Home » The PARIS Forums » PARIS: Main » My thoughts on pizza...
| My thoughts on pizza... [message #69194] |
Sun, 11 June 2006 17:44  |
chuck duffy
Messages: 453
Registered: July 2005
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Senior Member |
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This is mostly for Jimmy... :-)
Jimmy, when I read that you got it after ten tries I almost pissed myself.
I have been working at it for the past ten years and have yet to produce
a pie that I'm satisfied with. But anyway..
Here is my ramble.. You gotta have a stone, or you gotta have some clay
tiles. The stone needs to be heated in a 500 degree oven for at least 30
minutes before hand. The dough needs to be at room temperature (go figure
:-).
Now here's where I go different from everyone else I know. I never, never,
ever put the pizza together and throw it in the oven.
First I sprinkle the stone with corn meal - it will smoke like crazy, and
after tossing the dough lay it out on the stone. Brush the top litely with
olive oil and push the assembly back into the oven.
Watch carefully, and when the top of the dough starts to turn the slightest
brown it's time for the sauce. This is the crucial time, it's where everyone
makes the mistakes... Poke the bubbles that are forming and do the sauce.
It doesn't take much sauce, a couple tablespoons full of crushed tomato/garlic/olive
oil, or a nice pesto. Too much sauce destroys the pie.
Put it back into the oven until the sauce is hot and just starting to dry.
There's nothing worse than a pie with sloppy, dripping sauce.
Now it's time for cheese. Use interesting mixtures of fresh mozz, parm,
romano, assagio, whatever you have on hand, but the key is this.... The cheeses
have to COOK, brown and almost burn to bring out the real flavor.
Once you get to the point where you can reliably produce a great pie you
can move on to adding toppings.
The other thing people often overlook is that a grill is an excellent pizza
oven, but you need to watch the pie like crazy. Soaked apple wood is a good
wood to try on top of the coals.
The other aspect that is often overlooked is the crust. A mixture of crushed
red pepper, kosher salt, parmesean and olive oil brushed over the crust about
2/3 the way through is NUTS!
I love pizza !
Chuck
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| Re: My thoughts on pizza... [message #69205 is a reply to message #69194] |
Mon, 12 June 2006 01:34  |
rick
Messages: 1976
Registered: February 2006
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Senior Member |
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i'm more of a fresh plum tomato guy. sliced, remove seeds and pulp,
lightly salt to extract water (about 30 minutes). as for the crust i
like to brush it with a pepper infused roasted garlic/olive oil puree.
On 12 Jun 2006 10:44:00 +1000, "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>This is mostly for Jimmy... :-)
>
>Jimmy, when I read that you got it after ten tries I almost pissed myself.
> I have been working at it for the past ten years and have yet to produce
>a pie that I'm satisfied with. But anyway..
>
>Here is my ramble.. You gotta have a stone, or you gotta have some clay
>tiles. The stone needs to be heated in a 500 degree oven for at least 30
>minutes before hand. The dough needs to be at room temperature (go figure
>:-).
>
>Now here's where I go different from everyone else I know. I never, never,
>ever put the pizza together and throw it in the oven.
>
>First I sprinkle the stone with corn meal - it will smoke like crazy, and
>after tossing the dough lay it out on the stone. Brush the top litely with
>olive oil and push the assembly back into the oven.
>
>Watch carefully, and when the top of the dough starts to turn the slightest
>brown it's time for the sauce. This is the crucial time, it's where everyone
>makes the mistakes... Poke the bubbles that are forming and do the sauce.
> It doesn't take much sauce, a couple tablespoons full of crushed tomato/garlic/olive
>oil, or a nice pesto. Too much sauce destroys the pie.
>
>Put it back into the oven until the sauce is hot and just starting to dry.
> There's nothing worse than a pie with sloppy, dripping sauce.
>
>Now it's time for cheese. Use interesting mixtures of fresh mozz, parm,
>romano, assagio, whatever you have on hand, but the key is this.... The cheeses
>have to COOK, brown and almost burn to bring out the real flavor.
>
>Once you get to the point where you can reliably produce a great pie you
>can move on to adding toppings.
>
>The other thing people often overlook is that a grill is an excellent pizza
>oven, but you need to watch the pie like crazy. Soaked apple wood is a good
>wood to try on top of the coals.
>
>The other aspect that is often overlooked is the crust. A mixture of crushed
>red pepper, kosher salt, parmesean and olive oil brushed over the crust about
>2/3 the way through is NUTS!
>
>I love pizza !
>
>Chuck
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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| Re: My thoughts on pizza... [message #69229 is a reply to message #69194] |
Mon, 12 June 2006 07:34 |
tonehouse
Messages: 184
Registered: July 2006
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Senior Member |
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Hi Chuck ..I'll bring the beer..I'll be over in about an hour to try that
pizza recipie.....
"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:448cb8d0$1@linux...
>
> This is mostly for Jimmy... :-)
>
> Jimmy, when I read that you got it after ten tries I almost pissed myself.
> I have been working at it for the past ten years and have yet to produce
> a pie that I'm satisfied with. But anyway..
>
> Here is my ramble.. You gotta have a stone, or you gotta have some clay
> tiles. The stone needs to be heated in a 500 degree oven for at least 30
> minutes before hand. The dough needs to be at room temperature (go figure
> :-).
>
> Now here's where I go different from everyone else I know. I never,
never,
> ever put the pizza together and throw it in the oven.
>
> First I sprinkle the stone with corn meal - it will smoke like crazy, and
> after tossing the dough lay it out on the stone. Brush the top litely
with
> olive oil and push the assembly back into the oven.
>
> Watch carefully, and when the top of the dough starts to turn the
slightest
> brown it's time for the sauce. This is the crucial time, it's where
everyone
> makes the mistakes... Poke the bubbles that are forming and do the sauce.
> It doesn't take much sauce, a couple tablespoons full of crushed
tomato/garlic/olive
> oil, or a nice pesto. Too much sauce destroys the pie.
>
> Put it back into the oven until the sauce is hot and just starting to dry.
> There's nothing worse than a pie with sloppy, dripping sauce.
>
> Now it's time for cheese. Use interesting mixtures of fresh mozz, parm,
> romano, assagio, whatever you have on hand, but the key is this.... The
cheeses
> have to COOK, brown and almost burn to bring out the real flavor.
>
> Once you get to the point where you can reliably produce a great pie you
> can move on to adding toppings.
>
> The other thing people often overlook is that a grill is an excellent
pizza
> oven, but you need to watch the pie like crazy. Soaked apple wood is a
good
> wood to try on top of the coals.
>
> The other aspect that is often overlooked is the crust. A mixture of
crushed
> red pepper, kosher salt, parmesean and olive oil brushed over the crust
about
> 2/3 the way through is NUTS!
>
> I love pizza !
>
> Chuck
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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| Re: My thoughts on pizza... [message #69235 is a reply to message #69194] |
Mon, 12 June 2006 09:58 |
uptown jimmy
Messages: 441
Registered: September 2005
|
Senior Member |
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Man. I swear I'm turning out a top-notch pie. I swear it. But I'm sorta
food-obsessed, and I was in the business for 20 years, so maybe that
accelerated my pizza technique.
I can offer a few tips in addition to all the other good stuff guys have
suggested here. But some of them are just tips for food in general. This is
directed at James, I guess. Nice name, by the way. Elegant and classy, if I
do say so myself.
Use the best ingredients. None of that nasty pasteurized American mozz, use
the real thing. Same for the parm, the sausage or pepperoni, the basil, the
flour, the sauce ingredients, everything. It's a lot easier to make
world-class food when you have world-class ingredients.
You gotta take it seriously. Cooking is the most fundamental hobby in the
world, and it takes tools, time, patience, curiosity, mistakes, etc. You
gotta make your own dough, your own sauce. A lot of this sort of thing is
personal taste. I work with a couple of websites for ideas, and mix and
match to suit my inclinations. I always have three or four versions of a
dish as inspirations when I start the process of learning to make it. Food
Network has a great, free website, and the America's Test Kitchen charge a
pittance for their excellent advice.
My pie, in a nutshell, no recipes but mostly technique:
1. Hot stone in a hot oven. Chuck called that.
2. Good dough. This is just a necessary chore, but not that hard. Bread
ain't hard. I use a rolling pin to get about 7 oz of dough really thin. I
mean really thin. I place it on a cheap, thin baking sheet with a little
flour sprinkled on it.
3. Great sauce. Matter of taste, but it's gotta be thicker, not watery.
Canned tomatoes, a few dried herbs, onions and olive oil, nothing too
difficult here. There's tons of recipes online. Not too tart, not too salty,
not too sweet. Mellow and solid, with a slight kick from red pepper flakes.
Don't be afraid of a T or three of brown sugar when cooking with canned
tomatoes. Let it cool before assembling pies, spread it on thin but
thoroughly. I cover the pie almost up to the edge. Thin coating, some dough
poking through the red. Use a swirling motion with a ladel.
4. Dried oregano. This is my secret weapon. Sprinkle it on top of the sauce,
not too much, but get enough on there. Sorta the same technique as
sprinkling kosher salt on it. Thorough but not excessive.
5. Sprinkling of salt and freshly ground pepper. Don't be afraid of
seasoning. Bland and boring means you forgot the seasoning. Oversalting is a
myth, really. Nobody likes the taste of too much salt unless it has been
incorporated into food with too much fat and too much sugar by evil food
scientists in mega-corporate labs. But don't get carried away. A light
sprinklng across the pie. And you do own a pepper grinder, correct?
6. Grate on the Parmesano Regiano. Use a Microplane right onto the pie. You
can do this step later in the process if you want, right beneath the mozz. I
like a good bit of parm, but not so much as to obscure the red of the sauce,
you know.
7. Fresh basil. Lay the leaves out evenly. Don't try to cover the whole pie.
Leave spaces between. This ain't Pizza Hut.
8. If you want a topping, keep it simple. Pepperoni or Italian sausage, one
or the other. I like to slice the raw sausage thinly and lay them out
evenly, once again with some small spaces between. You don't need a topping,
but that sausage will make you happy, I promise.
9. I like to cover the whole pie in cooked mozz, but that means slicing the
mozz thinly and laying the pieces out with space between. It melts and
spread out.
10. I just lay the thin baking sheet on top of the stone. Works a charm. The
traditional thing is to get the pie off the peel onto the stone, but it's a
trick with a twist to it, for sure. Since I dress the pie almost to the
edge, it's even harder for me. And I don't have a peel. I discovered my "lay
it on top" trick in frustration at being unable to get a pie off the baking
sheet one afternoon, and like I said it works a charm.
11. Let the thing cook until it is GBD, baby. Goldbrownanddelicious. Bubbly.
Browner than not. This is key. You're better getting it a little too dark
than too light, fer sher. 12 to 15 minutes.
12. Let it COOL some. It tastes better closer to room temperature than to
cooking temperature. Most food does. Give it at least five minutes. You'll
be busy getting the next pie in the oven anyway. Roll another crust out (a
tedious process, one that takes longer than you'll think, but then all of a
sudden it works) while the first one cooks and it'll be ready to throw on
the baking sheet once you pull the cooked pizza off it. Then quickly
assemble the next pie while the first one cools.
It's all about the best ingredients in the right proportions. The only
tricks are the dough, the sauce, and the PROPORTIONS. That's the key, not
too much of any one thing, and not too little.
Taste your sauce with a spoon and alter it until it tastes right to you. No
two batches of canned tomatoes are the same. When dressing the pie, think
Naples, not Papa John's. You don't have to make it minimalist, but we're
talking pizza here, not obesity in a box. You should see all the layers when
you look down at the pizza from above before you cook it. It's a thin
contraption, not some mountain of ingredients. It's a magical thing, how
those few ingredients belnd together in the oven to create a thing so
sublime.
I don't know, it doesn't sound so amazing when I read it back, but man, I
have never put anything tastier in my mouth. If anyone wants something
clarified, let me know. I tend shy away from offering advice, just by
inclination, but I'd love to help if someone needs it.
Jimmy
"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:448cb8d0$1@linux...
>
> This is mostly for Jimmy... :-)
>
> Jimmy, when I read that you got it after ten tries I almost pissed myself.
> I have been working at it for the past ten years and have yet to produce
> a pie that I'm satisfied with. But anyway..
>
> Here is my ramble.. You gotta have a stone, or you gotta have some clay
> tiles. The stone needs to be heated in a 500 degree oven for at least 30
> minutes before hand. The dough needs to be at room temperature (go figure
> :-).
>
> Now here's where I go different from everyone else I know. I never,
never,
> ever put the pizza together and throw it in the oven.
>
> First I sprinkle the stone with corn meal - it will smoke like crazy, and
> after tossing the dough lay it out on the stone. Brush the top litely
with
> olive oil and push the assembly back into the oven.
>
> Watch carefully, and when the top of the dough starts to turn the
slightest
> brown it's time for the sauce. This is the crucial time, it's where
everyone
> makes the mistakes... Poke the bubbles that are forming and do the sauce.
> It doesn't take much sauce, a couple tablespoons full of crushed
tomato/garlic/olive
> oil, or a nice pesto. Too much sauce destroys the pie.
>
> Put it back into the oven until the sauce is hot and just starting to dry.
> There's nothing worse than a pie with sloppy, dripping sauce.
>
> Now it's time for cheese. Use interesting mixtures of fresh mozz, parm,
> romano, assagio, whatever you have on hand, but the key is this.... The
cheeses
> have to COOK, brown and almost burn to bring out the real flavor.
>
> Once you get to the point where you can reliably produce a great pie you
> can move on to adding toppings.
>
> The other thing people often overlook is that a grill is an excellent
pizza
> oven, but you need to watch the pie like crazy. Soaked apple wood is a
good
> wood to try on top of the coals.
>
> The other aspect that is often overlooked is the crust. A mixture of
crushed
> red pepper, kosher salt, parmesean and olive oil brushed over the crust
about
> 2/3 the way through is NUTS!
>
> I love pizza !
>
> Chuck
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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| Re: My thoughts on pizza... [message #69242 is a reply to message #69194] |
Mon, 12 June 2006 13:20 |
Sarah
Messages: 608
Registered: February 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
You know, I was just the other day thinking how nice it would be to have a
live-in cook . . .
Sarah (drooling on keyboard)
www.sarahtonin.com/wayward.htm
"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:448cb8d0$1@linux...
>
> This is mostly for Jimmy... :-)
>
> Jimmy, when I read that you got it after ten tries I almost pissed myself.
> I have been working at it for the past ten years and have yet to produce
> a pie that I'm satisfied with. But anyway..
>
> Here is my ramble.. You gotta have a stone, or you gotta have some clay
> tiles. The stone needs to be heated in a 500 degree oven for at least 30
> minutes before hand. The dough needs to be at room temperature (go figure
> :-).
>
> Now here's where I go different from everyone else I know. I never,
> never,
> ever put the pizza together and throw it in the oven.
>
> First I sprinkle the stone with corn meal - it will smoke like crazy, and
> after tossing the dough lay it out on the stone. Brush the top litely
> with
> olive oil and push the assembly back into the oven.
>
> Watch carefully, and when the top of the dough starts to turn the
> slightest
> brown it's time for the sauce. This is the crucial time, it's where
> everyone
> makes the mistakes... Poke the bubbles that are forming and do the sauce.
> It doesn't take much sauce, a couple tablespoons full of crushed
> tomato/garlic/olive
> oil, or a nice pesto. Too much sauce destroys the pie.
>
> Put it back into the oven until the sauce is hot and just starting to dry.
> There's nothing worse than a pie with sloppy, dripping sauce.
>
> Now it's time for cheese. Use interesting mixtures of fresh mozz, parm,
> romano, assagio, whatever you have on hand, but the key is this.... The
> cheeses
> have to COOK, brown and almost burn to bring out the real flavor.
>
> Once you get to the point where you can reliably produce a great pie you
> can move on to adding toppings.
>
> The other thing people often overlook is that a grill is an excellent
> pizza
> oven, but you need to watch the pie like crazy. Soaked apple wood is a
> good
> wood to try on top of the coals.
>
> The other aspect that is often overlooked is the crust. A mixture of
> crushed
> red pepper, kosher salt, parmesean and olive oil brushed over the crust
> about
> 2/3 the way through is NUTS!
>
> I love pizza !
>
> Chuck
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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| Re: My thoughts on pizza... [message #69252 is a reply to message #69235] |
Mon, 12 June 2006 16:15 |
chuck duffy
Messages: 453
Registered: July 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Hi Jimmy
Now it's obvious to me that you know your pie. A fantabulous assortment
of great tips in your post. The fact that it has taken me ten years to produce
a pie that I like speaks volumes about my limits :-)
Chuck
"uptown jimmy" <johnson314@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>Man. I swear I'm turning out a top-notch pie. I swear it. But I'm sorta
>food-obsessed, and I was in the business for 20 years, so maybe that
>accelerated my pizza technique.
>
>I can offer a few tips in addition to all the other good stuff guys have
>suggested here. But some of them are just tips for food in general. This
is
>directed at James, I guess. Nice name, by the way. Elegant and classy, if
I
>do say so myself.
>
>Use the best ingredients. None of that nasty pasteurized American mozz,
use
>the real thing. Same for the parm, the sausage or pepperoni, the basil,
the
>flour, the sauce ingredients, everything. It's a lot easier to make
>world-class food when you have world-class ingredients.
>
>You gotta take it seriously. Cooking is the most fundamental hobby in the
>world, and it takes tools, time, patience, curiosity, mistakes, etc. You
>gotta make your own dough, your own sauce. A lot of this sort of thing is
>personal taste. I work with a couple of websites for ideas, and mix and
>match to suit my inclinations. I always have three or four versions of a
>dish as inspirations when I start the process of learning to make it. Food
>Network has a great, free website, and the America's Test Kitchen charge
a
>pittance for their excellent advice.
>
>My pie, in a nutshell, no recipes but mostly technique:
>
>1. Hot stone in a hot oven. Chuck called that.
>
>2. Good dough. This is just a necessary chore, but not that hard. Bread
>ain't hard. I use a rolling pin to get about 7 oz of dough really thin.
I
>mean really thin. I place it on a cheap, thin baking sheet with a little
>flour sprinkled on it.
>
>3. Great sauce. Matter of taste, but it's gotta be thicker, not watery.
>Canned tomatoes, a few dried herbs, onions and olive oil, nothing too
>difficult here. There's tons of recipes online. Not too tart, not too salty,
>not too sweet. Mellow and solid, with a slight kick from red pepper flakes.
>Don't be afraid of a T or three of brown sugar when cooking with canned
>tomatoes. Let it cool before assembling pies, spread it on thin but
>thoroughly. I cover the pie almost up to the edge. Thin coating, some dough
>poking through the red. Use a swirling motion with a ladel.
>
>4. Dried oregano. This is my secret weapon. Sprinkle it on top of the sauce,
>not too much, but get enough on there. Sorta the same technique as
>sprinkling kosher salt on it. Thorough but not excessive.
>
>5. Sprinkling of salt and freshly ground pepper. Don't be afraid of
>seasoning. Bland and boring means you forgot the seasoning. Oversalting
is a
>myth, really. Nobody likes the taste of too much salt unless it has been
>incorporated into food with too much fat and too much sugar by evil food
>scientists in mega-corporate labs. But don't get carried away. A light
>sprinklng across the pie. And you do own a pepper grinder, correct?
>
>6. Grate on the Parmesano Regiano. Use a Microplane right onto the pie.
You
>can do this step later in the process if you want, right beneath the mozz.
I
>like a good bit of parm, but not so much as to obscure the red of the sauce,
>you know.
>
>7. Fresh basil. Lay the leaves out evenly. Don't try to cover the whole
pie.
>Leave spaces between. This ain't Pizza Hut.
>
>8. If you want a topping, keep it simple. Pepperoni or Italian sausage,
one
>or the other. I like to slice the raw sausage thinly and lay them out
>evenly, once again with some small spaces between. You don't need a topping,
>but that sausage will make you happy, I promise.
>
>9. I like to cover the whole pie in cooked mozz, but that means slicing
the
>mozz thinly and laying the pieces out with space between. It melts and
>spread out.
>
>10. I just lay the thin baking sheet on top of the stone. Works a charm.
The
>traditional thing is to get the pie off the peel onto the stone, but it's
a
>trick with a twist to it, for sure. Since I dress the pie almost to the
>edge, it's even harder for me. And I don't have a peel. I discovered my
"lay
>it on top" trick in frustration at being unable to get a pie off the baking
>sheet one afternoon, and like I said it works a charm.
>
>11. Let the thing cook until it is GBD, baby. Goldbrownanddelicious. Bubbly.
>Browner than not. This is key. You're better getting it a little too dark
>than too light, fer sher. 12 to 15 minutes.
>
>12. Let it COOL some. It tastes better closer to room temperature than to
>cooking temperature. Most food does. Give it at least five minutes. You'll
>be busy getting the next pie in the oven anyway. Roll another crust out
(a
>tedious process, one that takes longer than you'll think, but then all of
a
>sudden it works) while the first one cooks and it'll be ready to throw on
>the baking sheet once you pull the cooked pizza off it. Then quickly
>assemble the next pie while the first one cools.
>
>It's all about the best ingredients in the right proportions. The only
>tricks are the dough, the sauce, and the PROPORTIONS. That's the key, not
>too much of any one thing, and not too little.
>
>Taste your sauce with a spoon and alter it until it tastes right to you.
No
>two batches of canned tomatoes are the same. When dressing the pie, think
>Naples, not Papa John's. You don't have to make it minimalist, but we're
>talking pizza here, not obesity in a box. You should see all the layers
when
>you look down at the pizza from above before you cook it. It's a thin
>contraption, not some mountain of ingredients. It's a magical thing, how
>those few ingredients belnd together in the oven to create a thing so
>sublime.
>
>I don't know, it doesn't sound so amazing when I read it back, but man,
I
>have never put anything tastier in my mouth. If anyone wants something
>clarified, let me know. I tend shy away from offering advice, just by
>inclination, but I'd love to help if someone needs it.
>
>Jimmy
>
>
>
>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:448cb8d0$1@linux...
>>
>> This is mostly for Jimmy... :-)
>>
>> Jimmy, when I read that you got it after ten tries I almost pissed myself.
>> I have been working at it for the past ten years and have yet to produce
>> a pie that I'm satisfied with. But anyway..
>>
>> Here is my ramble.. You gotta have a stone, or you gotta have some clay
>> tiles. The stone needs to be heated in a 500 degree oven for at least
30
>> minutes before hand. The dough needs to be at room temperature (go figure
>> :-).
>>
>> Now here's where I go different from everyone else I know. I never,
>never,
>> ever put the pizza together and throw it in the oven.
>>
>> First I sprinkle the stone with corn meal - it will smoke like crazy,
and
>> after tossing the dough lay it out on the stone. Brush the top litely
>with
>> olive oil and push the assembly back into the oven.
>>
>> Watch carefully, and when the top of the dough starts to turn the
>slightest
>> brown it's time for the sauce. This is the crucial time, it's where
>everyone
>> makes the mistakes... Poke the bubbles that are forming and do the sauce.
>> It doesn't take much sauce, a couple tablespoons full of crushed
>tomato/garlic/olive
>> oil, or a nice pesto. Too much sauce destroys the pie.
>>
>> Put it back into the oven until the sauce is hot and just starting to
dry.
>> There's nothing worse than a pie with sloppy, dripping sauce.
>>
>> Now it's time for cheese. Use interesting mixtures of fresh mozz, parm,
>> romano, assagio, whatever you have on hand, but the key is this.... The
>cheeses
>> have to COOK, brown and almost burn to bring out the real flavor.
>>
>> Once you get to the point where you can reliably produce a great pie you
>> can move on to adding toppings.
>>
>> The other thing people often overlook is that a grill is an excellent
>pizza
>> oven, but you need to watch the pie like crazy. Soaked apple wood is
a
>good
>> wood to try on top of the coals.
>>
>> The other aspect that is often overlooked is the crust. A mixture of
>crushed
>> red pepper, kosher salt, parmesean and olive oil brushed over the crust
>about
>> 2/3 the way through is NUTS!
>>
>> I love pizza !
>>
>> Chuck
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
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| Re: My thoughts on pizza... [message #69256 is a reply to message #69252] |
Mon, 12 June 2006 17:22 |
uptown jimmy
Messages: 441
Registered: September 2005
|
Senior Member |
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|
Well, thanks, man. I needed that. Rough couple of days.
I do a few things well, I guess. I get really obsessive about certain
things. But then I don't have two rugrats to monitor, so that leaves me a
lot more time for things like cooking...
Jimmy
"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:448df59d$1@linux...
>
> Hi Jimmy
>
> Now it's obvious to me that you know your pie. A fantabulous assortment
> of great tips in your post. The fact that it has taken me ten years to
produce
> a pie that I like speaks volumes about my limits :-)
>
> Chuck
>
>
>
> "uptown jimmy" <johnson314@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> >Man. I swear I'm turning out a top-notch pie. I swear it. But I'm sorta
> >food-obsessed, and I was in the business for 20 years, so maybe that
> >accelerated my pizza technique.
> >
> >I can offer a few tips in addition to all the other good stuff guys have
> >suggested here. But some of them are just tips for food in general. This
> is
> >directed at James, I guess. Nice name, by the way. Elegant and classy, if
> I
> >do say so myself.
> >
> >Use the best ingredients. None of that nasty pasteurized American mozz,
> use
> >the real thing. Same for the parm, the sausage or pepperoni, the basil,
> the
> >flour, the sauce ingredients, everything. It's a lot easier to make
> >world-class food when you have world-class ingredients.
> >
> >You gotta take it seriously. Cooking is the most fundamental hobby in the
> >world, and it takes tools, time, patience, curiosity, mistakes, etc. You
> >gotta make your own dough, your own sauce. A lot of this sort of thing is
> >personal taste. I work with a couple of websites for ideas, and mix and
> >match to suit my inclinations. I always have three or four versions of a
> >dish as inspirations when I start the process of learning to make it.
Food
> >Network has a great, free website, and the America's Test Kitchen charge
> a
> >pittance for their excellent advice.
> >
> >My pie, in a nutshell, no recipes but mostly technique:
> >
> >1. Hot stone in a hot oven. Chuck called that.
> >
> >2. Good dough. This is just a necessary chore, but not that hard. Bread
> >ain't hard. I use a rolling pin to get about 7 oz of dough really thin.
> I
> >mean really thin. I place it on a cheap, thin baking sheet with a little
> >flour sprinkled on it.
> >
> >3. Great sauce. Matter of taste, but it's gotta be thicker, not watery.
> >Canned tomatoes, a few dried herbs, onions and olive oil, nothing too
> >difficult here. There's tons of recipes online. Not too tart, not too
salty,
> >not too sweet. Mellow and solid, with a slight kick from red pepper
flakes.
> >Don't be afraid of a T or three of brown sugar when cooking with canned
> >tomatoes. Let it cool before assembling pies, spread it on thin but
> >thoroughly. I cover the pie almost up to the edge. Thin coating, some
dough
> >poking through the red. Use a swirling motion with a ladel.
> >
> >4. Dried oregano. This is my secret weapon. Sprinkle it on top of the
sauce,
> >not too much, but get enough on there. Sorta the same technique as
> >sprinkling kosher salt on it. Thorough but not excessive.
> >
> >5. Sprinkling of salt and freshly ground pepper. Don't be afraid of
> >seasoning. Bland and boring means you forgot the seasoning. Oversalting
> is a
> >myth, really. Nobody likes the taste of too much salt unless it has been
> >incorporated into food with too much fat and too much sugar by evil food
> >scientists in mega-corporate labs. But don't get carried away. A light
> >sprinklng across the pie. And you do own a pepper grinder, correct?
> >
> >6. Grate on the Parmesano Regiano. Use a Microplane right onto the pie.
> You
> >can do this step later in the process if you want, right beneath the
mozz.
> I
> >like a good bit of parm, but not so much as to obscure the red of the
sauce,
> >you know.
> >
> >7. Fresh basil. Lay the leaves out evenly. Don't try to cover the whole
> pie.
> >Leave spaces between. This ain't Pizza Hut.
> >
> >8. If you want a topping, keep it simple. Pepperoni or Italian sausage,
> one
> >or the other. I like to slice the raw sausage thinly and lay them out
> >evenly, once again with some small spaces between. You don't need a
topping,
> >but that sausage will make you happy, I promise.
> >
> >9. I like to cover the whole pie in cooked mozz, but that means slicing
> the
> >mozz thinly and laying the pieces out with space between. It melts and
> >spread out.
> >
> >10. I just lay the thin baking sheet on top of the stone. Works a charm.
> The
> >traditional thing is to get the pie off the peel onto the stone, but it's
> a
> >trick with a twist to it, for sure. Since I dress the pie almost to the
> >edge, it's even harder for me. And I don't have a peel. I discovered my
> "lay
> >it on top" trick in frustration at being unable to get a pie off the
baking
> >sheet one afternoon, and like I said it works a charm.
> >
> >11. Let the thing cook until it is GBD, baby. Goldbrownanddelicious.
Bubbly.
> >Browner than not. This is key. You're better getting it a little too dark
> >than too light, fer sher. 12 to 15 minutes.
> >
> >12. Let it COOL some. It tastes better closer to room temperature than to
> >cooking temperature. Most food does. Give it at least five minutes.
You'll
> >be busy getting the next pie in the oven anyway. Roll another crust out
> (a
> >tedious process, one that takes longer than you'll think, but then all of
> a
> >sudden it works) while the first one cooks and it'll be ready to throw on
> >the baking sheet once you pull the cooked pizza off it. Then quickly
> >assemble the next pie while the first one cools.
> >
> >It's all about the best ingredients in the right proportions. The only
> >tricks are the dough, the sauce, and the PROPORTIONS. That's the key, not
> >too much of any one thing, and not too little.
> >
> >Taste your sauce with a spoon and alter it until it tastes right to you.
> No
> >two batches of canned tomatoes are the same. When dressing the pie, think
> >Naples, not Papa John's. You don't have to make it minimalist, but we're
> >talking pizza here, not obesity in a box. You should see all the layers
> when
> >you look down at the pizza from above before you cook it. It's a thin
> >contraption, not some mountain of ingredients. It's a magical thing, how
> >those few ingredients belnd together in the oven to create a thing so
> >sublime.
> >
> >I don't know, it doesn't sound so amazing when I read it back, but man,
> I
> >have never put anything tastier in my mouth. If anyone wants something
> >clarified, let me know. I tend shy away from offering advice, just by
> >inclination, but I'd love to help if someone needs it.
> >
> >Jimmy
> >
> >
> >
> >"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:448cb8d0$1@linux...
> >>
> >> This is mostly for Jimmy... :-)
> >>
> >> Jimmy, when I read that you got it after ten tries I almost pissed
myself.
> >> I have been working at it for the past ten years and have yet to
produce
> >> a pie that I'm satisfied with. But anyway..
> >>
> >> Here is my ramble.. You gotta have a stone, or you gotta have some
clay
> >> tiles. The stone needs to be heated in a 500 degree oven for at least
> 30
> >> minutes before hand. The dough needs to be at room temperature (go
figure
> >> :-).
> >>
> >> Now here's where I go different from everyone else I know. I never,
> >never,
> >> ever put the pizza together and throw it in the oven.
> >>
> >> First I sprinkle the stone with corn meal - it will smoke like crazy,
> and
> >> after tossing the dough lay it out on the stone. Brush the top litely
> >with
> >> olive oil and push the assembly back into the oven.
> >>
> >> Watch carefully, and when the top of the dough starts to turn the
> >slightest
> >> brown it's time for the sauce. This is the crucial time, it's where
> >everyone
> >> makes the mistakes... Poke the bubbles that are forming and do the
sauce.
> >> It doesn't take much sauce, a couple tablespoons full of crushed
> >tomato/garlic/olive
> >> oil, or a nice pesto. Too much sauce destroys the pie.
> >>
> >> Put it back into the oven until the sauce is hot and just starting to
> dry.
> >> There's nothing worse than a pie with sloppy, dripping sauce.
> >>
> >> Now it's time for cheese. Use interesting mixtures of fresh mozz,
parm,
> >> romano, assagio, whatever you have on hand, but the key is this.... The
> >cheeses
> >> have to COOK, brown and almost burn to bring out the real flavor.
> >>
> >> Once you get to the point where you can reliably produce a great pie
you
> >> can move on to adding toppings.
> >>
> >> The other thing people often overlook is that a grill is an excellent
> >pizza
> >> oven, but you need to watch the pie like crazy. Soaked apple wood is
> a
> >good
> >> wood to try on top of the coals.
> >>
> >> The other aspect that is often overlooked is the crust. A mixture of
> >crushed
> >> red pepper, kosher salt, parmesean and olive oil brushed over the crust
> >about
> >> 2/3 the way through is NUTS!
> >>
> >> I love pizza !
> >>
> >> Chuck
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>
|
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| Re: My thoughts on pizza... [message #69266 is a reply to message #69235] |
Mon, 12 June 2006 19:38 |
excelav
Messages: 2130
Registered: July 2005
Location: Metro Detroit
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Hey Jimmy! Thanks for the complement, I think your name rocks too! And thanks
for your recipes.
Since we're on pizza I'll tell ya where you can get some really good pizza.
I've lived in a few places in my days, so I'll jump around a bit.
Detroit
All deep dish pizza
#1 Buddy's Pizza, they use Wisconsin Brick Cheese.
#2 Rogers Roost (Chicago style deep dish pizza with polenta in the crust)
#3 Loui's Pizza (248) 547-171123141 Dequindre Rd Hazel Park, MI 48030 (Somebody
is trying to build a franchise by using (stealing) their name, there is only
one Loui's Pizza)
#4 Shield's Pizza (A kinda of copy of Buddy's Pizza)
#5 Nikki's (Greek Town Detroit)
In a pinch Jet's Deep dish Pizza will work.
Chicago!
Geno's II, Chicago deep dish
St.Louis!
St. Louis style pizza is thin crust, they use Cumin in the sauce and provel
cheese. It has a different taste. It's vary addicting!
The best Chicago style deep dish pizza was at a place called Calico's Bar
and Grill, there thick and thin crust rock also. All their locations shut
down accept one near down town St. Louis, and I've never eaten there. Calico's
was great pizza!
Talayna's is good, and I guess IMO's will work in a pinch
Los Angeles!
Well good luck finding good pizza in L.A., maybe DC or somebody can chime
in here.
The best pizza I could find in L.A. was the RainBow lounge on Sun Set Blvd.
It is good pizza. Or Spago is Ok (WolfgangPuck$$$)
In South O.C. Papa John's Pizza was the best I could do!
Hey guys, tell me where the best pizza is in your neck of the woods.
Thanks
James
"uptown jimmy" <johnson314@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>Man. I swear I'm turning out a top-notch pie. I swear it. But I'm sorta
>food-obsessed, and I was in the business for 20 years, so maybe that
>accelerated my pizza technique.
>
>I can offer a few tips in addition to all the other good stuff guys have
>suggested here. But some of them are just tips for food in general. This
is
>directed at James, I guess. Nice name, by the way. Elegant and classy, if
I
>do say so myself.
>
>Use the best ingredients. None of that nasty pasteurized American mozz,
use
>the real thing. Same for the parm, the sausage or pepperoni, the basil,
the
>flour, the sauce ingredients, everything. It's a lot easier to make
>world-class food when you have world-class ingredients.
>
>You gotta take it seriously. Cooking is the most fundamental hobby in the
>world, and it takes tools, time, patience, curiosity, mistakes, etc. You
>gotta make your own dough, your own sauce. A lot of this sort of thing is
>personal taste. I work with a couple of websites for ideas, and mix and
>match to suit my inclinations. I always have three or four versions of a
>dish as inspirations when I start the process of learning to make it. Food
>Network has a great, free website, and the America's Test Kitchen charge
a
>pittance for their excellent advice.
>
>My pie, in a nutshell, no recipes but mostly technique:
>
>1. Hot stone in a hot oven. Chuck called that.
>
>2. Good dough. This is just a necessary chore, but not that hard. Bread
>ain't hard. I use a rolling pin to get about 7 oz of dough really thin.
I
>mean really thin. I place it on a cheap, thin baking sheet with a little
>flour sprinkled on it.
>
>3. Great sauce. Matter of taste, but it's gotta be thicker, not watery.
>Canned tomatoes, a few dried herbs, onions and olive oil, nothing too
>difficult here. There's tons of recipes online. Not too tart, not too salty,
>not too sweet. Mellow and solid, with a slight kick from red pepper flakes.
>Don't be afraid of a T or three of brown sugar when cooking with canned
>tomatoes. Let it cool before assembling pies, spread it on thin but
>thoroughly. I cover the pie almost up to the edge. Thin coating, some dough
>poking through the red. Use a swirling motion with a ladel.
>
>4. Dried oregano. This is my secret weapon. Sprinkle it on top of the sauce,
>not too much, but get enough on there. Sorta the same technique as
>sprinkling kosher salt on it. Thorough but not excessive.
>
>5. Sprinkling of salt and freshly ground pepper. Don't be afraid of
>seasoning. Bland and boring means you forgot the seasoning. Oversalting
is a
>myth, really. Nobody likes the taste of too much salt unless it has been
>incorporated into food with too much fat and too much sugar by evil food
>scientists in mega-corporate labs. But don't get carried away. A light
>sprinklng across the pie. And you do own a pepper grinder, correct?
>
>6. Grate on the Parmesano Regiano. Use a Microplane right onto the pie.
You
>can do this step later in the process if you want, right beneath the mozz.
I
>like a good bit of parm, but not so much as to obscure the red of the sauce,
>you know.
>
>7. Fresh basil. Lay the leaves out evenly. Don't try to cover the whole
pie.
>Leave spaces between. This ain't Pizza Hut.
>
>8. If you want a topping, keep it simple. Pepperoni or Italian sausage,
one
>or the other. I like to slice the raw sausage thinly and lay them out
>evenly, once again with some small spaces between. You don't need a topping,
>but that sausage will make you happy, I promise.
>
>9. I like to cover the whole pie in cooked mozz, but that means slicing
the
>mozz thinly and laying the pieces out with space between. It melts and
>spread out.
>
>10. I just lay the thin baking sheet on top of the stone. Works a charm.
The
>traditional thing is to get the pie off the peel onto the stone, but it's
a
>trick with a twist to it, for sure. Since I dress the pie almost to the
>edge, it's even harder for me. And I don't have a peel. I discovered my
"lay
>it on top" trick in frustration at being unable to get a pie off the baking
>sheet one afternoon, and like I said it works a charm.
>
>11. Let the thing cook until it is GBD, baby. Goldbrownanddelicious. Bubbly.
>Browner than not. This is key. You're better getting it a little too dark
>than too light, fer sher. 12 to 15 minutes.
>
>12. Let it COOL some. It tastes better closer to room temperature than to
>cooking temperature. Most food does. Give it at least five minutes. You'll
>be busy getting the next pie in the oven anyway. Roll another crust out
(a
>tedious process, one that takes longer than you'll think, but then all of
a
>sudden it works) while the first one cooks and it'll be ready to throw on
>the baking sheet once you pull the cooked pizza off it. Then quickly
>assemble the next pie while the first one cools.
>
>It's all about the best ingredients in the right proportions. The only
>tricks are the dough, the sauce, and the PROPORTIONS. That's the key, not
>too much of any one thing, and not too little.
>
>Taste your sauce with a spoon and alter it until it tastes right to you.
No
>two batches of canned tomatoes are the same. When dressing the pie, think
>Naples, not Papa John's. You don't have to make it minimalist, but we're
>talking pizza here, not obesity in a box. You should see all the layers
when
>you look down at the pizza from above before you cook it. It's a thin
>contraption, not some mountain of ingredients. It's a magical thing, how
>those few ingredients belnd together in the oven to create a thing so
>sublime.
>
>I don't know, it doesn't sound so amazing when I read it back, but man,
I
>have never put anything tastier in my mouth. If anyone wants something
>clarified, let me know. I tend shy away from offering advice, just by
>inclination, but I'd love to help if someone needs it.
>
>Jimmy
>
>
>
>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:448cb8d0$1@linux...
>>
>> This is mostly for Jimmy... :-)
>>
>> Jimmy, when I read that you got it after ten tries I almost pissed myself.
>> I have been working at it for the past ten years and have yet to produce
>> a pie that I'm satisfied with. But anyway..
>>
>> Here is my ramble.. You gotta have a stone, or you gotta have some clay
>> tiles. The stone needs to be heated in a 500 degree oven for at least
30
>> minutes before hand. The dough needs to be at room temperature (go figure
>> :-).
>>
>> Now here's where I go different from everyone else I know. I never,
>never,
>> ever put the pizza together and throw it in the oven.
>>
>> First I sprinkle the stone with corn meal - it will smoke like crazy,
and
>> after tossing the dough lay it out on the stone. Brush the top litely
>with
>> olive oil and push the assembly back into the oven.
>>
>> Watch carefully, and when the top of the dough starts to turn the
>slightest
>> brown it's time for the sauce. This is the crucial time, it's where
>everyone
>> makes the mistakes... Poke the bubbles that are forming and do the sauce.
>> It doesn't take much sauce, a couple tablespoons full of crushed
>tomato/garlic/olive
>> oil, or a nice pesto. Too much sauce destroys the pie.
>>
>> Put it back into the oven until the sauce is hot and just starting to
dry.
>> There's nothing worse than a pie with sloppy, dripping sauce.
>>
>> Now it's time for cheese. Use interesting mixtures of fresh mozz, parm,
>> romano, assagio, whatever you have on hand, but the key is this.... The
>cheeses
>> have to COOK, brown and almost burn to bring out the real flavor.
>>
>> Once you get to the point where you can reliably produce a great pie you
>> can move on to adding toppings.
>>
>> The other thing people often overlook is that a grill is an excellent
>pizza
>> oven, but you need to watch the pie like crazy. Soaked apple wood is
a
>good
>> wood to try on top of the coals.
>>
>> The other aspect that is often overlooked is the crust. A mixture of
>crushed
>> red pepper, kosher salt, parmesean and olive oil brushed over the crust
>about
>> 2/3 the way through is NUTS!
>>
>> I love pizza !
>>
>> Chuck
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
|
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| Re: My thoughts on pizza... [message #69268 is a reply to message #69266] |
Mon, 12 June 2006 20:01 |
uptown jimmy
Messages: 441
Registered: September 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Hmmm.
Chicago. Deep dish.
Pizza Hut's spiritual home. Can't go there.
Not any more. Too old for that much fat in one sitting. Tastes good, more
filling.
However, I should point out that my name is James McRay Johnson III.
We're probably distant cousins. Small world.
James McCloskey.
James McRay.
I wanna hug you, man.
"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:448e2530$1@linux...
>
> Hey Jimmy! Thanks for the complement, I think your name rocks too! And
thanks
> for your recipes.
>
> Since we're on pizza I'll tell ya where you can get some really good
pizza.
> I've lived in a few places in my days, so I'll jump around a bit.
>
> Detroit
>
> All deep dish pizza
>
> #1 Buddy's Pizza, they use Wisconsin Brick Cheese.
> #2 Rogers Roost (Chicago style deep dish pizza with polenta in the crust)
> #3 Loui's Pizza (248) 547-171123141 Dequindre Rd Hazel Park, MI 48030
(Somebody
> is trying to build a franchise by using (stealing) their name, there is
only
> one Loui's Pizza)
> #4 Shield's Pizza (A kinda of copy of Buddy's Pizza)
> #5 Nikki's (Greek Town Detroit)
>
> In a pinch Jet's Deep dish Pizza will work.
>
>
> Chicago!
>
> Geno's II, Chicago deep dish
>
>
> St.Louis!
>
> St. Louis style pizza is thin crust, they use Cumin in the sauce and
provel
> cheese. It has a different taste. It's vary addicting!
>
> The best Chicago style deep dish pizza was at a place called Calico's Bar
> and Grill, there thick and thin crust rock also. All their locations
shut
> down accept one near down town St. Louis, and I've never eaten there.
Calico's
> was great pizza!
>
>
> Talayna's is good, and I guess IMO's will work in a pinch
>
>
> Los Angeles!
>
> Well good luck finding good pizza in L.A., maybe DC or somebody can chime
> in here.
>
> The best pizza I could find in L.A. was the RainBow lounge on Sun Set
Blvd.
> It is good pizza. Or Spago is Ok (WolfgangPuck$$$)
>
> In South O.C. Papa John's Pizza was the best I could do!
>
> Hey guys, tell me where the best pizza is in your neck of the woods.
>
> Thanks
>
> James
>
>
> "uptown jimmy" <johnson314@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> >Man. I swear I'm turning out a top-notch pie. I swear it. But I'm sorta
> >food-obsessed, and I was in the business for 20 years, so maybe that
> >accelerated my pizza technique.
> >
> >I can offer a few tips in addition to all the other good stuff guys have
> >suggested here. But some of them are just tips for food in general. This
> is
> >directed at James, I guess. Nice name, by the way. Elegant and classy, if
> I
> >do say so myself.
> >
> >Use the best ingredients. None of that nasty pasteurized American mozz,
> use
> >the real thing. Same for the parm, the sausage or pepperoni, the basil,
> the
> >flour, the sauce ingredients, everything. It's a lot easier to make
> >world-class food when you have world-class ingredients.
> >
> >You gotta take it seriously. Cooking is the most fundamental hobby in the
> >world, and it takes tools, time, patience, curiosity, mistakes, etc. You
> >gotta make your own dough, your own sauce. A lot of this sort of thing is
> >personal taste. I work with a couple of websites for ideas, and mix and
> >match to suit my inclinations. I always have three or four versions of a
> >dish as inspirations when I start the process of learning to make it.
Food
> >Network has a great, free website, and the America's Test Kitchen charge
> a
> >pittance for their excellent advice.
> >
> >My pie, in a nutshell, no recipes but mostly technique:
> >
> >1. Hot stone in a hot oven. Chuck called that.
> >
> >2. Good dough. This is just a necessary chore, but not that hard. Bread
> >ain't hard. I use a rolling pin to get about 7 oz of dough really thin.
> I
> >mean really thin. I place it on a cheap, thin baking sheet with a little
> >flour sprinkled on it.
> >
> >3. Great sauce. Matter of taste, but it's gotta be thicker, not watery.
> >Canned tomatoes, a few dried herbs, onions and olive oil, nothing too
> >difficult here. There's tons of recipes online. Not too tart, not too
salty,
> >not too sweet. Mellow and solid, with a slight kick from red pepper
flakes.
> >Don't be afraid of a T or three of brown sugar when cooking with canned
> >tomatoes. Let it cool before assembling pies, spread it on thin but
> >thoroughly. I cover the pie almost up to the edge. Thin coating, some
dough
> >poking through the red. Use a swirling motion with a ladel.
> >
> >4. Dried oregano. This is my secret weapon. Sprinkle it on top of the
sauce,
> >not too much, but get enough on there. Sorta the same technique as
> >sprinkling kosher salt on it. Thorough but not excessive.
> >
> >5. Sprinkling of salt and freshly ground pepper. Don't be afraid of
> >seasoning. Bland and boring means you forgot the seasoning. Oversalting
> is a
> >myth, really. Nobody likes the taste of too much salt unless it has been
> >incorporated into food with too much fat and too much sugar by evil food
> >scientists in mega-corporate labs. But don't get carried away. A light
> >sprinklng across the pie. And you do own a pepper grinder, correct?
> >
> >6. Grate on the Parmesano Regiano. Use a Microplane right onto the pie.
> You
> >can do this step later in the process if you want, right beneath the
mozz.
> I
> >like a good bit of parm, but not so much as to obscure the red of the
sauce,
> >you know.
> >
> >7. Fresh basil. Lay the leaves out evenly. Don't try to cover the whole
> pie.
> >Leave spaces between. This ain't Pizza Hut.
> >
> >8. If you want a topping, keep it simple. Pepperoni or Italian sausage,
> one
> >or the other. I like to slice the raw sausage thinly and lay them out
> >evenly, once again with some small spaces between. You don't need a
topping,
> >but that sausage will make you happy, I promise.
> >
> >9. I like to cover the whole pie in cooked mozz, but that means slicing
> the
> >mozz thinly and laying the pieces out with space between. It melts and
> >spread out.
> >
> >10. I just lay the thin baking sheet on top of the stone. Works a charm.
> The
> >traditional thing is to get the pie off the peel onto the stone, but it's
> a
> >trick with a twist to it, for sure. Since I dress the pie almost to the
> >edge, it's even harder for me. And I don't have a peel. I discovered my
> "lay
> >it on top" trick in frustration at being unable to get a pie off the
baking
> >sheet one afternoon, and like I said it works a charm.
> >
> >11. Let the thing cook until it is GBD, baby. Goldbrownanddelicious.
Bubbly.
> >Browner than not. This is key. You're better getting it a little too dark
> >than too light, fer sher. 12 to 15 minutes.
> >
> >12. Let it COOL some. It tastes better closer to room temperature than to
> >cooking temperature. Most food does. Give it at least five minutes.
You'll
> >be busy getting the next pie in the oven anyway. Roll another crust out
> (a
> >tedious process, one that takes longer than you'll think, but then all of
> a
> >sudden it works) while the first one cooks and it'll be ready to throw on
> >the baking sheet once you pull the cooked pizza off it. Then quickly
> >assemble the next pie while the first one cools.
> >
> >It's all about the best ingredients in the right proportions. The only
> >tricks are the dough, the sauce, and the PROPORTIONS. That's the key, not
> >too much of any one thing, and not too little.
> >
> >Taste your sauce with a spoon and alter it until it tastes right to you.
> No
> >two batches of canned tomatoes are the same. When dressing the pie, think
> >Naples, not Papa John's. You don't have to make it minimalist, but we're
> >talking pizza here, not obesity in a box. You should see all the layers
> when
> >you look down at the pizza from above before you cook it. It's a thin
> >contraption, not some mountain of ingredients. It's a magical thing, how
> >those few ingredients belnd together in the oven to create a thing so
> >sublime.
> >
> >I don't know, it doesn't sound so amazing when I read it back, but man,
> I
> >have never put anything tastier in my mouth. If anyone wants something
> >clarified, let me know. I tend shy away from offering advice, just by
> >inclination, but I'd love to help if someone needs it.
> >
> >Jimmy
> >
> >
> >
> >"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:448cb8d0$1@linux...
> >>
> >> This is mostly for Jimmy... :-)
> >>
> >> Jimmy, when I read that you got it after ten tries I almost pissed
myself.
> >> I have been working at it for the past ten years and have yet to
produce
> >> a pie that I'm satisfied with. But anyway..
> >>
> >> Here is my ramble.. You gotta have a stone, or you gotta have some
clay
> >> tiles. The stone needs to be heated in a 500 degree oven for at least
> 30
> >> minutes before hand. The dough needs to be at room temperature (go
figure
> >> :-).
> >>
> >> Now here's where I go different from everyone else I know. I never,
> >never,
> >> ever put the pizza together and throw it in the oven.
> >>
> >> First I sprinkle the stone with corn meal - it will smoke like crazy,
> and
> >> after tossing the dough lay it out on the stone. Brush the top litely
> >with
> >> olive oil and push the assembly back into the oven.
> >>
> >> Watch carefully, and when the top of the dough starts to turn the
> >slightest
> >> brown it's time for the sauce. This is the crucial time, it's where
> >everyone
> >> makes the mistakes... Poke the bubbles that are forming and do the
sauce.
> >> It doesn't take much sauce, a couple tablespoons full of crushed
> >tomato/garlic/olive
> >> oil, or a nice pesto. Too much sauce destroys the pie.
> >>
> >> Put it back into the oven until the sauce is hot and just starting to
> dry.
> >> There's nothing worse than a pie with sloppy, dripping sauce.
> >>
> >> Now it's time for cheese. Use interesting mixtures of fresh mozz,
parm,
> >> romano, assagio, whatever you have on hand, but the key is this.... The
> >cheeses
> >> have to COOK, brown and almost burn to bring out the real flavor.
> >>
> >> Once you get to the point where you can reliably produce a great pie
you
> >> can move on to adding toppings.
> >>
> >> The other thing people often overlook is that a grill is an excellent
> >pizza
> >> oven, but you need to watch the pie like crazy. Soaked apple wood is
> a
> >good
> >> wood to try on top of the coals.
> >>
> >> The other aspect that is often overlooked is the crust. A mixture of
> >crushed
> >> red pepper, kosher salt, parmesean and olive oil brushed over the crust
> >about
> >> 2/3 the way through is NUTS!
> >>
> >> I love pizza !
> >>
> >> Chuck
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: My thoughts on pizza... [message #69274 is a reply to message #69242] |
Tue, 13 June 2006 04:57 |
Rich Lamanna
Messages: 316
Registered: February 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
One who can double as a massage therapist would be the ultimate :-) All this
pizza talk is making this Italian hungry and ready to throw one in the oven
for breakfast.
Rich
"Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com> wrote in message news:448dcb61@linux...
> You know, I was just the other day thinking how nice it would be to have a
> live-in cook . . .
>
> Sarah (drooling on keyboard)
>
> www.sarahtonin.com/wayward.htm
>
> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:448cb8d0$1@linux...
> >
> > This is mostly for Jimmy... :-)
> >
> > Jimmy, when I read that you got it after ten tries I almost pissed
myself.
> > I have been working at it for the past ten years and have yet to produce
> > a pie that I'm satisfied with. But anyway..
> >
> > Here is my ramble.. You gotta have a stone, or you gotta have some clay
> > tiles. The stone needs to be heated in a 500 degree oven for at least
30
> > minutes before hand. The dough needs to be at room temperature (go
figure
> > :-).
> >
> > Now here's where I go different from everyone else I know. I never,
> > never,
> > ever put the pizza together and throw it in the oven.
> >
> > First I sprinkle the stone with corn meal - it will smoke like crazy,
and
> > after tossing the dough lay it out on the stone. Brush the top litely
> > with
> > olive oil and push the assembly back into the oven.
> >
> > Watch carefully, and when the top of the dough starts to turn the
> > slightest
> > brown it's time for the sauce. This is the crucial time, it's where
> > everyone
> > makes the mistakes... Poke the bubbles that are forming and do the
sauce.
> > It doesn't take much sauce, a couple tablespoons full of crushed
> > tomato/garlic/olive
> > oil, or a nice pesto. Too much sauce destroys the pie.
> >
> > Put it back into the oven until the sauce is hot and just starting to
dry.
> > There's nothing worse than a pie with sloppy, dripping sauce.
> >
> > Now it's time for cheese. Use interesting mixtures of fresh mozz, parm,
> > romano, assagio, whatever you have on hand, but the key is this.... The
> > cheeses
> > have to COOK, brown and almost burn to bring out the real flavor.
> >
> > Once you get to the point where you can reliably produce a great pie you
> > can move on to adding toppings.
> >
> > The other thing people often overlook is that a grill is an excellent
> > pizza
> > oven, but you need to watch the pie like crazy. Soaked apple wood is a
> > good
> > wood to try on top of the coals.
> >
> > The other aspect that is often overlooked is the crust. A mixture of
> > crushed
> > red pepper, kosher salt, parmesean and olive oil brushed over the crust
> > about
> > 2/3 the way through is NUTS!
> >
> > I love pizza !
> >
> > Chuck
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: My thoughts on pizza... [message #69302 is a reply to message #69274] |
Tue, 13 June 2006 12:11 |
Sarah
Messages: 608
Registered: February 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Yes, perfect . . . live-in cook, massage therapist, and . . . would
housekeeper be too much to ask, you think?
S
"Rich Lamanna" <richard.lamanna@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:448e98f5@linux...
> One who can double as a massage therapist would be the ultimate :-) All
> this
> pizza talk is making this Italian hungry and ready to throw one in the
> oven
> for breakfast.
>
> Rich
>
>
> "Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com> wrote in message news:448dcb61@linux...
>> You know, I was just the other day thinking how nice it would be to have
>> a
>> live-in cook . . .
>>
>> Sarah (drooling on keyboard)
>>
>> www.sarahtonin.com/wayward.htm
>>
>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:448cb8d0$1@linux...
>> >
>> > This is mostly for Jimmy... :-)
>> >
>> > Jimmy, when I read that you got it after ten tries I almost pissed
> myself.
>> > I have been working at it for the past ten years and have yet to
>> > produce
>> > a pie that I'm satisfied with. But anyway..
>> >
>> > Here is my ramble.. You gotta have a stone, or you gotta have some
>> > clay
>> > tiles. The stone needs to be heated in a 500 degree oven for at least
> 30
>> > minutes before hand. The dough needs to be at room temperature (go
> figure
>> > :-).
>> >
>> > Now here's where I go different from everyone else I know. I never,
>> > never,
>> > ever put the pizza together and throw it in the oven.
>> >
>> > First I sprinkle the stone with corn meal - it will smoke like crazy,
> and
>> > after tossing the dough lay it out on the stone. Brush the top litely
>> > with
>> > olive oil and push the assembly back into the oven.
>> >
>> > Watch carefully, and when the top of the dough starts to turn the
>> > slightest
>> > brown it's time for the sauce. This is the crucial time, it's where
>> > everyone
>> > makes the mistakes... Poke the bubbles that are forming and do the
> sauce.
>> > It doesn't take much sauce, a couple tablespoons full of crushed
>> > tomato/garlic/olive
>> > oil, or a nice pesto. Too much sauce destroys the pie.
>> >
>> > Put it back into the oven until the sauce is hot and just starting to
> dry.
>> > There's nothing worse than a pie with sloppy, dripping sauce.
>> >
>> > Now it's time for cheese. Use interesting mixtures of fresh mozz,
>> > parm,
>> > romano, assagio, whatever you have on hand, but the key is this.... The
>> > cheeses
>> > have to COOK, brown and almost burn to bring out the real flavor.
>> >
>> > Once you get to the point where you can reliably produce a great pie
>> > you
>> > can move on to adding toppings.
>> >
>> > The other thing people often overlook is that a grill is an excellent
>> > pizza
>> > oven, but you need to watch the pie like crazy. Soaked apple wood is a
>> > good
>> > wood to try on top of the coals.
>> >
>> > The other aspect that is often overlooked is the crust. A mixture of
>> > crushed
>> > red pepper, kosher salt, parmesean and olive oil brushed over the crust
>> > about
>> > 2/3 the way through is NUTS!
>> >
>> > I love pizza !
>> >
>> > Chuck
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: My thoughts on pizza... [message #69316 is a reply to message #69274] |
Wed, 14 June 2006 02:45 |
rick
Messages: 1976
Registered: February 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Smoked Sausage with Fennel
1 Lb. Smoked brats cut into ¼" thick slices (or italian)
2 pkgs. Shitake mushrooms sliced
1 large red onion sliced 1/4 " thick
2 fresh fennel bulbs sliced ¼" thick
1 ½ cups chicken stock
14 oz. diced fire roasted tomatoes
20 cloves roasted garlic or 1 heaping tbsp. roasted garlic puree
3 tbsp. olive oil
2 ½ cups rigatoni (uncooked)
1 cup microplaned pecorino romano cheese
Season the fennel and onions with salt and pepper then saute in the
olive oil until tender. Add garlic and mushrooms and cook another 5
minutes. Add tomatoes and cook another 5 minutes. Add chicken stock
and bring to a fast simmer until liquid is reduced and starts to
thicken (about 5-8 minutes).
Boil pasta to aldente` doneness and add to the above and mix. Remove
from heat and add ¾ of the cheese and mix.
Plate and serve with remaining cheese per serving.
On Tue, 13 Jun 2006 06:57:25 -0500, "Rich Lamanna"
<richard.lamanna@verizon.net> wrote:
>One who can double as a massage therapist would be the ultimate :-) All this
>pizza talk is making this Italian hungry and ready to throw one in the oven
>for breakfast.
>
>Rich
>
>
>"Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com> wrote in message news:448dcb61@linux...
>> You know, I was just the other day thinking how nice it would be to have a
>> live-in cook . . .
>>
>> Sarah (drooling on keyboard)
>>
>> www.sarahtonin.com/wayward.htm
>>
>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:448cb8d0$1@linux...
>> >
>> > This is mostly for Jimmy... :-)
>> >
>> > Jimmy, when I read that you got it after ten tries I almost pissed
>myself.
>> > I have been working at it for the past ten years and have yet to produce
>> > a pie that I'm satisfied with. But anyway..
>> >
>> > Here is my ramble.. You gotta have a stone, or you gotta have some clay
>> > tiles. The stone needs to be heated in a 500 degree oven for at least
>30
>> > minutes before hand. The dough needs to be at room temperature (go
>figure
>> > :-).
>> >
>> > Now here's where I go different from everyone else I know. I never,
>> > never,
>> > ever put the pizza together and throw it in the oven.
>> >
>> > First I sprinkle the stone with corn meal - it will smoke like crazy,
>and
>> > after tossing the dough lay it out on the stone. Brush the top litely
>> > with
>> > olive oil and push the assembly back into the oven.
>> >
>> > Watch carefully, and when the top of the dough starts to turn the
>> > slightest
>> > brown it's time for the sauce. This is the crucial time, it's where
>> > everyone
>> > makes the mistakes... Poke the bubbles that are forming and do the
>sauce.
>> > It doesn't take much sauce, a couple tablespoons full of crushed
>> > tomato/garlic/olive
>> > oil, or a nice pesto. Too much sauce destroys the pie.
>> >
>> > Put it back into the oven until the sauce is hot and just starting to
>dry.
>> > There's nothing worse than a pie with sloppy, dripping sauce.
>> >
>> > Now it's time for cheese. Use interesting mixtures of fresh mozz, parm,
>> > romano, assagio, whatever you have on hand, but the key is this.... The
>> > cheeses
>> > have to COOK, brown and almost burn to bring out the real flavor.
>> >
>> > Once you get to the point where you can reliably produce a great pie you
>> > can move on to adding toppings.
>> >
>> > The other thing people often overlook is that a grill is an excellent
>> > pizza
>> > oven, but you need to watch the pie like crazy. Soaked apple wood is a
>> > good
>> > wood to try on top of the coals.
>> >
>> > The other aspect that is often overlooked is the crust. A mixture of
>> > crushed
>> > red pepper, kosher salt, parmesean and olive oil brushed over the crust
>> > about
>> > 2/3 the way through is NUTS!
>> >
>> > I love pizza !
>> >
>> > Chuck
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
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