
OS. Vista comes in different versions/sizes starting around 2.5 GB, RC2
(64bit) is about 8GB when installed, plus swap file (1-2GB) and hibernation
file.

The word is Leopard is optimized and runs faster than Tiger does on older
machines. It is speculation and assumption to say Leopard won't run well
on older Macs. It's FUD to say you have to go buy a new Mac to run Leopard.
Although a new Mac would be nice; )

"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>No, have you?
>
>I certainly wouldn't wan't to defend apple by saying "it's no
>worse than Vista" though...
>
>Know what I mean?
>
>DC
>
>
>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>Have you looked at the size of Vista?
>>
>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>I think he means it is bloated and slow for those machines
>>>because the OS is doing so many tricks these days. 2.3 gig on
>>>the install CD btw. That's really big for an OS.
>>>
>>>DC
>>>
>>>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Come on LaMont, you don't know that to be true. It runs on G4s, G5s,
>and
>>>>intel.
>>>>
>>>>"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>DC, Leopard would not run that good anyway on a G3 or G4. That OS what
>>>built
>>>>>for Dual core/Core Dual Intels. Not that old motorola stuff..
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>>>>>>tower?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>You're screwed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>No CD-Rom version exists.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>>>>>>an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>>>>>>because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>>>>>>new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>>>>>>Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>>>>>>Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>>>>>>Nobel...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Computer companies suck... all of them.
>>>>>>DC
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92303 is a reply to message #92298] Fri, 02 November 2007 15:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
LaMont is currently offline  LaMont
Messages: 828
Registered: October 2005
Senior Member
Agree. I still have Paris on Win 98se. That should tell you something and
Nuendo version 1.6 runs greta on it.

"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Mac guy/Gal still want to run Leopard of a Mac Quadra (LoL!!)..
>
>That's what goes inherently against our interests. The idea that
>there is something wrong with using an older machine!
>
>I can still
>Run Sonic Solutions on a Quadra and OS6xx and do world class
>mastering. If you bought the resulting CD, you would not go
>"oh-hey this was made on a Quadra" you would go "good CD!"
>Same with editing movies and TV on a 9600 and Avid.
>
>But the computer puds see it
>as just another app and no matter WHAT you can do with an
>older machine you are supposed to pony up (or bend over)
>every few years for new machines.
>
>
>The military guys have an acronym for everything.
>
>My favorite is BOHICA. Bend Over, Here it Comes Again...
>
>We Paris users are the "Last of the Bohicans"
>
>heh heh
>
>DC
>
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92304 is a reply to message #92276] Fri, 02 November 2007 15:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
TCB is currently offline  TCB
Messages: 1261
Registered: July 2007
Senior Member
For some reason BSD based *NIXs are always HUGE. Never been able to figure
out why, but maybe I should. You can still get Ubuntu 7.10 on a single live
CD, boot it, and install the whole damn thing from that one disc. And that
INCLUDES and office suite, productivity apps, media players, and so on. Pretty
good. My Debian installs are all done from 150MB netinstall images.

I know, I know, not pro audio OSs. My point is only that OS bloat is a choice.


TCB

"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>tower?
>
>Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>
>You're screwed.
>
>No CD-Rom version exists.
>
>So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>
>Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>
>Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>
>This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>Nobel...
>
>Computer companies suck... all of them.
>DC
Re: Apple sucks [message #92306 is a reply to message #92285] Fri, 02 November 2007 17:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Steve Helm is currently offline  Steve Helm
Messages: 37
Registered: April 2006
Member
Here you are..
http://www.macfixit.com/article.php?story=20071029000757347

"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>thanks Steve! Do you have the url for that article?
>
>DC
>
>
>"Steve Helm" <shelm@radford.edu> wrote:
>>
>>Relax...
>>MacFixit.com has a workaround:
>>
>>"Run Leopard (Mac OS X 10.5) on pre-867MHz systems
>>
>>Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard) requires Mac with an Intel, PowerPC G5, or PowerPC
>>G4 processor running at 867MHz or faster, and will refuse to install on
>any
>>systems running at a lower clock speed (even dual 800 MHz systems are excluded).
>>However, there's an easy way to trick your lower-than-867 MHz Mac into
running
>>Leopard: install the operating system on an external FireWire hard drive
>>using a computer that does meet the minimum clock speed requirements. You
>>can then use that drive to boot a Mac running at less than 867 MHz (see
>the
>>screenshot below for proof).
>>
>>Better yet, you can hook a pre-867 MHz Mac up to a Mac that does meet official
>>Leopard requirements and boot it in Target Disk Mode, then install Leopard
>>directly. This should (we haven't yet tested this method) allow you to
boot
>>Leopard from the system's internal hard drive.
>>
>>For more information on installing Leopard on a FireWire drive, see this
>>article.
>>
>>Obviously, performance for some features will be somewhat sluggish on older
>>processors, but we've already received reports indicating normal operation.
>>
>>MacFixIt reader Jim writes:
>>
>>"(I) hooked a Leopard drive to a 533 Mhz G4. It boots and runs fine. I
don't
>>know why Apple limited it to 867 or above. Maybe something will show up
>down
>>the road but so far I don't see any slowdown in speed or any anomalies.
>QT
>>movies and trailers play, Flip4Mac plays fine. It has only been a short
>while
>>on it, but so far I don't get why they cut it off where they did."
>>
>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>>>tower?
>>>
>>>Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>>>
>>>You're screwed.
>>>
>>>No CD-Rom version exists.
>>>
>>>So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>>>an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>>>because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>>>
>>>Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>>>
>>>Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>>>
>>>This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>>>new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>>>Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>>>Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>>>Nobel...
>>>
>>>Computer companies suck... all of them.
>>>DC
>>
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92307 is a reply to message #92306] Fri, 02 November 2007 17:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
DC is currently offline  DC
Messages: 722
Registered: July 2005
Senior Member
thanks!

DC


"Steve Helm" <shelm@radford.edu> wrote:
>
>Here you are..
>http://www.macfixit.com/article.php?story=20071029000757347
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>
>>thanks Steve! Do you have the url for that article?
>>
>>DC
>>
>>
>>"Steve Helm" <shelm@radford.edu> wrote:
>>>
>>>Relax...
>>>MacFixit.com has a workaround:
>>>
>>>"Run Leopard (Mac OS X 10.5) on pre-867MHz systems
>>>
>>>Mac OS X 10.5 (Leopard) requires Mac with an Intel, PowerPC G5, or PowerPC
>>>G4 processor running at 867MHz or faster, and will refuse to install on
>>any
>>>systems running at a lower clock speed (even dual 800 MHz systems are
excluded).
>>>However, there's an easy way to trick your lower-than-867 MHz Mac into
>running
>>>Leopard: install the operating system on an external FireWire hard drive
>>>using a computer that does meet the minimum clock speed requirements.
You
>>>can then use that drive to boot a Mac running at less than 867 MHz (see
>>the
>>>screenshot below for proof).
>>>
>>>Better yet, you can hook a pre-867 MHz Mac up to a Mac that does meet
official
>>>Leopard requirements and boot it in Target Disk Mode, then install Leopard
>>>directly. This should (we haven't yet tested this method) allow you to
>boot
>>>Leopard from the system's internal hard drive.
>>>
>>>For more information on installing Leopard on a FireWire drive, see this
>>>article.
>>>
>>>Obviously, performance for some features will be somewhat sluggish on
older
>>>processors, but we've already received reports indicating normal operation.
>>>
>>>MacFixIt reader Jim writes:
>>>
>>>"(I) hooked a Leopard drive to a 533 Mhz G4. It boots and runs fine. I
>don't
>>>know why Apple limited it to 867 or above. Maybe something will show up
>>down
>>>the road but so far I don't see any slowdown in speed or any anomalies.
>>QT
>>>movies and trailers play, Flip4Mac plays fine. It has only been a short
>>while
>>>on it, but so far I don't get why they cut it off where they did."
>>>
>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>>>>tower?
>>>>
>>>>Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>>>>
>>>>You're screwed.
>>>>
>>>>No CD-Rom version exists.
>>>>
>>>>So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>>>>an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>>>>because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>>>>
>>>>Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>>>>
>>>>Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>>>>
>>>>This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>>>>new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>>>>Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>>>>Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>>>>Nobel...
>>>>
>>>>Computer companies suck... all of them.
>>>>DC
>>>
>>
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92308 is a reply to message #92299] Fri, 02 November 2007 17:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dc[3] is currently offline  dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
Senior Member
"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>This sounds familiar, hmmmm...! I personally think it's unnecessary to
strip
>Mac OS for running pro apps. You can strip it, you just have to know how.

less of an issue with OSX. Made a huge difference with OS9 to
the extent that Avid required it and it was a really good idea
with Paris.


>Apple has always geared their OS to consumers, including pro audio guys;

Not consumers.

not at all...

DC
Re: Apple sucks [message #92309 is a reply to message #92300] Fri, 02 November 2007 17:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dc[3] is currently offline  dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
Senior Member
In the car biz, if you are going to make a car and put it on
the market, you have to provide parts for 10 years. It's
a legal requirement.

Now, I am a free enterprise guy, but it sounds like a good idea
to me...

DC

"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>I don't think anybody expects to be able to run Leopard on a 16-17 year
old
>Quadra, anymore than running Windows Vista on a 286-386. It does suck
that
>Apple drew the line where they did, summer 2001, but they have to draw the
>line some where. Some Mac users would use old machines forever if they
didn't.
> I won't up grade until I have to; )
>
>"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>Please, that what's worng with you Mac Only folks. PC guys/gals, understand
>>that with a New OS update, you need more CPU/RAM juice.
>>
>>Mac guy/Gal still want to run Leopard of a Mac Quadra (LoL!!).. Yes, we
>know
>>how much you have invested $$$.Let it go. Stay with the OS is was primed
>>for..
>>
>>Get a new Mac. A Current Mac. They're great.
>>
>>
>>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Come on LaMont, you don't know that to be true. It runs on G4s, G5s,
and
>>>intel.
>>>
>>>"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>DC, Leopard would not run that good anyway on a G3 or G4. That OS what
>>built
>>>>for Dual core/Core Dual Intels. Not that old motorola stuff..
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>>>>>tower?
>>>>>
>>>>>Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>>>>>
>>>>>You're screwed.
>>>>>
>>>>>No CD-Rom version exists.
>>>>>
>>>>>So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>>>>>an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>>>>>because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>>>>>
>>>>>Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>>>>>
>>>>>Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>>>>>
>>>>>This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>>>>>new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>>>>>Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>>>>>Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>>>>>Nobel...
>>>>>
>>>>>Computer companies suck... all of them.
>>>>>DC
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
Re: Apple sucks [message #92311 is a reply to message #92304] Fri, 02 November 2007 17:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dc[3] is currently offline  dc[3]
Messages: 895
Registered: September 2005
Senior Member
One more thing....

If our opinions mattered, there would have been a big fanfare
announcement of the fact that iTunes can import, and iPods
can store, CD redbook-grade, uncompressed audio.

Instead, it is merely a byproduct of the expanding
speed/power/bandwidth of the technology (and you have to
dig to find this out!) It did NOT happen because engineers
griped about mp3...

That is amazing to me.

Of course, the fact is that many of the compression schemes
sound decent these days is a factor as well, but you would think
someone would notice such a development.

DC
Re: Apple sucks [message #92330 is a reply to message #92309] Sat, 03 November 2007 12:43 Go to previous message
LaMontt  is currently offline  LaMontt   
Messages: 424
Registered: January 2007
Senior Member

That's the car biz.. But, software companies do support thier os for at least
10 years. Win 2k is still beign supported.

"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>In the car biz, if you are going to make a car and put it on
>the market, you have to provide parts for 10 years. It's
>a legal requirement.
>
>Now, I am a free enterprise guy, but it sounds like a good idea
>to me...
>
>DC
>
>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>I don't think anybody expects to be able to run Leopard on a 16-17 year
>old
>>Quadra, anymore than running Windows Vista on a 286-386. It does suck
>that
>>Apple drew the line where they did, summer 2001, but they have to draw
the
>>line some where. Some Mac users would use old machines forever if they
>didn't.
>> I won't up grade until I have to; )
>>
>>"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Please, that what's worng with you Mac Only folks. PC guys/gals, understand
>>>that with a New OS update, you need more CPU/RAM juice.
>>>
>>>Mac guy/Gal still want to run Leopard of a Mac Quadra (LoL!!).. Yes, we
>>know
>>>how much you have invested $$$.Let it go. Stay with the OS is was primed
>>>for..
>>>
>>>Get a new Mac. A Current Mac. They're great.
>>>
>>>
>>>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Come on LaMont, you don't know that to be true. It runs on G4s, G5s,
>and
>>>>intel.
>>>>
>>>>"LaMont" <jjdpro@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>DC, Leopard would not run that good anyway on a G3 or G4. That OS what
>>>built
>>>>>for Dual core/Core Dual Intels. Not that old motorola stuff..
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Guess what? Got an older iBook? Maybe an older G3 or G4
>>>>>>tower?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Want to upgrade to Leopard?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>You're screwed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>No CD-Rom version exists.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>So if you have an older box without a DVD drive it is now
>>>>>>an orphan. And no you can't install from an outboard drive
>>>>>>because you cannot boot from an outboard drive.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Stupid, stupid, stupid...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Like it would be really hard to release a CD version...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>This deliberate obsolete-ing of products to force you to buy
>>>>>>new ones is stupid, scummy, and certainly not green...
>>>>>>Which is important if you remember that Algore is on the
>>>>>>Apple board and Jobs was SO PROUD of him for winning the
>>>>>>Nobel...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Computer companies suck... all of them.
>>>>>>DC
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
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