Home » The PARIS Forums » PARIS: Main » The Next Step?
| The Next Step? [message #60795] |
Thu, 01 December 2005 08:34  |
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br />
>>>I received some wav files made in Nuendo ans some of them are not
>>>displaying the waveforms in Paris
>>>
>>>Any thoughts as to why this might be happening
>>>
>>>Don
>>>
>>>
>
>I'm using Logic "Pro" 7.1 on a dual 2.5GHZ G5 running OSX. Logic would
be "Pro" if it didn't crash. Of course OSX doesn't go down when Logic
does but it's still an interruption to restart Logic when it happens.
Some of that may be a hardware problem with my rig, I'm tracking down a
possible HD glitch right now.
The other thing about Logic is there is a bit of a learning curve. Most
things are straight forward but a few things are obtuse. You might give
yourself a few weeks to come
Gantt Kushner
Gizmo Recording Company
Silver Spring, MD
www.gizmorecording.com
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| Re: The Next Step? [message #60802 is a reply to message #60800] |
Thu, 01 December 2005 10:44  |
Jamie K
Messages: 1115
Registered: July 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
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ing curve. Most
>things are straight forward but a few things are obtuse. You might give
>yourself a few weeks to come up to speed, depending on what your needs are.
>
>Those negatives aside, Logic has come a long way and it rocks. It has an
>incredible selection of useful plugins for convolution reverb,
>compression, limiting, distortion, EQ, etc. It also includes a good
>variety of excellent virtual instrument/synth plugins, and great third
>party plugins are readily available. It really is a virtual studio and
>I'm very happy with the tracks I'm producing. C'mon over and check it
>out if you're ever in the neighborhood.
>
>Everything is automatable. Mixers show as many tracks as you have. The
>MIDI features are comprehensive. Logic can play video files for film
>scoring.
>
>The G5 processors support so many plugins and tracks that I rarely have
>to "freeze" anything, it's all live. But if I ever need more CPU
>overhead, freezing a track converts a track and all plugin operations to
>an audio file. It can be unfrozen if any editing is needed. There's also
>an option to network with another Mac to farm out CPU time but I've
>never needed that with the G5. BTW, the new dual core dual processor G5
>box is somewhere around twice as fast as mine. Whoa.
>
>If at all possible, you should try to mix on each of the systems you're
>considering and see if the sound pleases your ear. The i/o you choose
>will also matter. Like Tony I'm using a MOTU 828MII which has been a
>decent sounding, reliable piece of gear, and there are many other
>options to consider. You can combine several i/o devices if you need to
>expand to additional channels. If you need flying faders there are
>several choices with or without built-in i/o.
>
>Cheers,
> -Jamie
> http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>
>Tony Benson wrote:
>> I suppose it would depend on your style of mixing, but I've been really
>> happy lately using DP 4.6 and PARIS. I track and mix first in DP to take
>> advantage of any virtual instruments I might want to use, and any plugins
>> that won't work in PARIS. I'm using a MOTU 828 Mk2 firewire interface
that
>> actually sounds pretty good. It doesn't add any character while recording,
>> but that's what I'm wanting at this stage. This first mix is basically
just
>> a "get it close" type mix. I usually don't use any EQ plugins in DP opting
>> for the nice PARIS EQ's instead. Once I've got things close in DP I freeze
>> all the tracks (equivalent to rendering with plugins in PARIS). Then I
>> export the frozen DP tracks as 24 bit .wav files. Then I boot to OS9 and
use
>> SonicWorx to convert the .wavs to 24 bit .paf files. Then I open PARIS,
add
>> the audio files, and do all my editing and final mixing in PARIS. I still
>> like the editing in PARIS, I suppose because I'm so used to it. Right
now
>> I'm doing this all on one Mac dual processor G4 and dual booting. I'm
>> getting a G5 soon though and dedicating the G4 to PARIS only. I'll just
>> share a firewire drive between the two. This will also let me use the
G5 as
>> a virtual FX rack when mixing in PARIS using external sends. Anyway, I
know
>> this approach is pretty convoluted and might not work for everyone, but
it's
>> my way of having the best of both worlds so to speak. The modern features
in
>> DP and the great sounding mix bus, EQ and easy editing in PARIS. Not
to
>> mention the great PARIS plugs like NoLimit, BarbEQ, etc.
>>
>> Tony
>>
>>
>> "Gantt Kushner" <gizmo@his.com> wrote in message
>> news:438F262B.D0B3EB31@his.com...
>>
>>>I love Paris!
>>>
>>>But I'm beginning to realize, especially in the face of new,
>>>cool plugins that'll never work in Paris (like the Waves
>>>Transform Bundle, among others), that I'm eventually going
>>>to have to switch to something that actually has ongoing
>>>development and support.
>>>
>>>So what are my fellow Mac DAW users finding satisfying
>>>after Paris? I own Digital Performer (w/ an old 2408) and
>>>Protools LE (w/ Digi 002). Neither seems as intuitive as
>>>Paris, but I suppose I'd get faster if I immersed myself in
>>>one or the other. My big concern is sound quality. I haven't
>>>found either DP or PT LE as satisfying to listen to and mix on
>>>as Paris. I know I've lost business for not being a Protools
>>>studio, but PT HD would cost a couple of arms and legs.
>>>
>>>What to
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| Re: The Next Step? [message #60809 is a reply to message #60802] |
Thu, 01 December 2005 12:35 |
TCB
Messages: 1261
Registered: July 2007
|
Senior Member |
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it close" type mix. I usually don't use any EQ plugins in DP
opting
>
> >> for the nice PARIS EQ's instead. Once I've got things close in DP I
freeze
>
> >> all the tracks (equivalent to rendering with plugins in PARIS). Then I
>
> >> export the frozen DP tracks as 24 bit .wav files. Then I boot to OS9
and
> use
> >> SonicWorx to convert the .wavs to 24 bit .paf files. Then I open PARIS,
> add
> >> the audio files, and do all my editing and final mixing in PARIS. I
still
>
> >> like the editing in PARIS, I suppose because I'm so used to it. Right
> now
> >> I'm doing this all on one Mac dual processor G4 and dual booting. I'm
>
> >> getting a G5 soon though and dedicating the G4 to PARIS only. I'll just
>
> >> share a firewire drive between the two. This will also let me use the
> G5 as
> >> a virtual FX rack when mixing in PARIS using external sends. Anyway, I
> know
> >> this approach is pretty convoluted and might not work for everyone, but
> it's
> >> my way of having the best of both worlds so to speak. The modern
features
> in
> >> DP and the great sounding mix bus, EQ and easy editing in PARIS. Not
> to
> >> mention the great PARIS plugs like NoLimit, BarbEQ, etc.
> >>
> >> Tony
> >>
> >>
> >> "Gantt Kushner" <gizmo@his.com> wrote in message
> >> news:438F262B.D0B3EB31@his.com...
> >>
> >>>I love Paris!
> >>>
> >>>But I'm beginning to realize, especially in the face of new,
> >>>cool plugins that'll never work in Paris (like the Waves
> >>>Transform Bundle, among others), that I'm eventually going
> >>>to have to switch to something that actually has ongoing
> >>>development and support.
> >>>
> >>>So what are my fellow Mac DAW users finding satisfying
> >>>after Paris? I own Digital Performer (w/ an old 2408) and
> >>>Protools LE (w/ Digi 002). Neither seems as intuitive as
> >>>Paris, but I suppose I'd get faster if I immersed myself in
> >>>one or the other. My big concern is sound quality. I haven't
> >>>found either DP or PT LE as satisfying to listen to and mix on
> >>>as Paris. I know I've lost business for not being a Protools
> >>>studio, but PT HD would cost a couple of arms and legs.
> >>>
> >>>What to do?
> >>>
> >>>Gantt
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
>I don't check this NG for eons. Then I drop by on a whim and no flame wars,
no calls for Edmund to be covered in cattle blood and released into a cage
filled with starving ferrets, no lectures from Don about intelligent design?
Sheesh.
Seriously, hope all is well. I'm beaten down at work and trying do simple
things my brain can still manage, like look at newsgroups where I once spent
most of my time.
TCBSample rate was 44.1 and the bit rate was 24...I taught my friend long ago
to disable the "broadcast wav" thing so this is something new...and it's
just on three of the 10 tracks...weird
Don
"EK Sound" <spamnot.info@eksoundNO.com> wrote in message
news:438f3fc1$1@linux...
> Hmmm.. I didn't think it would do BW but maybe I'm wrong. The other thing
> to check would be sample rate and bit depth.
>
> David.
>
> Rod Lincoln wrote:
>> strip wave will strip the header off broadcast waves. that's what it
>> does.
>> Rod
>> "Dave(EK Sound)" <audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca> wrote:
>>
>>>Check the properties of the files to see if they are Broadcast Wav's...
>>>if they are, stripwav won't help. You will need something like Wavelab
>>>to batch process the files
>>
>>>from BW to PAF (or standard wav).
>>
>>>David.
>>>
>>>Don Nafe wrote:
>>>
>>>>Hi All
>>>>
>>>>I received some wav files made in Nuendo ans some of them are not
>>>>displaying the waveforms in Paris
>>>>
>>>>Any thoughts as to why this might be happening
>>>>
>>>>Don
>>>>
>>Hey Thad -
Long time :)
Where are you ?
Morgan
TCB wrote:
> I don't check this NG for eons. Then I drop by on a whim and no flame wars,
> no calls for Edmund to be covered in cattle blood and released into a cage
> filled with starving ferrets, no lectures from Don about intelligent design?
> Sheesh.
>
> Seriously, hope all is well. I'm beaten down at work and trying do simple
> things my brain can still manage, like look at newsgroups where I once spent
> most of my time.
>
> TCBToss the .ovw files for these tracks and let Paris re-build them
(close Paris, toss files, open Paris).
I am assuming you can "hear" the audio.
David.
Don Nafe wrote:
> Sample rate was 44.1 and the bit rate was 24...I taught my friend long ago
> to disable the "bro
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| Re: The Next Step? [message #60810 is a reply to message #60809] |
Thu, 01 December 2005 11:35 |
Deej [1]
Messages: 2149
Registered: January 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
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adcast wav" thing so this is something new...and it's
> just on three of the 10 tracks...weird
>
> Don
>
>
> "EK Sound" <spamnot.info@eksoundNO.com> wrote in message
> news:438f3fc1$1@linux...
>
>>Hmmm.. I didn't think it would do BW but maybe I'm wrong. The other thing
>>to check would be sample rate and bit depth.
>>
>>David.
>>
>>Rod Lincoln wrote:
>>
>>>strip wave will strip the header off broadcast waves. that's what it
>>>does.
>>>Rod
>>>"Dave(EK Sound)" <audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Check the properties of the files to see if they are Broadcast Wav's...
>>>>if they are, stripwav won't help. You will need something like Wavelab
>>>>to batch process the files
>>>
>>>>from BW to PAF (or standard wav).
>>>
>>>
>>>>David.
>>>>
>>>>Don Nafe wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Hi All
>>>>>
>>>>>I received some wav files made in Nuendo ans some of them are not
>>>>>displaying the waveforms in Paris
>>>>>
>>>>>Any thoughts as to why this might be happening
>>>>>
>>>>>Don
>>>>>
>>>
>Hey Morgan,
Still in New Haven, working a straight job again, though I write the odd
piece for Electronic Musician. Playing in a band too, which is weird. I tried
to upgrade the drummer and patch the songs but I just took a beating instead.
How's the move going?
TCB
Morgan <morganp@ntplx.net> wrote:
>Hey Thad -
>Long time :)
>Where are you ?
>Morgan
>
>TCB wrote:
>> I don't check this NG for eons. Then I drop by on a whim and no flame
wars,
>> no calls for Edmund to be covered in cattle blood and released into a
cage
>> filled with starving ferrets, no lectures from Don about intelligent design?
>> Sheesh.
>>
>> Seriously, hope all is well. I'm beaten down at work and trying do simple
>> things my brain can still manage, like look at newsgroups where I once
spent
>> most of my time.
>>
>> TCB
>Hey Deej, hope all is well.
"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>heheheh.........hi thad
>
>;o)
>
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:438f5066$1@linux...
>>
>> You're running this on BeOS, right?
>>
>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >I'm using Logic "Pro" 7.1 on a dual 2.5GHZ G5 running OSX. Logic would
>> >be "Pro" if it didn't crash. Of course OSX doesn't go down when Logic
>> >does but it's still an interruption to restart Logic when it happens.
>> >Some of that may be a hardware problem with my rig, I'm tracking down
a
>>
>> >possible HD glitch right now.
>> >
>> >The other thing about Logic is there is a bit of a learning curve. Most
>>
>> >things are straight forward but a few things are obtuse. You might give
>>
>> >yourself a few weeks to come up to speed, depending on what your needs
>are.
>> >
>> >Those negatives aside, Logic has come a long way and it rocks. It has
an
>>
>> >incredible selection of useful plugins for convolution reverb,
>> >compression, limiting, distortion, EQ, etc. It also includes a good
>> >variety of excellent virtual instrument/synth plugins, and great third
>> >party plugins are readily available. It really is a virtual studio and
>> >I'm very happy with the tracks I'm producing. C'mon over and check it
>> >out if you're ever in the neighborhood.
>> >
>> >Everything is automatable. Mixers show as many tracks as you have. The
>> >MIDI features are comprehensive. Logic can play video files for film
>> >scoring.
>> >
>> >The G5 processors support so many plugins and tracks that I rarely have
>>
>> >to "freeze" anything, it's all live. But if I ever need more CPU
>> >overhead, freezing a track converts a track and all plugin operations
to
>>
>> >an audio file. It can be unfrozen if any editing is needed. There's also
>>
>> >an option to network with another Mac to farm out CPU time but I've
>> >never needed that with the G5. BTW, the new dual core dual processor
G5
>>
>> >box is somewhere around twice as fast as mine. Whoa.
>> >
>> >If at all possible, you should try to mix on each of the systems you're
>>
>> >considering and see if the sound pleases your ear. The i/o you choose
>> >will also matter. Like Tony I'm using a MOTU 828MII which has been a
>> >decent sounding, reliable piece of gear, and there are many other
>> >options to consider. You can combine several i/o devices if you need
to
>>
>> >expand to additional channels. If you need flying faders there are
>> >several choices with or without built-in i/o.
>> >
>> >Cheers,
>> > -Jamie
>> > http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>> >
>> >Tony Benson wrote:
>> >> I suppose it would depend on your style of mixing, but I've been really
>>
>> >> happy lately using DP 4.6 and PARIS. I track and mix first in DP to
>take
>>
>> >> advantage of any virtual instruments I might want to use, and any
>plugins
>>
>> >> that won't
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| Re: The Next Step? [message #60816 is a reply to message #60810] |
Thu, 01 December 2005 13:39 |
TCB
Messages: 1261
Registered: July 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
;Hi All
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I received some wav files made in Nuendo ans some of them are not
>>>>>>displaying the waveforms in Paris
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Any thoughts as to why this might be happening
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Don
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>Gave your idea a try and it didn't work
DOn
"EK Sound" <spamnot.info@eksoundNO.com> wrote in message
news:438f5ab9$1@linux...
> Toss the .ovw files for these tracks and let Paris re-build them (close
> Paris, toss files, open Paris).
>
> I am assuming you can "hear" the audio.
>
> David.
>
> Don Nafe wrote:
>
>> Sample rate was 44.1 and the bit rate was 24...I taught my friend long
>> ago to disable the "broadcast wav" thing so this is something new...and
>> it's just on three of the 10 tracks...weird
>>
>> Don
>>
>>
>> "EK Sound" <spamnot.info@eksoundNO.com> wrote in message
>> news:438f3fc1$1@linux...
>>
>>>Hmmm.. I didn't think it would do BW but maybe I'm wrong. The other
>>>thing to check would be sample rate and bit depth.
>>>
>>>David.
>>>
>>>Rod Lincoln wrote:
>>>
>>>>strip wave will strip the header off broadcast waves. that's what it
>>>>does.
>>>>Rod
>>>>"Dave(EK Sound)" <audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Check the properties of the files to see if they are Broadcast Wav's...
>>>>>if they are, stripwav won't help. You will need something like Wavelab
>>>>>to batch process the files
>>>>
>>>>>from BW to PAF (or standard wav).
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>David.
>>>>>
>>>>>Don Nafe wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Hi All
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I received some wav files made in Nuendo ans some of them are not
>>>>>>displaying the waveforms in Paris
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Any thoughts as to why this might be happening
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Don
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>Hey, glad to hear you're working! BTW, lectures are now
1.75/minute, or you can check out my blog...
On the other hand don't, Lacan probably makes more sense to you
bein' uh inteelectuel and all..
<grin>
DC
"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>
>I don't check this NG for eons. Then I drop by on a whim and no flame wars,
>no calls for Edmund to be covered in cattle blood and released into a cage
>filled with starving ferrets, no lectures from Don about intelligent design?
>Sheesh.
>
>Seriously, hope all is well. I'm beaten down at work and trying do simple
>things my brain can still manage, like look at newsgroups where I once spent
>most of my time.
>
>TCBJamie,
Have you anyinvolvement with the LUG?
Are there any rumours of a "Logic Box" to compete with ProTools? Something
more like Paris and ProTools in the low-latency sense?
Jimmy
"Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message news:438f4510@linux...
>
> I'm using Logic "Pro" 7.1 on a dual 2.5GHZ G5 running OSX. Logic would
> be "Pro" if it didn't crash. Of course OSX doesn't go down when Logic
> does but it's still an interruption to restart Logic when it happens.
> Some of that may be a hardware problem with my rig, I'm tracking down a
> possible HD glitch right now.
>
> The other thing about Logic is there is a bit of a learning curve. Most
> things are straight forward but a few things are obtuse. You might give
> yourself a few weeks to come up to speed, depending on what your needs
are.
>
> Those negatives aside, Logic has come a long way and it rocks. It has an
> incredible selection of useful plugins for convolution reverb,
> compression, limiting, distortion, EQ, etc. It also includes a good
> variety of excellent virtual instrument/synth plugins, and great third
> party plugins are readily available. It really is a virtual studio and
> I'm very happy with the tracks I'm producing. C'mon over and check it
> out if you're ever in the neighborhood.
>
> Everything is automatable. Mixers show as many tracks as you have. The
> MIDI features are comprehensive. Logic can play video files for film
> scoring.
>
> The G5 processors support so many plugins and tracks that I rarely have
> to "freeze" anything, it's all live. But if I ever need more CPU
> overhead, freezing a track converts a track and all plugin operations to
> an audio file. It can be unfrozen if any editing is needed. There's also
> an option to network with another Mac to farm out CPU time but I've
> never needed that with the G5. BTW, the new dual core dual processor G5
> box is somewhere around twice as fast as mine. Whoa.
>
> If at all possible, you should try to mix on each of the systems you're
> considering and see if the sound pleases your ear. The i/o you choose
> will also matter. Like Tony I'm using a MOTU 828MII which has been a
> decent sounding, reliable piece of gear, and there are many other
> options to consider. You can combine several i/o devices if you need to
> expand to additional channels. If you need flying faders there are
> several choices with or without built-in i/o.
>
> Cheers,
> -Jamie
> http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>
> Tony Benson wrote:
> > I suppose it would depend on your style of mixing, but I've been really
> > happy lately using DP 4.6 and PARIS. I track and mix first in DP to take
> > advantage of any virtual instruments I might want to use, and any
plugins
> > that won't work in PARIS. I'm using a MOTU 828 Mk2 firewire interface
that
> > actually sounds pretty good. It doesn't add any character while
recording,
> > but that's what I'm wanting at this stage. This first mix is basically
just
> > a "get it close" type mix. I usually don't use any EQ plugins in DP
opting
> > for the nice PARIS EQ's instead. Once I've got things close in DP I
freeze
> > all the tracks (equivalent to rendering with plugins in PARIS). Then I
> > export the frozen DP tracks as 2
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| Re: The Next Step? [message #60820 is a reply to message #60802] |
Thu, 01 December 2005 13:38 |
uptown jimmy
Messages: 441
Registered: September 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
r />
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>David.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Don Nafe wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Hi All
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I received some wav files made in Nuendo ans some of them are not
>>>>>>>displaying the waveforms in Paris
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Any thoughts as to why this might be happening
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Don
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>
>mayboe he goofed up on those 3 tracks and gave you aiff or sd2 files by mistake.
I've had that happen before, a few errant file exports by a protools guy.
Rod
"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>Sample rate was 44.1 and the bit rate was 24...I taught my friend long ago
>to disable the "broadcast wav" thing so this is something new...and it's
>just on three of the 10 tracks...weird
>
>Don
>
>
>"EK Sound" <spamnot.info@eksoundNO.com> wrote in message
>news:438f3fc1$1@linux...
>> Hmmm.. I didn't think it would do BW but maybe I'm wrong. The other thing
>> to check would be sample rate and bit depth.
>>
>> David.
>>
>> Rod Lincoln wrote:
>>> strip wave will strip the header off broadcast waves. that's what it
>>> does.
>>> Rod
>>> "Dave(EK Sound)" <audioguy_editout_@shaw.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Check the properties of the files to see if they are Broadcast Wav's...
>>>>if they are, stripwav won't help. You will need something like Wavelab
>>>>to batch process the files
>>>
>>>>from BW to PAF (or standard wav).
>>>
>>>>David.
>>>>
>>>>Don Nafe wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Hi All
>>>>>
>>>>>I received some wav files made in Nuendo ans some of them are not
>>>>>displaying the waveforms in Paris
>>>>>
>>>>>Any thoughts as to why this might be happening
>>>>>
>>>>>Don
>>>>>
>>>
>Hey Thad,
We are coming down the home stretch !
At this point we are looking at Early Jan.
We gave it our best to be in by the holidays,
but the folks at town Hall even with Cattle prods,
hookers guns and fire engines move about as fast as
molases.
Please forward your email and such to me
morganp@ntplx.net
I have some things I'd like to share with you :)
Morgan
TCB wrote:
> Hey Morgan,
>
> Still in New Haven, working a straight job again, though I write the odd
> piece for Electronic Musician. Playing in a band too, which is weird. I tried
> to upgrade the drummer and patch the songs but I just took a beating instead.
>
>
> How's the move going?
>
> TCB
>
> Morgan <morganp@ntplx.net> wrote:
>
>>Hey Thad -
>>Long time :)
>>Where are you ?
>>Morgan
>>
>>TCB wrote:
>>
>>>I don't check this NG for eons. Then I drop by on a whim and no flame
>
> wars,
>
>>>no calls for Edmund to be covered in cattle blood and released into a
>
> cage
>
>>>filled with starving ferrets, no lectures from Don about intelligent design?
>>>Sheesh.
>>>
>>>Seriously, hope all is well. I'm beaten down at work and trying do simple
>>>things my brain can still manage, like look at newsgroups where I once
>
> spent
>
>>>most of my time.
>>>
>>>TCB
>>
>I initially used the WavPaf converter on these particular files, then I
tried bringing just these wav files into Paris and the result was the
same...no drawn wav forms.
I'm going to get him to resave them and drop off the new files and see what
happens.
I'd try them in wavelab except my second computer is on loan for video work
of my 50th B-Day Bash
Don
"Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@noispam.kc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:438f7cfa$1@linux...
>
> mayboe he goofed up on those 3 tracks and gave you aiff or sd2 files by
> mistake.
> I've had that happen before, a few errant file exports by a protools guy.
> Rod
> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>Sample rate was 44.1 and the bit rate was 24...I taught my friend long ago
>
>>to disable the "broadcast wav" thing so this is something new...and it's
>
>>just on three of the 10 tracks...weird
>>
>>Don
>>
>>
>>"EK Sound" <spamnot.info@eksoundNO.com> wrote in message
>>news:438f3fc1$1@linux...
>>> Hmmm.. I didn't think it would do BW but maybe I'm wrong. The other
>>> thing
&g
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| Re: The Next Step? [message #60834 is a reply to message #60795] |
Thu, 01 December 2005 18:05 |
Jeremy Luzier
Messages: 102
Registered: November 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
>
>>use
>>
>>>>SonicWorx to convert the .wavs to 24 bit .paf files. Then I open PARIS,
>>
>>add
>>
>>>>the audio files, and do all my editing and final mixing in PARIS. I
>
> still
>
>>>>like the editing in PARIS, I suppose because I'm so used to it. Right
>>
>>now
>>
>>>>I'm doing this all on one Mac dual processor G4 and dual booting. I'm
>>
>>>>getting a G5 soon though and dedicating the G4 to PARIS only. I'll just
>>
>>>>share a firewire drive between the two. This will also let me use the
>>
>>G5 as
>>
>>>>a virtual FX rack when mixing in PARIS using external sends. Anyway, I
>>
>>know
>>
>>>>this approach is pretty convoluted and might not work for everyone, but
>>
>>it's
>>
>>>>my way of having the best of both worlds so to speak. The modern
>
> features
>
>>in
>>
>>>>DP and the great sounding mix bus, EQ and easy editing in PARIS. Not
>>
>>to
>>
>>>>mention the great PARIS plugs like NoLimit, BarbEQ, etc.
>>>>
>>>>Tony
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>"Gantt Kushner" <gizmo@his.com> wrote in message
>>>>news:438F262B.D0B3EB31@his.com...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>I love Paris!
>>>>>
>>>>>But I'm beginning to realize, especially in the face of new,
>>>>>cool plugins that'll never work in Paris (like the Waves
>>>>>Transform Bundle, among others), that I'm eventually going
>>>>>to have to switch to something that actually has ongoing
>>>>>development and support.
>>>>>
>>>>>So what are my fellow Mac DAW users finding satisfying
>>>>>after Paris? I own Digital Performer (w/ an old 2408) and
>>>>>Protools LE (w/ Digi 002). Neither seems as intuitive as
>>>>>Paris, but I suppose I'd get faster if I immersed myself in
>>>>>one or the other. My big concern is sound quality. I haven't
>>>>>found either DP or PT LE as satisfying to listen to and mix on
>>>>>as Paris. I know I've lost business for not being a Protools
>>>>>studio, but PT HD would cost a couple of arms and legs.
>>>>>
>>>>>What to do?
>>>>>
>>>>>Gantt
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>
>I don't check this NG for eons. Then I drop by on a whi
|
|
|
|
| Re: The Next Step? [message #60835 is a reply to message #60810] |
Thu, 01 December 2005 19:47 |
Jamie K
Messages: 1115
Registered: July 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
m and no flame wars,
>no calls for Edmund to be covered in cattle blood and released into a cage
>filled with starving ferrets, no lectures from Don about intelligent design?
>Sheesh.
>
>Seriously, hope all is well. I'm beaten down at work and trying do simple
>things my brain can still manage, like look at newsgroups where I once spent
>most of my time.
>
>TCB
oddly enough, I seem to have started dropping by again, ever so occasionally...
-steveuptown jimmy wrote:
> Jamie,
>
> Have you anyinvolvement with the LUG?
Hi Jimmy. I've lurked there a bit.
Been more participatory on OSXAudio.com which has a wider scope.
> Are there any rumours of a "Logic Box" to compete with ProTools? Something
> more like Paris and ProTools in the low-latency sense?
I don't know, but most current i/o boxes have direct monitoring so you
don't have to put up with software monitoring latencies. My little MOTU
offers that.
If you want to monitor incoming takes through Logic, recent PowerMacs
are fast enough that you can set software monitoring to usably low
latencies.
Between the two I don't have problems with latency.
Cheers,
-Jamie
http://www.JamieKrutz.com
> Jimmy
>
> "Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message news:438f4510@linux...
>
>>I'm using Logic "Pro" 7.1 on a dual 2.5GHZ G5 running OSX. Logic would
>>be "Pro" if it didn't crash. Of course OSX doesn't go down when Logic
>>does but it's still an interruption to restart Logic when it happens.
>>Some of that may be a hardware problem with my rig, I'm tracking down a
>>possible HD glitch right now.
>>
>>The other thing about Logic is there is a bit of a learning curve. Most
>>things are straight forward but a few things are obtuse. You might give
>>yourself a few weeks to come up to speed, depending on what your needs
>
> are.
>
>>Those negatives aside, Logic has come a long way and it rocks. It has an
>>incredible selection of useful plugins for convolution reverb,
>>compression, limiting, distortion, EQ, etc. It also includes a good
>>variety of excellent virtual instrument/synth plugins, and great third
>>party plugins are readily available. It really is a virtual studio and
>>I'm very happy with the tracks I'm producing. C'mon over and check it
>>out if you're ever in the neighborhood.
>>
>>Everything is automatable. Mixers show as many tracks as you have. The
>>MIDI features are comprehensive. Logic can play video files for film
>>scoring.
>>
>>The G5 processors support so many plugins and tracks that I rarely have
>>to "freeze" anything, it's all live. But if I ever need more CPU
>>overhead, freezing a track converts a track and all plugin operations to
>>an audio file. It can be unfrozen if any editing is needed. There's also
>>an option to network with another Mac to farm out CPU time but I've
>>never needed that with the G5. BTW, the new dual core dual processor G5
>>box is somewhere around twice as fast as mine. Whoa.
>>
>>If at all possible, you should try to mix on each of the systems you're
>>considering and see if the sound pleases your ear. The i/o you choose
>>will also matter. Like Tony I'm using a MOTU 828MII which has been a
>>decent sounding, reliable piece of gear, and there are many other
>>options to consider. You can combine several i/o devices if you need to
>>expand to additional channels. If you need flying faders there are
>>several choices with or without built-in i/o.
>>
>>Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
>>Tony Benson wrote:
>>
>>>I suppose it would depend on your style of mixing, but I've been really
>>>happy lately using DP 4.6 and PARIS. I track and mix first in DP to take
>>>advantage of any virtual instruments I might want to use, and any
>
> plugins
>
>>>that won't work in PARIS. I'm using a MOTU 828 Mk2 firewire interface
>
> that
>
>>>actually sounds pretty good. It doesn't add any character while
>
> recording,
>
>>>but that's what I'm wanting at this stage. This first mix is basically
>
> just
>
>>>a "get it close" type mix. I usually don't use any EQ plugins in DP
>
> opting
>
>>>for the nice PARIS EQ's instead. Once I've got things close in DP I
>
> freeze
>
>>>all the tracks (equivalent to rendering with plugins in PARIS). Then I
>>>export the frozen DP tracks as 24 bit .wav files. Then I boot to OS9 and
>
> use
>
>>>SonicWorx to convert the .wavs to 24 bit .paf files. Then I open PARIS,
>
> add
>
>>>the audio files, and do all my editing and final mixing in PARIS. I
>
> still
>
>>>like the editing in PARIS, I suppose because I'm so used to it. Right
>
> now
>
>>>I'm doing this all on one Mac dual processor G4 and dual booting. I'm
>>>getting a G5 soon though and dedicating the G4 to PARIS only. I'll just
>>>share a firewire drive between the two. This will also let me use the G5
>
> as
>
>>>a virtual FX rack when mixing in PARIS using external sends. Anyway, I
>
> know
>
>>>this approach is pretty convoluted and might not work for everyone, but
>
> it's
>
>>>my way of having the best of both worlds so to speak. The modern
>
> features in
>
>>>DP and the great sounding mix bus, EQ and easy editing in PARIS. Not to
>>>mention the great PARIS plugs like NoLimit, BarbEQ, etc.
>>>
>>>Tony
>>>
>>>
>>>"Gantt Kushner" <gizmo@his.com> wrote in message
>>>news:438F262B.D0B3EB31@his.com...
>>>
>>>
>>>>I love Paris!
>>>>
>>>>But I'm beginning to realize, especially in the face of new,
>>>>cool plugins that'll never work in Paris (like the Waves
>>>>Transform Bundle, among others), that I'm eventually going
>>>>to have to switch to something that actually has ongoing
>>>>development and support.
>>>>
>>>>So what are my fellow Mac DAW users finding satisfying
>>>>after Paris? I own Digital Performer (w/ an old 2408) and
>>>>Protools LE (w/ Digi 002). Neither seems as intuitive as
>>>>Paris, but I suppose I'd get faster if I immersed myself in
>>>>one or the other. My big concern is sound quality. I haven't
>>>>found either DP or PT LE as satisfying to listen to and mix on
>>>>as Paris. I know I've lost business for not being a Protools
>>>>studio, but PT HD would cost a couple of arms and legs.
>>>>
>>>>What to do?
>>>>
>>>>Gantt
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>I was just busting your chops a bit. I yam what I yam.
On the "desktop" OS front I have converted 100% to Debian GNU/Linux. I still
have one M$oft box for my audio stuff (until Live, CubaseSX, VST, and a ton
of other things get ported to GNU/Linux I have no choice), but everything
else runs on GNU/Linux. I have to say whenver I use a desktop that isn't
Gnome and doesn't give me immediate access to a powerful command line I feel
like I'm running on one leg. There are some bumps along the road, and I have
to install some non free software for remote access to work (including some
kernel patches that are a PITA), but it's been worth every bit of the effort.
Now that I'm doing computer work again for a living I'm happy to be free
of proprietary software as much as humanly possible. For me all proprietary
systems like OS X, XP, Vista, BeOS, and everything else are all roughly equivalent
evils--places I have to spend some time in order to make a living.
Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>
>Heh. Yep Thad, I'm running it on BeOS, maybe that's the problem? ;^)
>
>Time for a BeOS report I guess. Palm bought BeOS and hired members of
>the engineering team. Your Palm's operating system now benefits.
>
>Be retained the right to sue Microsoft for closing them out of the OS
>market for Intel boxes through illegally restrictive OEM agreements.
>Microsoft paid m
|
|
|
|
| Re: The Next Step? [message #60837 is a reply to message #60820] |
Thu, 01 December 2005 20:02 |
Jamie K
Messages: 1115
Registered: July 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
has been steadily improving and has some good stuff. Oddly
>I ran Logic all day today in a project that was crashing left and right
>last time I worked on that project. It didn't crash once today.
>
>So I don't know, maybe it's not a Logic problem. It may have to do with
>Native Instruments plugins, whatever's going on with my system drive or
>?. Or maybe a recent update fixed something. BTW, I do send bug reports
>to Apple so they've seen the detailed crash reports.
>
>The bug where Logic stops playing back a virtual synth did come up one
>time today. That one needs to be fixed. Reloading the song is the
>workaround.
>
>On the plus side, Logic on a dual G5 is incredible in its capabilities
>and the music is sounding great.
>
>Nice to hear from you, Thad.
>
>Cheers,
> -Jamie
> http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>
>
>DJ wrote:
>> heheheh.........hi thad
>>
>> ;o)
>>
>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:438f5066$1@linux...
>>
>>>You're running this on BeOS, right?
>>>
>>>Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>I'm using Logic "Pro" 7.1 on a dual 2.5GHZ G5 running OSX. Logic would
>>>>be "Pro" if it didn't crash. Of course OSX doesn't go down when Logic
>>>>does but it's still an interruption to restart Logic when it happens.
>>>>Some of that may be a hardware problem with my rig, I'm tracking down
a
>>>
>>>>possible HD glitch right now.
>>>>
>>>>The other thing about Logic is there is a bit of a learning curve. Most
>>>
>>>>things are straight forward but a few things are obtuse. You might give
>>>
>>>>yourself a few weeks to come up to speed, depending on what your needs
>>
>> are.
>>
>>>>Those negatives aside, Logic has come a long way and it rocks. It has
an
>>>
>>>>incredible selection of useful plugins for convolution reverb,
>>>>compression, limiting, distortion, EQ, etc. It also includes a good
>>>>variety of excellent virtual instrument/synth plugins, and great third
>>>>party plugins are readily available. It really is a virtual studio and
>>>>I'm very happy with the tracks I'm producing. C'mon over and check it
>>>>out if you're ever in the neighborhood.
>>>>
>>>>Everything is automatable. Mixers show as many tracks as you have. The
>>>>MIDI features are comprehensive. Logic can play video files for film
>>>>scoring.
>>>>
>>>>The G5 processors support so many plugins and tracks that I rarely have
>>>
>>>>to "freeze" anything, it's all live. But if I ever need more CPU
>>>>overhead, freezing a track converts a track and all plugin operations
to
>>>
>>>>an audio file. It can be unfrozen if any editing is needed. There's also
>>>
>>>>an option to network with another Mac to farm out CPU time but I've
>>>>never needed that with the G5. BTW, the new dual core dual processor
G5
>>>
>>>>box is somewhere around twice as fast as mine. Whoa.
>>>>
>>>>If at all possible, you should try to mix on each of the systems you're
>>>
>>>>considering and see if the sound pleases your ear. The i/o you choose
>>>>will also matter. Like Tony I'm using a MOTU 828MII which has been a
>>>>decent sounding, reliable piece of gear, and there are many other
>>>>options to consider. You can combine several i/o devices if you need
to
>>>
>>>>expand to additional channels. If you need flying faders there are
>>>>several choices with or without built-in i/o.
>>>>
>>>>Cheers,
>>>> -Jamie
>>>> http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>
>>>>Tony Benson wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>I suppose it would depend on your style of mixing, but I've been really
>>>
>>>>>happy lately using DP 4.6 and PARIS. I track and mix first in DP to
>>
>> take
>>
>>>>>advantage of any virtual instruments I might want to use, and any
>>
>> plugins
>>
>>>>>that won't work in PARIS. I'm using a MOTU 828 Mk2 firewire interface
>>>
>>>that
>>>
>>>>>actually sounds pretty good. It doesn't add any character while
>>
>> recording,
>>
>>>>>but that's what I'm wanting at this stage. This first mix is basically
>>>
>>>just
>>>
>>>>>a "get it close" type mix. I usually don't use any EQ plugins in DP
>>
>> opting
>>
>>>>>for the nice PARIS EQ's instead. Once I've got things close in DP I
>>
>> freeze
>>
>>>>>all the tracks (equivalent to rendering with plugins in PARIS). Then
I
>>>
>>>>>export the frozen DP tracks as 24 bit .wav files. Then I boot to OS9
>>
>> and
>>
>>>use
>>>
>>>>>SonicWorx to convert the .wavs to 24 bit .paf files. Then I open PARIS,
>>>
>>>add
>>>
>>>>>the audio files, and do all my editing and final mixing in PARIS. I
>>
>> still
>>
>>>>>like the editing in PARIS, I suppose because I'm so used to it. Right
>>>
>>>now
>>>
>>>>>I'm doing this all on one Mac dual processor G4 and dual booting. I'm
>>>
>>>>>getting a G5 soon though and dedicating the G4 to PARIS only. I'll just
>>>
>>>>>share a firewire drive between the two. This will also let me use the
>>>
>>>G5 as
>>>
>>>>>a virtual FX rack when mixing in PARIS using external sends. Anyway,
I
>>>
>>>know
>>>
>>>>>this approach is pretty convoluted and might not work for everyone,
but
>>>
>>>it's
>>>
>>>>>my way of having the best of both worlds so to speak. The modern
>>
>> features
>>
>>>in
>>>
>>>>>DP and the great sounding mix bus, EQ and easy editing in PARIS. Not
>>>
>>>to
>>>
>>>>>mention the great PARIS plugs like NoLimit, BarbEQ, etc.
|
|
|
|
| Re: The Next Step? [message #60838 is a reply to message #60835] |
Thu, 01 December 2005 21:22 |
TCB
Messages: 1261
Registered: July 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
>>>>>
>>>>>Tony
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>"Gantt Kushner" <gizmo@his.com> wrote in message
>>>>>news:438F262B.D0B3EB31@his.com...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>I love Paris!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>But I'm beginning to realize, especially in the face of new,
>>>>>>cool plugins that'll never work in Paris (like the Waves
>>>>>>Transform Bundle, among others), that I'm eventually going
>>>>>>to have to switch to something that actually has ongoing
>>>>>>development and support.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>So what are my fellow Mac DAW users finding satisfying
>>>>>>after Paris? I own Digital Performer (w/ an old 2408) and
>>>>>>Protools LE (w/ Digi 002). Neither seems as intuitive as
>>>>>>Paris, but I suppose I'd get faster if I immersed myself in
>>>>>>one or the other. My big concern is sound quality. I haven't
>>>>>>found either DP or PT LE as satisfying to listen to and mix on
>>>>>>as Paris. I know I've lost business for not being a Protools
>>>>>>studio, but PT HD would cost a couple of arms and legs.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>What to do?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Gantt
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>
>>Hey Steve,
Good to see you! Been stupid busy for the past year. Still listen to the
CD you sent me every now and then. Cool stuff. If you like, check out www.moldmonkies.com
the band I'm playing in right now. Couldn't be further from the dub/electronica
that is my natural playground but I'm having a blast playing with these guys.
TCB
"steve the artguy" <artguy@svnhoohaa.net> wrote:
>
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>
>>I don't check this NG for eons. Then I drop by on a whim and no flame wars,
>>no calls for Edmund to be covered in cattle blood and released into a cage
>>filled with starving ferrets, no lectures from Don about intelligent design?
>>Sheesh.
>>
>>Seriously, hope all is well. I'm beaten down at work and trying do simple
>>things my brain can still manage, like look at newsgroups where I once
spent
>>most of my time.
>>
>>TCB
>
>oddly enough, I seem to have started dropping by again, ever so occasionally...
>
>-steve
>Hey Thad,
Moldmonkies - Cool !
The site has a fun vibe - you guy's must have
a blast at gigs. Are you playing out much ?
Morgan
TCB wrote:
> Hey Steve,
>
> Good to see you! Been stupid busy for the past year. Still listen to the
> CD you sent me every now and then. Cool stuff. If you like, check out www.moldmonkies.com
> the band I'm playing in right now. Couldn't be further from the dub/electronica
> that is my natural playground but I'm having a blast playing with these guys.
>
>
> TCB
>
> "steve the artguy" <artguy@svnhoohaa.net> wrote:
>
>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>
>>>I don't check this NG for eons. Then I drop by on a whim and no flame wars,
>>>no calls for Edmund to be covered in cattle blood and released into a cage
>>>filled with starving ferrets, no lectures from Don about intelligent design?
>>>Sheesh.
>>>
>>>Seriously, hope all is well. I'm beaten down at work and trying do simple
>>>things my brain can still manage, like look at newsgroups where I once
>
> spent
>
>>>most of my time.
>>>
>>>TCB
>>
>>oddly enough, I seem to have started dropping by again, ever so occasionally...
>>
>>-steve
>>
>
>We're just starting to play shows. It's a bit of a trick because a 90 minute
set in this band would be about 35 songs ;-) It's pretty exacting power pop
and more than half of the songs include three part harmonies that we have
to do live (I'm the third part, so I'm singing on roughly half the songs).
It's a lot harder than you might guess considering that it all sounds like
just uptempo "pop" and not much else. We're going to record another CD and
learn another dozen or so songs and then I think we'll be ready for more
serious shows. We're also doing the odd opening gig for friends and family.
I'll let you know if anything comes up in the neighborhood.
TCB
Morgan <morganp@ntplx.net> wrote:
>Hey Thad,
>Moldmonkies - Cool !
>The site has a fun vibe - you guy's must have
>a blast at gigs. Are you playing out much ?
>
>Morgan
>
>
>
>TCB wrote:
>> Hey Steve,
>>
>> Good to see you! Been stupid busy for the past year. Still listen to the
>> CD you sent me every now and then. Cool stuff. If you like, check out
www.moldmonkies.com
>> the band I'm playing in right now. Couldn't be further from the dub/electronica
>> that is my natural playground but I'm having a blast playing with these
guys.
>>
>>
>> TCB
>>
>> "steve the artguy" <artguy@svnhoohaa.net> wrote:
>>
>>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>I don't check this NG for eons. Then I drop by on a whim and no flame
wars,
>>>>no calls for Edmund to be covered in cattle blood and released into a
cage
>>>>filled with starving ferrets, no lectures from Don about intelligent
design?
>>>>Sheesh.
>>>>
>>>>Seriously, hope all is well. I'm beaten down at work and trying do simple
>>>>things my brain can still manage, like look at newsgroups where I once
>>
>> spent
>>
>>>>most of my time.
>>>>
>>>>TCB
>>>
>>>oddly enough, I seem to have started dropping by again, ever so occasionally...
>>>
>>>-steve
>>>
>>
>>
>Nice start :)
The money pit opens its jaws a little wider...
Seriously, some fun stuff on the way...
"Jeremy Luzier" <j.luzier@comcast.net> wrote:
>let me do a DJ sinister laugh as i rub my hands together....
>
>muuuuuhahahahahahaha!
>
>just ordered....
>
>LTD-1
>Calrec PQ1161 pair
>la3a vintage
>la2a 60's vintage
>33609 j/d :-)
>TG-1
>EL8X-S
>
>muuuuuuuuuhahahahahahaha!!!
>
>
>:-)
>
>Jeremy
>
>
>finally ! Box of Weasels!
if your photo will ever finish downloading, I'll get on to listening to what
I'm sure are cool groovy pop tunes....
-steve
"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>
>Hey Steve,
>
>Good to see you! Been stupid busy for the past year. Still listen to the
>CD you sent me every now and then. Cool stuff. If you like, check out www.moldmonkies.com
>the band I'm playing in right now. Couldn't be further from the dub/electronica
>that is my natural playground but I'm having a blast playing with these
guys.
>
>
>TCB
>
>"steve the artguy" <artguy@svnhoohaa.net> wrote:
>>
>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>I don't check this NG for eons. Then I drop by on a whim and no flame
wars,
>>>no calls for Edmund to be covered in cattle blood and released into a
cage
>>>filled with starving ferrets, no lectures from Don about intelligent design?
>>>Sheesh.
>>>
>>>Seriously, hope all is well. I'm beaten down at work and trying do simple
>>>things my brain can still manage, like look at newsgroups where I once
>spent
>>>most of my time.
>>>
>>>TCB
>>
>>oddly enough, I seem to have started dropping by again, ever so occasionally...
>>
>>-steve
>>
>Back in the *wasted years* during the mid 70's, while on a cross country
jaunt that would have made Hunter Thompson proud, I took a shower at the
big truck stop in Bucksnort Tennessee . It was something I'll never forget.
There was a guy prowling around there who looked sorta like you do now,
though I doubt he was a Mennonite. There was this weird stuff crawling up
the walls though. Maybe it was moldmonkies and I just didn't know..
"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:438fcc6a$1@linux...
>
> Hey Steve,
>
> Good to see you! Been stupid busy for the past year. Still listen to the
> CD you sent me every now and then. Cool stuff. If you like, check out
www.moldmonkies.com
> the band I'm playing in right now. Couldn't be further from the
dub/electronica
> that is my natural playground but I'm having a blast playing with these
guys.
>
>
> TCB
>
> "steve the artguy" <artguy@svnhoohaa.net> wrote:
> >
> >"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>I don't check this NG for eons. Then I drop by on a whim and no flame
wars,
> >>no calls for Edmund to be covered in cattle blood and released into a
cage
> >>filled with starving ferrets, no lectures from Don about intelligent
design?
> >>Sheesh.
> >>
> >>Seriously, hope all is well. I'm beaten down at work and trying do
simple
> >>things my brain can still manage, like look at newsgroups where
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Re: The Next Step? [message #60854 is a reply to message #60838] |
Fri, 02 December 2005 07:33 |
Jamie K
Messages: 1115
Registered: July 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
gt;>Cheers,
>>>>>-Jamie
>>>>>http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>
>>>>>Tony Benson wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>I suppose it would depend on your style of mixing, but I've been really
>>>>
>>>>>>happy lately using DP 4.6 and PARIS. I track and mix first in DP to
>>>
>>>take
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>advantage of any virtual instruments I might want to use, and any
>>>
>>>plugins
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>that won't work in PARIS. I'm using a MOTU 828 Mk2 firewire interface
>>>>
>>>>that
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>actually sounds pretty good. It doesn't add any character while
>>>
>>>recording,
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>but that's what I'm wanting at this stage. This first mix is basically
>>>>
>>>>just
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>a "get it close" type mix. I usually don't use any EQ plugins in DP
>>>
>>>opting
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>for the nice PARIS EQ's instead. Once I've got things close in DP I
>>>
>>>freeze
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>all the tracks (equivalent to rendering with plugins in PARIS). Then
>
> I
>
>>>>>>export the frozen DP tracks as 24 bit .wav files. Then I boot to OS9
>>>
>>>and
>>>
>>>
>>>>use
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>SonicWorx to convert the .wavs to 24 bit .paf files. Then I open PARIS,
>>>>
>>>>add
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>the audio files, and do all my editing and final mixing in PARIS. I
>>>
>>>still
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>like the editing in PARIS, I suppose because I'm so used to it. Right
>>>>
>>>>now
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>I'm doing this all on one Mac dual processor G4 and dual booting. I'm
>>>>
>>>>>>getting a G5 soon though and dedicating the G4 to PARIS only. I'll just
>>>>
>>>>>>share a firewire drive between the two. This will also let me use the
>>>>
>>>>G5 as
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>a virtual FX rack when mixing in PARIS using external sends. Anyway,
>
> I
>
>>>>know
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>this approach is pretty convoluted and might not work for everyone,
>
> but
>
>>>>it's
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>my way of having the best of both worlds so to speak. The modern
>>>
>>>features
>>>
>>>
>>>>in
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>DP and the great sounding mix bus, EQ and easy editing in PARIS. Not
>>>>
>>>>to
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>mention the great PARIS plugs like NoLimit, BarbEQ, etc.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Tony
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Gantt Kushner" <gizmo@his.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>news:438F262B.D0B3EB31@his.com...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I love Paris!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>But I'm beginning to realize, especially in the face of new,
>>>>>>>cool plugins that'll never work in Paris (like the Waves
>>>>>>>Transform Bundle, among others), that I'm eventually going
>>>>>>>to have to switch to something that actually has ongoing
>>>>>>>development and support.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>So what are my fellow Mac DAW users finding satisfying
>>>>>>>after Paris? I own Digital Performer (w/ an old 2408) and
>>>>>>>Protools LE (w/ Digi 002). Neither seems as intuitive as
>>>>>>>Paris, but I suppose I'd get faster if I immersed myself in
>>>>>>>one or the other. My big concern is sound quality. I haven't
>>>>>>>found either DP or PT LE as satisfying to listen to and mix on
>>>>>>>as Paris. I know I've lost business for not being a Protools
>>>>>>>studio, but PT HD would cost a couple of arms and legs.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>What to do?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Gantt
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>
>Thanks for your suggestions.
I have rendered using the hardware method via adat and achieved one nice
compact stereo track with my acoustic guitars, I even saved all audio files
on new folder and saved under new name I used the clear missing files just
before that but again no luck when I put a stereo native effect on this stereotrack
even without hitting play when I try to save assertion fails and doesn't
allow of any save !
Note that assertion failure appears ONLY when I hit SAve ...
rEGARDS,
dIMITRIOS
"Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>Dimitrios,
>Rendering is your answer. Don't render tracks with plugins. In stereo
=
>the right side=20
>won't have any effect. Double check to see that their timing is correct
=
>too.
>Some people have problems with that.
>Tom
> "erlilo" <erlilo@online.no> wrote in message news:43900b57$1@linux...
> There you have the problem. I think rendering the tracks and look =
>after that=20
> each stereopair is starting and ending at the same places will do the
=
>job=20
> when saving under a new name, just to be sure to go back if something
=
>are=20
> going wrong again. If the time alignments are going wrong in some of =
>the=20
> stereofiles, you can rendering the old, hard way, as in version 2, =
>when=20
> mixing down each stereopair with panning hard left and right and =
>muting all=20
> other tracks. Then you can import them into the project again on their
=
>old=20
> places and give them new names.
>
> Erling
>
>
> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> skrev i melding =
>news:439000f1$1@linux...
> >
> > Hi,
> > Thanks for your replies.
> > What I have managed is to have the same start and end for both audio
=
>files
> > just by cutting at cursor pointy on both tracks.
> > Buit insight the stereo tracks each of themhas different cut points
=
>and=20
> > joint
> > points , does this matter?
> > If you ask me why it is because these tracks are not actually stereo
=
>but
> > two takes of acoustic guitar playing so I had tomove different parts
=
>on=20
> > each
> > of the "stereo" tracks to make them on time.
> > I want a stereo effect because I wanna expand the stereo perspective
=
>of=20
> > them
> > pl;aying hard left and hard right.
> > Have you tried T-racks compressor's stereo widening knob ?? !!
> > Amazing stereo result with complete mono compatibility , not like =
>waves=20
> > imager
> > at all...
> > Cheers,
> > DImitrios
> >
> >
> > "Ennio" <ennio@galicorp.net> wrote:
> >>The in-points (and out-points) on both sides of the stereo file must
=
>be
> > at
> >>the identical spot - down to the sample (the furthest down you can =
>go on
> > the
> >>zoom tool)
> >>
> >>"erlilo" <erlilo@online.no> wrote in message news:438f4d36@linux...
> >>> Is it exactly the same length on each stereo files or no different
=
>holes
> >>in
> >>> any of the stereo objects?
> >>>
> >>> Erling
> >>>
> >>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> skrev i melding=20
> >>> news:438f3760$1@linux...
> >>> >
> >>> > Hi,
> >>> > I have almost finished my project mixing and when I try to put a
=
>
> >>> > stereo
> >>> > native
> >>> > effect on any audio track on any submix when I try to save I =
>always
> > get
> >>> > assertion
> >>> > failed and cannot save either on same name or other...
> >>> > The problem is that I want to use stereo effects as I did before
=
>but
> >>don't
> >>> > know why Paris doesn't let to...
> >>> > Regards,
> >>> > Dimitrios
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >=20
>
>
>
><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
><HTML><HEAD>
><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1400" name=3DGENERATOR>
><STYLE></STYLE>
></HEAD>
><BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Dimitrios,</FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Rendering is your answer. Don't =
>render tracks=20
>with plugins. In stereo the right side </FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>won't </FONT><FONT face=3DArial =
>size=3D2>have any=20
>effect. Double check to see that their timing is correct =
>too.</FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Some people have problems with =
>that.</FONT></DIV>
><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Tom</FONT></DIV>
><BLOCKQUOTE=20
>style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
>BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
> <DIV>"erlilo" <<A =
>href=3D"mailto:erlilo@online.no">erlilo@online.no</A>>=20
> wrote in message <A=20
> href=3D"news:43900b57$1@linux">news:43900b57$1@linux</A>...</DIV>There
=
>you have=20
> the problem. I think rendering the tracks and look after that <BR>each
=
>
> stereopair is starting and ending at the same places will do the job =
><BR>when=20
> saving under a new name, just to be sure to go back if something are =
><BR>going=20
> wrong again. If the time alignments are going wrong in some of the=20
> <BR>stereofiles, you can rendering the old, hard way, as in version 2,
=
>when=20
> <BR>mixing down each stereopair with panning hard left and right and =
>muting=20
> all <BR>other tracks. Then you can import them into the project again
=
>on their=20
> old <BR>places and give them new =
>names.<BR><BR>Erling<BR><BR><BR>"Dimitrios"=20
> <<A href=3D"mailto:musurgio@otenet.gr">musurgio@otenet.gr</A>> =
>skrev i=20
> melding <A=20
> =
>href=3D"news:439000f1$1@linux">news:439000f1$1@linux</A>...<BR>><BR>&g=
>t;=20
> Hi,<BR>> Thanks for your replies.<BR>> What I have managed is to =
>have=20
> the same start and end for both audio files<BR>> just by cutting at =
>cursor=20
> pointy on both tracks.<BR>> Buit insight the stereo tracks each of =
>themhas=20
> different cut points and <BR>> joint<BR>> points , does this=20
> matter?<BR>> If you ask me why it is because these tracks are not =
>actually=20
> stereo but<BR>> two takes of acoustic guitar playing so I had =
>tomove=20
> different parts on <BR>> each<BR>> of the "stereo" tracks to =
>make them=20
> on time.<BR>> I want a stereo effect because I wanna expand the =
>stereo=20
> perspective of <BR>> them<BR>> pl;aying hard left and hard=20
> right.<BR>> Have you tried T-racks compressor's stereo widening =
>knob ??=20
> !!<BR>> Amazing stereo result with complete mono compatibility , =
>not like=20
> waves <BR>> imager<BR>> at all...<BR>> Cheers,<BR>>=20
> DImitrios<BR>><BR>><BR>> "Ennio" <<A=20
> href=3D"mailto:ennio@galicorp.net">ennio&#
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Re: The Next Step? [message #60866 is a reply to message #60854] |
Fri, 02 December 2005 11:17 |
TCB
Messages: 1261
Registered: July 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
t;>>>Those negatives aside, Logic has come a long way and it rocks. It has
>>
>> an
>>
>>>>>>incredible selection of useful plugins for convolution reverb,
>>>>>>compression, limiting, distortion, EQ, etc. It also includes a good
>>>>>>variety of excellent virtual instrument/synth plugins, and great third
>>>>>>party plugins are readily available. It really is a virtual studio
and
>>>>>>I'm very happy with the tracks I'm producing. C'mon over and check
it
>>>>>>out if you're ever in the neighborhood.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Everything is automatable. Mixers show as many tracks as you have.
The
>>>>>>MIDI features are comprehensive. Logic can play video files for film
>>>>>>scoring.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>The G5 processors support so many plugins and tracks that I rarely
have
>>>>>
>>>>>>to "freeze" anything, it's all live. But if I ever need more CPU
>>>>>>overhead, freezing a track converts a track and all plugin operations
>>
>> to
>>
>>>>>>an audio file. It can be unfrozen if any editing is needed. There's
also
>>>>>
>>>>>>an option to network with another Mac to farm out CPU time but I've
>>>>>>never needed that with the G5. BTW, the new dual core dual processor
>>
>> G5
>>
>>>>>>box is somewhere around twice as fast as mine. Whoa.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>If at all possible, you should try to mix on each of the systems you're
>>>>>
>>>>>>considering and see if the sound pleases your ear. The i/o you choose
>>>>>>will also matter. Like Tony I'm using a MOTU 828MII which has been
a
>>>>>>decent sounding, reliable piece of gear, and there are many other
>>>>>>options to consider. You can combine several i/o devices if you need
>>
>> to
>>
>>>>>>expand to additional channels. If you need flying faders there are
>>>>>>several choices with or without built-in i/o.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Cheers,
>>>>>>-Jamie
>>>>>>http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Tony Benson wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I suppose it would depend on your style of mixing, but I've been really
>>>>>
>>>>>>>happy lately using DP 4.6 and PARIS. I track and mix first in DP to
>>>>
>>>>take
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>advantage of any virtual instruments I might want to use, and any
>>>>
>>>>plugins
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>that won't work in PARIS. I'm using a MOTU 828 Mk2 firewire interface
>>>>>
>>>>>that
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>actually sounds pretty good. It doesn't add any character while
>>>>
>>>>recording,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>but that's what I'm wanting at this stage. This first mix is basically
>>>>>
>>>>>just
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>a "get it close" type mix. I usually don't use any EQ plugins in DP
>>>>
>>>>opting
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>for the nice PARIS EQ's instead. Once I've got things close in DP
I
>>>>
>>>>freeze
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>all the tracks (equivalent to rendering with plugins in PARIS). Then
>>
>> I
>>
>>>>>>>export the frozen DP tracks as 24 bit .wav files. Then I boot to OS9
>>>>
>>>>and
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>use
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>SonicWorx to convert the .wavs to 24 bit .paf files. Then I open PARIS,
>>>>>
>>>>>add
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>the audio files, and do all my editing and final mixing in PARIS.
I
>>>>
>>>>still
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>like the editing in PARIS, I suppose because I'm so used to it. Right
>>>>>
>>>>>now
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>I'm doing this all on one Mac dual processor G4 and dual booting.
I'm
>>>>>
>>>>>>>getting a G5 soon though and dedicating the G4 to PARIS only. I'll
just
>>>>>
>>>>>>>share a firewire drive between the two. This will also let me use
the
>>>>>
>>>>>G5 as
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>a virtual FX rack when mixing in PARIS using external sends. Anyway,
>>
>> I
>>
>>>>>know
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>this approach is pretty convoluted and might not work for everyone,
>>
>> but
>>
>>>>>it's
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>my way of having the best of both worlds so to speak. The modern
>>>>
>>>>features
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>in
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>DP and the great sounding mix bus, EQ and easy editing in PARIS.
Not
>>>>>
>>>>>to
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>mention the great PARIS plugs like NoLimit, BarbEQ, etc.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Tony
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"Gantt Kushner" <gizmo@his.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>news:438F262B.D0B3EB31@his.com...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I love Paris!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>But I'm beginning to realize, especially in the face of new,
>>>>>>>>cool plugins that'll never work in Paris (like the Waves
>>>>>>>>Transform Bundle, among others), that I'm eventually going
>>>>>>>>to have to switch to something that actually has ongoing
>>>>>>>>development and support.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>So what are my fellow Mac DAW users finding satisfying
>>>>>>>>after Paris? I own Digital Performer (w/ an old 2408) and
>>>>>>>>Protools LE (w/ Digi 002). Neither seems as intuitive as
>>>>>>>>Paris, but I suppose I'd get faster if I immersed myself in
>>>>>>>>one or the other. My big concern is sound quality. I haven't
>>>>>>>>found either DP or PT LE as satisfying to listen to and mix on
>>>>>>>>as Paris. I know I've lost business for not being a Protools
>>>>>>>>studio, but PT HD would cost a couple of arms and legs.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>What to do?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Gantt
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>Thanks that makes sense...
Of course I don't use mono effects on stereo tracks.
I know this EDS bug when you have stereo native effect the eds "right channel"
effect doesn't work...
Regarding the rebuilding can someone direct me with the right procedure to
avoid loosing precious time here ?
Thanks for all for your guide...
Regards,
Dimitrios
"Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>Dimitrios,
>I agree with Erlilo. Try different channels or a different
>submix if you can. Otherwise rebuilding the mix from
>scratch in a new project is the next best bet. Copy all
>mixer settings and presets of effects to make it easier.
>Tom
>
>
>
> "Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com> wrote in message =
>news:43908331$1@linux...
>
> Dimitrios, You probably know this, but just to make sure...
> If you want to use stereo native plugins, you can NOT have any mono =
>plugins
> on those tracks. That goes for native and EDS.
> Do you have any mono eds or native plugs also on the stereo pair?
> Rod
> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
> >
> >Dear Tom,
> >It is not the plugin under other song I can open a stereo native =
>effect.
> >In my project I cannot open ANY stereo effect.
> >Even chainer only...
> >I can save my project no problem if I don't use a stereo native =
>effect.
> >ALSO on submix 3 I managed toopen a stereo native effect but not on =
>submix
> >1 or 4 , any suggestion ?
> >Regards,
> >Dimitrios
> >
> >"Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>Dimitrios,
> >>Are you saying you can save before this stereo plugin
> >>is inserted? I'd say you may have a rouge plugin that
> >>your wrapper or Paris just doesn't like. Try the same thing
> >>in a different project. ie: Same stereo plugin inserted
> >>on another stereo pair of tracks. Now can you save?
> >>If so it may be your project. If not it's probably your plugin.
> >>
> >>Good luck,
> >>Tom
> >> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message =3D
> >>news:43906b78$1@linux...
> >>
> >> Thanks for your suggestions.
> >> I have rendered using the hardware method via adat and achieved =
>one =3D
> >>nice
> >> compact stereo track with my acoustic guitars, I even saved all =
>audio
> >=3D
> >>files
> >> on new folder and saved under new name I used the clear missing =
>files
> >=3D
> >>just
> >> before that but again no luck when I put a stereo native effect on
=
>=3D
> >>this stereotrack
> >> even without hitting play when I try to save assertion fails and
=
>=3D
> >>doesn't
> >> allow of any save !
> >> Note that assertion failure appears ONLY when I hit SAve ...
> >> rEGARDS,
> >> dIMITRIOS
> >>
> >> "Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >Dimitrios,
> >> >Rendering is your answer. Don't render tracks with plugins. In
=
>=3D
> >>stereo
> >> =3D3D
> >> >the right side=3D3D20
> >> >won't have any effect. Double check to see that their timing is
=
>=3D
> >>correct
> >> =3D3D
> >> >too.
> >> >Some people have problems with that.
> >> >Tom
> >> > "erlilo" <erlilo@online.no> wrote in message =3D
> >>news:43900b57$1@linux...
> >> > There you have the problem. I think rendering the tracks and =
>look
> =3D
> >>=3D3D
> >> >after that=3D3D20
> >> > each stereopair is starting and ending at the same places will
=
>do
> =3D
> >>the
> >> =3D3D
> >> >job=3D3D20
> >> > when saving under a new name, just to be sure to go back if =3D
> >>something
> >> =3D3D
> >> >are=3D3D20
> >> > going wrong again. If the time alignments are going wrong in =
>some
> =3D
> >>of =3D3D
> >> >the=3D3D20
> >> > stereofiles, you can rendering the old, hard way, as in version
=
>2,
> >=3D
> >>=3D3D
> >> >when=3D3D20
> >> > mixing down each stereopair with panning hard left and right =
>and =3D
> >>=3D3D
> >> >muting all=3D3D20
> >> > other tracks. Then you can import them into the project again =
>on =3D
> >>their
> >> =3D3D
> >> >old=3D3D20
> >> > places and give them new names.
> >> >
> >> > Erling
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> skrev i melding =3D3D
> >> >news:439000f1$1@linux...
> >> > >
> >> > > Hi,
> >> > > Thanks for your replies.
> >> > > What I have managed is to have the same start and end for =
>both =3D
> >>audio
> >> =3D3D
> >> >files
> >> > > just by cutting at cursor pointy on both tracks.
> >> > > Buit insight the stereo tracks each of themhas different cut
=
>=3D
> >>points
> >> =3D3D
> >> >and=3D3D20
> >> > > joint
> >> > > points , does this matter?
> >> > > If you ask me why it is because these tracks are not actually
=
>=3D
> >>stereo
> >> =3D3D
> >> >but
> >> > > two takes of acoustic guitar playing so I had tomove =
>different =3D
> >>parts
> >> =3D3D
> >> >on=3D3D20
> >> > > each
> >> > > of the "stereo" tracks to make them on time.
> >> > > I want a stereo effect because I wanna expand the stereo =3D
> >>perspective
> >> =3D3D
> >> >of=3D3D20
> >> > > them
> >> > > pl;aying hard left and hard right.
> >> > > Have you tried T-racks compressor's stereo widening knob ?? =
>!!
> >> > > Amazing stereo result with complete mono compatibility , not
=
>like
> >=3D
> >>=3D3D
> >> >waves=3D3D20
> >> > > imager
> >> > > at all...
> >> > > Cheers,
> >> > > DImitrios
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > "Ennio" <ennio@galicorp.net> wrote:
> >> > >>The in-points (and out-points) on both sides of the stereo =
>file
> =3D
> >>must
> >> =3D3D
> >> >be
> >> > > at
> >> > >>the identical spot - down to the sample (the furthest down =
>you =3D
> >>can =3D3D
> >> >go on
> >> > > the
> >> > >>zoom tool)
> >> > >>
> >> > >>"erlilo" <erlilo@online.no> wrote in message =3D
> >>news:438f4d36@linux...
> >> > >>> Is it exactly the same length on each stereo files or no =
>=3D
> >>different
> >> =3D3D
> >> >holes
> >> > >>in
> >> > >>> any of the stereo objects?
> >> > >>>
> >> > >>> Erling
> >> > >>>
> >> > >>> "Dimitrios" <
|
|
|
|
| Re: The Next Step? [message #60869 is a reply to message #60866] |
Fri, 02 December 2005 11:05 |
Tony Benson
Messages: 453
Registered: June 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
us side, Logic on a dual G5 is incredible in its capabilities
>
>>>>and the music is sounding great.
>>>>
>>>>Nice to hear from you, Thad.
>>>>
>>>>Cheers,
>>>> -Jamie
>>>> http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>DJ wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>heheheh.........hi thad
>>>>>
>>>>>;o)
>>>>>
>>>>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:438f5066$1@linux...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>You're running this on BeOS, right?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I'm using Logic "Pro" 7.1 on a dual 2.5GHZ G5 running OSX. Logic
>>>>>>>would
>>>>>>>be "Pro" if it didn't crash. Of course OSX doesn't go down when Logic
>>>>>>>does but it's still an interruption to restart Logic when it happens.
>>>>>>>Some of that may be a hardware problem with my rig, I'm tracking down
>>>
>>> a
>>>
>>>>>>>possible HD glitch right now.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>The other thing about Logic is there is a bit of a learning curve.
> Most
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>things are straight forward but a few things are obtuse. You might
> give
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>yourself a few weeks to come up to speed, depending on what your
>>>>>>>needs
>>>>>
>>>>>are.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>Those negatives aside, Logic has come a long way and it rocks. It has
>>>
>>> an
>>>
>>>>>>>incredible selection of useful plugins for convolution reverb,
>>>>>>>compression, limiting, distortion, EQ, etc. It also includes a good
>>>>>>>variety of excellent virtual instrument/synth plugins, and great
>>>>>>>third
>>>>>>>party plugins are readily available. It really is a virtual studio
> and
>>>>>>>I'm very happy with the tracks I'm producing. C'mon over and check
> it
>>>>>>>out if you're ever in the neighborhood.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Everything is automatable. Mixers show as many tracks as you have.
> The
>>>>>>>MIDI features are comprehensive. Logic can play video files for film
>>>>>>>scoring.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>The G5 processors support so many plugins and tracks that I rarely
> have
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>to "freeze" anything, it's all live. But if I ever need more CPU
>>>>>>>overhead, freezing a track converts a track and all plugin operations
>>>
>>> to
>>>
>>>>>>>an audio file. It can be unfrozen if any editing is needed. There's
> also
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>an option to network with another Mac to farm out CPU time but I've
>>>>>>>never needed that with the G5. BTW, the new dual core dual processor
>>>
>>> G5
>>>
>>>>>>>box is somewhere around twice as fast as mine. Whoa.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>If at all possible, you should try to mix on each of the systems
>>>>>>>you're
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>considering and see if the sound pleases your ear. The i/o you choose
>>>>>>>will also matter. Like Tony I'm using a MOTU 828MII which has been
> a
>>>>>>>decent sounding, reliable piece of gear, and there are many other
>>>>>>>options to consider. You can combine several i/o devices if you need
>>>
>>> to
>>>
>>>>>>>expand to additional channels. If you need flying faders there are
>>>>>>>several choices with or without built-in i/o.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Cheers,
>>>>>>>-Jamie
>>>>>>>http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Tony Benson wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I suppose it would depend on your style of mixing, but I've been
>>>>>>>>really
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>happy lately using DP 4.6 and PARIS. I track and mix first in DP to
>>>>>
>>>>>take
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>advantage of any virtual instruments I might want to use, and any
>>>>>
>>>>>plugins
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>that won't work in PARIS. I'm using a MOTU 828 Mk2 firewire
>>>>>>>>interface
>>>>>>
>>>>>>that
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>actually sounds pretty good. It doesn't add any character while
>>>>>
>>>>>recording,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>but that's what I'm wanting at this stage. This first mix is
>>>>>>>>basically
>>>>>>
>>>>>>just
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>a "get it close" type mix. I usually don't use any EQ plugins in DP
>>>>>
>>>>>opting
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>for the nice PARIS EQ's instead. Once I've got things close in DP
> I
>>>>>
>>>>>freeze
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>all the tracks (equivalent to rendering with plugins in PARIS). Then
>>>
>>> I
>>>
>>>>>>>>export the frozen DP tracks as 24 bit .wav files. Then I boot to OS9
>>>>>
>>>>>and
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>use
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>SonicWorx to convert the .wavs to 24 bit .paf files. Then I open
>>>>>>>>PARIS,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>add
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>the audio files, and do all my editing and final mixing in PARIS.
> I
>>>>>
>>>>>still
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>like the editing in PARIS, I suppose because I'm so used to it.
>>>>>>>>Right
>>>>>>
>>>>>>now
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I'm doing this all on one Mac dual processor G4 and dual booting.
> I'm
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>getting a G5 soon though and dedicating the G4 to PARIS only. I'll
> just
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>share a firewire drive between the two. This will also let me use
> the
>>>>>>
>>>>>>G5 as
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>a virtual FX rack when mixing in PARIS using external sends. Anyway,
>>>
>>> I
>>>
>>>>>>know
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>this approach is pretty convoluted and might not work for everyone,
>>>
>>> but
>>>
>>>>>>it's
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>my way of having the best of both worlds so to speak. The modern
>>>>>
>>>>>features
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>in
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>DP and the great sounding mix bus, EQ and easy editing in PARIS.
> Not
>>>>>>
>>>>>>to
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>mention the great PARIS plugs like NoLimit, BarbEQ, etc.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Tony
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>"Gantt Kushner" <gizmo@his.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>news:438F262B.D0B3EB31@his.com...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>I love Paris!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>But I'm beginning to realize, especially in the face of new,
>>>>>>>>>cool plugins that'll never work in Paris (like the Waves
>>>>>>>>>Transform Bundle, among others), that I'm eventually going
>>>>>>>>>to have to switch to something that actually has ongoing
>>>>>>>>>development and support.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>So what are my fellow Mac DAW users finding satisfying
>>>>>>>>>after Paris? I own Digital Performer (w/ an old 2408) and
>>>>>>>>>Protools LE (w/ Digi 002). Neither seems as intuitive as
>>>>>>>>>Paris, but I suppose I'd get faster if I immersed myself in
>>>>>>>>>one or the other. My big concern is sound quality. I haven't
>>>>>>>>>found either DP or PT LE as satisfying to listen to and mix on
>>>>>>>>>as Paris. I know I've lost business for not being a Protools
>>>>>>>>>studio, but PT HD would cost a couple of arms and legs.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>What to do?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Gantt
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>Anyone know where these can be downloaded from? the purgatorycreek urls
are not longer valid.
Thanks,
JHTrust me, if I didn't work with computers for a living I'd be saying exactly
the same things. Also, I didn't make my point abotu PARIS well. I've used
so much software that I've seen go under. PARIS, Opcode, Cubase was a little
dicey there for a while, and so on. By using free software at the very worst
I have to learn to fix something myself. If Larry Wall gets hit by a bus
tomorrow the Perl community will keep Perl working and even if they don't
in theory I can learn to make the changes myself. That, to me, is a MASSIVE
reason to go through whatever hassle I have to using free software.
In other words, I didn't mean this to be Apple bashing--I meant it to be
proprietary software bashing.
TCB
"Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote:
>Thad,
>
>I understand your point, and to be sure, Apple could be more cooperative
>with third party programmers, but what you have to remember is, most of
us
>aren't "programmers". Most of us don't want anything to do with the inner
>workings of our computers. We just want them to run our chosen software,
be
>user friendly and not crash. For a "non-programmer" type person like me,
the
>Mac has been my choice. At first because they were the only game in town
>(1986), and now because I have so much legacy software that switching would
>cost a fortune, but I digress. ;>) Anyway, I envy you guys for having the
>smarts to get open source software to work for you and even the PC guys
who
>have to know a lot more "technical" stuff to tweak their PC's into smooth
>running speed beasts. Now, get to work on an open source brain/computer
>interface so I can make the music I hear in my head, instead of the music
my
>lousy fingers are capable of! ;>)
>
>Tony
>
>
>
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:43908fa7$1@linux...
>>
>> Well, one of the reasons I am so opposed to proprietary software and
>> hardware
>> in general is my experience with PARIS. People often confuse free software
>> with money cost, which really isn't the point, IHMO. Stallman talked about
>> "free as in speech and free as in beer" and the big one to me is the
>> first.
>> If I need a new perl module or I want to install a new package on my
>> Debian
>> boxes, and there's a problem I can open up the installer script and see
>> what's
>> going on. Oh, it's expecting an older C compiler in a different place.
>> Find
>> and replace "gcc3" with "CC" and off we go. Try that with any other OS.
>> That
>> kind of control matters *a lot* to me these days.
>>
>> I also find it supremely ironic that Apple is considered to be a foward
>> looking,
>> innovative company for making a Unix based OS. They chose the least
>> restrictive
>> license on planet earth and have grudgingly followed the letter of the
law
>> for all of code not under the "go ahead and steal it" BSD structure. There
>> have been constant bubbling complaints from the KDE crowd about getting
>> code
>> back to the community. On the other side, stodgy old IBM works with GPL
>> code
>> as model citizens and even pays for lawyers to defend that code from silly
>> law suits.
>>
>> In any case, there's no way VST will ever make it to GPL'd code so I'm
>> stuck
>> with one Windows box no matter what. That said, the ALSA guys do really
>> good
>> work under Linux, it's too bad it will be so underexploited.
>>
>> TCB
>>
>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Thanks for sharing your info about your Linux experience, Thad. That's
>>>good to hear. My old PARIS Intel box has became my Linux/BeOS box.
>>>
>>>I've used a lot of different hardware and OS combinations over the
>>>years. OSX with its command line, UNIX roots and tons of media
>>>production software has covered my primary computing needs fairly well
>>>for the last couple of years. However things are steadily progressing
in
>>
>>>Linux land and I think it has a bright future.
>>>
>>>I hear you about proprietary systems. I'm not against them except when
>>>they are used to force out competition through means other than on their
>>
>>>technical merits, as Microsoft has notably done. And on the flip side,
>>>their vulnerability in manipulated markets, as the Amiga and BeOS ably
>>>demonstrated. Open source has become the best way to survive in this
>>>environment. Even Apple is participating in open source to an extent at
>>
>>>the kernel and browser levels.
>>>
>>>I am not opposed to companies making money on their technology when
>>>competing fairly on merits and pushing the envelope to provide needed
>>>tools. I'm happy to pay fair prices for hardware and software when they
>>
>>>meets my needs, and to support talented engineers in the quest. I
>>>originally bought PARIS for that reason.
>>>
>>>But using monopolistic leveraging, Orwellian marketspeak, and swallowing
>>
>>>other companies while killing a lot of great competitive tech and
>>>promoting marginal tech, that kind of behavior doesn't endear much
>>>respect.
>>>
>>>I got into Macs this time around because of OSX and the continued
>>>strides being made with OSX production software. After years of
>>>misdirection with OS7-8-9 and failed attempts to significantly progress,
>>
>>>with OSX Apple was able to push the envelope to provide improved
>>>technology for computing, media production, and lately, media
>>>distribution.
>>>
>>>I'm not saying Apple is perfect, there are disadvantages to some of
>>>their decisions and they have had a lot of reports from me to help them
>>
>>>improve. :^) But the advantages of OSX, generally solid hardware like
>>>the current dual G5s, and a steady stream of capable software transcend
>>
>>>the disadvantages right now.
>>>
>>>Good luck with your computer and music pursuits! When the time comes to
>>
>>>move your music production over to Linux I'd love to hear how it goes.
>>>
>>>Cheers,
>>> -Jamie
>>> http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>
>>>
>>>TCB wrote:
>>>> I was just busting your chops a bit. I yam what I yam.
>>>>
>>>> On the "desktop" OS front I have converted 100% to Debian GNU/Linux.
I
>> still
>>>> have one M$oft box for my audio stuff (until Live, CubaseSX, VST, and
>> a ton
>>>> of other things get ported to GNU/Linux I have no choice), but
>>>> everything
>>>> else runs on GNU/Linux. I have to say whenver I use a desktop that isn't
>>>> Gnome and doesn't give me immediate access to a powerful command line
>> I feel
>>>> like I'm running on one leg. There are some bumps along the road, and
>> I have
>>>> to install some non free software for remote access to work (including
>> some
>>>> kernel patches that are a PITA), but it's been worth every bit of the
>> effort.
>>>> Now that I'm doing computer work again for a living I'm happy to be
free
>>>> of proprietary software as much as humanly possible. For me all
>>>> proprietary
>>>> systems like OS X, XP, Vista, BeOS, and everything else are all roughly
>> equivalent
>>>> evils--places I have to spend some time in order to make a living.
>>>>
>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Heh. Yep Thad, I'm running it on BeOS, maybe that's the problem? ;^)
>>>>>
>>>>>Time for a BeOS report I guess. Palm bought BeOS and hired members of
>>
>>>>>the engineering team. Your Palm's operating system now benefits.
>>>>>
>>>>>Be retained the right to sue Microsoft for closing them out of the OS
>>
>>>>>market for Intel boxes through illegally restrictive OEM agreements.
>>>>>Microsoft paid millions to settle. Chump change.
>>>>>
>>>>>Wish it had been different. BeOS was full of great tech. Imagine where
|
|
|
|
| Re: The Next Step? [message #60871 is a reply to message #60869] |
Fri, 02 December 2005 13:05 |
TCB
Messages: 1261
Registered: July 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
IS could be today, if only...
>>>>>
>>>>>More on BeOS:
>>>>>http://www.birdhouse.org/beos/byte/30-bootloader/
>>>>>http://www.itjungle.com/mid/mid022702-story06.html
>>>>>http://www.mv-voice.com/morgue/2003/2003_09_26.bisi.html
>>>>>
>>>>>Meanwhile OSX has been steadily improving and has some good stuff. Oddly
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>I ran Logic all day today in a project that was crashing left and right
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>last time I worked on that project. It didn't crash once today.
>>>>>
>>>>>So I don't know, maybe it's not a Logic problem. It may have to do with
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Native Instruments plugins, whatever's going on with my system drive
or
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>?. Or maybe a recent update fixed something. BTW, I do send bug reports
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>to Apple so they've seen the detailed crash reports.
>>>>>
>>>>>The bug where Logic stops playing back a virtual synth did come up one
>>
>>>>>time today. That one needs to be fixed. Reloading the song is the
>>>>>workaround.
>>>>>
>>>>>On the plus side, Logic on a dual G5 is incredible in its capabilities
>>
>>>>>and the music is sounding great.
>>>>>
>>>>>Nice to hear from you, Thad.
>>>>>
>>>>>Cheers,
>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>> http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>DJ wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>heheheh.........hi thad
>>>>>>
>>>>>>;o)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:438f5066$1@linux...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>You're running this on BeOS, right?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I'm using Logic "Pro" 7.1 on a dual 2.5GHZ G5 running OSX. Logic
>>>>>>>>would
>>>>>>>>be "Pro" if it didn't crash. Of course OSX doesn't go down when Logic
>>>>>>>>does but it's still an interruption to restart Logic when it happens.
>>>>>>>>Some of that may be a hardware problem with my rig, I'm tracking
down
>>>>
>>>> a
>>>>
>>>>>>>>possible HD glitch right now.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>The other thing about Logic is there is a bit of a learning curve.
>> Most
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>things are straight forward but a few things are obtuse. You might
>> give
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>yourself a few weeks to come up to speed, depending on what your
>>>>>>>>needs
>>>>>>
>>>>>>are.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Those negatives aside, Logic has come a long way and it rocks. It
has
>>>>
>>>> an
>>>>
>>>>>>>>incredible selection of useful plugins for convolution reverb,
>>>>>>>>compression, limiting, distortion, EQ, etc. It also includes a good
>>>>>>>>variety of excellent virtual instrument/synth plugins, and great
>>>>>>>>third
>>>>>>>>party plugins are readily available. It really is a virtual studio
>> and
>>>>>>>>I'm very happy with the tracks I'm producing. C'mon over and check
>> it
>>>>>>>>out if you're ever in the neighborhood.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Everything is automatable. Mixers show as many tracks as you have.
>> The
>>>>>>>>MIDI features are comprehensive. Logic can play video files for film
>>>>>>>>scoring.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>The G5 processors support so many plugins and tracks that I rarely
>> have
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>to "freeze" anything, it's all live. But if I ever need more CPU
>>>>>>>>overhead, freezing a track converts a track and all plugin operations
>>>>
>>>> to
>>>>
>>>>>>>>an audio file. It can be unfrozen if any editing is needed. There's
>> also
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>an option to network with another Mac to farm out CPU time but I've
>>>>>>>>never needed that with the G5. BTW, the new dual core dual processor
>>>>
>>>> G5
>>>>
>>>>>>>>box is somewhere around twice as fast as mine. Whoa.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>If at all possible, you should try to mix on each of the systems
>>>>>>>>you're
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>considering and see if the sound pleases your ear. The i/o you choose
>>>>>>>>will also matter. Like Tony I'm using a MOTU 828MII which has been
>> a
>>>>>>>>decent sounding, reliable piece of gear, and there are many other
>>>>>>>>options to consider. You can combine several i/o devices if you need
>>>>
>>>> to
>>>>
>>>>>>>>expand to additional channels. If you need flying faders there are
>>>>>>>>several choices with or without built-in i/o.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Cheers,
>>>>>>>>-Jamie
>>>>>>>>http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Tony Benson wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>I suppose it would depend on your style of mixing, but I've been
>>>>>>>>>really
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>happy lately using DP 4.6 and PARIS. I track and mix first in DP
to
>>>>>>
>>>>>>take
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>advantage of any virtual instruments I might want to use, and any
>>>>>>
>>>>>>plugins
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>that won't work in PARIS. I'm using a MOTU 828 Mk2 firewire
>>>>>>>>>interface
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>that
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>actually sounds pretty good. It doesn't add any character while
>>>>>>
>>>>>>recording,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>but that's what I'm wanting at this stage. This first mix is
>>>>>>>>>basically
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>just
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>a "get it close" type mix. I usually don't use any EQ plugins in
DP
>>>>>>
>>>>>>opting
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>for the nice PARIS EQ's instead. Once I've got things close in DP
>> I
>>>>>>
>>>>>>freeze
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>all the tracks (equivalent to rendering with plugins in PARIS).
Then
>>>>
>>>> I
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>export the frozen DP tracks as 24 bit .wav files. Then I boot to
OS9
>>>>>>
>>>>>>and
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>use
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>SonicWorx to convert the .wavs to 24 bit .paf files. Then I open
>>>>>>>>>PARIS,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>add
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>the audio files, and do all my editing and final mixing in PARIS.
>> I
>>>>>>
>>>>>>still
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>like the editing in PARIS, I suppose because I'm so used to it.
>>>>>>>>>Right
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>now
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>I'm doing this all on one Mac dual processor G4 and dual booting.
>> I'm
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>getting a G5 soon though and dedicating the G4 to PARIS only. I'll
>> just
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>share a firewire drive between the two. This will also let me use
>> the
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>G5 as
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>a virtual FX rack when mixing in PARIS using external sends. Anyway,
>>>>
>>>> I
>>>>
>>>>>>>know
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>this approach is pretty convoluted and might not work for everyone,
>>>>
>>>> but
>>>>
>>>>>>>it's
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>my way of having the best of both worlds so to speak. The modern
>>>>>>
>>>>>>features
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>in
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>DP and the great sounding mix bus, EQ and easy editing in PARIS.
>> Not
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>to
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>mention the great PARIS plugs like NoLimit, BarbEQ, etc.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Tony
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>"Gantt Kushner" <gizmo@his.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>>news:438F262B.D0B3EB31@his.com...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>I love Paris!
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>But I'm beginning to realize, especially in the face of new,
>>>>>>>>>>cool plugins that'll never work in Paris (like the Waves
>>>>>>>>>>Transform Bundle, among others), that I'm eventually going
>>>>>>>>>>to have to switch to something that actually has ongoing
>>>>>>>>>>development and support.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>So what are my fellow Mac DAW users finding satisfying
>>>>>>>>>>after Paris? I own Digital Performer (w/ an old 2408) and
>>>>>>>>>>Protools LE (w/ Digi 002). Neither seems as intuitive as
>>>>>>>>>>Paris, but I suppose I'd get faster if I immersed myself in
>>>>>>>>>>one or the other. My big concern is sound quality. I haven't
>>>>>>>>>>found either DP or PT LE as satisfying to listen to and mix on
>>>>>>>>>>as Paris. I know I've lost business for not being a Protools
>>>>>>>>>>studio, but PT HD would cost a couple of arms and legs.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>What to do?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Gantt
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>
>
>anyone use one of these?
I'm getting one on spec from a distributor, along with the MidiMate
switcther.
Kinda hoping that it'll be cool live along with my gr-33.
jefI didn't take it as Apple bashing. Sorry if I gave that impression. I agree,
open source is the way to go. Maybe some of you smart guys can work out the
hard stuff, package the apps up with simple user interfaces and sell the
"service of keeping it simple" to guys like me. I'd gladly pay for killer
stable open source audio apps, if all I have to do is install and run them.
See, to me Perl is a necklace and C++ is a little better than slightly above
average. The thought of a command line makes me wet myself! That way, the
source code stays "open" and us codephobes pay for the "service" of making
it easy to use. Are there any really cool, GUI based open source audio apps
out there? Anyway, I was really agreeing with you, just not communicating
very much betterly. ;>) Ah cyberspace. So liberating yet so impersonal.
Good Things,
Tony
"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:4390a914$1@linux...
>
> Trust me, if I didn't work with computers for a living I'd be saying
> exactly
> the same things. Also, I didn't make my point abotu PARIS well. I've used
> so much software that I've seen go under. PARIS, Opcode, Cubase was a
> little
> dicey there for a while, and so on. By using free software at the very
> worst
> I have to learn to fix something myself. If Larry Wall gets hit by a bus
> tomorrow the Perl community will keep Perl working and even if they don't
> in theory I can learn to make the changes myself. That, to me, is a
> MASSIVE
> reason to go through whatever hassle I have to using free software.
>
> In other words, I didn't mean this to be Apple bashing--I meant it to be
> proprietary software bashing.
>
> TCB
>
> "Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote:
>>Thad,
>>
>>I understand your point, and to be sure, Apple could be more cooperative
>
>>with third party programmers, but what you have to remember is, most of
> us
>>aren't "programmers". Most of us don't want anything to do with the inner
>
>>workings of our computers. We just want them to run our chosen software,
> be
>>user friendly and not crash. For a "non-programmer" type person like me,
> the
>>Mac has been my choice. At first because they were the only game in town
>
>>(1986), and now because I have so much legacy software that switching
>>would
>
>>cost a fortune, but I digress. ;>) Anyway, I envy you guys for having the
>
>>smarts to get open source software to work for you and even the PC guys
> who
>>have to know a lot more "technical" stuff to tweak their PC's into smooth
>
>>running speed beasts. Now, get to work on an open source brain/computer
>
>>interface so I can make the music I hear in my head, instead of the music
> my
>>lousy fingers are capable of! ;>)
>>
>>Tony
>>
>>
>>
>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:43908fa7$1@linux...
>>>
>>> Well, one of the reasons I am so opposed to proprietary software and
>>> hardware
>>> in general is my experience with PARIS. People often confuse free
>>> software
>>> with money cost, which really isn't the point, IHMO. Stallman talked
>>> about
>>> "free as in speech and free as in beer" and the big one to me is the
>>> first.
>>> If I need a new perl module or I want to install a new package on my
>>> Debian
>>> boxes, and there's a problem I can open up the installer script and see
>
>>> what's
>>> going on. Oh, it's expecting an older C compiler in a different place.
>
>>> Find
>>> and replace "gcc3" with "CC" and off we go. Try that with any other OS.
>
>>> That
>>> kind of control matters *a lot* to me these days.
>>>
>>> I also find it supremely ironic that Apple is considered to be a foward
>
>>> looking,
>>> innovative company for making a Unix based OS. They chose the least
>>> restrictive
>>> license on planet earth and have grudgingly followed the letter of the
> law
>>> for all of code not under the "go ahead and steal it" BSD structure.
>>> There
>>> have been constant bubbling complaints from the KDE crowd about getting
>
>>> code
>>> back to the community. On the other side, stodgy old IBM works with GPL
>
>>> code
>>> as model citizens and even pays for lawyers to defend that code from
>>> silly
>>> law suits.
>>>
>>> In any case, there's no way VST will ever make it to GPL'd code so I'm
>
>>> stuck
>>> with one Windows box no matter what. That said, the ALSA guys do really
>
>>> good
>>> work under Linux, it's too bad it will be so underexploited.
>>>
>>> TCB
>>>
>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Thanks for sharing your info about your Linux experience, Thad. That's
>>>>good to hear. My old PARIS Intel box has became my Linux/BeOS box.
>>>>
>>>>I've used a lot of different hardware and OS combinations over the
>>>>years. OSX with its command line, UNIX roots and tons of media
>>>>production software has covered my primary computing needs fairly well
>>>>for the last couple of years. However things are steadily progressing
> in
>>>
>>>>Linux land and I think it has a bright future.
>>>>
>>>>I hear you about proprietary systems. I'm not against them except when
>>>>they are used to force out competition through means other than on their
>>>
>>>>technical merits, as Microsoft has notably done. And on the flip side,
>>>>their vulnerability in manipulated markets, as the Amiga and BeOS ably
>>>>demonstrated. Open source has become the best way to survive in this
>>>>environment. Even Apple is participating in open source to an extent at
>>>
>>>>the kernel and browser levels.
>>>>
>>>>I am not opposed to companies making money on their technology when
>>>>competing fairly on merits and pushing the envelope to provide needed
>>>>tools. I'm happy to pay fair prices for hardware and software when they
>>>
>>>>meets my needs, and to support talented engineers in the quest. I
>>>>originally bought PARIS for that reason.
>>>>
>>>>But using monopolistic leveraging, Orwellian marketspeak, and swallowing
>>>
>>>>other companies while killing a lot of great competitive tech and
>>>>promoting marginal tech, that kind of behavior doesn't endear much
>>>>respect.
>>>>
>>>>I got into Macs this time around because of OSX and the continued
>>>>strides being made with OSX production software. After years of
>>>>misdirection with OS7-8-9 and failed attempts to significantly progress,
>>>
>>>>with OSX Apple was able to push the envelope to provide improved
>>>>technology for computing, media production, and lately, media
>>>>distribution.
>>>>
>>>>I'm not saying Apple is perfect, there are disadvantages to some of
>>>>their decisions and they have had a lot of reports from me to help them
>>>
>>>>improve. :^) But the advantages of OSX, generally solid hardware like
>>>>the current dual G5s, and a steady stream of capable software transcend
>>>
>>>>the disadvantages right now.
>>>>
>>>>Good luck with your computer and music pursuits! When the time comes to
>>>
>>>>move your music production over to Linux I'd love to hear how it goes.
>>>>
>>>>Cheers,
>>>> -Jamie
>>>> http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>TCB wrote:
>>>>> I was just busting your chops a bit. I yam what I yam.
>>>>>
>>>>> On the "desktop" OS front I have converted 100% to Debian GNU/Linux.
> I
>>> still
>>>>> have one M$oft box for my audio stuff (until Live, CubaseSX, VST, and
|
|
|
|
| Re: The Next Step? [message #60873 is a reply to message #60871] |
Fri, 02 December 2005 12:40 |
Tony Benson
Messages: 453
Registered: June 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
say whenver I use a desktop that
>>>>> isn't
>>>>> Gnome and doesn't give me immediate access to a powerful command line
>>> I feel
>>>>> like I'm running on one leg. There are some bumps along the road, and
>>> I have
>>>>> to install some non free software for remote access to work (including
>>> some
>>>>> kernel patches that are a PITA), but it's been worth every bit of the
>>> effort.
>>>>> Now that I'm doing computer work again for a living I'm happy to be
> free
>>>>> of proprietary software as much as humanly possible. For me all
>>>>> proprietary
>>>>> systems like OS X, XP, Vista, BeOS, and everything else are all
>>>>> roughly
>>> equivalent
>>>>> evils--places I have to spend some time in order to make a living.
>>>>>
>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>Heh. Yep Thad, I'm running it on BeOS, maybe that's the problem? ;^)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Time for a BeOS report I guess. Palm bought BeOS and hired members of
>>>
>>>>>>the engineering team. Your Palm's operating system now benefits.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Be retained the right to sue Microsoft for closing them out of the OS
>>>
>>>>>>market for Intel boxes through illegally restrictive OEM agreements.
>>>>>>Microsoft paid millions to settle. Chump change.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Wish it had been different. BeOS was full of great tech. Imagine where
>>>
>>>>>>it could be today.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Heck, for that matter imagine where PARIS could be today, if only...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>More on BeOS:
>>>>>>http://www.birdhouse.org/beos/byte/30-bootloader/
>>>>>>http://www.itjungle.com/mid/mid022702-story06.html
>>>>>>http://www.mv-voice.com/morgue/2003/2003_09_26.bisi.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Meanwhile OSX has been steadily improving and has some good stuff.
>>>>>>Oddly
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>I ran Logic all day today in a project that was crashing left and
>>>>>>right
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>last time I worked on that project. It didn't crash once today.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>So I don't know, maybe it's not a Logic problem. It may have to do
>>>>>>with
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Native Instruments plugins, whatever's going on with my system drive
> or
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>?. Or maybe a recent update fixed something. BTW, I do send bug
>>>>>>reports
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>to Apple so they've seen the detailed crash reports.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>The bug where Logic stops playing back a virtual synth did come up one
>>>
>>>>>>time today. That one needs to be fixed. Reloading the song is the
>>>>>>workaround.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>On the plus side, Logic on a dual G5 is incredible in its capabilities
>>>
>>>>>>and the music is sounding great.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Nice to hear from you, Thad.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Cheers,
>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>> http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>DJ wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>heheheh.........hi thad
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>;o)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:438f5066$1@linux...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>You're running this on BeOS, right?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>I'm using Logic "Pro" 7.1 on a dual 2.5GHZ G5 running OSX. Logic
>
>>>>>>>>>would
>>>>>>>>>be "Pro" if it didn't crash. Of course OSX doesn't go down when
>>>>>>>>>Logic
>>>>>>>>>does but it's still an interruption to restart Logic when it
>>>>>>>>>happens.
>>>>>>>>>Some of that may be a hardware problem with my rig, I'm tracking
> down
>>>>>
>>>>> a
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>possible HD glitch right now.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>The other thing about Logic is there is a bit of a learning curve.
>>> Most
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>things are straight forward but a few things are obtuse. You might
>>> give
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>yourself a few weeks to come up to speed, depending on what your
>
>>>>>>>>>needs
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>are.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Those negatives aside, Logic has come a long way and it rocks. It
> has
>>>>>
>>>>> an
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>incredible selection of useful plugins for convolution reverb,
>>>>>>>>>compression, limiting, distortion, EQ, etc. It also includes a good
>>>>>>>>>variety of excellent virtual instrument/synth plugins, and great
>
>>>>>>>>>third
>>>>>>>>>party plugins are readily available. It really is a virtual studio
>>> and
>>>>>>>>>I'm very happy with the tracks I'm producing. C'mon over and check
>>> it
>>>>>>>>>out if you're ever in the neighborhood.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Everything is automatable. Mixers show as many tracks as you have.
>>> The
>>>>>>>>>MIDI features are comprehensive. Logic can play video files for
>>>>>>>>>film
>>>>>>>>>scoring.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>The G5 processors support so many plugins and tracks that I rarely
>>> have
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>to "freeze" anything, it's all live. But if I ever need more CPU
>>>>>>>>>overhead, freezing a track converts a track and all plugin
>>>>>>>>>operations
>>>>>
>>>>> to
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>an audio file. It can be unfrozen if any editing is needed. There's
>>> also
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>an option to network with another Mac to farm out CPU time but I've
>>>>>>>>>never needed that with the G5. BTW, the new dual core dual
>>>>>>>>>processor
>>>>>
>>>>> G5
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>box is somewhere around twice as fast as mine. Whoa.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>If at all possible, you should try to mix on each of the systems
>
>>>>>>>>>you're
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>considering and see if the sound pleases your ear. The i/o you
>>>>>>>>>choose
>>>>>>>>>will also matter. Like Tony I'm using a MOTU 828MII which has been
>>> a
>>>>>>>>>decent sounding, reliable piece of gear, and there are many other
>>>>>>>>>options to consider. You can combine several i/o devices if you
>>>>>>>>>need
>>>>>
>>>>> to
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>expand to additional channels. If you need flying faders there are
>>>>>>>>>several choices with or without built-in i/o.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>-Jamie
>>>>>>>>>http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Tony Benson wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>I suppose it would depend on your style of mixing, but I've been
>
>>>>>>>>>>really
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>happy lately using DP 4.6 and PARIS. I track and mix first in DP
> to
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>take
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>advantage of any virtual instruments I might want to use, and any
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>plugins
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>that won't work in PARIS. I'm using a MOTU 828 Mk2 firewire
>>>>>>>>>>interface
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>that
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>actually sounds pretty good. It doesn't add any character while
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>recording,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>but that's what I'm wanting at this stage. This first mix is
>>>>>>>>>>basically
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>just
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>a "get it close" type mix. I usually don't use any EQ plugins in
> DP
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>opting
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>for the nice PARIS EQ's instead. Once I've got things close in DP
>>> I
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>freeze
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>all the tracks (equivalent to rendering with plugins in PARIS).
> Then
>>>>>
>>>>> I
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>export the frozen DP tracks as 24 bit .wav files. Then I boot to
> OS9
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>and
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>use
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>SonicWorx to convert the .wavs to 24 bit .paf files. Then I open
>
>>>>>>>>>>PARIS,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>add
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>the audio files, and do all my editing and final mixing in PARIS.
>>> I
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>still
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>like the editing in PARIS, I suppose because I'm so used to it.
>
>>>>>>>>>>Right
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>now
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>I'm doing this all on one Mac dual processor G4 and dual booting.
>>> I'm
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>getting a G5 soon though and dedicating the G4 to PARIS only. I'll
>>> just
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>share a firewire drive between the two. This will also let me use
>>> the
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>G5 as
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>a virtual FX rack when mixing in PARIS using external sends.
>>>>>>>>>>Anyway,
>>>>>
>>>>> I
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>know
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>this approach is pretty convoluted and might not work for
>>>>>>>>>>everyone,
>>>>>
>>>>> but
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>it's
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>my way of having the best of both worlds so to speak. The modern
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>features
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>in
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>DP and the great sounding mix bus, EQ and easy editing in PARIS.
>>> Not
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>to
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>mention the great PARIS plugs like NoLimit, BarbEQ, etc.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Tony
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>"Gantt Kushner" <gizmo@his.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>>>news:438F262B.D0B3EB31@his.com...
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>I love Paris!
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>But I'm beginning to realize, especially in the face of new,
>>>>>>>>>>>cool plugins that'll never work in Paris (like the Waves
>>>>>>>>>>>Transform Bundle, among others), that I'm eventually going
>>>>>>>>>>>to have to switch to something that actually has ongoing
>>>>>>>>>>>development and support.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>So what are my fellow Mac DAW users finding satisfying
>>>>>>>>>>>after Paris? I own Digital Performer (w/ an old 2408) and
>>>>>>>>>>>Protools LE (w/ Digi 002). Neither seems as intuitive as
>>>>>>>>>>>Paris, but I suppose I'd get faster if I immersed myself in
>>>>>>>>>>>one or the other. My big concern is sound quality. I haven't
>>>>>>>>>>>found either DP or PT LE as satisfying to listen to and mix on
>>>>>>>>>>>as Paris. I know I've lost business for not being a Protools
>>>>>>>>>>>studio, but PT HD would cost a couple of arms and legs.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>What to do?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>Gantt
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>hehehehehehe!
muuuuuuuhahahahahahaha!
man, i love typing that sinister laugh... thanks DJ!
"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:43903a04@linux...
> so you're the one with all the cash!
>
> Jeremy Luzier wrote:
> > let me do a DJ sinister laugh as i rub my hands together....
> >
> > muuuuuhahahahahahaha!
> >
> > just ordered....
> >
> > LTD-1
> > Calrec PQ1161 pair
> > la3a vintage
> > la2a 60's vintage
> > 33609 j/d :-)
> > TG-1
> > EL8X-S
> >
> > muuuuuuuuuhahahahahahaha!!!
> >
> >
> > :-)
> >
> > Jeremy
> >
> >
> >I've messed around with one at the local guitar store a few times and have a
friend who loves his. My inexperienced impression would be of a Sans Amp on
horse steroids. And I mean that in a good way. I remember the thing having
some real nice tone.
Tony
"jef knight" <thestudio@allknightmusic.com> wrote in message
news:4390b051@linux...
> anyone use one of these?
>
> I'm getting one on spec from a distributor, along with the MidiMate
> switcther.
>
> Kinda hoping that it'll be cool live along with my gr-33.
>
> jefIt's getting there, trust me. 95% of computer users who don't directly make
a living off of computers (i.e. excluding musicians, graphic designers, etc.)
could do everything they do on a Mac or a PC with a GNU/Linux box. The install/config
is getting SO close to being grandma-proofed as well with distros like Ubuntu.
GNU/Linux is still behind a little in "multimedia" stuff like video playback
(and porn makes the 'net go 'round) and burning CDs (usually you have to
type the super user password) but it's SO SO SO close. In my opinion Gnome
and OpenOffice are significantly better than either of their equivalents
on any other platform. But hey, I'm a geek so maybe I'm wrong.
TCB
"Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote:
>I didn't take it as Apple bashing. Sorry if I gave that impression. I agree,
>open source is the way to go. Maybe some of you smart guys can work out
the
>hard stuff, package the apps up with simple user interfaces and sell the
>"service of keeping it simple" to guys like me. I'd gladly pay for killer
>stable open source audio apps, if all I have to do is install and run them.
>See, to me Perl is a necklace and C++ is a little better than slightly above
>average. The thought of a command line makes me wet myself! That way, the
>source code stays "open" and us codephobes pay for the "service" of making
>it easy to use. Are there any really cool, GUI based open source audio apps
>out there? Anyway, I was really agreeing with you, just not communicating
>very much betterly. ;>) Ah cyberspace. So liberating yet so impersonal.
>
>Good Things,
>
>Tony
>
>
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:4390a914$1@linux...
>>
>> Trust me, if I didn't work with computers for a living I'd be saying
>> exactly
>> the same things. Also, I didn't make my point abotu PARIS well. I've used
>> so much software that I've seen go under. PARIS, Opcode, Cubase was a
>> little
>> dicey there for a while, and so on. By using free software at the very
>> worst
>> I have to learn to fix something myself. If Larry Wall gets hit by a bus
>> tomorrow the Perl community will keep Perl working and even if they don't
>> in theory I can learn to make the changes myself. That, to me, is a
>> MASSIVE
>> reason to go through whatever hassle I have to using free software.
>>
>> In other words, I didn't mean this to be Apple bashing--I meant it to
be
>> proprietary software bashing.
>>
>> TCB
>>
>> "Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote:
>>>Thad,
>>>
>>>I understand your point, and to be sure, Apple could be more cooperative
>>
>>>with third party programmers, but what you have to remember is, most of
>> us
>>>aren't "programmers". Most of us don't want anything to do with the inner
>>
>>>workings of our computers. We just want them to run our chosen software,
>> be
>>>user friendly and not crash. For a "non-programmer" type person like me,
>> the
>>>Mac has been my choice. At first because they were the only game in town
>>
>>>(1986), and now because I have so much legacy software that switching
>>>would
>>
>>>cost a fortune, but I digress. ;>) Anyway, I envy you guys for having
the
>>
>>>smarts to get open source software to work for you and even the PC guys
>> who
>>>have to know a lot more "technical" stuff to tweak their PC's into smooth
>>
>>>running speed beasts. Now, get to work on an open source brain/computer
>>
>>>interface so I can make the music I hear in my head, instead of the music
>> my
>>>lousy fingers are capable of! ;>)
>>>
>>>Tony
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:43908fa7$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> Well, one of the reasons I am so opposed to proprietary software and
>>>> hardware
>>>> in general is my experience with PARIS. People often confuse free
>>>> software
>>>> with money cost, which really isn't the point, IHMO. Stallman talked
>>>> about
>>>> "free as in speech and free as in beer" and the big one to me is the
>>>> first.
>>>> If I need a new perl module or I want to install a new package on my
>>>> Debian
>>>> boxes, and there's a problem I can open up the installer script and
see
>>
>>>> what's
>>>> going on. Oh, it's expecting an older C compiler in a different place.
>>
>>>> Find
>>>> and replace "gcc3" with "CC" and off we go. Try that with any other
OS.
>>
>>>> That
>>>> kind of control matters *a lot* to me these days.
>>>>
>>>> I also find it supremely ironic that Apple is considered to be a foward
>>
>>>> looking,
>>>> innovative company for making a Unix based OS. They chose the least
>>>> restrictive
>>>> license on planet earth and have grudgingly followed the letter of the
>> law
>>>> for all of code not under the "go ahead and steal it" BSD structure.
>>>> There
>>>> have been constant bubbling complaints from the KDE crowd about getting
>>
>>>> code
>>>> back to the community. On the other side, stodgy old IBM works with
GPL
>>
>>>> code
>>>> as model citizens and even pays for lawyers to defend that code from
>>>> silly
>>>> law suits.
>>>>
>>>> In any case, there's no way VST will ever make it to GPL'd code so I'm
>>
>>>> stuck
>>>> with one Windows box no matter what. That said, the ALSA guys do really
>>
>>>> good
>>>> work under Linux, it's too bad it will be so underexploited.
>>>>
>>>> TCB
>>>>
>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>Thanks for sharing your info about your Linux experience, Thad. That's
>>>>>good to hear. My old PARIS Intel box has became my Linux/BeOS box.
>>>>>
>>>>>I've used a lot of different hardware and OS combinations over the
>>>>>years. OSX with its command line, UNIX roots and tons of media
>>>>>production software has covered my primary computing needs fairly well
>>>>>for the last couple of years. However things are steadily progressing
>> in
>>>>
>>>>>Linux land and I think it has a bright future.
>>>>>
>>>>>I hear you about proprietary systems. I'm not against
|
|
|
|
| Re: The Next Step? [message #60876 is a reply to message #60873] |
Fri, 02 December 2005 14:23 |
TCB
Messages: 1261
Registered: July 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
push the envelope to provide improved
>>>>>technology for computing, media production, and lately, media
>>>>>distribution.
>>>>>
>>>>>I'm not saying Apple is perfect, there are disadvantages to some of
>>>>>their decisions and they have had a lot of reports from me to help them
>>>>
>>>>>improve. :^) But the advantages of OSX, generally solid hardware like
>>>>>the current dual G5s, and a steady stream of capable software transcend
>>>>
>>>>>the disadvantages right now.
>>>>>
>>>>>Good luck with your computer and music pursuits! When the time comes
to
>>>>
>>>>>move your music production over to Linux I'd love to hear how it goes.
>>>>>
>>>>>Cheers,
>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>> http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>TCB wrote:
>>>>>> I was just busting your chops a bit. I yam what I yam.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On the "desktop" OS front I have converted 100% to Debian GNU/Linux.
>> I
>>>> still
>>>>>> have one M$oft box for my audio stuff (until Live, CubaseSX, VST,
and
>>>> a ton
>>>>>> of other things get ported to GNU/Linux I have no choice), but
>>>>>> everything
>>>>>> else runs on GNU/Linux. I have to say whenver I use a desktop that
>>>>>> isn't
>>>>>> Gnome and doesn't give me immediate access to a powerful command line
>>>> I feel
>>>>>> like I'm running on one leg. There are some bumps along the road,
and
>>>> I have
>>>>>> to install some non free software for remote access to work (including
>>>> some
>>>>>> kernel patches that are a PITA), but it's been worth every bit of
the
>>>> effort.
>>>>>> Now that I'm doing computer work again for a living I'm happy to be
>> free
>>>>>> of proprietary software as much as humanly possible. For me all
>>>>>> proprietary
>>>>>> systems like OS X, XP, Vista, BeOS, and everything else are all
>>>>>> roughly
>>>> equivalent
>>>>>> evils--places I have to spend some time in order to make a living.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Heh. Yep Thad, I'm running it on BeOS, maybe that's the problem? ;^)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Time for a BeOS report I guess. Palm bought BeOS and hired members
of
>>>>
>>>>>>>the engineering team. Your Palm's operating system now benefits.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Be retained the right to sue Microsoft for closing them out of the
OS
>>>>
>>>>>>>market for Intel boxes through illegally restrictive OEM agreements.
>>>>>>>Microsoft paid millions to settle. Chump change.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Wish it had been different. BeOS was full of great tech. Imagine where
>>>>
>>>>>>>it could be today.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Heck, for that matter imagine where PARIS could be today, if only...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>More on BeOS:
>>>>>>>http://www.birdhouse.org/beos/byte/30-bootloader/
>>>>>>>http://www.itjungle.com/mid/mid022702-story06.html
>>>>>>>http://www.mv-voice.com/morgue/2003/2003_09_26.bisi.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Meanwhile OSX has been steadily improving and has some good stuff.
>>>>>>>Oddly
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I ran Logic all day today in a project that was crashing left and
>>>>>>>right
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>last time I worked on that project. It didn't crash once today.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>So I don't know, maybe it's not a Logic problem. It may have to do
>>>>>>>with
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Native Instruments plugins, whatever's going on with my system drive
>> or
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>?. Or maybe a recent update fixed something. BTW, I do send bug
>>>>>>>reports
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>to Apple so they've seen the detailed crash reports.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>The bug where Logic stops playing back a virtual synth did come up
one
>>>>
>>>>>>>time today. That one needs to be fixed. Reloading the song is the
>>>>>>>workaround.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On the plus side, Logic on a dual G5 is incredible in its capabilities
>>>>
>>>>>>>and the music is sounding great.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Nice to hear from you, Thad.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Cheers,
>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>> http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>DJ wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>heheheh.........hi thad
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>;o)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:438f5066$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>You're running this on BeOS, right?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>I'm using Logic "Pro" 7.1 on a dual 2.5GHZ G5 running OSX. Logic
>>
>>>>>>>>>>would
>>>>>>>>>>be "Pro" if it didn't crash. Of course OSX doesn't go down when
>>>>>>>>>>Logic
>>>>>>>>>>does but it's still an interruption to restart Logic when it
>>>>>>>>>>happens.
>>>>>>>>>>Some of that may be a hardware problem with my rig, I'm tracking
>> down
>>>>>>
>>>>>> a
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>possible HD glitch right now.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>The other thing about Logic is there is a bit of a learning curve.
>>>> Most
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>things are straight forward but a few things are obtuse. You might
>>>> give
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>yourself a few weeks to come up to speed, depending on what your
>>
>>>>>>>>>>needs
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>are.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Those negatives aside, Logic has come a long way and it rocks.
It
>> has
>>>>>>
>>>>>> an
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>incredible selection of useful plugins for convolution reverb,
>>>>>>>>>>compression, limiting, distortion, EQ, etc. It also includes a
good
>>>>>>>>>>variety of excellent virtual instrument/synth plugins, and great
>>
>>>>>>>>>>third
>>>>>>>>>>party plugins are readily available. It really is a virtual studio
>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>>I'm very happy with the tracks I'm producing. C'mon over and check
>>>> it
>>>>>>>>>>out if you're ever in the neighborhood.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Everything is automatable. Mixers show as many tracks as you have.
>>>> The
>>>>>>>>>>MIDI features are comprehensive. Logic can play video files for
>>>>>>>>>>film
>>>>>>>>>>scoring.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>The G5 processors support so many plugins and tracks that I rarely
>>>> have
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>to "freeze" anything, it's all live. But if I ever need more CPU
>>>>>>>>>>overhead, freezing a track converts a track and all plugin
>>>>>>>>>>operations
>>>>>>
>>>>>> to
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>an audio file. It can be unfrozen if any editing is needed. There's
>>>> also
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>an option to network with another Mac to farm out CPU time but
I've
>>>>>>>>>>never needed that with the G5. BTW, the new dual core dual
>>>>>>>>>>processor
>>>>>>
>>>>>> G5
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>box is somewhere around twice as fast as mine. Whoa.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>If at all possible, you should try to mix on each of the systems
>>
>>>>>>>>>>you're
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>considering and see if the sound pleases your ear. The i/o you
>>>>>>>>>>choose
>>>>>>>>>>will also matter. Like Tony I'm using a MOTU 828MII which has been
>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>decent sounding, reliable piece of gear, and there are many other
>>>>>>>>>>options to consider. You can combine several i/o devices if you
>>>>>>>>>>need
>>>>>>
>>>>>> to
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>expand to additional channels. If you need flying faders there
are
>>>>>>>>>>several choices with or without built-in i/o.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>-Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>http://www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Tony Benson wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>I suppose it would depend on your style of mixing, but I've been
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>really
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>happy lately using DP 4.6 and PARIS. I track and mix first in
DP
>> to
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>take
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>advantage of any virtual instruments I might want to use, and
any
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>plugins
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>that won't work in PARIS. I'm using a MOTU 828 Mk2 firewire
>>>>>>>>>>>interface
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>that
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>actually sounds pretty good. It doesn't add any character while
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>recording,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>but that's what I'm wanting at this stage. This first mix is
>>>>>>>>>>>basically
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>just
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>a "get it close" type mix. I usually don't use any EQ plugins
in
>> DP
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>opting
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>for the nice PARIS EQ's instead. Once I've got things close in
DP
>>>> I
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>freeze
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>all the tracks (equivalent to rendering with plugins in PARIS).
>> Then
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>export the frozen DP tracks as 24 bit .wav files. Then I boot
to
>> OS9
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>and
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>use
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>SonicWorx to convert the .wavs to 24 bit .paf files. Then I open
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>PARIS,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>add
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>the audio files, and do all my editing and final mixing in PARIS.
>>>> I
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>still
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>like the editing in PARIS, I suppose because I'm so used to it.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>Right
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>now
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>I'm doing this all on one Mac dual processor G4 and dual booting.
>>>> I'm
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>getting a G5 soon though and dedicating the G4 to PARIS only.
I'll
>>>> just
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>share a firewire drive between the two. This will also let me
use
>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>G5 as
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>a virtual FX rack when mixing in PARIS using external sends.
>>>>>>>>>>>Anyway,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>know
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>this approach is pretty convoluted and might not work for
>>>>>>>>>>>everyone,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> but
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>it's
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>my way of having the best of both worlds so to speak. The modern
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>features
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>in
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>DP and the great sounding mix bus, EQ and easy editing in PARIS.
>>>> Not
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>to
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>mention the great PARIS plugs like NoLimit, BarbEQ, etc.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>Tony
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>"Gantt Kushner" <gizmo@his.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>>>>news:438F262B.D0B3EB31@his.com...
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>I love Paris!
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>But I'm beginning to realize, especially in the face of new,
>>>>>>>>>>>>cool plugins that'll never work in Paris (like the Waves
>>>>>>>>>>>>Transform Bundle, among others), that I'm eventually going
>>>>>>>>>>>>to have to switch to something that actually has ongoing
>>>>>>>>>>>>development and support.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>So what are my fellow Mac DAW users finding satisfying
>>>>>>>>>>>>after Paris? I own Digital Performer (w/ an old 2408) and
>>>>>>>>>>>>Protools LE (w/ Digi 002). Neither seems as intuitive as
>>>>>>>>>>>>Paris, but I suppose I'd get faster if I immersed myself in
>>>>>>>>>>>>one or the other. My big concern is sound quality. I haven't
>>>>>>>>>>>>found either DP or PT LE as satisfying to listen to and mix on
>>>>>>>>>>>>as Paris. I know I've lost business for not being a Protools
>>>>>>>>>>>>studio, but PT HD would cost a couple of arms and legs.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>What to do?
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>Gantt
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>John, your question reflects exactly what ID was hoping for.....
John <no@no.com> wrote:
>Who is Edmund ?
>
>Morgan wrote:
>> Hey Thad -
>> Long time :)
>> Where are you ?
>> Morgan
>>
>> TCB wrote:
>>
>>> I don't check this NG for eons. Then I drop by on a whim and no flame
>>> wars,
>>> no calls for Edmund to be covered in cattle blood and released into a
>>> cage
>>> filled with starving ferrets, no lectures from Don about intelligent
>>> design?
>>> Sheesh.
>>> Seriously, hope all is well. I'm beaten down at work and trying do simple
>>> things my brain can still manage, like look at newsgroups where I once
>>> spent
>>> most of my time.
>>> TCB
>>
>>I've got them. Where's the address we can uplaod files to?
I can put them there.
Rod
Jeff hoover <jkhoover@excite.com> wrote:
>Anyone know where these can be downloaded from? the purgatorycreek urls
>are not longer valid.
>
>
>Thanks,
>
>JHJust saw this on craigslist. Free.
ok, someone here must need one. Just have to pick it up.
In Sonoma, California...
http://www.craigslist.org/nby/sys/115372279.html
-steveAnother option that was given to me re: these live vocal tracks
"You could make a copy of the vocal track, and cut out all the bleed
inbetween vocals. Set up your gate to key off the copy track. Adjust your
threshold, reduction and times accordingly"
Thoughts
DonJohn <no@no.com> wrote:
>Who is Edmund ?
He is the son of the guy that created Jurassic Park! Remember, he is the
greedy fat guy, you know, the computer nerd that steals the eggs to sell.
(killed the goose that laid the golden eggs!) He shuts down the system
on everybody, and the dinosaurs go ape shit. Remember when they try to reboot
the system, a picture of the asshole waving his finger, saying, No, no. no!
Pops up on the screen. The selfish asshole leaves everybody fucked. (Pace
security bullshit) Well, in the end, the arrogant fat fuck gets eaten by
a dinosaur. (Damn, this only happens in the movies!!!)
>
>Morgan wrote:
>> Hey Thad -
>> Long time :)
>> Where are you ?
>> Morgan
>>
>> TCB wrote:
>>
>>> I don't check this NG for eons. Then I drop by on a whim and no flame
>>> wars,
>>> no calls for Edmund to be covered in cattle blood and released into a
>>> cage
>>> filled with starving ferrets, no lectures from Don about intelligent
>>> design?
>>> Sheesh.
>>> Seriously, hope all is well. I'm beaten down at work and trying do simple
>>> things my brain can still manage, like look at newsgroups where I once
>>> spent
>>> most of my time.
>>> TCB
>>
>>Try:
ftp://manitou.serveftp.net
user/pass = bt
Also disable passive mode.
Rob
"Jeff hoover" <jkhoover@excite.com> wrote in message
news:43909f78$1@linux...
> Anyone know where these can be downloaded from? the purgatorycreek urls
> are not longer valid.
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> JHWith all of this talk of GNU's and Gnomes, I'm somehow reminded of an
African fairy tale...........is there a Gfilterphish also? I thnk that would
be a coolname for an EQ plugin.
;o)
"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:4390bb43$1@linux...
>
> It's getting there, trust me. 95% of computer users who don't directly
make
> a living off of computers (i.e. excluding musicians, graphic designers,
etc.)
> could do everything they do on a Mac or a PC with a GNU/Linux box. The
install/config
> is getting SO close to being grandma-proofed as well with distros like
Ubuntu.
> GNU/Linux is still behind a little in "multimedia" stuff like video
playback
> (and porn makes the 'net go 'round) and burning CDs (usually you have to
> type the super user password) but it's SO SO SO close. In my opinion Gnome
> and OpenOffice are significantly better than either of their equivalents
> on any other platform. But hey, I'm a geek so maybe I'm wrong.
>
> TCB
>
> "Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote:
> >I didn't take it as Apple bashing. Sorry if I gave that impression. I
agree,
>
> >open source is the way to go. Maybe some of you smart guys can work out
> the
> >hard stuff, package the apps up with simple user interfaces and sell the
>
> >"service of keeping it simple" to guys like me. I'd gladly pay for killer
>
> >stable open source audio apps, if all I have to do is install and run
them.
>
> >See, to me Perl is a necklace and C++ is a little better than slightly
above
>
> >average. The thought of a command line makes me wet myself! That way, the
>
> >source code stays "open" and us codephobes pay for the "service" of
making
>
> >it easy to use. Are there any really cool, GUI based open source audio
apps
>
> >out there? Anyway, I was really agreeing with you, just not communicating
>
> >very much betterly. ;>) Ah cyberspace. So liberating yet so impersonal.
> >
> >Good Things,
> >
> >Tony
> >
> >
> >"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:4390a914$1@linux...
> >>
> >> Trust me, if I didn't work with computers for a living I'd be saying
> >> exactly
> >> the same things. Also, I didn't make my point abotu PARIS well. I've
used
> >> so much software that I've seen go under. PARIS, Opcode, Cubase was a
>
> >> little
> >> dicey there for a while, and so on. By using free software at the very
>
> >> worst
> >> I have to learn to fix something myself. If Larry Wall gets hit by a
bus
> >> tomorrow the Perl community will keep Perl working and even if they
don't
> >> in theory I can learn to make the changes myself. That, to me, is a
> >> MASSIVE
> >> reason to go through whatever hassle I have to using free software.
> >>
> >> In other words, I didn't mean this to be Apple bashing--I meant it to
> be
> >> proprietary software bashing.
> >>
> >> TCB
> >>
> >> "Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote:
> >>>Thad,
> >>>
> >>>I understand your point, and to be sure, Apple could be more
cooperative
> >>
> >>>with third party programmers, but what you have to remember is, most of
> >> us
> >>>aren't "programmers". Most of us don't want anything to do with the
inner
> >>
> >>>workings of our computers. We just want them to run our chosen
software,
> >> be
> >>>user friendly and not crash. For a "non-programmer" type person like
me,
> >> the
> >>>Mac has been my choice. At first because they were the only game in
town
> >>
> >>>(1986), and now because I have so much legacy software that switching
>
> >>>would
> >>
> >>>cost a fortune, but I digress. ;>) Anyway, I envy you guys for having
> the
> >>
> >>>smarts to get open source software to work for you and even the PC guys
> >> who
> >>>have to know a lot more "technical" stuff to tweak their PC's into
smooth
> >>
> >>>running speed beasts. Now, get to work on an open source brain/computer
> >>
> >>>interface so I can make the music I hear in my head, instead of the
music
> >> my
> >>>lousy fingers are capable of! ;>)
> >>>
> >>>Tony
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:43908fa7$1@linux...
|
|
|
|
| Re: The Next Step? [message #60883 is a reply to message #60876] |
Fri, 02 December 2005 20:33 |
Deej [1]
Messages: 2149
Registered: January 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
;>demonstrated. Open source has become the best way to survive in this
> >>>>>environment. Even Apple is participating in open source to an extent
> at
> >>>>
> >>>>>the kernel and browser levels.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>I am not opposed to companies making money on their technology when
> >>>>>competing fairly on merits and pushing the envelope to provide needed
> >>>>>tools. I'm happy to pay fair prices for hardware and software when
they
> >>>>
> >>>>>meets my needs, and to support talented engineers in the quest. I
> >>>>>originally bought PARIS for that reason.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>But using monopolistic leveraging, Orwellian marketspeak, and
swallowing
> >>>>
> >>>>>other companies while killing a lot of great competitive tech and
> >>>>>promoting marginal tech, that kind of behavior doesn't endear much
> >>>>>respect.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>I got into Macs this time around because of OSX and the continued
> >>>>>strides being made with OSX production software. After years of
> >>>>>misdirection with OS7-8-9 and failed attempts to significantly
progress,
> >>>>
> >>>>>with OSX Apple was able to push the envelope to provide improved
> >>>>>technology for computing, media production, and lately, media
> >>>>>distribution.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>I'm not saying Apple is perfect, there are disadvantages to some of
> >>>>>their decisions and they have had a lot of reports from me to help
them
> >>>>
> >>>>>improve. :^) But the advantages of OSX, generally solid hardware like
> >>>>>the current dual G5s, and a steady stream of capable software
transcend
> >>>>
> >>>>>the disadvantages right now.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Good luck with your computer and music pursuits! When the time comes
> to
> >>>>
> >>>>>move your music production over to Linux I'd love to hear how it
goes.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Cheers,
> >>>>> -Jamie
> >>>>> http://www.JamieKrutz.com
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>TCB wrote:
> >>>>>> I was just busting your chops a bit. I yam what I yam.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On the "desktop" OS front I have converted 100% to Debian
GNU/Linux.
> >> I
> >>>> still
> >>>>>> have one M$oft box for my audio stuff (until Live, CubaseSX, VST,
> and
> >>>> a ton
> >>>>>> of other things get ported to GNU/Linux I have no choice), but
> >>>>>> everything
> >>>>>> else runs on GNU/Linux. I have to say whenver I use a desktop that
>
> >>>>>> isn't
> >>>>>> Gnome and doesn't give me immediate access to a powerful command
line
> >>>> I feel
> >>>>>> like I'm running on one leg. There are some bumps along the road,
> and
> >>>> I have
> >>>>>> to install some non free software for remote access to work
(including
> >>>> some
> >>>>>> kernel patches that are a PITA), but it's been worth every bit of
> the
> >>>> effort.
> >>>>>> Now that I'm doing computer work again for a living I'm happy to be
> >> free
> >>>>>> of proprietary software as much as humanly possible. For me all
> >>>>>> proprietary
> >>>>>> systems like OS X, XP, Vista, BeOS, and everything else are all
> >>>>>> roughly
> >>>> equivalent
> >>>>>> evils--places I have to spend some time in order to make a living.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Heh. Yep Thad, I'm running it on BeOS, maybe that's the problem?
;^)
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Time for a BeOS report I guess. Palm bought BeOS and hired members
> of
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>the engineering team. Your Palm's operating system now benefits.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Be retained the right to sue Microsoft for closing them out of the
> OS
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>market for Intel boxes through illegally restrictive OEM
agreements.
> >>>>>>>Microsoft paid millions to settle. Chump change.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Wish it had been different. BeOS was full of great tech. Imagine
where
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>it could be today.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Heck, for that matter imagine where PARIS could be today, if
only...
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>More on BeOS:
> >>>>>>>http://www.birdhouse.org/beos/byte/30-bootloader/
> >>>>>>>http://www.itjungle.com/mid/mid022702-story06.html
> >>>>>>>http://www.mv-voice.com/morgue/2003/2003_09_26.bisi.html
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Meanwhile OSX has been steadily improving and has some good stuff.
>
> >>>>>>>Oddly
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>I ran Logic all day today in a project that was crashing left and
>
> >>>>>>>right
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>last time I worked on that project. It didn't crash once today.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>So I don't know, maybe it's not a Logic problem. It may have to do
>
> >>>>>>>with
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Native Instruments plugins, whatever's going on with my system
drive
> >> or
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>?. Or maybe a recent update fixed something. BTW, I do send bug
> >>>>>>>reports
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>to Apple so they've seen the detailed crash reports.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>The bug where Logic stops playing back a virtual synth did come up
> one
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>time today. That one needs to be fixed. Reloading the song is the
> >>>>>>>workaround.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>On the plus side, Logic on a dual G5 is incredible in its
capabilities
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>and the music is sounding great.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Nice to hear from you, Thad.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Cheers,
> >>>>>>> -Jamie
> >>>>>>> http://www.JamieKrutz.com
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>DJ wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>heheheh.........hi thad
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>;o)
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message
news:438f5066$1@linux...
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>You're running this on BeOS, right?
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>I'm using Logic "Pro" 7.1 on a dual 2.5GHZ G5 running OSX. Logic
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>>would
> >>>>>>>>>>be "Pro" if it didn't crash. Of course OSX doesn't go down when
>
> >>>>>>>>>>Logic
> >>>>>>>>>>does but it's still an interruption to restart Logic when it
> >>>>>>>>>>happens.
> >>>>>>>>>>Some of that may be a hardware problem with my rig, I'm tracking
> >> down
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> a
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>possible HD glitch right now.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>The other thing about Logic is there is a bit of a learning
curve.
> >>>> Most
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>things are straight forward but a few things are obtuse. You
might
> >>>> give
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>yourself a few weeks to come up to speed, depending on what your
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>>needs
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>are.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>Those negatives aside, Logic has come a long way and it rocks.
> It
> >> has
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> an
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>incredible selection of useful plugins for convolution reverb,
> >>>>>>>>>>compression, limiting, distortion, EQ, etc. It also includes a
> good
> >>>>>>>>>>variety of excellent virtual instrument/synth plugins, and great
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>>third
> >>>>>>>>>>party plugins are readily available. It really is a virtual
studio
> >>>> and
> >>>>>>>>>>I'm very happy with the tracks I'm producing. C'mon over and
check
> >>>> it
> >>>>>>>>>>out if you're ever in the neighborhood.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>Everything is automatable. Mixers show as many tracks as you
have.
> >>>> The
> >>>>>>>>>>MIDI features are comprehensive. Logic can play video files for
>
> >>>>>>>>>>film
> >>>>>>>>>>scoring.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>The G5 processors support so many plugins and tracks that I
rarely
> >>>> have
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>to "freeze" anything, it's all live. But if I ever need more CPU
> >>>>>>>>>>overhead, freezing a track converts a track and all plugin
> >>>>>>>>>>operations
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> to
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>an audio file. It can be unfrozen if any editing is needed.
There's
> >>>> also
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>an option to network with another Mac to farm out CPU time but
> I've
> >>>>>>>>>>never needed that with the G5. BTW, the new dual core dual
> >>>>>>>>>>processor
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> G5
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>box is somewhere around twice as fast as mine. Whoa.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>If at all possible, you should try to mix on each of the systems
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>>you're
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>considering and see if the sound pleases your ear. The i/o you
>
> >>>>>>>>>>choose
> >>>>>>>>>>will also matter. Like Tony I'm using a MOTU 828MII which has
been
> >>>> a
> >>>>>>>>>>decent sounding, reliable piece of gear, and there are many
other
> >>>>>>>>>>options to consider. You can combine several i/o devices if you
>
> >>>>>>>>>>need
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> to
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>expand to additional channels. If you need flying faders there
> are
> >>>>>>>>>>several choices with or without built-in i/o.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>Cheers,
> >>>>>>>>>>-Jamie
> >>>>>>>>>>http://www.JamieKrutz.com
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>Tony Benson wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>I suppose it would depend on your style of mixing, but I've
been
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>>>really
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>happy lately using DP 4.6 and PARIS. I track and mix first in
> DP
> >> to
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>take
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>advantage of any virtual instruments I might want to use, and
> any
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>plugins
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>that won't work in PARIS. I'm using a MOTU 828 Mk2 firewire
> >>>>>>>>>>>interface
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>that
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>actually sounds pretty good. It doesn't add any character while
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>recording,
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>but that's what I'm wanting at this stage. This first mix is
> >>>>>>>>>>>basically
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>just
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>a "get it close" type mix. I usually don't use any EQ plugins
> in
> >> DP
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>opting
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>for the nice PARIS EQ's instead. Once I've got things close in
> DP
> >>>> I
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>freeze
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>all the tracks (equivalent to rendering with plugins in PARIS).
> >> Then
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>export the frozen DP tracks as 24 bit .wav files. Then I boot
> to
> >> OS9
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>and
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>use
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>SonicWorx to convert the .wavs to 24 bit .paf files. Then I
open
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>>>PARIS,
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>add
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>the audio files, and do all my editing and final mixing in
PARIS.
> >>>> I
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>still
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>like the editing in PARIS, I suppose because I'm so used to it.
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>>>Right
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>now
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>I'm doing this all on one Mac dual processor G4 and dual
booting.
> >>>> I'm
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>getting a G5 soon though and dedicating the G4 to PARIS only.
> I'll
> >>>> just
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>share a firewire drive between the two. This will also let me
> use
> >>>> the
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>G5 as
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>a virtual FX rack when mixing in PARIS using external sends.
> >>>>>>>>>>>Anyway,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>know
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>this approach is pretty convoluted and might not work for
> >>>>>>>>>>>everyone,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> but
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>it's
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>my way of having the best of both worlds so to speak. The
modern
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>features
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>in
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>DP and the great sounding mix bus, EQ and easy editing in
PARIS.
> >>>> Not
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>to
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>mention the great PARIS plugs like NoLimit, BarbEQ, etc.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>Tony
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>"Gantt Kushner" <gizmo@his.com> wrote in message
> >>>>>>>>>>>news:438F262B.D0B3EB31@his.com...
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>I love Paris!
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>But I'm beginning to realize, especially in the face of new,
> >>>>>>>>>>>>cool plugins that'll never work in Paris (like the Waves
> >>>>>>>>>>>>Transform Bundle, among others), that I'm eventually going
> >>>>>>>>>>>>to have to switch to something that actually has ongoing
> >>>>>>>>>>>>development and support.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>So what are my fellow Mac DAW users finding satisfying
> >>>>>>>>>>>>after Paris? I own Digital Performer (w/ an old 2408) and
> >>>>>>>>>>>>Protools LE (w/ Digi 002). Neither seems as intuitive as
> >>>>>>>>>>>>Paris, but I suppose I'd get faster if I immersed myself in
> >>>>>>>>>>>>one or the other. My big concern is sound quality. I haven't
> >>>>>>>>>>>>found either DP or PT LE as satisfying to listen to and mix on
> >>>>>>>>>>>>as Paris. I know I've lost business for not being a Protools
> >>>>>>>>>>>>studio, but PT HD would cost a couple of arms and legs.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>What to do?
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>Gantt
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >
> >
>Thanks Rod. I'll try to pick it up tomorrow when I will be at a faster
connection.
JH
Rob Arsenault wrote:
> Try:
> ftp://manitou.serveftp.net
> user/pass = bt
>
> Also disable passive mode.
>
> Rob
>
>
> "Jeff hoover" <jkhoover@excite.com> wrote in message
> news:43909f78$1@linux...
>
>>Anyone know where these can be downloaded from? the purgatorycreek urls
>>are not longer valid.
>>
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>JH
>
>
>Sory if I ask much but the way I do the project rebuild does not help.
How do you do a rebuild ?
I just go to audio folder export audio objects or wave files under a new
folder then save the new song and then reopen from new folder.
I guess you might refer to something different here right ?
Can you explain your way ?
Thanks
Regards,
Dimitrios
"Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>Dimitrios,
>I agree with Erlilo. Try different channels or a different
>submix if you can. Otherwise rebuilding the mix from
>scratch in a new project is the next best bet. Copy all
>mixer settings and presets of effects to make it easier.
>Tom
>
>
>
> "Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com> wrote in message =
>news:43908331$1@linux...
>
> Dimitrios, You probably know this, but just to make sure...
> If you want to use stereo native plugins, you can NOT have any mono =
>plugins
> on those tracks. That goes for native and EDS.
> Do you have any mono eds or native plugs also on the stereo pair?
> Rod
> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
> >
> >Dear Tom,
> >It is not the plugin under other song I can open a stereo native =
>effect.
> >In my project I cannot open ANY stereo effect.
> >Even chainer only...
> >I can save my project no problem if I don't use a stereo native =
>effect.
> >ALSO on submix 3 I managed toopen a stereo native effect but not on =
>submix
> >1 or 4 , any suggestion ?
> >Regards,
> >Dimitrios
> >
> >"Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>Dimitrios,
> >>Are you saying you can save before this stereo plugin
> >>is inserted? I'd say you may have a rouge plugin that
> >>your wrapper or Paris just doesn't like. Try the same thing
> >>in a different project. ie: Same stereo plugin inserted
> >>on another stereo pair of tracks. Now can you save?
> >>If so it may be your project. If not it's probably your plugin.
> >>
> >>Good luck,
> >>Tom
> >> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message =3D
> >>news:43906b78$1@linux...
> >>
> >> Thanks for your suggestions.
> >> I have rendered using the hardware method via adat and achieved =
>one =3D
> >>nice
> >> compact stereo track with my acoustic guitars, I even saved all =
>audio
> >=3D
> >>files
> >> on new folder and saved under new name I used the clear missing =
>files
> >=3D
> >>just
> >> before that but again no luck when I put a stereo native effect on
=
>=3D
> >>this stereotrack
> >> even without hitting play when I try to save assertion fails and
=
>=3D
> >>doesn't
> >> allow of any save !
> >> Note that assertion failure appears ONLY when I hit SAve ...
> >> rEGARDS,
> >> dIMITRIOS
> >>
> >> "Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >Dimitrios,
> >> >Rendering is your answer. Don't render tracks with plugins. In
=
>=3D
> >>stereo
> >> =3D3D
> >> >the right side=3D3D20
> >> >won't have any effect. Double check to see that their timing is
=
>=3D
> >>correct
> >> =3D3D
> >> >too.
> >> >Some people have problems with that.
> >> >Tom
> >> > "erlilo" <erlilo@online.no> wrote in message =3D
> >>news:43900b57$1@linux...
> >> > There you have the problem. I think rendering the tracks and =
>look
> =3D
> >>=3D3D
> >> >after that=3D3D20
> >> > each stereopair is starting and ending at the same places will
=
>do
> =3D
> >>the
> >> =3D3D
> >> >job=3D3D20
> >> > when saving under a new name, just to be sure to go back if =3D
> >>something
> >> =3D3D
> >> >are=3D3D20
> >> > going wrong again. If the time alignments are going wrong in =
>some
> =3D
> >>of =3D3D
> >> >the=3D3D20
> >> > stereofiles, you can rendering the old, hard way, as in version
=
>2,
> >=3D
> >>=3D3D
> >> >when=3D3D20
> >> > mixing down each stereopair with panning hard left and right =
>and =3D
> >>=3D3D
> >> >muting all=3D3D20
> >> > other tracks. Then you can import them into the project again =
>on =3D
> >>their
> >> =3D3D
> >> >old=3D3D20
> >> > places and give them new names.
> >> >
> >> > Erling
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> skrev i melding =3D3D
> >> >news:439000f1$1@linux...
> >> > >
> >> > > Hi,
> >> > > Thanks for your replies.
> >> > > What I have managed is to have the same start and end for =
>both =3D
> >>audio
> >> =3D3D
> >> >files
> >> > > just by cutting at cursor pointy on both tracks.
> >> > > Buit insight the stereo tracks each of themhas different cut
=
>=3D
> >>points
> >> =3D3D
> >> >and=3D3D20
> >> > > joint
> >> > > points , does this matter?
> >> > > If you ask me why it is because these tracks are not actually
=
>=3D
> >>stereo
> >> =3D3D
> >> >but
> >> > > two takes of acoustic guitar playing so I had tomove =
>different =3D
> >>parts
> >> =3D3D
> >> >on=3D3D20
> >> > > each
> >> > > of the "stereo" tracks to make them on time.
> >> > > I want a stereo effect because I wanna expand the stereo =3D
> >>perspective
> >> =3D3D
> >> >of=3D3D20
> >> > > them
> >> > > pl;aying hard left and hard right.
> >> > > Have you tried T-racks compressor's stereo widening knob ?? =
>!!
> >> > > Amazing stereo result with complete mono compatibility , not
=
>like
> >=3D
> >>=3D3D
> >> >waves=3D3D20
> >> > > imager
> >> > > at all...
> >> > > Cheers,
> >> > > DImitrios
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > "Ennio" <ennio@galicorp.net> wrote:
> >> > >>The in-points (and out-points) on both sides of the stereo =
>file
> =3D
> >>must
> >> =3D3D
> >> >be
> >> > > at
> >> > >>the identical spot - down to the sample (the furthest down =
>you =3D
> >>can =3D3D
> >> >go on
> >> > > the
> >> > >>zoom tool)
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| Re: The Next Step? [message #61150 is a reply to message #60851] |
Fri, 09 December 2005 05:54 |
|
|
ark,Atlanta
> > Ga..I was 15..My friend, who owned a music store, knew the sound man,and
> he
> > let us set up 2 mics and tape it in stereo,at the board position...They
> did
> > basically the same songs back then,as on the RAH DVD..I assume they
also
> > taped the MSG concerts in Oct.....The new DVD sounds nothing like the
> "old
> > Cream"...I totally liked Clapton when he played his Gibson SG (as he did
> on
> > Live at the Fillmore)..his Strat tones are not nearly as
> "psychedelic"..and
> > of course the Drums and Bass also sound much cleaner now....Bruce's new
> > version of "Train Time" was just awesome...
> > "DC" <dc@spamthegrammys.com> wrote in message news:43989adb$1@linux...
> > >
> > > Did you guys see the Royal Albert Hall Cream concert?
> > >
> > > Here in the US it has been on public TV recently. Dang, those guys
> > > can still do it. They look like hell, but man they are playing
great.
> > >
> > > I never realized how truly impressive Jack Bruce's bass playing was
> > > years ago. During solos, he actually brings them close to great
> > > jazz with these amazing bass parts.
> > >
> > > I really enjoyed that show. Hope you got to see it.
> > >
> > > DC
> >
> >
>
>I feel like I may have appeased the gods by offering up my power supply as
a sacrafice.
Who knows...
-scott v
"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in news:4399b406$1@linux:
> Sometimes the
Gantt Kushner
Gizmo Recording Company
Silver Spring, MD
www.gizmorecording.com
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